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Thread: Rocket Evo V2 or Profitec pro 500

  1. #1
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    Rocket Evo V2 or Profitec pro 500

    I have it down to 2 heat exchangers, but t he rocket is a rotary pump while the proftec is vibration
    what do you guys think, I dont mind paying for the extra, and can I also descale the rocket evo at home; because I can for the profitec

  2. #2
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    I would plumb it in if you can. You have to put in water filtration inline but most of this can do double duty, the sediment and carbon filter for both drinking water (from a separate tap) and then a T branch to the machine with an inline water softening cartridge.

    You plumb in the drain too. Once you do it, you reap the benefits plus a rotary pump sounds better and has heaps of pumping power.

  3. #3
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    Did you also consider the ECM Technica Profi IV rotary?
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  4. #4
    Senior Member matth3wh's Avatar
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    Rocket Evo V2 or Profitec pro 500

    Definitely consider if you want to plumb in. RE: pump noise - Pro 500 seems like they've done a good job with designing rubber mounts to dampen the normal vibe rhythms.

    Plenty of in depth YouTube videos to see the insides and compare features of these excellent machines.

    +1 for the Profi IV rotary. Probably compares nicely on price too.

    Are you in around Sydney or Melbourne?

    Plenty of site sponsors happy to show you machines and make you a nice cuppa

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    Did you also consider the ECM Technica Profi IV rotary?
    yes I have looked at it, and it is a beautiful machine but I am more a knob guy rather then a joy stick on espresso machines; overall its actually a great machine

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    Quote Originally Posted by matth3wh View Post
    Definitely consider if you want to plumb in. RE: pump noise - Pro 500 seems like they've done a good job with designing rubber mounts to dampen the normal vibe rhythms.

    Plenty of in depth YouTube videos to see the insides and compare features of these excellent machines.

    +1 for the Profi IV rotary. Probably compares nicely on price too.

    Are you in around Sydney or Melbourne?

    Plenty of site sponsors happy to show you machines and make you a nice cuppa
    no actually in the states

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    well I am learning more about espresso machines everday but if I wanted a DB I would get the Profitec pro 700, the reason why I dont want to get it becasue of descaling; but if have soft water (which I dont know yet, going to do a water hardness test) I am prob going to save my pennies for the profitec pro 700 with the pro t64 grinder and plus that in with the BWT bestmax filter from Wholelattelove.com so I will not need to descale for a very long time, otherwise I am prob going to go with the profitec pro 500

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    Quote Originally Posted by kRnD3m0n View Post
    yes I have looked at it, and it is a beautiful machine but I am more a knob guy rather then a joy stick on espresso machines; overall its actually a great machine
    I reckon it is a marketing mistake. I have even had an experienced person at a coffee machine place here in Perth put me off this machine because of it. It is a fad IMHO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wattgn View Post
    I reckon it is a marketing mistake. I have even had an experienced person at a coffee machine place here in Perth put me off this machine because of it. It is a fad IMHO.
    I was a little concerned when I bought mine (two machines ago) but didn't have any problems with the joysticks. It really was a great machine and I wouldn't have any problem going back to it.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    Did you also consider the ECM Technica Profi IV rotary?
    I did and it is a very nice machine. I ended up getting the Wega Mini Nova Classic from LBM here in Perth. I've had coffee machines before so I knew what to look for. I think the ECM is slightly nicer externally but the differences are minimal and I wasn't sure about the joystick valves. The Wega is a good name Italian brand too and for nearly $800 less than the ECM, it was a no brainer for me and left enough money to buy a grinder as well.

    The ECM has a dual tank / plumb option though and a gauge for line/head pressure which the Wega doesn't have. The extra gauge though isn't that useful as pressure is generally a set and forget once done.

    I wouldn't be afraid to buy on price too as long as it is a machine from a reputable maker and the supplier is helpful and good at after sales service.

    I couldn't be happier with my machine anyway.

    Out of the two machines, both are great but I like the attention to detail and the great manuals that the Rocket have in their machines.

