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Thread: Boema Single Group Adventure

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    Member hunty's Avatar
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    Boema Single Group Adventure

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi all, just picked up a second hand boema espresso machine and grinder. A little bit of a project/adventure.
    Being fairly green as far as coffee machines go, I was hoping to maybe find some potential guidance.

    About the machine; Boema Single Group, 2400w 10A, $250nzd auction buy. Ex cafe/shop. Been sitting for approx 12months, working when removed from service, with slight water leak.

    About Me; current set up, sunbeam em0480 grinder and breville cafe roma. Pan roasting beans, and weighing/timing my brews.

    Technical abilities; by trade an industrial electrician dual traded in instrumentation.

    Before I have a go at running up the machine for the first time, my plan is to replace the relief valve and insulation test the element, and maybe flush the boiler and refill it until the element is not exposed (still has water sitting in the boiler, so not sure if this is a problem given the machine has been sitting for 12 months.

    One thing I was wondering is if anyone knows where I could get a service manual for the machine if there is such a thing.

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    Member hunty's Avatar
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    IMG_20180412_124807.jpgIMG_20180412_125009.jpg

    This is the machine and internals.

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    Senior Member Jackster's Avatar
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    Id fill boiler with descaler (through the relief valve while you have it out...after boiler is cleaned, id run new descaler through the systems to clean the pipes and solenoids.
    Then flush and start looking to fire it up and find the leaks.
    You could make a fitting to utilize a bike pump to pressurise the boiler to aid in leak detecting so its not to hot to work on.

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    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunty View Post
    Hi all, just picked up a second hand boema espresso machine and grinder. A little bit of a project/adventure.
    Being fairly green as far as coffee machines go, I was hoping to maybe find some potential guidance.

    About the machine; Boema Single Group, 2400w 10A, $250nzd auction buy. Ex cafe/shop. Been sitting for approx 12months, working when removed from service, with slight water leak.

    About Me; current set up, sunbeam em0480 grinder and breville cafe roma. Pan roasting beans, and weighing/timing my brews.

    Technical abilities; by trade an industrial electrician dual traded in instrumentation.

    Before I have a go at running up the machine for the first time, my plan is to replace the relief valve and insulation test the element, and maybe flush the boiler and refill it until the element is not exposed (still has water sitting in the boiler, so not sure if this is a problem given the machine has been sitting for 12 months.

    One thing I was wondering is if anyone knows where I could get a service manual for the machine if there is such a thing.
    Hey mate. Where are you? Iím in Canterbury and restored one of these last year so probably have quite a bit of info that could be helpful to you. Send me a PM and maybe we can connect via email if not in person. I have PDFs of the parts lists as well as a basic manual and a few photos of my rebuild.
    Dimal and HorseFD like this.

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    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunty View Post
    IMG_20180412_124807.jpgIMG_20180412_125009.jpg

    This is the machine and internals.
    Hey mate. Where are you? Iím in Canterbury and restored one of these last year so probably have quite a bit of info that could be helpful to you. Send me a PM and maybe we can connect via email if not in person. I have PDFs of the parts lists as well as a basic manual and a few photos of my rebuild.

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    Hey Leroy, sent you a message. I have seen a parts list from the boema Web site, haven't looked into whether or not it is relevant to this machine given it is older, but I'm hoping it will be.I'd love to see the photo of your rebuild.

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    Member hunty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackster View Post
    Id fill boiler with descaler (through the relief valve while you have it out...after boiler is cleaned, id run new descaler through the systems to clean the pipes and solenoids.
    Then flush and start looking to fire it up and find the leaks.
    You could make a fitting to utilize a bike pump to pressurise the boiler to aid in leak detecting so its not to hot to work on.
    Hi Jackster, thanks heaps for the tips. Found and bought a 1/8th fitting schrader valve today (air compressor tank fill valve?) which should do the job, that and some snoop or home made equivalent should help me find any leaks above the water line.

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    Member hunty's Avatar
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    IMG_20180413_211534.jpgIMG_20180413_211616.jpg

    So a bit more investigation this evening, side cover off showing what appears to be a build up around the element, I'm guessing this was the source of the leak I was told about, I'm also guessing the build up is scale deposits from the leak???? Has anyone seen anything like this before?

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    I'm thinking the plan might evolve to an element replacement and maybe remove that end plate and replace the gasket.

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    Member hunty's Avatar
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    IMG_20180412_132331.jpg
    This is the grinder that came with the machine, goes way finer than the sunbeam I have. It's pretty big and solid, and heavy.

