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Thread: Quamar grinders

  1. #1
    TC
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    Quamar grinders

    I am hoping to have a play with these soon...They are Fiorenzato based.

    There are 2 which I plan to look at:
    • M1E which is slow speed conical. Speedwise, it looks to be somewhere around K10 (perhaps a little faster)
    • M80E is planar and might be a Super Jolly competitor- but for little more than Mini-manual RRP

    What's nice?
    • Price
    • A super short hopper will go on each and you could then have a big conical for the home which is about 500mm tall.
    • Colour choices
    • User interface. Amazing functionality.

    Any good? Dunno....Anyone used one?

    Stay tuned....

    .PDF attached.


    M1E_en_web.pdf
    Last edited by TC; 3rd October 2012 at 08:22 AM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Looks the goods doesn't it?

    This from the company website:

    "In December 2005 Quamar buys the company of a historical operator of this sector as Fiorenzato" (sic)

  3. #3
    TC
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    Looks the goods doesn't it?
    Sure does. The workmanship looks terrific. The interface is Macap like- but with waaaay more functionality.

    I have seen them in white and black and they look schmick.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Pavoniboy's Avatar
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    I use a Fiorenzato Doge 63, which I think the Quamar M80 is based on. I love my Doge. Grinds like Super Jolly. Well built. Easy to clean out retained grinds. Built well.
    I haven't used any E models yet.

  5. #5
    tek
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    I have one grind on demand easily adjustable 3 dose settings bigger cutters and significantly cheaper with bigger cutters than a mazzer mini e

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    Senior Member NakiChap's Avatar
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    hello just wondering your thoughts on these grinders.

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    I've just scored a secondhand M80E in very good condition. I think I have the electronics etc figured out, but if some kind person has a copy of the manual I would be eternally grateful.

    I'm also keen to learn from others the best way to grind on demand using this unit or other similar electronic dosers. My previous grinder was a Rocky doser, where I weighed the beans and distributed using the doser. Worked well, but becomes tedious after a while. The Quamar M80E seems to grind and dose very consistently, but I worry how it would perform without the weight of beans in the hopper.

    Thanks Everyone!

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    I have had one of these for just over a year now. It's a white M80E

    Very happy. It's rock solid in performance. Has a good quality, well engineered feel overall

    Seems to handle anything I've thrown at it with ease. Eg the beanbay Maui mokka come out of the roaster like tiny black diamond-hard nuggets. A friend's mahlkonig vario choked on these beans (as does the built in on my old BES800 coffee machine) but the Quamar laughs at them like they are just coco pops

    Only gripes are pretty minor:
    - control panel/lid on top of funnel sometimes pops off and needs to be pressed back on
    - if dosing using manual button I find the touch sensitive button can be a bit unpredictable and sometimes take a couple of presses to turn off
    - auto dosing system under doses progressively as the hopper gets near to emptying. Probably similar on most brands I'm guessing
    - hopper is fine but a bit plasticky compared to the super solid body

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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Sure does. The workmanship looks terrific. The interface is Macap like- but with waaaay more functionality.

    I have seen them in white and black and they look schmick.
    so, what happened to the Quamar grinders ?
    i have not heard much about them lately, though I notice they have some new models out overseas. IE, small 50mm unit with electronic doser !
    the T48 "retro" look unit with 83mm burrs looks to be much more compact (shorter) than the similar big burr grinders (MMajor, K8 etc ). Anybody use one at home ?

  10. #10
    TOK
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    It looked promising early on because of the .....price....and apparent similarity to other good commercial grinders.

    But there were a lot of bugs to iron out....

    And over time, it became clear it was simply way better to pay more for the usual suspects and have long term reliable trouble free operation, than pay less and....

    Then they seemed to upgrade themselves a bit and appointed an importer here, but after the first contact he seemed to disappear into a puff of smoke and....

    ...Here we are !

    They had a stand at HOST last year but I didn't stop to talk this time round.....

