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Thread: I've succumbed to blending.

  1. #1
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    I've succumbed to blending.

    Recently purchased a few kilo's each of India Elephant Hills Monsoon and Colombia La Esperanza Red Heirloom Bourbon, I really like the EH and the Colombian sounds like it should combine with it nicely.

    Yesterday roasted a batch of 725 grams 50% of each, will trial it around the end of the week and report back.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Gavisconi007's Avatar
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    I would suggest also Yelta that you try 25% Indian EH. It is a crema monster with quite a nutty taste. 50% is a bit high IMO, whereas 25% will add a subtle nuance which will compliment the Colombian well.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gavisconi007 View Post
    I would suggest also Yelta that you try 25% Indian EH. It is a crema monster with quite a nutty taste. 50% is a bit high IMO, whereas 25% will add a subtle nuance which will compliment the Colombian well.
    Been roasting EH for quite some time, really enjoy it as a SO so suspect I will handle 50% without a problem, time will tell.

  4. #4
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    If you nail that Columbian, would love to know what you're doing with it. I haven't got a roast right yet!

  5. #5
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by readeral View Post
    If you nail that Columbian, would love to know what you're doing with it. I haven't got a roast right yet!
    Came out of the roaster looking good, took it to just before SC, now for the taste test.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    By all accounts it's very tasty, but all I've managed is the extremes of too acidic, or baking it. Might need to lower my batch and push it through 1st crack quite hard.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    You've got me wondering! just turned the machine on, +36 hours post roast, gonna pull a shot, will report back.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by readeral View Post
    By all accounts it's very tasty, but all I've managed is the extremes of too acidic, or baking it. Might need to lower my batch and push it through 1st crack quite hard.
    Yeah don't forget most Colombians are quite hard Al. My default approach would be plenty of heat up front, maybe ease back just a little about 75-80% of the way to first crack, but then ramped up again to give a good robust rolling first crack. Not too much post-first crack development, just enough to ensure an even roast. Test and make adjustments from there.
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  9. #9
    Senior Member Gavisconi007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Been roasting EH for quite some time, really enjoy it as a SO so suspect I will handle 50% without a problem, time will tell.

    Sorry Yelta. I should have known better. Cheers Mate

  10. #10
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Yeah don't forget most Colombians are quite hard Al. My default approach would be plenty of heat up front, maybe ease back just a little about 75-80% of the way to first crack, but then ramped up again to give a good robust rolling first crack. Not too much post-first crack development, just enough to ensure an even roast. Test and make adjustments from there.
    Thanks LeroyC!

  11. #11
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    What can I say! my expectations were well and truly exceeded, to say this was a god shot would be an understatement.

    18 grams in, approx 40ml out, monstrous crema, viscous syrupy pour, big chocolaty winey flavour, unbelievably complex and an after taste I'm still enjoying 10 minutes later, without doubt the best espresso I've had in years.

    I'm not normally a person given to superlatives, however, this was spectacular.

    And only 36 hours after roasting, it can only improve over the next week or so.ace-ventura-dance.gif

  12. #12
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Be prepared for some very interesting and beautiful flavour development over the next few days mate.
    It's pretty well a new experience every day...

    Mal.
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  13. #13
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    I've never managed to successfully roast monsooned beans but this thread is making me consider trying again.
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  14. #14
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Recently purchased a few kilo's each of India Elephant Hills Monsoon and Colombia La Esperanza Red Heirloom Bourbon, I really like the EH and the Colombian sounds like it should combine with it nicely.

    Yesterday roasted a batch of 725 grams 50% of each, will trial it around the end of the week and report back.
    Hey! I've been planning on blending those two! Curious to hear how they taste.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprezzatura View Post
    Hey! I've been planning on blending those two! Curious to hear how they taste.
    See post 11 this thread Sprezz, your curiosity will be addressed.
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  16. #16
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    I've never managed to successfully roast monsooned beans but this thread is making me consider trying again.
    Not sure why your having problems, Ive always found monsooned beans very easy to roast, I use a Corretto, have been doing so for about 10 years.
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  17. #17
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    What's your grind like with this blend Yelta? My memory of the Monsooned Malabar was it required a very tight grind to get a good pour. I have a bag of the EH Monsooned I haven't tried yet but you have piqued my curiosity.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Not sure why your having problems, Ive always found monsooned beans very easy to roast, I use a Corretto, have been doing so for about 10 years.
    I probably should have been more careful when I wrote "successfully". I'm sure that many would have found the results satisfactory but I personally never really liked the roasted output so it could just be preference.

    The only bean I honestly couldn't roast properly was that tiny Hawaiian bean which I always charred to within an inch of its life!!!

  19. #19
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    What's your grind like with this blend Yelta? My memory of the Monsooned Malabar was it required a very tight grind to get a good pour. I have a bag of the EH Monsooned I haven't tried yet but you have piqued my curiosity.
    Within the parameters of what I consider normal for my setup Flynn, certainly requires no special treatment.

