So, just to clarify about the 'staining' comment previously - here's a photo of the machine today, still looking great, perhaps not quite as shiny as the new models...
Is anyone else using Breville The Smart Grinder Pro BCG820BSS?
Would be interested in seeing which number people are using for the grind setting also the time they are using to get the correct amount of grind in both the single and double baskets which are included with the machine.
Trial and error for me, still haven't found that sweet spot just yet - not far away though !
Java "" phile
Toys! I must have new toys!!!
Are the VST baskets worth the money with this machine? What are the other alternatives if they aren't worth it?
Thinking a new tamper may be a worthy upgrade from the include sunbeam tamper..
Hi everyone at Coffee Snobs! First-time poster, long-time lurker Brett here.
I've found a lot of advice on this forum very helpful over the years which resulted in obtaining my first proper coffee setup a couple of years ago consisting of a Sunbeam EM7000 & Breville Smart Grinder Pro.
The EM7000 came about when Harvey Norman had it for sale at $399 in approx. June 2014 although I didn't start using it until August 2014, and have been maintaining it as per the user manual with regular clean & descale cycles & the replacement of the internal water filter & group head seal after the first 12 months of operation. In that initial 12 month period I had a factory warranty repair to replace the steam wand which was never right from the get-go out of the box - it never felt like the tap/dial properly closed off the steam and eventually it would follow-on with a lot of noise & steam after operation. The repairer (Ewings in Nowra, NSW) said that it appeared to have a fault with the dial however it was quite corroded & affected by scale and it was replaced under warranty.
Once the steam module was replaced it operated much better, however over time it has gradually started following on after use (not as bad as the first time). From what I've read on here I understand this is fairly common with EM7000s however if my last module was corroded after less than a year I don't hold great hope that this one will last a lot longer into the future. The water I use is boiled & filtered with a Brita carbon filter, so nothing too drastic - I guess the Brita filter doesn't remove a lot of the metals/minerals?
The other problem is that I've stripped the philips-head slots in the screw that holds the shower screen so now I can't properly clean the group head and replace the O-ring seal. The machine is now out of factory warranty coverage however at the time it was purchased with the Product Care up-sell which at the time seemed to be a good investment. It turns out that given the purchase price was less than $400 their policy is to just offer $399 store credit at Harvey Norman rather than send it for repairs. I decided to get a quote (from Regional Appliance Service in Fairy Meadow, NSW) and it was over the $240 mark, so not worth the investment for something that in all likelihood will be lucky to last for another year or so before more repairs.
The problem is that given the initial purchase price was so low I don't have a lot to play with and looking at what's on offer at HN I'm pretty much limited to the Breville BES920 & Sunbeam Torino manual machines or a whole bunch of automatics which I'm not interested in. So if of you Snobs out there are happy to offer some advice, I'm wondering whether I should:
a) persevere with the EM7000 & get it repaired by an authorised repairer
b) as above however attempt to do the repair myself, however void the Product Care warranty
c) make the Product Care claim and put the $399 towards something at HN... but what?
d) acquire a taste for tea
For options a & b above (and probably all options) I might have to look at improving my water supply - flavour-wise I'm happy with what I'm producing now but I'm more concerned with the scale/corrosion. I live in Wollongong so it's not like we're on bore water here.
I haven't bothered fiddling with the factory settings of the EM7000 but am pretty happy with the results out of the box. I would love to have the time to fiddle with the settings to get things ideal however I have a two year old time-vampire that leaves me to prioritise employment/sleep/cleaning (not necessarily in that particular order) over playing with my own toys. I'm happy with a set & forget machine that gives feedback on group pressure & milk temperature so both the wife & I can use it without understanding too many of the intricacies.
Any feedback would be much appreciated!
Coffeehack what sort of coffees do you usually make? And typically for 1, 2 people or more? Cheers
Hi Scott, I'm generally pulling flatties using a double basket, occasionally with the single basket, although sometimes I'll just make espressos for myself especially if I get the chance to try out some single-origin beans.
