Results 1 to 40 of 40
Like Tree16Likes
  • 1 Post By artman
  • 1 Post By artman
  • 2 Post By danyboy
  • 2 Post By artman
  • 1 Post By artman
  • 1 Post By sprezzatura
  • 1 Post By sprezzatura
  • 1 Post By artman
  • 1 Post By danyboy
  • 2 Post By artman
  • 2 Post By danyboy
  • 1 Post By artman

Thread: Faema E98 loud noise, help!

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37

    Faema E98 loud noise, help!

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hello folks
    I've been using a Faema E98 for a little while and recently it started making a loud whiney noise when brewing. The noise disappeared and returned a few times. Now it seems to be permanent. The video below demonstrates the sound... Note I have a blind filter on and doing a clean but the noise occurs with a normal basket with espresso in as well. I haven't noticed a difference in taste or brewing time.
    Any thoughts on what the problem might be?

    Video: https://youtu.be/f4P5luKf-74

    Cheers!

  2. #2
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Your OPV needs to be overhauled. It's bypassing water and the bypass is vibrating and causing harmonics.

  3. #3
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    Ahhhhh, the E98 A1, my first "real" machine.....

    Hard to tell exactly from the vid but I reckon your pump has sucked in a bit of air.

    The feed from the tank does a loop towards the top so sometimes the pump can struggle to purge the air if it has sucked some in (which it shouldn't be able to as the pump turns off with low water level) but can happen if you have cleaned the tank etc.

    Take off the side and read panels and make sure all the tubes are full of water and the inlet is not restricted.

    Cheers
    sprezzatura likes this.

  4. #4
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    These run a rotary pump so the OPV should only kick in as safety device at 12bar, which can happen if the pump bypass piston sticks and sends the pressure sky high.

    Cheers
    sprezzatura likes this.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Thanks guys!
    I doubt air's gotten in, I am anal about starting my brew with a full tank as this machine drinks so much water (even when filling the tank on boot-up, it puts out a couple hundred mls)!
    I do notice the noise kicks in usually after pressure starts building (rather than at initial brew time)... so does that point to the OPV being defective?
    Is there a way to fix the OPV or do I need to acquire a new one? I'm having trouble finding a replacement online, and they look to be quite pricey from the European websites that sell them! Do I need a new check valve as well?

    artman, is the pump bypass piston part of the pump or part of the OPV?

    Thanks for your help!

  6. #6
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930

    Faema E98 loud noise, help!

    Quote Originally Posted by danyboy View Post
    Thanks guys!
    I doubt air's gotten in, I am anal about starting my brew with a full tank as this machine drinks so much water (even when filling the tank on boot-up, it puts out a couple hundred mls)!
    I do notice the noise kicks in usually after pressure starts building (rather than at initial brew time)... so does that point to the OPV being defective?
    Is there a way to fix the OPV or do I need to acquire a new one? I'm having trouble finding a replacement online, and they look to be quite pricey from the European websites that sell them! Do I need a new check valve as well?

    artman, is the pump bypass piston part of the pump or part of the OPV?

    Thanks for your help!
    Artman's on it: check the bypass piston. They can stick closed (no bypass) and force water through the OPV which may cause whistling. They can stick open too which causes hardly any pressure 4-5bar at the group head.

  7. #7
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Disassembling the OPV/inlet manifold and cleaning scale, swarf and gunk out can clear up the issue.

  8. #8
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    I posted my adventures on the pump bypass a few years ago, do a search. It's easily accessible and easy to remove and take apart to clean/lube etc. likewise the OPV.

    A brew pressure gauge will be handy to set the brew pressure and safety OPV.

    If the pump bypass is stuck and you are getting big pressure, water should be dumping out of the OPV. This would be an easy check.

    For parts, when looking through coffeeparts website, the Cimbali section is more relevant. This machine is basically a Cimbali junior pimped with electronics.