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    IMG_20180417_150654.jpg

    Boiler has been removed for a clean

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    IMG_20180417_150921.jpg

    And its pretty filthy inside. I like that it has a removable end plate from a maintenance perspective. I also like that the element appears to be a standard size hot water element.

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    IMG_20180421_183003.jpg

    Is anyone able to provide me with any information about this controller? I'm interested in whether or not relay 1 and relay 2 are both activated by the level probe, and whether or not they activate at different times.


    Boema RL40/IES/F

    Does any one have a data sheet for this or some documentation of any kind?

    If I had to guess, I would say relay 2 is activated as soon as water touches the probe (this would give you low water protection, illuminating the empty lamp and requiring the manual fill valve if water dropped below the probe).

    And for the above to be true, relay 1 would have to activate via a difference in resitance/voltage/current depending on how much of the probe was under water.

    So probe should always be in the water, and the controller will start filling at a point when less of the probe is in the water, then stop when more of the probe is covered by water.

    If the probe ever ends up completely out of the water, relay 2 will cut power and turn on warning lamp, manual fill switch could then be used to refill the boiler.
    Last edited by hunty; 21st April 2018 at 10:00 PM.

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    boema electrical wiring.jpgboema electrical wiring2.jpg

    been tracing through the wiring, think I have it pretty close, still not sure about the RL40 though, if both RL1 and RL2 operate at the same time i cant see that it could get up to temp (unless i have the wiring wrong). On the down side, the GICAR 1d5 fell to bits while i was tracing the wiring, the plastic was extremely brittle, im guessing that could be expensive :-O

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    Senior Member Xanthine's Avatar
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    Hi hunty
    I'm afraid I don't have any info on your control circuit but I would suggest that you may be on the wrong track regarding the operation of the water level probe.
    I have always been under the impression that these only work as a bi-state sensor, albeit with a bit of latitude in their switching point which would be caused by variations in the conductivity of the water due to the different TDS levels and scale coatings on their surface.
    I would think that variations in these would make them too inaccurate to use for an analogue signal as you suggest -

    "And for the above to be true, relay 1 would have to activate via a difference in resitance/voltage/current depending on how much of the probe was under water."

    The control circuit probably incorporates some hysteresis to avoid frequent pump switching when the tip of the probe makes or breaks contact with the surface of the water in the boiler.
    Hope this helps
    Trev

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthine View Post
    Hi hunty
    I'm afraid I don't have any info on your control circuit but I would suggest that you may be on the wrong track regarding the operation of the water level probe.
    Thank you for the info Trev, do you have any info on the operation of any water level controllers that you could share?

    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthine View Post
    I would think that variations in these would make them too inaccurate to use for an analogue signal as you suggest -

    "And for the above to be true, relay 1 would have to activate via a difference in resitance/voltage/current depending on how much of the probe was under water."
    Trev
    Thanks for that, I definitely get what your saying, trouble is from what I'm seeing from the wiring, I can't see how both relays can switch at the same time and the circuit could work (RL2 removes/applys the power supply for the element) .
    The other explanation could be a Timing circuit of some sort for RL2, ensuring it does not switch until a set time has elapsed after RL1 has activated. This could allow RL1 to get the water level back up to the set level within a certain time frame, and if water supply was not available the set time would expire removing power from the element.

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    Senior Member Xanthine's Avatar
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    I had a bit of a search online and came up with these links which may be helpful -

    Gicar Controllers
    GICAR RL30 Autofill Schematic - Espresso Machines
    Repair/rebuild GiCar units and Controllers CONTROL BOARDS & TOUCH PADS :: COFFEE MACHINE PARTS :: Bombora Coffee & Water...


    Not sure if they will work or be allowed.

    At the moment I am working on an Azkoyen 3 group resto with a couple of friends but it does not use a Gicar controller so not much help there.

    Trev

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthine View Post
    Thanks Trev, your link has just made me realise that what I thought was a solenoid may actually be a volumetric counter. IMG_20180425_100126.jpg
    So would there be a check valve inbuilt to the volumetric counter or is there effectively nothing until the group head solenoid?

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    Senior Member Xanthine's Avatar
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    Glad that info was of some use - I've never tried attaching links before, especially multiples from a bookmark folder.

    I've not heard of a check valve in the flow sensor. They usually consist of a jet on the inlet which directs a stream of water onto a free spinning impeller. A magnet on this pulses a hall effect device to produce the signal to the control board.