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    They seem to get a good rap on the Euro and US forums, and the suggestion is that most of the range were the Fiorenzato grinders renamed. ? ( and there is another brand that seems to be poorly represented ?)
    maybe the Italians keep all the best stuff for themselves ?

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    They are sold by a non-sponsor supplier here in Sydney. I very nearly went for one, but the reputation of the Mazzer got me. They do look good, and yes apparently they were to have a smaller prosumer, Mazzer Mini E type model available soon - haven't been back there for a while.

    Also a quick google and it appears CS sponsor Silipo Coffee sell them.

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    Thanks for the tips.
    I have also heard that there will be a Quamar display at the Aroma fest in Sydney this weekend
    i still find it odd that they, ( Quamar and Fiorenzato) get practically no mention on forums or product reviews.
    I also felt your comment as to why you chose the Mazzer was interesting, ...reputation , as there seems to be a different view in the US where the Mazzer (domestic) grinders are viewed a little like a 1980's Mercedes sedan .
    That is rock solid reliable, but has been long super ceded in performance, value, features, and user satisfaction by various newer products .
    im not suggesting the Quamar is that machine, but it's difficult not to get swayed by "peer pressure" and outdated information.."...especially when there is not much balanced info available on new offerings .
    no mention of the new M50E on any of the local sites though ?
    Q50E.jpg

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    I remember seeing them at MICE this year but I might be wrong but I thought they had another name. Anyway I was really interested in them and the salesman said the price was around $800 for the smaller one. Sort of equivalent to the functionality of the mazzer mini e as well as looks but a few hundred dollars cheaper but Its hard to go against a proven performer. I'd love some more info.

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    Agree with you there b52, but if i expand on that 'reputation' to mean wide availibility of parts, service, advice, support from a local CS sponsor, the mazzer represented a safer bet for a me. Mind you I was every bit impressed by the Quamar grinders when I first looked and I am sure I would have been happy with it. BUT I am very, very happy with the coffee in my cup and that is the most important thing. As for peer pressure? I treat reviews like the scoring of judges at the olympics, delete the highest and lowest scores or ignore the most glowing reviews and the worst reviews.....when you look at it that way there aren't many reviews to read.

  16. #16
    TOK
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    Yeah, the bane of professional equipment vendors...."reviews".....very often written by clients that have the experience of one, at home, for equipment that is designed for use in cafe situations....not testing what the grinder is actually designed for. Obvious example: US forums write reviews on these grinders. Quesiton: Are they writing the review from the point of view of use in the field the equipment is designed for (busy cafe / business / office situations), or from a home use situation. The industry looked at these as a total "brand" from an industry viewpoint and found them to be lacking. My (re) view, is that they will probably make a reasonable home grinder where they are not subject to the pressure of use in the area thay were actually designed for, and where few are used....

    As stated up top in a round about way.......initially, its the price tha makes them attrractive. After that, it depends on the situation.

    Whereas, with known name brand equipment, whether some very foolish possibly non industry reviewers write off some models as seeming to be 1980's mercs, you get what you pay for, which is what it is designed for. And if I may add......who are these reviewers? Do they have any credentials and the expertise to say stuff like that? Take "reviews" with not a grain of salt, but several, please.

    And of course that is not to say that the model which is the subject of this discussion is not a great grinder....for home use....which it is probably not designed for.....regardless it may be great at home, where it will get far less than the designed use, at a great starting price tag.

    Confused yet....you should be , because this is the strange world we live in.

    Hope that helps.

    EDIT. It has been said above that these babies have some tie up with Fiorenzato......please note Fiorenzato grinders are built like the proverbial brick shee-it houses and are quite expensive in the scheme of things.....so i wouldlnt necessarily think that the "base price" brand discussed here has much in common internally....no?
    Last edited by TOK; 23rd July 2014 at 08:20 AM.
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  17. #17
    TC
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    I had a look/play with one of the digital ones last year.

    Whilst the interface is fine and they outwardly look somewhat similar to the Mazzer offer, I thought that they were not finished as well- especially around the lid and cone which were of inferior construction in my opinion- so we didn't range them. The one I sampled had a black crackle finish and I thought it would be difficult to keep looking good/hard to clean.