    Cheers

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Thanks guys
    I've taken apart the back of the machine and disconnected the OPV and check valve.
    I don't have a brew pressure gauge and can't be fussed building one with the appropriate fittings...
    I haven't disassembled the OPV as I'm scared I won't be able to set the pressure to the correct setting if I do without a brew pressure gauge
    Any advice for cleaning? I'm soaking in vinegar first to loosen up and calcium and will flush some water through afterwards

    I'll look up your old threads artman and see what I can dig up

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Just found the thread and post #2 by dimal seems to explain how to clean it.. Looks like I'll have to take it apart
    http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-eq...tml#post263599

    Hopefully I can count the # of turns taking it out and and try and try and re-tighten the same number of times when re-assembling...

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Also I wonder if I should clean out the pump "piston" like you did while I have everything open? But then again I can't calibrate afterwards!
    I'm confused about the OPV after reading that entire post - does it matter at all how much it's screwed in? If it doesn't affect the brew pressure, what is the point of adjusting it?

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Ok sorry for the serial postings...
    I measured the extrusion of the piston/adjustable screw in the OPV with a precise ruler, took it apart, soaked it, wiped it and reassembled to close to what it was prior to disassembly. I flushed water through it and through the check valve, reassembled and shoved everything back into the machine
    While I was at it I just checked how stuck the pump piston was and it seemed to move a quarter turn in either direction quite easily, so I didn't bother cleaning it...I suppose I can always do it another time should I need to

    Turned the machine on and first thing I noticed is that the usual filling of the boiler which is USUALLY associated with a good amount of water coming out of the outlet did not occur...ie no water wastage
    Second, the sound disappeared! Popped the blind filter on and flushed to make sure the pressure gets nice and high, and no more whining. WOOHOO

    Thanks guys!
    Dimal and sprezzatura like this.

  13. #13
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    Good work!!

    The adjustment screw on the pump bypass just pre loads the spring. The piston can still be jammed inside, it slides along the shaft.

    From memory you should be able to unscrew the complete bypass, remove and clean the piston, re lube and screw back in. All without touching the adjustment pre load.

    See if you can get a hold of a brew pressure gauge (Greg Pullman was lending his out for a small fee) then you can adjust the brew pressure to 9 bar and the OPV to 12 bar.

    Cheers
    Dimal and sprezzatura like this.

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Hmm yeah maybe I'll ask him... Or maybe I'll attempt to build one... It's just the 1/4" fitting on the bottom of the portafilter is tricky to find the right adapter for hooking up standard pipe fittings and pressure gauge...

    Did I have to lube the OPV? I didn't actually do that and if so, what lube should I use?

  15. #15
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418

    Faema E98 loud noise, help!

    There is a thread here somewhere called Pullmans pressure gauge on the road or something like that.

    You should be able to get the fittings from a hydraulics shop like enzed or pirtek. Take your PF and gauge. I think the PF is a 3/8 thread?

    From memory the OPV is just a rubber disc sealing against the brass so would be ok without lube. The pump bypass piston needs a bit of lube, not much I just smeared the o rings after cleaning everything. Use a good grade lube, I got a small tube from Jaycar.

    Cheers
    Last edited by artman; 26th May 2016 at 01:35 AM. Reason: More info
    Dimal likes this.

  16. #16
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Quote Originally Posted by artman View Post
    There is a thread here somewhere called Pullmans pressure gauge on the road or something like that.

    You should be able to get the fittings from a hydraulics shop like enzed or pirtek. Take your PF and gauge. I think the PF is a 3/8 thread?

    From memory the OPV is just a rubber disc sealing against the brass so would be ok without lube. The pump bypass piston needs a bit of lube, not much I just smeared the o rings after cleaning everything. Use a good grade lube, I got a small tube from Jaycar.

    Cheers
    Hey! This is a great idea! I've got spare parts to build e-61 compatible and NS compatible group pressure gauges. I'm happy to ship them around for postage.