  11. #11
    Senior Member matth3wh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wattgn View Post
    I have even had an experienced person at a coffee machine place here in Perth put me off this machine because of it. It is a fad IMHO.
    I'm intrigued to hear more about actual reasons informing said experienced person's opinion. I would imagine the design was one coming out of a decision around ease of use. Another potential option, is developments coming from commercial equipment where turning steam knobs all day leads to RSI for the barista. Of course, not such a big factor in the home environment. ;-) ... but ease of use is a worth while engineering pursuit. Along those lines they've made improvements to standard style rotary valves, easier to turn and no crush seats. There's commercial machines with steam foot pedals, but that might be going a bit too far for a home machine again. ;-)

    Regarding the OP topic, it looks from post #95 here that kRnD3m0n is going with a Profitec Pro 700.

    kRnD3m0n, wondering if you're close to stores like (east coast/west) Whole Latte Love or Seattle Coffee Gear or 1st Line equipment to be able to play with some machines in store and check out some more water filter options...?
    Either way, worthwhile getting a water test kit and check for published TDS for water in your area...
    Last edited by matth3wh; 2nd November 2016 at 12:07 PM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by matth3wh View Post
    I'm intrigued to hear more about the actual reasons for the basis of this experienced person's opinion.

    Regarding the OP topic, it looks from post #95 here that kRnD3m0n is going with a Profitec Pro 700.

    kRnD3m0n, wondering if you're close to stores like Whole Latte Love or Seattle Coffee Gear or 1st Line equipment to be able to play with some machines in store and check out some more water filter options...?
    Get a water test kit and check for published TDS for water in your area... :-)
    i wish not in new york or seattle not even LA
    you know how much easier it would be then, to be able see the machine and get it demo out

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by matth3wh View Post

    I'm intrigued to hear more about the actual reasons for the basis of this experienced person's opinion.
    I guess simple enough. They sell the range of ECM machines and they had customers who had complained that they didn't like the joy stick controls after they bought them. I think he didn't like them either. He was the service guy who has been there for a long time, a long time. I was surprised and I know opinions are just that, it can vary.

    I still think it is risky business going to these controls. It follows fashion but fashion can change. I just think normal valves are not a problem and therefore doesn't require a solution. I would personally want to use the machine if it had joy stick valves before buying it and be 100% sure it is what I want.

  14. #14
    Senior Member matth3wh's Avatar
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    Good to know. I'd be interested to hear from site sponsors and other repairers more on differences in servicing... but perhaps the answers could be added on to this existing thread Knobs or Levers or solenoids

    Good luck with your machine kRnD3m0n and your water. Many happy coffees to you. :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by matth3wh View Post
    Good to know. I'd be interested to hear from site sponsors and other repairers more on differences in servicing... but perhaps the answers could be added on to this existing thread Knobs or Levers or solenoids

    Good luck with your machine kRnD3m0n and your water. Many happy coffees to you. :-)
    well I am not sure what I will get but first what I am going to do, I have some water hardness strips coming soon, so I am going to test my water which is past throught an RO membrane filter; if that mattters I am also having my freind take a look at it if a plum options is even a possible(o yea hes a plumber over 30 years. my RO mebrane filter prob is good enough I belive it is Reverse Osmosis water coming out.
    so i am going to test the water and go from there

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by kRnD3m0n View Post
    well I am not sure what I will get but first what I am going to do, I have some water hardness strips coming soon, so I am going to test my water which is past throught an RO membrane filter; if that mattters I am also having my freind take a look at it if a plum options is even a possible(o yea hes a plumber over 30 years. my RO mebrane filter prob is good enough I belive it is Reverse Osmosis water coming out.
    so i am going to test the water and go from there
    RO is the worst possible source of water, highly corrosive to boiler and lines. Best water actually has slight tendency to scale and alkaline.

  17. #17
    Super Moderator Javaphile's Avatar
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    Most home RO systems now come with a remineralizing cartridge. Even those with-out one may be suitable for use in an espresso machine as home RO units do not output pure/lab grade water.


    Java "Test, test, test." phile
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    Toys! I must have new toys!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by wattgn View Post
    RO is the worst possible source of water, highly corrosive to boiler and lines. Best water actually has slight tendency to scale and alkaline.
    i mean thats what I got to work for, and from what I hear RO water is good to use but (and is a real big) it can reduce your sot taste.
    unless if i get the profitec pro 700 with plumb in with the bwt bestmax but i alreday have a water filter alreday in, the one we drink our water in the RO membrane filter; it is a Coway CHP-250 if that helps
    but that would cost a big price tag if i am able to put another water filter onto our alreday one

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by wattgn View Post
    I guess simple enough. They sell the range of ECM machines and they had customers who had complained that they didn't like the joy stick controls after they bought them. I think he didn't like them either. He was the service guy who has been there for a long time, a long time. I was surprised and I know opinions are just that, it can vary.