    Would they be fine in a home situation? I see no reason that they wouldn't. Buyers should consider that some of the more obscure stuff is harder to to move if/when a sale is being considered. It may well be that the actual cost of ownership is higher. As always, it's up the buyer to determine what best suits.

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    Gents, just considering the domestic situation here, not commercial applications .
    the "Merc" reference was most likely directed at the Mini Maz E which has often been seen as the "standard" by which other home grinders are judged.
    i suspect we all might argue that there are other options that compete with and even out perform that unit now..Macap, Compak, etc ......and the Quamar M80E (km II ?). is a similar machine that under cuts the Mazzer by a few hundred $$s in the US. Hence it's popularity I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOK View Post
    ....... It has been said above that these babies have some tie up with Fiorenzato......please note Fiorenzato grinders are built like the proverbial brick shee-it houses and are quite expensive in the scheme of things.....so i wouldlnt necessarily think that the "base price" brand discussed here has much in common internally....no?
    i think it's well understood that Quamar took over the Fiorenzato business a few years back and have simply "rebadged". Some of the designs.
    just compare the Quamar t48 and the Fiorenzato T48.


    Then with regard to the M80.....
    from the Quamar site.....
    DescriptionM80 Quamar Grinder


    If it is already difficult to copy a product as T80, then why change it? With the M80 we have tried to modernized the aesthetic of the well known T80, without changing the internal components. So we can introduce to our customers a product reliable, with known performaces but with a renewed look, that follows the modern aesthetic tendencies maintainig it recognizable at the maximum, conserving dimensions.
    with the T80 being the previous Fiorenzato model.

  20. #20
    TOK
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    S'pose you understand there were two (2) Fiorenzato grinder businesses operating....same name, different companies. Not many on here would know that.

    All my references are to Fiorenzato as it still exists, building quality if exi grinders. Readers shouldnt confuse Quamar with Fiorenzato...the one that still exists.
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  21. #21
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Correct TOK.

    When Fiorenzato isnt Fiorenzato?

    Pavoniboy's post #2:


    "Re: When Fiorenzato isnt Fiorenzato?
    Okay, Im going to answer my own question now. After a lot searching I didnt find an answer and posted here. Then I kept searching and found the answer shortly after posting here.

    Anyway, in case others are interested:

    quoted from 1st line equipment (USA importer of Fiorenzato - the Fiorenzato that makes the Doge that is):

    "As for Fiorenzato; long story short.

    As explained by the Export Director at Quamar, back in the 40s, Mr Fiorenzato started a coffee grinder company. His two sons took over and they split. One of their daughters husband is using the Fiorenzato name because they have a right to use their last name in the company name, and this is their web site (removed). 1st-line has been contacted by them and 1st-line has evaluated their grinders in Milan, Italy, but there is no business relationship at the time of this writing. Just a little tidbit that we are not sure of the validity - the engineers who left this original company went on to work at Mazzer and Macap.

    Of the original company, the T80 molds of the grinders were sold to another Fiorenzato company. This company was previously named Quamar by Fiorenzato. Due to the confusion, they recently changed their name to only Quamar. Web site is (removed). 1st-line now has a business relationship with Quamar after evaluating their grinders. Keep in mind that 1st-line does NOT stock parts for the former Fiorenzato T80 as this grinder is very old and we were advised that parts were different.

    Finally, the name Fiorenzato was sold to the current Fiorenzato Macchine per Il Caffe. This company currently owns the rights to the Fiorenzato name in Italy with many entailing lawsuits, but the original company can use the name because of the last name rights. 1st-line was a distributor for their products through their previous USA office. This summer, 1st-line has become the importer for the USA.

    I hope this clears things up...." "

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    When Fiorenzato isnt Fiorenzato?

    Pavoniboy's post #2:

    Of the original company, the T80 molds of the grinders were sold to another Fiorenzato company. This company was previously named Quamar by Fiorenzato. Due to the confusion, they recently changed their name to only Quamar.