  17. #17
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    27
    I have a vibro pump and I get a bit of whining every now and then. Cleaned everything out to no avail. What is the OVP? I only have the main brew pressure adjustment large screw on the RHS at the back.
    I also seem to have a 1.25mm Gicleur in the machine - aren't these supposed to have 0.8mm? Might explain why I have to use a very fine grind to get the right extraction times and there is always a pool of water left on the puck?

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Hi floatingwiki
    The big adjustment screw at the back is on the RHS which is exposed when you remove the side panel IS the OPV. you can unscrew it if you take the back panel off as well as the tank and tank backing and insulation bits out which leaved the check valve and OPV accessible to unscrew.
    As far as the gicleur goes, not sure...
    Wet puck is a normal-ish phenomenon. Overdosing can eliminate this but will also affect your brew ratios...

  19. #19
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    27
    OK I thought that might be the OVP - getting confused with rotary pump machines that seem a bit different.

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Hey guys
    Needing some further assistance with my OPV/pump!
    I've finally assembled a brew pressure gauge and adjusted my OPV so that max pressure at head is 12 bar
    However, in trying to adjust the pump, I seem to be stuck at 12 bar, similar to what artman went through in http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-eq...tml#post263599 - although artman's pictures seem to have vanished (possibly hosted elsewhere and gone now?)

    I've read through the thread and tried the following: removed adjustment screw, locknut, and spring and cleaned all of them (although no gunk apparent). I've tried adjusting the screw to different settings with no change in pressure at the gauge.
    I'm wondering if I'm doing the right thing/removing the correct part. I've attached the photo of the removed screw/nut/spring and the part that remains at the pump. Artman, you mention a seal - can't seem to see it/find it (obviously spaces are tight!).
    What am I missing here? Thanks in advance!!

    Danyboy
    Attached Images Attached Images
    • File Type: jpg 1.jpg (21.3 KB, 16 views)
    • File Type: jpg 0.jpg (121.9 KB, 17 views)

  21. #21
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Have you pulled the seal and plug assembly out? It's F.915 on the attached image. If it's scaled in hard you won't be able to adjust the OPV as it won't release with less tension on the spring in your image.
    danyboy likes this.

  22. #22
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    My bad, I see that you've provided an image of your rotary pump bypass.

  23. #23
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Here's all the internals of a rotary pump bypass.
    danyboy likes this.

  24. #24
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Except the acorn nut and grub screw which are external. There are several variation but all function the same. Note o ring which must move and bypass on far right which can freeze (scale) and needs to move back into bypass spring to allow water to bypass (less pump pressure at head, etc.).

  25. #25
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    Inside this bit should be a silver piston with an o ring or two. Remove, clean, lube and you will be good to go. Similar to the one in the photo in previous post but shorter from memory.

    Cheers

    danyboy likes this.

  26. #26
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Thanks for all the replies guys
    Given the tight space, I haven't been able to pull anything but the spring out (the only mobile element).
    Do I need to remove the external assembly bit with the acorn bottom (what the green arrow is pointing to in my image)? Or can that remain in situ as I attempt to remove everything else? I've tried wiggling an adjustable spanner in to there, but the metal casing makes it practically impossible to get it horizontal on the acorn to obtain maximal torque

    sprezzatura, thanks for the diagram and photo - however, I can't seem to consolidate those 2 which are slightly different to each other, with my own assembly...

    As far

  27. #27
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Sometimes you can reach in there with a stout pair of tweezers and grab the bypass and pull it out. It's tight in there! That (well, yours isn't an acorn nut) nut will unscrew and it's easier to access the bypass plug with it out.

  28. #28
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Ok think I figured it out
    There's no way that external bit is coming off. The whole pump moves when I attempt to turn it.
    As far as what's inside there, we'll it looks like the pic below (somehow managed to get a half-decent pic with my phone). Looks to me like all the components are there but heavily calcified and unlikely to budge easily?