    Did you get in touch with LeroyC as he may have more info?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthine View Post
    Glad that info was of some use - I've never tried attaching links before, especially multiples from a bookmark folder.

    I've not heard of a check valve in the flow sensor. They usually consist of a jet on the inlet which directs a stream of water onto a free spinning impeller. A magnet on this pulses a hall effect device to produce the signal to the control board.

    Did you get in touch with LeroyC as he may have more info?
    Yeah I did, Im in touch with him. I'm pretty grateful for the help he has already given me.
    I do apologies for the amount of questions I'm asking, I tend to get a little carried away at times (when I start digging I tend to find it hard to stop).
    One thing I have found interesting with the control gear for the coffee machines, is they seem to be light on documentation on the manufacturers websites (unless I'm just looking in the wrong place of course).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthine View Post
    The control circuit probably incorporates some hysteresis to avoid frequent pump switching when the tip of the probe makes or breaks contact with the surface of the water in the boiler.
    Most machines use the probe as a simple binary input (open circuit or closed circuit depending on whether the tip of the probe is touching the water). Most also have a timer circuit associated with the probe, so that autofill is only activated or ended after 2 seconds of the water dropping below the probe or reaching the probe when refilling. This is to avoid the autofill activating too often or switching on/off rapidly if the water in the boiler is sloshing about (if the machine is bumped, or in a van, on a cart etc.)

    There is often another timer associated with the autofill circuit to protect the pump - if the autofill is activated and the probe does not sense water within a set time (often 90 secs for many Gicar units) it turns off the autofill to avoid overheating the pump, on the assumption that there is no water flow into the boiler.
    If the manufacturer decides they want a safety device to shut down the heating element (or the whole machine) if the water level drops too low in the boiler, this is usually done by fitting a second longer probe, which is always in contact with water in normal operation as it is usually somewhere around 10-15mm below the main probe, so extends below the normal range of variation of water level. In Synessos the probes go into the boiler horizontally at one end, so sometimes the safety probe (being completely immersed) builds up enough scale to insulate it, the electronics freak out thinking the water is too low and kill power to the steam boiler element, and the machine suddenly loses pressure. Easy to fix once you know what causes it, but not the most obvious thing to check at first.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MorganGT View Post
    Most machines use the probe as a simple binary input (open circuit or closed circuit depending on whether the tip of the probe is touching the water). Most also have a timer circuit associated with the probe, so that autofill is only activated or ended after 2 seconds of the water dropping below the probe or reaching the probe when refilling. This is to avoid the autofill activating too often or switching on/off rapidly if the water in the boiler is sloshing about (if the machine is bumped, or in a van, on a cart etc.)

    There is often another timer associated with the autofill circuit to protect the pump - if the autofill is activated and the probe does not sense water within a set time (often 90 secs for many Gicar units) it turns off the autofill to avoid overheating the pump, on the assumption that there is no water flow into the boiler.
    If the manufacturer decides they want a safety device to shut down the heating element (or the whole machine) if the water level drops too low in the boiler, this is usually done by fitting a second longer probe, which is always in contact with water in normal operation as it is usually somewhere around 10-15mm below the main probe, so extends below the normal range of variation of water level. In Synessos the probes go into the boiler horizontally at one end, so sometimes the safety probe (being completely immersed) builds up enough scale to insulate it, the electronics freak out thinking the water is too low and kill power to the steam boiler element, and the machine suddenly loses pressure. Easy to fix once you know what causes it, but not the most obvious thing to check at first.
    Thanks heaps for that, that makes more sense now. The way the boema is wired appears to also have the element supplied off of the relay that provides the pump protection.

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    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Hopefully Boema get back to you with some helpful info. They can be a little slow to reply, but will always do so eventually. The other option is you could give them a call. I did this once or twice and was able to get an answer pretty quickly this way, if not on the spot.
    Gicar units are somewhat plug and play as well so although you need to find out from Boema the way they use it you might find more specific info about the unit itself from Gicar. Maybe not as theyíre obviously a huge company, but you never know.

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    IMG_20180429_180400.jpg IMG_20180429_180343.jpg
    IMG_20180429_175430.jpg
    IMG_20180429_175516.jpg

    Well I think I'm making some progress with the boiler, there seems to be a silver coating that has come off in the places where there was scale build up (not sure if that is normal or not), I have removed the element and am going to replace it with a 2kw (or possibly a 2.2kw), being that I will be using it in domestic service, the 2.4kw seems more than I need and is bang on the 10A loading for a standard 10A outlet. I'm thinking a lower power element shouldn't be a major issue for domestic use given I wont be needing to bang out coffee after coffee (interested to hear any opinion on this).