    Finally, the name Fiorenzato was sold to the current Fiorenzato Macchine per Il Caffe. This company currently owns the rights to the Fiorenzato name in Italy with many entailing lawsuits, but the original company can use the name because of the last name rights.

    I hope this clears things up...." "
    Clear as mud that lot !
    So it seems that "Quamar" is the original Fiorenzato company..dating back to the 40's and makers of the T80, T48 etc

    The current Fiorenzato MC , makers of the F5, F6 etc,.. owned by Macchine per Il Caffe, who are based in Peraga di Vigonza, apparently only producing the current range of Fiorenzato grinders . ??
    ..but infact has since been partly acquired by Grimac SpA, under their group Cogeco SpA. trading as "Fiorenzato CS " based in Bologna, who produce the Fiorenzato brand of espresso machines , Ducale, Briccoletta, etc... ???????????


    It seems the "Doge" grinder was developed under the management of the Macchine per Il Caffe group as a separate brand.
    however, that brand seems to be currently traded under the Cogeco group, "Fiorenzato CS " ,
    ....
    So we seem to have 3 companies with a take on the Fiorenzato name ?

    and just to confuse things, the Grimac site states that their Cogeco group acquired 100% of Macchine per Il Caffe in 2011 ??
    so i still dont understand hoe Fiorenzato MC still exists separately ?

    ..Heavily edited to attempt some clarification of this situation !
    Last edited by blend52; 23rd July 2014 at 04:40 PM.

  23. #23
    TOK
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    hahahahahahahahaha !!!!!!!!!!!! That is why I kept my references to Fiorenzato short and sweet, otherwise its clear as mud

    Look seriously I think you can simplify it a lot more and no one is going to bother about the details.....

    Try this:
    The company that made the "Doge" and other models including a range of espresso machines under the same name (Fiorenzato) got out of them say around.....5 years ago.....actually the company's principle business was as a coffee roaster. Cant remember the name of the roastery....they offloaded the equipt biz.

    The OTHER Fiorenzato only makes grinders. This is the one that is still going. The grinders are quite DIFFERENT to the ones above. Diff company remember........

    As far as I know (and what would I know ) the other Fiorenzato name (the one that was sold off...not the one that still makes grinders NOW under the name) was recently acquired by a financing company that does just that...it acquires companies and does stuff with them. So the Fiorenzato company that shall we say, went out of business (the one that used to produce the "doge") is now back in business but is NOT the same company.....This same financing company also acquired the Grimac name, and some others.....all defunct in terms of their original companies and names.

    Are you confused yet ???

    All you need to know is....the Fiorenzato company that produces grinders under that name currently, most probably has nothing to do with the "Quamar" name, which will be whatever is left of the *other* Fiorenzato company.

    Seriously, who cares what Quamar used to be. Its what it is now that counts.

    Hope that helps.

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    ...All you need to know is....the Fiorenzato company that produces grinders under that name currently, most probably has nothing to do with the "Quamar" name, which will be whatever is left of the *other* Fiorenzato company.
    Yes but.... there are still two (2) different companies currently making grinders under the Fiorenzato name ..
    FiorenzatoCS, (Bologna) make the Doge, Junior, Maxima, etc
    FiorenzatoMC (Vigonza) make the F5 F6, F71 etc

    ...... all in addition to the Quamar brand!

  25. #25
    TOK
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    Hi...yeah....sometimes on forum discussions get padded up by information that just isn't relevant.

    I would look at it this way.

    The company that went down or went out or just went elsewhere and is now somehow resurrected.....I would say...."Fiorenzato" who? In terms of its brand awareness or even market penetration here.....Forget it.

    Fiorenzato, not the one that went down. Yes going strong, but nothing to do with Quamar.

    Quamar. Should be judged according to its own merits, not on the basis of some perceived similarity to others...