    I can't see how they'll come out without taking the nut off?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  29. #29
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Easiest (although maybe not in this case) method is to remove pump so you can put it in a vise or at least on a counter to work on it. And yes ... cool image! Nice job!

  30. #30
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Like Artman said, it's got to come out. If you get the pump off you can soak it in descale (leave bearings and shaft up in the air; inlet, outlet and bypass submerged).

  31. #31
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Thanks for all the help!
    Managed to unscrew it by opening the back of the machine and disconnecting one of the water hoses, which cleared just enough area to loosen the nut!
    Everything is soaking now, although everything is submerged, oops
    I guess I need to pick up some lube next? Silicon lube?

    Will update post-clean

    (I am attaching the photos of the components if anyone else looks at this thread in the future)
    Attached Images Attached Images
    sprezzatura likes this.

  32. #32
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    All that stuff can soak in descale. No worries. I use INOX food grade PTFE lube but there are many different brands. Make sure it's PTFE light lube. Cheers!

  33. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Ok so here's the update

    Descaled and gently wiped everything down, found some foodgrade lube somehow on the weekend, connected everything back up and woohoo the pump pressure is now adjustable. Started at low pressure of 3 bar and kept tightening until I reached the 9 bar mark with a slow drip through my needle valve.
    Other thing I noticed is that the machine is much quieter now that it's not running at 12 bar+ I had a laugh, and the coffee extraction process was a lot smoother. additionally, I guess now that the OPV valve is properly set at 12 bar and the pump at 9 bar, I don't get any water wastage when the tank fills (previously emptying about 10L of water a week having made about 20-25 coffees/week!)
    All seems to be OK, EXCEPT:

    The pump adjustment nut seems to leak water, not from where it joins to the pump, but rather from the top part (See image)
    Does this mean the little black seal needs replacing?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by danyboy; 25th June 2016 at 03:23 PM. Reason: Forgot attachment

  34. #34
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    Yes. New seal! Good work.

  35. #35
    Senior Member sprezzatura's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Hervey Bay, QLD
    Posts
    930
    If you can somehow measure that o ring I've several sizes that may suit.

  36. #36
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    Or if you have no luck take the parts to a bearing shop, they should be able to match it up.

    Take your anti vac valve while you are there and get some for that (mine used to go hard and stop sealing after a couple of years).

    Cheers
    Dimal and sprezzatura like this.

  37. #37
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Yeah I can't seem to find the size of that O-ring actually documented anywhere! I've only found it referenced in a single diagram from procon (manufacturers of the rotary pump) that matches up with the relief valve I have, and that diagram has no part number indicated unfortunately.

    It seems there are many variations of the valve which makes even asking a parts supplier very tricky.
    I've no way of accurately measuring it so I guess I'll have to find a shop that may have be able to help.

    Will post with an update once that's done.

  38. #38
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    That's why I suggested taking it to a bearing shop, they will assist in matching up a suitable o ring for the parts, just take them with you. That's what they did for me anyway.

    I guess you need a helpful shop that are happy to help and trial a few as opposed to wanting to know the size you want. I would give them a go.

    Cheers

  39. #39
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    37
    Managed to make it to a bearing shop today and got a new o-ring
    The guy mumbled something under his breath about it being 2mm thick with an external diameter of 10mm
    Unsure if those sizes were accurate (comparing to available sizes on spare parts catalogues like LF Spare parts http://b2b.lfspareparts724.com/publi...5211613_lf.pdf), but the o-ring he provided me with, although not as tall (original one seemed to be taller than it's thickness), seems to be working just as fine - no more leaks from the relief valve
    Also, now that everything is calibrated, I'm saving on water and not having to refill the tank every 2 coffees, and not having to empty my waste container as often. Also the machine is running a lot smoother, feels almost new

    Thanks for all your help
    dumiya and sprezzatura like this.

  40. #40
    Senior Member artman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,418
    Good work!!

    Cheers
    danyboy likes this.



Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •