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Thread: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

  1. #1
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    Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi guys, just been trying to help a relative buy a machine and they asked if id ever heard of a Leone BV....its a dutch company apparently, but ive never heard of them.

    I did a search here and apparently someone sold one a few years ago, but thats about all.

    I found this old ebay listing that has pictures of one:

    http://cgi.ebay.com.au/LEONE-BV-2-GROUP-CAPPUCCINO-MACHINE_W0QQitemZ160150816130QQcmdZViewItemQQssPag eNameZRSS:B:SRCH:AU:101


    Just wondering if they are any good....and what the hell that side door is for. hehe ;)



    thanks in advance for any input.

  2. #2
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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    The Leone is a brand range commissioned by Douwe Egbert (spelling???), and built for them by CMA in Italy.

    I could be wrong but I dont think they have been bringing them into Australia for a number of years so are quite aged and certainly more than obsolete in commercial terms....or atleast any remaining examples in my neck of the woods certainly are.....

    In Australia, Douwe Egbert are ofcourse, the two brand names Harris and Piazza DOro.

    Hope this helps.

    Regardz,
    FC.

  3. #3
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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Hey Z, your link cant be downloaded. It can be if evilbay is replaced with ebay.

    Looks like a bit of a dinosaur.

    The side door thingy opens so that the pink bike in the background can be stored ;D

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakal1 link=1192493913/0#0 date=1192493913
    Just wondering if they are any good....and what the hell that side door is for. hehe ;)
    Accepting all the good advice that FC has provided above, it does look like a nice clean unit and as a commercial machine made by CMA it will have good quality commercial grade hardware as its internals.

    With old machines like this though, I wouldnt buy it unless you can personally inspect it in an operating condition or employ the services of someone you trust to do this for you. You dont mention how experienced you are in restoring old equipment of this type but if it needs a fair amount of restorative work, you need to make sure you are up to the task and dont get in over your head.

    Its quite possible of course that the machine is in perfect operating condition and will give you many years of reliable and faithful service..... You wont know that of course without an opportunity to give it a good work over. All the best mate,

    Mal.

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Yeah all valid points.

    What i was mostly looking for was how good a quality i could expect from it build-quality wise.

    Sounds like CMA would be okay, and given the price it wouldnt be too big a risk as its only for home use. Worries me that its got a fair bit of electronics though.

    At least with my LSM i can override the touchpad completely if it fails....but that said, it looks like its got a far better electronics isolation setup that most other older machines ive seen. Its all contained inside a rubber-sealed box which would give it a good measure of protection from steam etc. In mine its all just open.


    Ill try and get someone to go take a look at it.



    Also, is it just me or does the idea of putting wood on a machine full of steam and heat just seem a bit bizarre?

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakal1 link=1192493913/0#4 date=1192505186
    Sounds like CMA would be okay, and given the price it wouldnt be too big a risk as its only for home use. Worries me that its got a fair bit of electronics though.

    At least with my LSM i can override the touchpad completely if it fails....but that said, it looks like its got a far better electronics isolation setup that most other older machines ive seen. Its all contained inside a rubber-sealed box which would give it a good measure of protection from steam etc. In mine its all just open.

    Dont be fooled how well "isolated" the electronics are... The La Cimbali is also well isolated- but that didnt stop the board failing just before I bought it (probably why I got a good price ;))

    The problem with these autos is once the board fails you have nothing - nada.... until you either replace the board (possibly hard to get for that model - but definitely expensive if you can get them) or rewire the machine as a semi-auto (which I will be doing - one day!!)....

    The place where I buy my spares services all kinds of commercial machines.... and you should see the pile of dead "computer boards"..... they are the weakest link in these machines.

    Good luck if you decide to "go for it"...

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Hello again Zakal,

    You asked about build quality...........

    Some brands are built so well (from the point of view of solidity / longevity) that they keep working for what seems like eons after they reach the end of their useable service life.

    Remember I am talking about commerical equipment in commercial situations.

    In that case "build quality" actually works against some store owners who steadfastly refuse to replace crappy obsolete equipment with new equipment (that would transform their coffee from pig swill into something pleasurable), because it still has life left in it.

    I would say the old leone falls into this category.

    You can recondition machines like this right up to as new condition if that is your thing, but if they turn out to be incorrigible coffee burners (as many of them are), *they are impossible (from a commercial vs time spent point of view) to tame down to make them brew at an acceptable temperature.