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Hopefully Boema get back to you with some helpful info. They can be a little slow to reply, but will always do so eventually. The other option is you could give them a call. I did this once or twice and was able to get an answer pretty quickly this way, if not on the spot.
    Gicar units are somewhat plug and play as well so although you need to find out from Boema the way they use it you might find more specific info about the unit itself from Gicar. Maybe not as theyíre obviously a huge company, but you never know.
    Yeah, I'll give them a call if I don't hear back from them in a other week or so. Still got plenty of jobs to do yet on the machine.

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    IMG_20180429_201936.jpgIMG_20180429_200240.jpg
    IMG_20180429_200014.jpg
    OK so this is interesting, the limited electrical elements I've seen personally are 1 or 1 1/4 inch bsp. So on the face of it 38mm hole size in the flange (1.5 inch) would be my 1 1/4 inch bsp (remembering bsp is a standard for pipe threads, and pipes are measured via a nominal Internal Diameter making an Outer Diameter measurement only relevant for a thread tapping drill size.
    IMG_20180429_201159.jpg
    Interesting part seems to be the thread pitch, 11 tpi for bsp. Yet the hole for my element has a 12 tpi thread pitch, and this along with the 41mm OD measurement of the element thread (clearance drill size) would give me the circled UNF size.

    Which means I may have to stick to a boema 2.4kw element, as it may not be a simple case of buy a standard hot water element for replacement.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    OK so to simplify, the element on the face of it, seems to be a 1.25 bsp with should be 11 tpi. However I measured with my thread gauge 12 tpi on both the element and the boiler end plate (why oh why I checked this I don't know, as its resulted in a couple of hours of confusion). Any way 12 tpi at the measurements of the element appears to be 1.5inch unf, however..... The element is a 2.4kw eutron, now eutron do a 2.4kw cafe bar element that looks similar, and yes it is a 1.25 bsp. So maybe I'll just forget that I put the thread gauge on anything and buy a 1.25 inch bsp element.
    What I can say, is that was a couple of hours that I will never get back.

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    Senior Member Jackster's Avatar
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    My opinion- you are overthinking all of it. Put it together with a good descale (your boiler still looks cruddy-soak it in some citric acid), backflush and make some coffee. Then you can replace the parts that arent working.
    If the element works, why even think about replacing it. Reseal it and put it back in....

    The machine worked before, reseal and use it. Forget about how the gicar works or 11 or 12 tpi element threads.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackster View Post
    My opinion- you are overthinking all of it. Put it together with a good descale (your boiler still looks cruddy-soak it in some citric acid), backflush and make some coffee. Then you can replace the parts that arent working.
    If the element works, why even think about replacing it. Reseal it and put it back in....

    The machine worked before, reseal and use it. Forget about how the gicar works or 11 or 12 tpi element threads.
    That is a fair comment, simple answer is that I want to. Its a hobby and I'm interested to find out how it works. As far as the element goes, it's cheap enough and easier to replace it now imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hunty View Post
    That is a fair comment, simple answer is that I want to. Its a hobby and I'm interested to find out how it works. As far as the element goes, it's cheap enough and easier to replace it now imo.
    Hi hunty,

    I have a schematic for a Boema semi auto single. I refurbished one about a year ago and it is worth the effort. My element failed after descaling and the Boema parts guy said that is common. They cost about $100 so it is not wise to descale the element.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    IMG_20180606_075035.jpg
    Awesome, mcudogs, thanks heaps for the diagram. WRT to elements, I have replaced mine. Mine was in poor shape and with the boiler out and end plate of for descaling, it was a no brainer in my personal opinion.

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    Also WRT the elements, for future reference for others. These are very similar to your standard water heater element. Eutron make a large range of water heater elements which you could easily assume you could use as a replacement. However they are DEFINITELY a different thread and will not fit your boiler.
    You can buy the correct element from boema, they are really good to deal with.

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    IMG_20180422_100824.jpgIMG_20180423_211647.jpg
    Box of bits and a bare chassis.

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    IMG_20180608_225258-754x1008.jpg
    First coffee with the machine (excuse the poor coffee art), finding the steam wand really hard to get the hang of. Aside for a couple of small drips, all seems to be working well.

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    IMG_20180507_204233-754x1008.jpgIMG_20180606_171538-754x1008.jpg
    Chassis after a hot dip galvanising.Alot of surface rust before, the galvanising should hopefully keep it in good order for some time to come.