    That's just my take, and would simplify the discussion markedly.
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    I just found this video of how to program this grinder. It looks really good. I want one! I'de love to know about its consistency, longevity and serviceability.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouu4FbI4EtE
    Last edited by barri; 24th July 2014 at 01:10 PM.

  27. #27
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    I'd prefer one of these...

    Mal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    I'd prefer one of these...

    Mal.
    Only problem with one of those is that with heavy use, eventually the 'buttons' on the display stop working - seems to be a weak point of the design.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MorganGT View Post
    Only problem with one of those is that with heavy use, eventually the 'buttons' on the display stop working - seems to be a weak point of the design.
    You've experienced this have you, 'GT?...

    Mal.

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    Do we have a sponsor who sells Quamar grinders?

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    ? Weak point of the design ? ... I thought these were the grinders that TOK said were built like "brick dunnys" ?

    Barri.... It was mentioned earlier in the thread,....Silipo in QLD are stockists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    You've experienced this have you, 'GT?...

    Mal.
    Yep, quite a few of the G.O.D. Fiorenzatos I come across (that were imported and put into use by one of the roasters we work for) have had problems with the electronics, mostly with those buttons. They aren't a mechanical type of button/switch, they are a touch-sensitive design that doesn't seem to survive heavy use well. Quite a few of their G.O.D. Fiorenzatos have been rewired to completely bypass the electronics, so they are a purely manual G.O.D. grinder.

    Other than the electronics, Fiorenzatos are mechanically very reliable. We import some ourselves and have worked on a lot of others brought in by another roaster we used to work for, and I would consider the common F5 and F6 models to be close in quality/durability to the Mazzer Super Jolly and Major.
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  33. #33
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Interesting 'GT...

    No doubt feedback to Fiorenzato has been completed; can't imagine they would be happy with this...

    Mal.

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    Oddly, other than the Breville spread, and a few Lelit's on JB's stand at the Aroma Festival, the only domestic grinders on display/sale were the Quamar range !
    I think the M50E ( MiniMazzer competitor ?) had a $650 price tag. ?

  35. #35
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    We are Quamar stockist and also the repair warranty service for them under our All Fixed Coffee Services brand. We have now had Quamar grinders for over a year and they are excellent grinders. We are especially impressed with the home Q50 which sells in a couple of colours and also a full electronic version for $895 as well as a push version for $695. We have three Quamar's on our benches at present. We have a Q13 Electric GOD(previously called a M1)$1850, a M80 Electric GOD and on display we have a new Q50 in white which looks awesome. Besides a few usual small issues with computers a year ago the new version which is much easier to use we have had no problems at all. We use approximately 15 in all our accounts and all are giving us pleasure and no head aches. If anyone would like to come in and try them out it would be a pleasure. Richard

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    It's been almost two years since the last posting.

    Any more information on the quality, performance and durability of Quamar? I'm in interested in Quamar 80E.

    Thanks.

  37. #37
    Junior Member foxfraser's Avatar
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    Maybe ask K Bean, I was speaking to him recently about the Q50 and he definitely recommends them, here's a short review he's done...

    Quamar Q50 Push grinder (with timer) - short review

  38. #38
    Senior Member iggs's Avatar
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    I'd also be keen to hear some longer term reviews. Interested in a q50

  39. #39
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    I can't give a review from personal use, but I can tell you that Cafe2U use Quamar grinders. They started switching over to them about 4-5 years ago and as far as I know every van in Australia will be using Quamar now, with some vans probably onto their second one. As you can imagine they get a fair hammering in this sort of setting and I believe that Cafe2U have been more than happy with their performance, durability and ease of use.
    From what I hear the finishing on the current range is a bit nicer than when they first came out as well as they were a bit utilitarian initially. As I said it's not a personal review so take it as you will, I only know as a family member works for Cafe2U.
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Bean_Coffee View Post
    Absolutely correct Leroy.
    I am new to this site and I need help with parts for my Quamar M1. I am in the USA and no help here. This site and the post seams to know about the Quamar grinder. Can you or someone on this site help me with this. The doser board and cover needs to be replace. I can do this if I can find the parts. Thank You Phil

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    Hi Phil,

    Have you tried contacting Whole Latte Love or First Line. I believe they are based in the USA and selling Quamar grinders.

