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Thread: La Cimbali Start M27 DT1 - group produces only steam no water

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    La Cimbali Start M27 DT1 - group produces only steam no water

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Trying to get this machine up and running, but I'm not sure where to start. I had a leak on the pump and found a disintegrated oring. I put it back together and powered up the machine. When pressing the continuous button I got a trickle of water for a second and then nothing. The steam wand works, the hot water dispenser works, but when turning on the group I get nothing but steam. The pump runs and the solenoid is making a nice loud click. Any suggestions would be appreciated!


    EDIT: now i am no longer getting steam from the grouphead although all the other functions are functioning.
    Last edited by mgarst; 23rd February 2015 at 10:32 AM.

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    mgarst,
    Welcome,if you press either double or single shot buttons ,do you get the same result?
    If you do, I would suspect you need to check the wiring to the cigar flow meters as well as the meters themselves.
    These meters do suffers from blockages and you should find them easy to disassemble/clean.
    See how you go there first.
    Cheers,
    Mick.

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    Cigar flow meter? I checked the flow meter and found it free of instructions and passing water well

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    Also now there is nothing when i press any of the dosed or continuous buttons.

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    Junior Member Christiano's Avatar
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    Most likely a blocked jet before the group head follow the pipe down from the group head and you will see a large nut around one inch long, the jet is in there.
    But also check to make sure the pump is alive and well , by checking that the water is flowing out of the pipe when undone.

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    Pump is alive and well. I tested it like you said. I followed the pipes and tried to check that which i think you are referring, but they're made out of brass and the metal was giving without actually turning. Any tricks of the trade for undoing these?

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    Junior Member Christiano's Avatar
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    Be patient , you can use heat , freeze spray, but I have never had to before and I have tackled plenty of these that are more than 10 years old.
    Just spray with inox and leave it alone for a day.. then try again.
    Make sure you use two correct fitting spanners , one on the main nut and one on the bottom and apply even pressure with each one in the opposite direction.
    This will avoid twisting the pipe, if you are unsure we are talking about the same thing post some pic's.
    If you are unsure or think we are talking about two different things

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    image.jpg This is the best drawing i could find. I will try to upload a picture of the actual machine shortly. The pipes i scribbled out don't exist. 1-there is nothing in these holes. 2,3,4 these are the fittings i tried to disconnect that were not budging. 4-this is where i traced the water line coming in. 5-from underneath there is some sort of plug with a large Allen, filter, access port? I have not tried to open it yet. 6-the screw hole for the screen. Could i try to fish into this to clear the debris/clog?
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Junior Member Christiano's Avatar
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    The jet I was talking about is listed on your diagram c241

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    Crap. I will snap you a picture of the actual machine to confirm we're talking about the same thing now, however, i believe the scribbled out line is the line in going to what i labeled as 4. Near as i can tell, though, it's just a coupling-it doesn't look like a jet like i would think of one. It's down inside the machine between the boiler and the front panel. There is no way i can think of to get at it without some serious disassembly. Do you think removing the bolt at 4 where it goes into the group head and using suction or a fish wire would be a potential plan of action?

  11. #11
    Junior Member Christiano's Avatar
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    The jet is inside that coupling , nut at the bottom of that pipe you scribbled out . You have to remove the the front cover to get to it.
    You can't use wire , air etc to remove with out disassembly as the hole in the jet is 0.8mm and also has a mesh filter inside it .
    Send some pics and year date and I will flick you a parts diagram.
    It is possible you have a different variation of this machine.
    There are also m27 models which were basically rebadged Faema and don't have many Cimbali parts in them at all.

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    image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg

    This is my actual machine. The pipe from the group head running down is the one where i believe the jet would be. I haven't taken a serious go at it, but so far it has proven very difficult to remove the side panels. Any suggestion or experience?
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    Junior Member Christiano's Avatar
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    Side panels normally only have one screw to undo at the top in the middle, then lift side panel out and upwards. Then take front panel off. With out doing this you simply cant do the job.

    Trying to undo the pipe on the group head will be of no benefit, the jet as pictured in your diagram is at the bottom of this pipe, about 10cm up from the bottom of the machine. Your machine should have a rotary pump and also
    this jet.

    Vibration pump models don't have the jet.

  14. #14
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    It is a vib pump

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    IMG_0075.jpgIMG_0076.jpgIMG_0077.jpgIMG_0078.jpg

    finally got the sides off, thank you. I thought that was going to be a lot worse than it turned out to be. Going to open up the fitting on the front that we talked about and see what it looks like in there. this will be so much easier now that I can get my hands in there to work!

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    found the problem:
    IMG_0081.jpg

    next problem: when I took the coupling apart that went rocketing out of the machine and i'm not sure how it goes back in. my best guess from the illustration is that the coup points down, or, worded differently, the flat part with the hole is on top, with the washer above it.

    IMG_0082.jpg

    I put it back together that way and this is what I got:




    Everything's good, right? Wrong. Now this is the new problem:



    According to the manual this is the antisuction valve. When I first turned the machine on and began working on it, that wasn't happening. I removed the Boiler Safety Valve and put vinegar into the boiler in an effort to descale when I had the clog (I didn't reaiize the group head water didn't come from the boiler at that time). I adjusted the overpressure valve (which I'll have to adjust back.... any help on that one?), but I did not adjust the boiler pressure valve. The heat keeps building until the pressure comes out at a pretty full and audible steam and THEN the heat switches off. Once the steam disipates/the heat goes down and then it kicks back on. Repeat.
    Last edited by mgarst; 1st March 2015 at 04:24 PM.

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    Took apart the anti vacuum valve and it was heavily corroded. I'm guessing that it has been bad for some time. I took it apart and cleaned it in an ultrasonic cleaner. I can't believe how bad it was! I had to pull out the pin with a pair of pliers while turning one end with a screw driver and pressing the pin in from the other end to give it more leverage. Now that it is cleaned up it moves so smoothly, but there is still a small amount of steam escaping. I suspect i need a new oring as well. I found this post (http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-eq...vac-valve.html) and saw a Viton 007 should do the trick. Sound right?

    The only thing I have left to do is adjust the overpressure valve, the boiler pressure, and find a portafilter. My business parter seems to have misplaced them. If anyone has a recommendation for a vendor in the United States, feel free to send it my way since I have to get it before this upcoming weekend.
    Last edited by mgarst; 1st March 2015 at 04:20 PM.

  18. #18
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    Hi All, I have a La Cimbali 27 Electronic version machine, just purchased on line. The unit was made in 2011, does any one have a current manual ??



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