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Thread: BeanBay Green Bean Release - April 2016

  1. #1
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    BeanBay Green Bean Release - April 2016

    BeanBay Green Bean Release - April 2016
    Available in BeanBay now:

    Panama Finca La Mula Geisha


    Panama Finca La Mula Geisha Special Reserve
    Possibly one of the most awarded coffees in the last year, it won the "Best of Panama" competition, it was the highest scoring coffee review coffee for the year and Gridlock roasted it to win gold in the Golden Bean single origin espresso category.
    Yes, this is a very special coffee.


    Stock levels are tiny and the price is high due to import duties, permits, freight fees on such a small lot but if you are lucky enough to afford to try it you should be blown away.


    Honduras Montana de Comayagua


    Honduras Montana de Comayagua.
    This large bean, fully washed, high grown Honduran coffee is a ripper.
    Most Central American coffees can be a little thin but this one has a surprisingly good body. In the lighter roasts (CS8) the zesty citrus peel acidity shines through, taken a little darker (CS9) it becomes crisp, green apple like acidity. Really interesting coffee that works in a wide range of roast depths and should work in a wide range of brewing styles too.



    ...the required fine print...
    (with the exception of the 1kg Maui, 1kg Congo, 1kg Panama and the 2kg Elephant Monsoon) All BeanBay green beans are packed in 2.5kg zippered cotton bags, perfect for storage for up to 3 years when kept in a cool, dark and dry position. We ship paid orders out from the Snobbery Monday to Thursday and BeanBay will show the available shipping options to your area. Larger orders are typically cheaper to freight per kilogram so we suggest ordering all your requirements at once. We also strongly recommend that you ship to an attended address (eg: work or grandma's house) to avoid delivery delays.


    Enjoy!
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    I'll tell you what, you wouldn't want to drop a bean or two of the Panama when transferring to the roasting chamber

  3. #3
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    No argument at all with the pricing, at the end of the day the market has set the price and I imagine Andy's price is as good as you will find it for anywhere -BUT!...its the rule of diminishing returns, a coffee that costs nearly 20 times as much as many fantastic coffees from regions all over the world cannot be 20 times better. Given my experience with Giesha's I would also say its a very different flavour profile and it wont be to everyone's taste. Kudos for Andy giving us the chance to try it if desired, but I for one know my $280 is better spent elsewhere!!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry O'Speedwagon View Post
    I'll tell you what, you wouldn't want to drop a bean or two of the Panama when transferring to the roasting chamber
    dialling in grinder too

  5. #5
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
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    Its only $5.60 per 20 gram double shot. Sounds like a bargain if you look at it like that. I have paid that much for "coffee" at a cafe and it was rubbish.

    Cheers
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  6. #6
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Guess it depends on your definition of a bargain.

    As Jules remarked in Pulp Fiction "may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'd never know" @ approx .33 cents a gram roasted waaaaay too rich for my blood.

    No matter, I'm sure Andy will have no problem finding buyers, to those who do take the plunge, enjoy it, oh, and don't over cook em.

  7. #7
    Senior Member trentski's Avatar
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    The Panama would be worth it just for the cool drawing of a dog on the packet

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by trentski View Post
    The Panama would be worth it just for the cool drawing of a dog on the packet
    Dog/Mule same thing :P

  9. #9
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Its got a head like a cow moose.
    Last edited by Yelta; 7th April 2016 at 01:48 PM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by artman View Post
    Its only $5.60 per 20 gram double shot. Sounds like a bargain if you look at it like that. I have paid that much for "coffee" at a cafe and it was rubbish.

    Cheers
    Good point but don't forget to allow for 15% weight loss when roasting. That pushes it up to about $6.60 per double.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    Good point but don't forget to allow for 15% weight loss when roasting. That pushes it up to about $6.60 per double.
    Spot on Flynn, see my post, #6, did the arithmetic and like you got .33 cents a gram = $6.60 for 20 grams.

  12. #12
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
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    Oops. You're correct , I didn't take into account the moisture loss.

    Would be good to go in with a few people to make the cost more palatable (pardon the pun)

    Cheers

  13. #13
    Senior Member Gavisconi007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Spot on Flynn, see my post, #6, did the arithmetic and like you got .33 cents a gram = $6.60 for 20 grams.

    Should we also be making an adjustment for grind retention and resultant wastage?

  14. #14
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gavisconi007 View Post
    Should we also be making an adjustment for grind retention and resultant wastage?
    If that's what floats your boat.

    PS !6% is significant.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Gavisconi007's Avatar
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    So it would be $6.60/0.84= $7.86. Or $6.60 for Nino owners.......

  16. #16
    Senior Member greenman's Avatar
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    Imagine the nighmares one would have if you botched the roast 😠😠😠😠😠😠
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    Any chance Andy could bring back the sampler pack and include 500 grams of this in it? Be good to practise on. Shouldn't cost much.......
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  18. #18
    Senior Member Gavisconi007's Avatar
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    Yeah.......would be sleeping in the shed that night for sure.