    Quote Originally Posted by pweagle View Post
    I am new to this site and I need help with parts for my Quamar M1. I am in the USA and no help here. This site and the post seams to know about the Quamar grinder. Can you or someone on this site help me with this. The doser board and cover needs to be replace. I can do this if I can find the parts. Thank You Phil

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    I found a company in the US Nuova Ricambi USA in California they are the Quamar importer I think they can help Thank You for your help an advise. If I can be of help to you please post or email pweagle@bellsouth.net

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    Re: Quamar grinders

    Hi K_Bean_Coffee. In the market for a new grinder. The beginning of this thread mentions build quality issues with the Quamar grinders. That was some time ago. Can you tell me how the current build quality compares with the Compak K3 Touch, Macap M4D and Mazza mini electronic? (Things like the hopper lid's plastic quality and fit). Also, how does the timer adjustment intervals and consistency on the Q50 Push compare with the Q50 E? I'd want the timing function to very consistent and the steps not too big. If the analog version works well on both those counts, that would do me.
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  44. #44
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    Thanks K_Bean. I'm assuming you're replying to me (but I'm not Leroy). The grinder I'm replacing is a first generation Breville smart grinder. I like the timer as it makes it easy for my wife - I adjust the grind and the timer and she's set. Can you tell me how well does the analog timer on the Q50 push work compared with the electronic timer on the Q50 E?

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    Great! Sounds good. Thanks K-Bean.
    kbc likes this.

  46. #46
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    How does Q50p stack up to the macap m2m?

  47. #47
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    I too am on the market for a new grinder and I like what I read on the Q50p or Q50e.

    I also am moving on from a very old Sunbeam and just hate the mess. I think I'm drawn to the funnel aimed directly into the basket but of course I'm realistic and know they'll still be mess just a reduced amount.

    Can anyone advise on the timing for both single and double shots?

    I've read a lot of posts and I think a lot of perspective is required when buying anything coffee related, for me, I'm a coffee maker, not a barista, I'm a domestic user not commercial, I make circa 20 shots per week on average not 2000. I just think it's very easy for non professional snobs to get caught up in a lot of hype and end in a confused quagmire. Just sayin'.

  48. #48
    TC
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    Hi Paul,

    I'll qualify this contribution by declaring that I have never even seen a Q50P. I guess it fits into our buying guide Buying guide- coffee grinders | Talk Coffee in the manual doserless/analogue timer doserless category? To make a valid comparison to the E5 et al, you move to the digital timer category in my opinion so you'd be comparing the Q50E to the E5. I would have thought Q50P would compare to a Compak K3T, Macap M2D or similar. Apples et al as they say.

    I use digital timers all the time and the good ones just work. I still classify them as the "aspirational" grinder for the majority of home users: More expensive, but great gear. I still dislike the Mazzer mini-e (appalling bang for buck) as all competitors in class literally blow it into the weeds.
    Last edited by TC; 15th May 2016 at 04:50 PM. Reason: additional info and examples
    Dimal likes this.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Bean_Coffee View Post
    Hi Richard,
    Many people (including myself) don't use the timer function at all. The" grind to fill," then swipe across out the top technique is great. That's one reason I like the Quamar Q50 Push. It's great for the "grind to fill" technique, but still has a timer function if you want to try it out.
    Cheers
    Paul
    Thanks Paul

    But the "grind to fill" takes a designated amount of time, what would a single and a double shot take to grind on this?

    I have read good info on various snob threads that certain grinders can grind shots faster than others including some higher end domestic units

  50. #50
    TC
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Bean_Coffee View Post
    Good points Chris.
    I put this in the middle between push to grind and full electronic grinders because it does still have a timer option.
    re Mini E - agree 100%.
    i.e: same class as M2D, K3P et al (analogue timer and push to grind).

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