  20. #20
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Within the parameters of what I consider normal for my setup Flynn, certainly requires no special treatment.
    Yep, that's been my experience as well...
    How far do you take the MM beans Steve? Maybe you need to go a bit further towards 2nd-Crack...

    Mal.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    What's your grind like with this blend Yelta? My memory of the Monsooned Malabar was it required a very tight grind to get a good pour. I have a bag of the EH Monsooned I haven't tried yet but you have piqued my curiosity.
    I had the same experience. I had to use a similar grind to geisha which is quite a bit finer than for the same dose of Brazilian for example.

  22. #22
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    The only bean I honestly couldn't roast properly was that tiny Hawaiian bean which I always charred to within an inch of its life!!!
    Ahhh the Hawaiian - my fav bean ever!
    Was interesting to roast though - no first crack virtually and then into second crack 3-4 earlier - no wonder it caused you issues

  23. #23
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    Thanks to LeroyC I think I finally understand how to roast my Columbian. Still has issues, but significantly better development, much sweeter smell coming straight out of the roaster, and munching on a bean from the cooler the acidity didn't smash my face in, nor did it have no character. Quite satisfied.
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  24. #24
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Yeah don't forget most Colombians are quite hard Al. My default approach would be plenty of heat up front, maybe ease back just a little about 75-80% of the way to first crack, but then ramped up again to give a good robust rolling first crack. Not too much post-first crack development, just enough to ensure an even roast. Test and make adjustments from there.
    I used a variation of this technique with the La Esperanza and it came out smelling sweet. Bean tasted good - low acidity and a sweet zing. Very tasty actually. For munching on a bean.

    Behmor 1600+

    200g Colombia La Esperanza
    P5D/Start
    P5
    D
    Wall temp to 138-140
    1st crack
    Rosetta
    P3
    Open door for 8 seconds
    Run out to cool
    Open door

  25. #25
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Never found that Colombian beans required a special approach (not including the La Esperanza), with my standard profile producing excellent results in the cup. Never found them to be particular hard in the past either but apart from the LE mentioned, it's been a while since I've roasted a generic Colombian bean.

    One thing that became obvious quite quickly though, was the need to keep them well away from 2nd-Crack otherwise they turned ashy and bitter very quickly...

    Mal.
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  26. #26
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    LE seems to like a lot of heat early right up to first crack and then drop the heat. Really good before second crack through the Hario.

  27. #27
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    I've only tried 2 generic Colombians so far (Supremo and Excelso, i.e. best and 2nd best). They're certainly nowhere near as hard as the SHB Mexican I have at the moment, but I've still had the most success with a fairly hot start. The last couple of batches were really nice.
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  28. #28
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    The LE has been what I've been roasting. It's hard to land it at a good depth between 1st and 2nd. We'll see how this goes.
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  29. #29
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Not sure how to say this without coming across as a bighead know it all.

    I don't have the drama's that others mention, my roasts are always even, I don't do anything special as regards juggling temperature and time, I monitor the roast constantly and am guided by my digital thermometer and the appearance of the beans during roasting as to changes that need to be made.

    I roasted 725 grams of La Esperanza as a SO 4 days ago, my second roast of this bean, like the first roast it went very well, without any problems at all, stopped it at the very first snaps of second crack, I'm drinking a lungo made with these beans as I type this, very, very nice coffee, well balanced, big chocolaty/caramel flavours with lots of crema.

    Brief pause to make my second lungo.

    I still use a Corretto, a converted Breville single loaf breadmaker, temperature probe inserted right through the body of the machine into the loaf pan just above the paddle, I use a cover on top (covers approx 3/4 of the opening) with a hole cut to accept the nozzle of my Bosch variable temp/blower speed heat gun.

    I roast in the doorway of a shed with a pedestal fan set up to blow chaff into the garden, the heat gun blower blows the chaff out of the opening in the pan cover.

    All of my roasts are of 725 grams, I start all roasts cold/ambiant temp, no pre heat, with the heat gun set at between 500 and 550 C, depending on time of year and aim for first crack at around 14 minutes, almost always spot on 200 C on this setup, once I hit FC my next target is first signs of SC in the vicinity of 225 at around the 19 minute mark, if during the period between FC and SC the beans are showing signs of too much heat (excess smoke) I will drop the temp of my heat gun by about 50, this slows things down nicely.

    At the very first snaps of SC I stop the roast and cool it fast (approx 1 minute) in my cooler, its usually bagged within a couple of minutes of roast end.

    Temperatures I have mentioned are obviously unique to this setup, but are 100% reliable for my purposes.

    I don't have problems with uneven roasts, tipping, divots or under/over roasting, always seem to be able to hit my target without difficulty.

    Been using this device for almost 10 years and estimate I have completed over 300 roasts on it.

    Will post some pics below, happy to answer any questions.DSC_0277_669x1000.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Yelta; 28th May 2016 at 01:49 PM.

  30. #30
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    Never found that Colombian beans required a special approach (not including the La Esperanza), with my standard profile producing excellent results in the cup. Never found them to be particular hard in the past either but apart from the LE mentioned, it's been a while since I've roasted a generic Colombian bean.