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    IMG_20180606_210750-754x1008.jpgIMG_20180607_112149-754x1008.jpg
    Boiler put back in, with new element, new anti-vacuum valve and new relief valve.
    Second photo showing the new volumetric unit, the old one fell to bits when I removed it. Also thd group head got new seals and a new filter along with a good clean. (valves were not touched)
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  37. #37
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    IMG_20180523_194232.jpgcleanboiler.jpg
    The new element, and a cleaner than before boiler.

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    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Awesome work! I see it has one of those awful Ďfrothingí steam tips. I cut the end off mine, plugged the large hole left in the middle then drilled two small 1mm holes either side. Came up good and worked much better.

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    inside.jpg
    And the inside of the machine with everything back in. So I have two water leaks, one from the nut on the top of the group head where I replaced the filter, and one coming from the pump (the pump leak could be a bit of a headache).
    Also the portafilters are in poor shape, the single is not so bad, but the double is pretty beat up.
    The finish on the chassis is no where near as good as a paint job, the idea was corrosion prevention more than looks.
    And the other thing I need to do is adjust the level probe, as I am getting a bit of steam breaking through with the hot water after a few seconds of running hot water.

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    Thanks, yeah I struggled with the steam tip, early days yet though I reckon, see if I can't get the hang of it. It's definitely a lot different from the breville. I'm glad I replaced the volumetric unit(pretty convenient) , I almost rewired it without replacing the volumetric unit.
    It's going to be a heavy coffee weekend in my houshold I'm thinking. I've already had more coffees than I should have before bedtime :-0
    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    Awesome work! I see it has one of those awful ‘frothing’ steam tips. I cut the end off mine, plugged the large hole left in the middle then drilled two small 1mm holes either side. Came up good and worked much better.

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    My pump needed a few new o rings. The pressure adjusting screw needed 2 and the non return valve was leaking. Supercheap Auto has a good kit of o rings for $11.00 that fit most of them.

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    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunty View Post
    inside.jpg
    And the inside of the machine with everything back in. So I have two water leaks, one from the nut on the top of the group head where I replaced the filter, and one coming from the pump (the pump leak could be a bit of a headache).
    Also the portafilters are in poor shape, the single is not so bad, but the double is pretty beat up.
    The finish on the chassis is no where near as good as a paint job, the idea was corrosion prevention more than looks.
    And the other thing I need to do is adjust the level probe, as I am getting a bit of steam breaking through with the hot water after a few seconds of running hot water.
    The leak from the mushroom valve should be easy to fix. From memory itís got a flat washer so check itís condition. If itís really hard or damaged youíll have to replace it. Theyíre a common part so are readily available from Boema or any parts supplier. If the gasket looks ok you could just add some Teflon tape. I put Teflon tape on most of these sort of threads on my machine and itís pretty common practice so if you havenít done so it could be worth adding some to your machine in key places. Also I have at least one portafilter, Iíll email you about it.

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    OK thanks, I'll have a look at that mushroom valve seal. Been having a play today with that steam wand and it just isn't a skill I seem to be able to aquire. Yeah I haven't used a lot of thread tape, mainly just for thread lubrication, the tapered pipe threads should seal on the threads, and the parallel pipe threads I have used copper washers/gaskets which seal pretty good. Yeah flick me an email, do you have a portafilter to sell? I'd really like a naked portafilter also. Where abouts did you get your naked portafilter?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyC View Post
    The leak from the mushroom valve should be easy to fix. From memory itís got a flat washer so check itís condition. If itís really hard or damaged youíll have to replace it. Theyíre a common part so are readily available from Boema or any parts supplier. If the gasket looks ok you could just add some Teflon tape. I put Teflon tape on most of these sort of threads on my machine and itís pretty common practice so if you havenít done so it could be worth adding some to your machine in key places. Also I have at least one portafilter, Iíll email you about it.

  44. #44
    Member hunty's Avatar
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    So this is the next mission, a trolley to mount the machine on, the plan is to hit dip galvanise and dress with some wood counter tops and add some solid castor wheels. It will look somewhat industrial/agricultural which is how I view the machine, not so much a looker, but a big solid dependable workhorse, So hopefully the trolley will complement that look/perception. Also at some point I'd like to put a fixed tank on the trolley and supply thd machine via a flojet pump or similar. Unfortunately I am the only person in the house hold who would like it permenantly taking up counter space.

    IMG_20180614_163010-1206x1612.jpg
    LeroyC likes this.