On weekdays we're making two coffees for my partner & I in the morning, she's less-confident with the grind/dose/tamp process but (like me) finds the pressure gauge on the EM7000 very helpful and once the group handle goes in it's easy just to press a button and steam the milk. On weekends there's usually an extra 2-3 cups made per day however when people come around they know we have "good coffee" at our place so I could spend a good 15-20 mins pumping out 5-10 cups in one go.
I've been reading further on here and I'm starting to think another strategy is for me to put my $399 credit towards the Breville "Dynamic Duo" BES920 & Smart Grinder Pro (which retails for less than the stand-alone BES920???), then on-sell the two items as new stock and get a non big-label appliance from somewhere other than Harvey Norman...
Any advice would be appreciated!
VST: Given your grinder, yes, absolutely. Get a lot more and better flavour out of your fresh beans. Stale beans - explore how bad they can taste.
new tamper: Probably. VSTs require a flat base on the tamper - no US, Euro or whatever curve. Some SB tampers have a flat base, however my 7000 doesn't.
Hi. I'm not sure if my new questions about the EM7000 should go here or in another place... (let me know if otherwise)
Does anyone know of a tamping mat that fits the portafilter really well for using on the side of the bench? I've seen some that have a recessed spot for the spout and I'm not sure if these need to match properly or if any of them would be OK.
Which leads to another question... do you prefer to tamp with the spout taking the weight, use the little tamp pad on the side of a bench, or a mat like I'm asking about, or...?
When I clean out my portafilter, I always have to take the basket out as there's water trapped in there. Is that normal? Do you all have to do that too?
I'll have more later, I'm sure
Last edited by lindsayward; 25th November 2016 at 09:46 PM. Reason: update/add to question
Hi lindsayward, for me I just rested the group head onto the side of a hard bench with the pad that comes with the handle when tamping. I've recently upgraded to a proper HX machine, and have had to get a "tamping station" to cater for my new Bezzera group handles. I've just checked and this fits my EM7000 handle/spout for tamping without putting any pressure on the spout, however because of the rubber tamp pad already on the handle it sort of defeats the purpose resting it on the tamping stand.
As for the portafilter basket issue I know what you're talking about and I did the same with my EM7000. Generally though I believe that with pro gear the basket should be pretty tightly held in the group head, although I don't see it as being a problem with the EM7000 - it might mean that the spring in the head eventually fails but from my experience it's likely that many other parts of the machine will fail first!
How do people go with the temperature gauge for milk steaming?
I normally steam about 180-200mL and find when I go up to the coloured portion ("correct" temp) my resulting latte is a bit too hot, so I've started stopping before it gets to the first grey area.
If you are curious, beg, buy or borrow a medical thermometer and use it to calibrate your gauge - I have seen over 6 degree Celsius variations on 7000s. Also, bear in mind that the 7000 gauge is, of necessity, attached to the wand. It measures some consistent combo of milk temp and wand temp which will vary according to your technique.
I'm the owner of an EM7000 and would love some comments/ideas if anyone has any.
Recently, after a basic barista course, I decided to upgrade to a Macap M4D grinder for ease of use in the mornings when I am running out the door.
The EM7000 was used only sporadically so I have done a descale cycle (virtually no dirty water) and remove and cleaned the shower screen and grouphead.
I'm using freshly roasted beans with a VST 18g basket and the flat tamper that came with the SB.
I think my grind is fairly close, I get a 6-8 sec lag time with a 28-32 second pour, very dark and nice looking crema.
The flavour doesn't show any characteristics of being over or under extracted (I spent a fair bit of time over Christmas dialing-in the grind, so I did taste it when it was over and under).
There just doesn't seem to be the 'body' or depth of flavour. I've experimented with 18g/18.6g/19g. Tried a few different milks and variations in temp for the milk, same deal.
Any ideas??? Is it time to consider adjusting the extraction temperature?
1) Roasts take a while to develop. Lights take weeks, darks are the oft quoted "4 to 11 days". If the coffee is still slightly green / underdeveloped it will be OK taste but lack body and richness / depth - sounds close.