    There are other brands/models that are easier to "play with" from a "project" point of view, and to get parts for.

    Regardz,
    FC.

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Yeah, thats a good point.


    It was something i started thinking just before....yeah well it might be built fine...but where the hell do i get parts for for it all the same?

    I know with my LSM it was in reasonable condition, but it still needed a few bits and pieces that may have been a bit difficult to source had coffeeparts not stocked them...and even if i got them, i wouldnt have known quite how to install them without coffeeparts great diagrams.


    So yeah...might tell them to give this one a miss actually. Both for that reason and as JavaB says, unless there is a semi-auto option (doesnt look like it) the electronics could be a real bitch to find and replace if they fail.


    Not worth it without having a few hours to play with the machine before purchasing, and thats not an option.

    Oh well, back to looking for some more familiar brands....maybe i might find another LSM so i can steal all the good parts for my machine as a "researchers fee" muhuhahah ;).

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakal1 link=1192493913/0#7 date=1192517137

    I know with my LSM it was in reasonable condition, but it still needed a few bits and pieces that may have been a bit difficult to source had coffeeparts not stocked them...and even if i got them, i wouldnt have known quite how to install them without coffeeparts great diagrams.

    I would definitely suggest that should be the first priority with taking on any of these machines.... If CoffeeParts dont have spares... I wouldnt touch it. The other machines may have some spare parts availability - but at a price....

    (And you wont have Pedro to advise either - priceless!!)

    Good call I feel - give this one a miss.

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Hehehe.....thats just a tad harsh Java.....anyone that buys a machine that originated from this business for example, has ready access to spare parts and sound technical advice on the models, for years to come.

    And dare I say it, *as long as the importer of whatever brand/model someone buys is still in business, the client should be able to expect support dependent in the end, on whether the equipment has reached a certain age and is deemed to be obsolete and nolonger worthy of support.

    So in the event that Zakal has a sudden flash of insight and decides after careful consideration to purchase said Leone, he ***should*** be able to expect support from Douwe Egbert/Harris/Piazza DOro. I would check before purchase.

    Not to say that CoffeeParts doesnt offer an excellent service for the brand/models he supports as a "secondary" (ie in addition to the importer who is the primary) supplier.

    Regardz,
    FC.

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    FC,

    Id certainly agree with you if the model is reasonably current.... but very few of the "bargains" the likes of us buy are...... and the chances of the original importer or seller being around and having spares diminishes with age...

    As you said above, most commercial machines have a "life" beyond which technology makes them obsolete for their original purpose..... and the original supplier has probably lost interest in supporting said machine once it is passed as a "bargain buy" to one of we hobbyists.... who then set about restoring it to (near) its former glory...... something which wouldnt be dreamt of in the commercial world......

    IMHO the restoration of older machines is where CoffeeParts shines..... their aftermarket parts come in very handy (and for a fraction of the price of the genuine spares - which are still readily available by the way - using my machine as an example)

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakal1 link=1192493913/0#0 date=1192493913
    Just wondering if they are any good....and what the hell that side door is for.
    Inside the left door is where milk is put that is fed through the auto-frother located under the left steam knob.

    The right door is most likely there for easier access to the electronics. :)


    Java "Whats behind door #3?!" phile

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    auto-frother?


    ....i think that alone just put me off the machine. ;)

    Have decided to steer them in the direction of a more manual machine (semi-auto). No electronics, pretty accessible brand, and some very recent restorative work done on it.

    Significantly higher price (percentage wise) but not too much in actual dollars compared to what a new machine of this type would have cost them.


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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Sounds better.....just remember, dont buy it unless it can be demonstrated to be working in its entirety for you. ie, everything works.

    For a semi auto, make sure the water pump is actually pumping, and pull water out of the boiler to make sure the auto fill circuit is working ie, a few seconds after you pull water out of the boiler (say half a litre should do it) the auto fill should kick in to refill it.

    Otherwise, just when you thought yous spent enough.....youll need to start spending again! The pump and auto fill box (a simple electronic board) are I guess the most expensive individual parts in a semi auto that need occasional replacement.....

    Good luck,
    FC.

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    Re: Leone BV....anyone heard of them?

    Zakal,

    What FC said above..... plus taste the water which comes out of the boiler.... if it smells / tastes funny then milk has probably been sucked back into the boiler..... which will require a strip down and clean..... and this can also be quite expensive.



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