    I still think it is risky business going to these controls. It follows fashion but fashion can change. I just think normal valves are not a problem and therefore doesn't require a solution. I would personally want to use the machine if it had joy stick valves before buying it and be 100% sure it is what I want.
    Well they've been using them on commercial machines for 30 odd years so they can't be too bad. Unless the reasons for this person's dislike for them were clearly explained I'd say they were either a muppet, or doing a sales job and steering you towards a machine that had a better margin.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Well they've been using them on commercial machines for 30 odd years so they can't be too bad. Unless the reasons for this person's dislike for them were clearly explained I'd say they were either a muppet, or doing a sales job and steering you towards a machine that had a better margin.
    I dont think so. It was an honest opinion. In the direction was down in price as the Technika was the most expensive of the ECM machines they had.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by wattgn View Post
    I dont think so. It was an honest opinion. In the direction was down in price as the Technika was the most expensive of the ECM machines they had.
    Down in price can still mean up in margin. But assuming that wasn't the reason for the opinion why didn't he like them? Was it levers in general or just the ECM ones? I don't have heaps of experience with them, but I really liked them when I used them on my old Faema Due.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Bean_Coffee View Post
    However, knobs have an upside in that they allow you to control pressure.
    Cheers, Paul
    The only problem I see from that perspective though, is that the more you throttle the steam output, the cooler the resulting steam will be and probably more condensate too. With full steam output being used, have always found that using the correct size jug for the amount of milk to be textured, resulted in the best quality milk afterwards - Always more creamy and silky...

    Always have about 4-5 different sized milk jugs on hand, but mostly only use 2-3 of them.

    Mal.
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    Resurrecting on old thread.

    I also am looking am looking to upgrade/change from my VBM Jnr HX (which has been great BTW) and like the look of the Pro 500, Mozzafiato Evoluzione R (2017 Rocket) and the ECM T IV profi.

    Obviously there is the vibe of the Pro 500 difference, but then things get pretty closely matched.

    One thing I have read is Pro 500 vs ECM vs Rocket in boiler material is Copper vs SS vs Copper with different end plates not sure what that means, and knobs vs levers as discussed above.

    Aesthetically I like them all, with the rocket having the tick, though my head says the ECM has is over the other two regarding the position of the gauges as I reckon some water staining may be likely as I don't religiously clean the outside of the machine now.

    I guess any previous experience from others regarding reliability would be appreciated, though I am aware that all machines can have niggles regardless of their manufacturer.

    So looking to hear opinions.

    Ta

  24. #24
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    Hi piccoloman.
    I have owned the Pro 500 for almost two years now and have had no issues or regrets. It's a great machine.
    Almost bought the ECM, they are very similar, really just came down to a coin flip.
    Although the other two brands were on my initial list, I quickly zeroed in on these two brands as the German engineered/Italian made appealed to me.
    As I don't have any first hand experience with the Rocket or VBM, I'll let other owners comment on them.
    Good luck with your purchase.

    Mal

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    My 2008 Rocket Premium - still going strong - has the brass end plates. It is my guess that the boiler end plates being flat brass is used because it is stronger. I don't think I have see on this forum a problem mentioned with these end plates. Mine look as good as on the day I first used the machine.
    I have see problems with stainless steel mentioned.

  26. #26
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    I have owned the Pro 500 for almost two years now
    Brewster, good to hear. How have the gauges gone, any water staining over time, from splashing or steam residue?

    in regards to boiler materials, I vaguely remember reading about stainless steel possibly being higher long term maintenance? Not sure if true or not.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by piccoloman View Post
    Brewster, good to hear. How have the gauges gone, any water staining over time, from splashing or steam residue?

    in regards to boiler materials, I vaguely remember reading about stainless steel possibly being higher long term maintenance? Not sure if true or not.
    Gauges are fine, no problems with steam, water stains or anything else. Having said that, I do wipe any splashes after every session, it only takes a few seconds and keeps every thing nice and shiney
    As for the stainless steel boilers, like a lot of things, there are arguments for and against. I won't offer an opinion either way as it didn't play a role in my decision.
    I believe that sometimes we overthink these kind of things. In my opinion, most machines in this price bracket are of a high standard, and with a minimum of TLC and will not let you down.

    Cheers
    Mal
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewster View Post
    Gauges are fine, no problems with steam, water stains or anything else. Having said that, I do wipe any splashes after every session, it only takes a few seconds and keeps every thing nice and shiney
    As for the stainless steel boilers, like a lot of things, there are arguments for and against. I won't offer an opinion either way as it didn't play a role in my decision.
    I believe that sometimes we overthink these kind of things. In my opinion, most machines in this price bracket are of a high standard, and with a minimum of TLC and will not let you down.

    Cheers
    Mal
    Your are correct about overthinking, but it is part of the fun.