  19. #19
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArnhemR View Post
    .....a coffee that costs nearly 20 times as much as many fantastic coffees from regions all over the world cannot be 20 times better.
    Ahhh... this is where you are wrong. Your statement and math would be true for nearly any other seriously expensive coffee and certainly true for anything that came out of a critters backside but not true for this one.

    This is the most amazing coffee I've had the pleasure to roast and drink. YES it was a nervous roast of a couple of kilos and YES you are very careful with how you roast and use it but ahhhhhh.... the aroma off the grinder fills the room with truly intoxicating florals and fruits and unlike any other bean I've ever used/seen/tasted.

    A commercial roaster came into the Snobbery and bought 6 kilos for his own consumption after smelling the grind.

    I ran this coffee in two Brazen brewers side-by-side at MICE. One brewed at 89C and one at 92C so people could smell and taste the difference in accurate brewing. There were some seriously wide eyes and open mouths over the 3 days. Mostly industry people find it hard to have one of those gobsmacking moments after years in coffee but this coffee certainly delivered in spades.

    I must say, as an espresso it was very good but in the Brazen it's stunning.

    The other observation was that it got better and better for a long period, maybe 3 weeks until it peaked which is a first for me too.

    Should you buy it for the experience? Well, that's up to you. Once you try it you can see why it is a magnet to awards.
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  20. #20
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    This is a good reminder for me to pick up a Brazen. Too much water temperature variation from my cheap kettle! The difference in tastes in the Ardi is ludicrous: can be berries and blueberries to a slightly grassy berry brightness from the same batch.
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  21. #21
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    ... not that I need a reminder. Now, what do I gotta sell on Gumtree...

  22. #22
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprezzatura View Post
    This is a good reminder for me to pick up a Brazen. Too much water temperature variation from my cheap kettle! The difference in tastes in the Ardi is ludicrous: can be berries and blueberries to a slightly grassy berry brightness from the same batch.
    EXACTLY. You really notice temperature effect on lighter, fruitier roasts and it's nearly impossible to manually pour anything with repeatability (regardless of how hard you intently stare at the water coming out of the neck of an Egyptian kettle)

    I wasn't really trying to plug the Brazen but yeah, once you have that fine level of control it's really hard to go back. We have been smashing-out stunning long blacks which ooze body and fruit. Make the same coffee as an Americano on the espresso machine and it's pale in comparison. Paula drinks the Brazen brews with a splash of milk (like you would make instant coffee) and much prefers that to stodgy buckets of milk.
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  23. #23
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    EXACTLY. You really notice temperature effect on lighter, fruitier roasts and it's nearly impossible to manually pour anything with repeatability (regardless of how hard you intently stare at the water coming out of the neck of an Egyptian kettle)

    I wasn't really trying to plug the Brazen but yeah, once you have that fine level of control it's really hard to go back. We have been smashing-out stunning long blacks which ooze body and fruit. Make the same coffee as an Americano on the espresso machine and it's pale in comparison. Paula drinks the Brazen brews with a splash of milk (like you would make instant coffee) and much prefers that to stodgy buckets of milk.
    Well, I can't wait to get one! No Americano I've had can stand up to a superb filter brew. My Aussie family are true converts (OK, so the folks still drink instant at home but they vastly prefer pour over) and are becoming choosy about where they get a flat white or a long black (increasingly our place; part of the reason I've been ordering more green).

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    Funny how the community is so divided over a geisha. For years now I've wanted to see rare micro lots available from CS without having to pay $100 a kg from others. Even something from Aida Battle would be awesome - we haven't had her coffee for years.

    Coming back to the specialty coffee - do the beans really hold a $100 value when scored above 95? Or do the Auctions just push the prices up this far? Is each lot a different size in weight? Are cafes buying and saying well we could make 40 coffees at $5.50 a pop so we'll charge $100 a kg?

    What are your thoughts on "specialty coffee"?

  25. #25
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    I second your desire for Aida Batlle coffee, I've never managed to source greens from her. The geisha price is absolutely market driven. Lots of demand, very little supply. I recently spoke to the head roaster for Double Roasters and they do not buy geisha purely because they can't get enough to make a difference to their business.

  26. #26
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Its all very subjective, some of us will happily pay very high prices for perceived higher quality commodities be it coffee, champagne or caviar, others like myself are content to consume very good commercial grade products.

    If it floats your boat and you can afford it why not? although my take on the subject is that when you consume the very best of anything on a regular basis it rapidly becomes the norm, in other words the special becomes mundane! where to from there???

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    Very good point about the caviar etc. I went to corinthians the other day, all they had was a five senses kenya AA. The profile was raspberry, white chocolate with green apple acidity. Well its identical to the Kenya AA from CS. No raspberry, no white chocolate. Green apple acidity yes.

    This is probably a poor example as that cafe has gone down hill but i do witness some cafes to be exploiting things.

  28. #28
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Not wishing to labour the point re special things, but I will.

    When I was a kid, many many moons ago, we enjoyed special foods at certain times of the year, Mum would roast a rooster at Christmas, perhaps a few prawns, a leg of ham was on the table, nuts, cherries, glace fruit, perhaps turkey and very rarely crayfish, I'm sure others can add to the list.

    Nowadays these delicacies are available to most of us all year round, nothing is special, even hot cross buns are on the shelves the week after Christmas, and stay there until well after Easter, 3 months of hot cross buns, I think you know what I'm getting at.

    I like to leave some room at the top for special things, be they, food, beverages, travel, family get together's etc, then when we encounter something special we recognise it as such and enjoy it all the more.

    That's all I have to say about that.Forrest.jpg
    Last edited by Yelta; 10th April 2016 at 04:07 PM.
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  29. #29
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    I second your desire for Aida Batlle coffee, I've never managed to source greens from her.
    You could have bought it here!

    We were selling her coffee before it got trendy (and expensive)


    El Salvador Aida Batlle SHG - $11.00/kg*


    El Salvador Aida Batlle SHG is well processed, washed and graded. Roasted to a CS9 it's bright and crisp like a Central bean should be, take it a little deeper into the roast curve and the sweetness comes forward. Excellent coffee with a stunning fruity aroma even as a green bean.
    Monthly BeanBay GREEN Bean Release - SUNDAY 10th Feb 2013 - 8pm AEDT

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  30. #30
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Current pricing/quality is well beyond my resources, but interesting to read about "what's out there"...

    Mal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    Ahhh... this is where you are wrong.
    Actually I dont think I am wrong - with all due respect. I stand by my statement that it simply cant be 20 times better than some of the world's best coffees. I doubt it can be twice as good.

    What it can be is different, and amazing, and worth trying - but 20 times better, NO!

    The real test would be to ask yourself would you be prepared to always pay that much for coffee - if it were really worth the multiple of cost then you would.

    I get your passion for it, and I understand that others are also impressed enough to pay the premium, but it is IMO its driven by marketing, supply & demand - not relative value.

    Its also fine that we hold different opinions, and thats why I am not wrong - anymore than you are.
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  32. #32
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArnhemR View Post
    Actually I dont think I am wrong - with all due respect. I stand by my statement that it simply cant be 20 times better than some of the world's best coffees. I doubt it can be twice as good.
    The good news is that you don't have to justify why you won't buy it. If I could afford it, I would have no problem buying it.
    How can you taste any two coffees and measure one as tasting x times better than the other?
    I would say the high price is driven by the demand more than the premium quality (Andy's description made my mouth water).
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  33. #33
    TC
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    A Barina will get you to the local for a carton of milk just as easily as a Ferrari which is worth 50x the price.

    If there's some left when I next get something from Andy, I plan to grab a bag for our Aillio when it arrives. If I can get anywhere near what Andy has described, I'll call it money well spent as these opportunities are once off.

    Who knows? If a lucky CS'er (or two) happen to turn up on the day some finds its way thorough the shed Brazen we'll have the opportunity for more opinions here which are based on experience rather than hot air...
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    I was lucky enough to go to a friend's house last night where he conducted a little blind tasting of wine. He opened four bottles and decanted them... we could see the bottles but we didn't know which wine was in which decanter. One of them was a 2010 Grange. The Grange was clearly not 10x the quality of the St Henri that was also open, but it was pretty amazing especially taking into account that it was WAY too young (I'm hoping that someone will provide me with the opportunity to taste it again in twenty years). Penfolds clearly doesn't have any issue selling out of Grange every vintage.

    I'm going to be honest and say that I'm the sort of person who would pay for this geisha as a one off... I've decided not to because I'm scared that it will be so good that it will make me relatively less happy every time I drink something else!
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  35. #35
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post



    I must say, as an espresso it was very good but in the Brazen it's stunning.

    The other observation was that it got better and better for a long period, maybe 3 weeks until it peaked which is a first for me too.

    Should you buy it for the experience? Well, that's up to you. Once you try it you can see why it is a magnet to awards.
    Ha, reminds me of the exchange between Lance and Vincent in Pulp Fiction.

    Warning, don't click the link if bad language offends you.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwpcQTLVlJU
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  36. #36
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwantfm View Post
    I was lucky enough to go to a friend's house last night where he conducted a little blind tasting of wine. He opened four bottles and decanted them... we could see the bottles but we didn't know which wine was in which decanter. One of them was a 2010 Grange. The Grange was clearly not 10x the quality of the St Henri that was also open, but it was pretty amazing especially taking into account that it was WAY too young (I'm hoping that someone will provide me with the opportunity to taste it again in twenty years). Penfolds clearly doesn't have any issue selling out of Grange every vintage.

    I'm going to be honest and say that I'm the sort of person who would pay for this geisha as a one off... I've decided not to because I'm scared that it will be so good that it will make me relatively less happy every time I drink something else!
    I've also seen blind tasting where less expensive wines have come out head and shoulders above the premium wine in the tasting, as far as Grange selling out each year, bear in mind the snob value of an bottle of Grange or Hill of Grace on the table, and in many cases its pretty much a case of pearls before swine, no accounting for human nature.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post

    Who knows? If a lucky CS'er (or two) happen to turn up on the day some finds its way thorough the shed Brazen we'll have the opportunity for more opinions here which are based on experience rather than hot air...
    Just a tad curious as to what day that might be???
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