  45. #45
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    Hello Hunty,
    Just read this series of posts re your "new" Boema machine. We bought a Boema single group 10amp machine 15 years ago new, and used it for 4 years commercially then we wanted to use it in our domestic kitchen but didn't want to cut a hole in the bench for the water supply so just put it away. Then several years ago I read on this Forum that the internal pump will pump from an external water supply so filled a 10 litre plastic container and put it beside the machine and voila, it works fine! So we've been using it that way for probably 5 years now (we use filtered tank water in the plastic container). I did find that it wasn't happy trying to suck through a Everpure IN-10 in line filter which Boom sell (put in the line between the reservoir and the machine) but our tank water has a good filter and pump anyway so it works fine for us.
    So you should find it will work fine if you put a fixed tank on the trolley along with he machine and you shouldn't need a separate pump.

  46. #46
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Hello Hunty,
    Just read this series of posts re your "new" Boema machine. We bought a Boema single group 10amp machine 15 years ago new, and used it for 4 years commercially then we wanted to use it in our domestic kitchen but didn't want to cut a hole in the bench for the water supply so just put it away. Then several years ago I read on this Forum that the internal pump will pump from an external water supply so filled a 10 litre plastic container and put it beside the machine and voila, it works fine! So we've been using it that way for probably 5 years now (we use filtered tank water in the plastic container). I did find that it wasn't happy trying to suck through a Everpure IN-10 in line filter which Boom sell (put in the line between the reservoir and the machine) but our tank water has a good filter and pump anyway so it works fine for us.
    So you should find it will work fine if you put a fixed tank on the trolley along with he machine and you shouldn't need a separate pump.
    It will definitely work, but it does put some excess load on the pump if the tank is at the same level or below the pump. The lower the tank the worse the issue. Itís not that it canít be done it just means you can burn out the pump in a shorter period of time. If anyone wants to set up this system and has a way to mount the tank above the level of the pump it is desirable. This obviously isnít possible for most people, but the constant pressure that a little bit of gravity provides is much better for the pump.

  47. #47
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Broadly right but the issue is keeping the seals wet rather than the load on the pump.

    A pump running at 200 litres per hour into a 900 kPa head (approx 9 bar) has a hydraulic load of 50 watts. If it's drawing from 1 metre below the inlet this raises the hydraulic load to ~50.5 watts, an insignificant increase.

    Having the reservoir below the suction (inlet) can result in the pump being dry. The manufacturers warn against running these pumps with dry seals as they can be damaged within minutes. The further the reservoir is below the suction the longer it will take to rewet the seals and the faster the damage will accumulate.

    Having the reservoir above the inlet ensures that the suction remains flooded so that the seals are always wet.
    Last edited by Lyrebird; 4th July 2018 at 04:04 PM.

  48. #48
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    Thanks very much for that info LeroyC and Lyrebird, I was not previously aware of these issues so I'll make a plinth to put my water reservoir on in order to raise it. This forum is certainly very helpful in sharing information, especially information which is not readily available.
    Thanks again,

  49. #49
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Thanks very much for that info LeroyC and Lyrebird, I was not previously aware of these issues so I'll make a plinth to put my water reservoir on in order to raise it. This forum is certainly very helpful in sharing information, especially information which is not readily available.
    Thanks again,
    Lyrebird explained it much better than me in that itís not so much lack of pressure causing thatís the issue, but just that the pump can run dry. You still end up with a pump that can wear out faster. Another thing that can help is a non return valve fitted in the line.

  50. #50
    Member hunty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanW View Post
    Hello Hunty,
    Just read this series of posts re your "new" Boema machine. We bought a Boema single group 10amp machine 15 years ago new, and used it for 4 years commercially then we wanted to use it in our domestic kitchen but didn't want to cut a hole in the bench for the water supply so just put it away. Then several years ago I read on this Forum that the internal pump will pump from an external water supply so filled a 10 litre plastic container and put it beside the machine and voila, it works fine! So we've been using it that way for probably 5 years now (we use filtered tank water in the plastic container). I did find that it wasn't happy trying to suck through a Everpure IN-10 in line filter which Boom sell (put in the line between the reservoir and the machine) but our tank water has a good filter and pump anyway so it works fine for us.
    So you should find it will work fine if you put a fixed tank on the trolley along with he machine and you shouldn't need a separate pump.
    Thanks for the info Ian, unfortunately due to the dimensions of the trolley I have made, the water tank can only practically mounted below the coffee machine, so I doubt I can get away without a flojet or similar supplying water to the machine.



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