    Thanks for for the info.
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  29. #29
    Senior Member Brewster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by piccoloman View Post
    Your are correct about overthinking, but it is part of the fun.

    Thanks for for the info.
    Definately, I'm as guilty as anyone for going into too much detail.

    and you're welcome.

  30. #30
    Senior Member Brewster's Avatar
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    How have the gauges gone, any water staining over time, from splashing or steam residue?
    Hi again piccoloman.

    After your questions regarding water stains on the Pro 500 gauges, I took particular notice of splashing when making my afternoon coffee today.
    I'm happy to say that no water splashed on the gauges at all. The bit of splashing that occurred during back flushing was mostly on the lip just above the drip tray.

    Mal
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brewster View Post
    Hi again piccoloman.

    After your questions regarding water stains on the Pro 500 gauges, I took particular notice of splashing when making my afternoon coffee today.
    I'm happy to say that no water splashed on the gauges at all. The bit of splashing that occurred during back flushing was mostly on the lip just above the drip tray.

    Mal
    Good to hear. Sounds like it not a problem, I just thought it might be.
    i reckon it probably between the profitec and the new rocket evo R.

    I think the rocket is not available for a few months, so plenty of time to think about it.

  32. #32
    Senior Member trentski's Avatar
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    Rocket gpp owner here since 2009. Its been rock solid no reason to upgrade unfortunately.
    No issues with splashing due to drip tray design, i backflush with the tray in, maybe thats the secret.
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  33. #33
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    image.jpg Next to each other. ECM looks great in person, but don't want levers.
    Last edited by piccoloman; 12th March 2017 at 12:51 PM.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by piccoloman View Post
    image.jpg Next to each other. ECM looks great in person, but don't want levers.
    When I was considering the ECM, I was given the option of swaping levers for knobs by the retailer at no cost. Would be worth asking if thats your preference.

    Mal
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  35. #35
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    Does the ecm have cool touch steam wand? The silicon sleeve says it doesnt. Definitely worth having, makes cleaning milk off it a breeze

  36. #36
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    The ECM has cool touch wands, plus the sleeve/grip. I preferred the levers and after almost 6 months I certainly don't regret the decision, a simple flick and you have full steam, another and it's off.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stu76 View Post
    .... I preferred the levers and after almost 6 months I certainly don't regret the decision, a simple flick and you have full steam, another and it's off.
    Stu76, can you feather the pressure on the water or the steam. So if you want less pressure?

  38. #38
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    I honestly don't quite understand the desire to control steam power. My ECM (with levers) runs at 1.5bar, which is a bit higher than a Technika normally would, but I still wish I had more guts in it for more speed. Of course, that's my experience, but I'm doing what everyone want to do: make between 1 and 10 milk drinks. It's fine.

    If you want to do less milk, same pressure, smaller jug. Find yourself a ~200-250ml jug and nail your technique for your piccolos.

    I'm not convinced that a rotary valve would offer you any linear control of steam pressure. Give it a few months, and then you'll likely just resort to using full pressure.

    But the Pro 500 will get you there if you're really keen on it.

    If staining is really your biggest concern - cleaning glass is easy enough. Cleaning that ECM badge - much more of a pain in the ass. I was was wrestling with it myself today. If that's really the only thing dividing the machines, get the Pro 500 and your rotary valves.
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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by readeral View Post
    I honestly don't quite understand the desire to control steam power. My ECM (with levers) runs at 1.5bar, which is a bit higher than a Technika normally would, but I still wish I had more guts in it for more speed.
    Fully agree with Al on this. The rotary valves on my Pro 500 have never been less than fully open when steaming.
    Steam power is usually one of the top for reasons for upgrading, most people wanting more, not less.
    See my post #30 re overthinking things
    Best way to convince yourself that this will not be an issue would be to get into a store and try both machines. Plenty of site sponsers more than happy to help.

    Mal

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    image.jpeg Desicion made. Waiting till may or June when released. Sold my vbm to a friend in discussion yesterday. New machine will go well with my fausto.
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  41. #41
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    Very nice.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by piccoloman View Post
    image.jpeg Desicion made. Waiting till may or June when released. Sold my vbm to a friend in discussion yesterday. New machine will go well with my fausto.
    This is also probably what I'm going for, but the Mozzafiato style instead. Would love to get the ECM Technika IV Profi/Switchable instead but it's too wide for my current kitchen :/ Rocket Evo R is 28 cm wide vs Technika's 32.5. Will await your and others' reviews

  43. #43
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    Well done, decision made, time to move forward and enjoy.
    I am very happy with other members of the Rocket family, both old and new.


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