    One thing that became obvious quite quickly though, was the need to keep them well away from 2nd-Crack otherwise they turned ashy and bitter very quickly...

    Mal.
    What type of roaster do you use Mal?

  31. #31
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    Turns out I didn't get the Columbian roast right. Bummer... I did a (blind) cupping of my 3 coffees roasted the other day, I could tell very easily which was which, and unfortunately the Columbian had a predominant ashy taste. The sweetness in the smell stuck around (marzipan sweetness) which was surprising, it just didn't translate to flavour.


    EDIT
    So much for telling easily - just asked my wife which sample was which, the burnt ashy one was my Mexican. Turns out the Columbian was ok.
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  32. #32
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    What type of roaster do you use Mal?
    Much the same as yours mate. Nothing fancy...

    Mal.

  33. #33
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by readeral View Post
    So much for telling easily - just asked my wife which sample was which, the burnt ashy one was my Mexican. Turns out the Columbian was ok.
    Labelling the bags takes the embarrassment out of these situations....

    Same happened to me shortly after I first started roasting at home, couldn't remember which bean was in which bag. Didn't matter too much in the end though, as both roast batches turned out very nice...

  34. #34
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    Much the same as yours mate. Nothing fancy...

    Mal.
    They seem to get the job done with a minimum of fuss.
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  35. #35
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Not sure how to say this without coming across as a bighead know it all.

    I don't have the drama's that others mention, my roasts are always even, I don't do anything special as regards juggling temperature and time, I monitor the roast constantly and am guided by my digital thermometer and the appearance of the beans during roasting as to changes that need to be made.

    I roasted 725 grams of La Esperanza as a SO 4 days ago, my second roast of this bean, like the first roast it went very well, without any problems at all, stopped it at the very first snaps of second crack, I'm drinking a lungo made with these beans as I type this, very, very nice coffee, well balanced, big chocolaty/caramel flavours with lots of crema.

    Brief pause to make my second lungo.

    I still use a Corretto, a converted Breville single loaf breadmaker, temperature probe inserted right through the body of the machine into the loaf pan just above the paddle, I use a cover on top (covers approx 3/4 of the opening) with a hole cut to accept the nozzle of my Bosch variable temp/blower speed heat gun.

    I roast in the doorway of a shed with a pedestal fan set up to blow chaff into the garden, the heat gun blower blows the chaff out of the opening in the pan cover.

    All of my roasts are of 725 grams, I start all roasts cold/ambiant temp, no pre heat, with the heat gun set at between 500 and 550 C, depending on time of year and aim for first crack at around 14 minutes, almost always spot on 200 C on this setup, once I hit FC my next target is first signs of SC in the vicinity of 225 at around the 19 minute mark, if during the period between FC and SC the beans are showing signs of too much heat (excess smoke) I will drop the temp of my heat gun by about 50, this slows things down nicely.

    At the very first snaps of SC I stop the roast and cool it fast (approx 1 minute) in my cooler, its usually bagged within a couple of minutes of roast end.

    Temperatures I have mentioned are obviously unique to this setup, but are 100% reliable for my purposes.

    I don't have problems with uneven roasts, tipping, divots or under/over roasting, always seem to be able to hit my target without difficulty.

    Been using this device for almost 10 years and estimate I have completed over 300 roasts on it.

    Will post some pics below, happy to answer any questions.DSC_0277_669x1000.jpg
    Not big-headed at all as far as I can tell Yelta. Just a statement of fact really. Your consistency is what everyone should be aiming for and I'd certainly be disappointed if I wasn't achieving that after 10 years. I'm sure you still learn things as you go.
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  36. #36
    Senior Member readeral's Avatar
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    The massive benefit of the Coretto over the KKTO is the unadulterated access to sensory indicators when roasting. Getting your roast down pat isn't big headed, it's helpful to know that's (hopefully) down the track!
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  37. #37
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Your consistency is what everyone should be aiming for and I'd certainly be disappointed if I wasn't achieving that after 10 years. I'm sure you still learn things as you go.
    Yep your right, 10 years is a pretty fair apprenticeship, your right again, one thing I have learned is you never stop learning.

  38. #38
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    Thanks for a great post. As time goes by I find different blends but love the thick pour with the IEH Monssoon. It's my Blender of choice but I need it to be a lesser bean.
    More like 35% with Ethiopian Gamballa Sundried. A really nice bean mix.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Been roasting EH for quite some time, really enjoy it as a SO so suspect I will handle 50% without a problem, time will tell.
    Yelta - The constant feedback I ve got with the EH is that its really mild ! Have you had the same experience or am I roasting too light and maybe need to go closer to SC. Thoughts? So far I ve tried CS 8 & 9 and both were fairly "mild"

  40. #40
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by themortalbard View Post
    Yelta - The constant feedback I ve got with the EH is that its really mild ! Have you had the same experience or am I roasting too light and maybe need to go closer to SC. Thoughts? So far I ve tried CS 8 & 9 and both were fairly "mild"
    As with most beans I take this variety a few seconds into second crack, not to the point of being oily, big chocolatey viscous pour with great crema, one of my favorites.

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