2) VSTs - they need a coffee grind a lot finer than standard espresso. Some trad grinders(or badly calibrated ones "out of the box") cannot do that fine a grind without going bitter (poor particle spread). So you grind coarser and overdose it and then run the shot short to try to compromise your way out of the mess... exit regional characteristics amongst other things (like body, depth, quality).
3) VST's also hate severe under / overdosing. Which begs the question - have you actually checked the dosing with scales? I have been to cafes that stick close to 30g in a 15g double! Needless to say, easy to sort.
If it is none of those, send me a PM with more details and I will try to sort it remotely for you.
It may be the roast - I'm not sure - I'm using it within the guidelines on the bag.
I can definitely play around with a finer grind and see what the results are. Yes, weighing the dose every time at the moment as I haven't programmed a time on the M4D yet.
HI guys. thanks for all the info in this thread. I picked up a em7000 a few days ago. I think i may have the leaky steam wand issue where steam still seeps out the nozzle after it is shut off for 20 sec or so, until i jiggle with the switch a little, then it stops.
Also, is it 'normal' for water to constantly drip from the shower screen after each shot, and often just after it's been turned on.?
I'm finding there's very little room for error in the dosing/grind/tamp in order to get a propper shot pulled in 25-30 seconds with gauge in the orange. often seems to be pouring best if it's a bit shorter (20-25 sec) and in the first grey mark on the pressure gauge.
Finally, i can't seem to get a 'positive' 5 cent test without loading at least 22-24gms into the PF (double shot). Best pours have been with 19-20gms so far but leaves a soggy puck
Any thoughts, suggestions on these issues would be greatly appreciated.
My EM6910 has been retired to the recycling bin after 5/6 years of good use...a great workhorse it's been, but the group head collar was badly worn and I had been troubled with leaks and the necessary shim use for the last year. I'm handy, but it just became too much of a burden...I could have bought and fitted a new collar but another expensive component could have failed at any time of course.
As for the EM7000...it seems an excellent machine overall....
To me, on the plus side:
#Milk texturing is much faster than the 6910 (look out - that steam wand roars) AND it the steam shuts off when you turn it off (no milk spluttering over the bench if you withdraw the milk jug too soon :-)
#The milk temperature sensor/gauge seems accurate (consistent with my Davis & Waddell milk thermometer).
#All of the loose parts from the EM6910 appear compatible with the 7000, including the group handle and screw-on screens (and the 7000 does not come with double baskets...but the 6910 doubles fit, if ever needed).
#It is way quieter than the 6910 !
On the minus side ?
>>The hot water pipe is fixed (not a biggy)
Making consistent, satisfying coffee seems a breeze right now*.....in tandem with my Cafe Series EM0480 Conical Burr grinder, the whole process has been quick and easy for this first week of use.
*but hey....knowing me, things could turn turtle at any time...fingers crossed.
I will have to read this whole thread, just bought a 7000, and relegated my 6910, with a new collar to the holiday place.
Only read the first and last pages.
Paired with a shimmed 480, 7/15/ VST, Pullman 19/22, naked P/F, so lots to play with and try, and a brand new SS PF.
On another thread Tampit said something like the 6910 was the better of the 7000 and 6910 for making microfoam.
Well that sure seems to be the case for me.
Noisy the 6910 maybe, but steam making/microfoaming with the 4820 nozzle is excellent.
However, after another factory setting descale, using a vinegar solution, the steam is better this morning. So the 700 has come up a bit in my ratings.
I do like the quiet too.
My $205.00 purchase needed $147.00 spent on it to get it to go.
New solenoid fitted, it failed, then replaced again, and now it seems fine.
Should have bought new!!
And I do think the factory setting for descaling is a great idea.
I doubt it had been done to this machine.
Last edited by rawill; 5th December 2017 at 02:53 AM.
[ Update ]
Here we are in late December 17 and I'm still very happy with the 7000.....good espresso, made quick and easy.
If I want micro foam milk (we use 2% light for everything at home), I just place the milk jug so that the wand is immersed a couple of mm and leave it alone....until the milk temperature gauge arrives at the sweet spot. One should pour immediately of course, so the espresso run needs to preceed the finish of the milk. If I want frothed milk, manual handling/angling of the jug is required of course....but that too is easy to achieve.
As for grinders, the EM0480 that came along years back with the with the old 6910 machine is still going like a new one !
So I removed the shower screens on my EM7000 to clean and check the seal, and as I removed the lower screen, the upper screen fell out along with a small washer. Now my problem is that I don't know whether the washer goes between the screens or above the upper screen. Exploded parts diagrams I've found online don't show any washer there.
Has anyone else encountered this on their EM7000 or 6910?
The reason I was checking the seal is because I was getting watery shots all of a sudden and it seemed water was leaking underneath the filter basket but not out around the group handle. The puck seem to be lifting after pouring the shot. Turns out my double filter basket was cracked partway around the edge. Don't know if this is a common problem or just me overdosing and/or tamping too hard.
Some feedback on my own question - I reassembled the shower screens with the washer in between the upper and lower. Shots seem to be pouring ok with the single basket.
Mine gurgles and a little steam comes out the outlet in the drip tray. Is that normal?
Yes mine does it occasionally too. As long as it’s not constant I guess.
When? If itís only when you turn it on itís fine, if itís all the time itís a problem.
What temperature water output is normal for this machine. I thought my shots were little low in temp. Just measured the water using a probe thermometer with water directly through the shower screen and its only about 71-2 degrees. Is that normal?
did a factory resets, clean cycle, had my mate come down, tried resetting temps via the manual no change ,grabbed a digital thermometer and only getting max 74
any suggestions folks , i am only a newbie, good guys said they will do a new machine exchange, just got to drive back to cairns,120ks
cheers for advice
That is a puzzle. I don't think the 7000 is as good as the 6910. I have both.
But I have not got the cold problem you speak of. My 7000 was bought second hand.
Hope someone who knows comes along.
You should get the thermoblock set temperature immediately then it will drop off by a few degrees by the end of the shot.
How are you performing the measurements and with what equipment? If it's just a milk thermometer or similar then it won't respond fast enough. Ideally you want a thermocouple connected to a multimeter which will respond much faster.
You can try adjusting the temperature to see if it has any effect on the shot. With the machine off, press and hold the one cup button then press the power button then release the one cup button. It will stay illuminated indicating factory default.
The two cup button is +second crack, the program button is +4C.
Picked up new machine whilst doing the first clean through tried to adjust temp still only getting basically 75 deg c
what are other members getting?
suppose to be pre factory set at 92.
I am new. What temps are required?
I think your issues lie elsewhere rather then the machine not getting hot enough. I'll take a measurement the next time I have one just so you have a reference.
I've probably worked on at least 70-100 of these machines by now and I've never seen one have a low temperature problem. I've seen a few with over temperature problems associated with relay failure but this is a different issue.
I also measured 75C on my EM7000 using a styrofoam cup. I initially thought something was wrong but eventually learned to make beautiful, sweet, shots on it. It's likely your machine is working well, I would focus on the basics of technique.
I bought with with it a Breville smart grinder pro.
May I ask what possibly fellow members who have this combination what settings they run their grinder
i understand different beans etc you need to adjust. Is there a good ball park place to start?
i am a newbie so I hope it’s not a silly question.
Earlier on on my first machine I seemed to be hitting the mark but then it just all changed. The pressure gauge wouldn’t even move.
Thanks in advance. Pat
Interesting isn't it, as well as frustrating. Reminds me of my earlier ventures into making coffee, now a few years down the track it can all seem so easy.
But I can still get caught out.
First. Does your coffee taste good. If it does, then don't stress, just keep working on your technique.
Second. If you have not got one, get a naked P/F and see what you can see.
This has to have been the best investment I made in trying to understand the flaws in my technique, and I still have them!
Third. Don't worry about what others set their grinders to. If yours in like the EM480, they are all different and you have to adjust them to suit your machine and your style of coffee needs.
Fourth. Keep hunting out info and reading to build up your knowledge so you have more points of reference.
Hunt out some posts by Journeyman, Tampit, Dimal, Yelta, Noidle22 and others to see how they solved issues and advice they gave.
But remember, this subject is a bit like wine, so many opinions and ideas, so many tracks to follow, but as long as you get there.
I started with a Breville Bar Aroma or similar and an EM 5600.
Now using EM 6910 and EM7000. So still some way to go, but I am happy.
And I used either Decent Espresso or VST baskets along with naked P/F.
Naked or bottomless Portafilter. No spouts just a hole underneath, You can see the bottom of the basket.
Google it you will find one.
Darkfalz, I have had my EM7000 for 3 years now. Very impressed with it EXCEPT started getting leaks around the Group Head Collar & loss of pressure with ground beans/water squirting everywhere. Had a re-read of the manual & realised the blue coloured silicone seal under the Shower Head needed replacing as it's a wearing consumable item. SO, thinking I could save a few bucks by doing the seal replacement myself I try to unscrew the shower head retaining screw but couldn't - the screw was too tight. THEN, off to the nearest authorized Sunbeam Service Centre for a pro to fix it. I go there, very friendly chap, remembered me calling the day before & he turned my unit upside down & started to unscrew the shower head retaining screw. BUT, he had the same problem, screw wouldn't budge at first. AFTER a number of attempts, different screwdrivers, SUCCESS, removed the components & pulled out the ORIGINAL seal. He was amazed it was the original seal & replaced it with a new one. He was going to throw the original seal away but I took it & studied it closely to see how it had deteriorated. After reinstalling all the disassembled components in reverse the job was completed. Handing over the $25 I was most happy & couldn't wait to try it out as this baby works hard pumping out a minimum 9 cappuccinos a week year in, year out. Get home, first pour awesome, pressure needle half way in the orange zone, awesome pour, great coffee! THEN, loss of pressure, leaks around the group head collar, actually WORSE than before with original seal from Factory when new! Also, the Group Handle was very loose when locking it in all the way & it had very little resistance while turning/tightening.Scratching my head & very frustrated I started analyzing what the real issue was here. Dissasembling the shower head assembly myself was easy now as the retaining screw was easy to undo & I had a good look at what was happening inside the seal/collar. IMMEDIATELY, I noticed that the new seal finish level was a fraction of a millimetre lower than the surrounding metal inside the collar & this resulted in a loose/poor contact when the Group Handle was tightened to the lock position. COMPARING the bright new blue seal to the original worn discoloured blue/brown/black one I suddenly noticed, the original one was slightly different in overall height as there was a "raised ring" on the largest diameter surface of the seal. Rubbing it with my finger, a very thin sliver of blue silicone seal came off! THERE were in fact 2 seals on top of each other, not just 1 as in the replacement seal!! BINGO! now I understood what was happening & the REAL PROBLEM here causing loss of pressure, liquid squirting out under pressure from the Group Handle. The thin sliver of silicone seal was a shim/ packer used to increase the overall height of the seal when assembled so as to ensure a TIGHT/SNUG seal! I reassembled the unit & tried the Group Handle - SIGNIFICANTLY tighter & felt more like when the unit was NEW. Thinking I've now found the real cause of this issue, I thought about INCREASING the overall height of the seal even further to see what would happen. SO, finding a very thin rubber ring/washer (about 1/3 of a millimetre thick) in the workshop I thought about also adding this under the replacement seal with the added sliver of silicone seal on top & WOW!! RESULTS - now BETTER than when new, awesome soft feel when tightening the Group Handle, beautiful firm/ solid resistance when in lock position, consistent orange zone pressure readings time after time using same beans, same grind, same techniques. RECOMMEND this to ANYONE with loss of pressure issues, old sealing ring problems. VERY HAPPY CHAPPY.
AAAAh - the wall of text! It got me!
A week or so ago, tried to steam milk but cold water was being pumped instead . Reading various threads (possibly mainly this one), it looked like the relay for the steam thermoblock was the likely culprit. Anyway, put into repair shop and mentioned the relay.
Just received the machine back and it turns out that the wire to the steam thermoblock was broken, so no new parts needed - just repair and test time (approx $120). Back to making great coffee again!