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Thread: Latte with an Aeropress vs Moka

  1. #1
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    Latte with an Aeropress vs Moka

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    So I am new to all this and realising that it is very much a learning process and curve.

    I am a recent convert over from pod coffee. I purchased an Aeropress and Porlex grinder with an Able fine stainless steel filter. I have been experimenting and playing around with it a lot and I can get a really nice cup of coffee (similar to french press/filter). For that it is great. Quick, easy and yummy. I add a small splash of milk and enjoy. I prefer the SS filter to the paper. There seems to be more flavor and I enjoy it.

    Problem is that I occasionally like a Latte and I cannot seem to get anything strong and diluted enough from the AP to suit. I've tried everything. I've watched videos online, read incessantly, tried and tried again. I just cannot get it strong enough. I changed beans, used more beans, used coarser grind, used finer grind. I am essentially wanting 100mls of STRONG coffee. I was starting to think it was my own taste preference and I was going to buy a darker roast BUT I recently picked up a small 2 cup Moka Pot off gumtree and using the same pack of beans and less than half the beans I am using in the AP, I was finally able to make a decent latte!! It was really nice.

    Now I have tried as little as 16grams of beans and gone up to as much as 25-30grams in the AP and no luck. The little Moka pot I grabbed is barely able to fit any more than about 13 grams and it puts out 110mls of coffee strong enough to make a delicious latte.

    Where am I going wrong? I really like the AP for how quick and easy it is. I love the moka pot for what it puts out but if I could get the AP to put out what the Moka pot does then I would be in coffee heaven.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Magic_Matt's Avatar
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    Welcome Poena!

    I'd say you're not doing anything wrong - you've probably just found the limit of the AP in making "espresso-like" coffee as an immersion brewer. You certainly won't get the same output from an AP as a moka pot - they're at almost opposite ends of the spectrum really.

    Personally I find the AP makes an acceptable (to my taste) "espressoish" tasting flat white style drink with the right beans* and technique** - but of course what's to my taste may or may not be to yours.

    If the moka pot is delivering results you're happy with, you could persevere with that or consider one of the portable espresso devices (Minipresso, Airpresso etc).

    *I generally find that something with plenty of heavier chocolate, caramel etc notes but balanced with a bit of fruity sweetness works best for milk-based AP drinks - not too dark roast. Blends intended for milk-based espresso generally work well.

    **in case you want yet another recipe... I generally use 20g beans and a fineish grind between espresso and filter.

    Invert AP, steep with 50ml water at a little over 90° for 30 seconds, stir then add another 100ml water and steep for a further 60 seconds. I also generally use the fine Able disc. Preheating everything with boiling water prevents any sourness from creeping in.
    Last edited by Magic_Matt; 26th May 2016 at 11:05 AM.
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  3. #3
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    Hi Poena,

    Have you tried using the inverted AP technique and increasing the steeping time?
    I use 17 g of coffee, fill up the cillinder with water, steep for 3 minutes and extract. The result is a fairly strong coffee but I can make it a lot stronger by adding more coffee, using less water or grinding finer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic_Matt View Post
    Welcome Poena!

    I'd say you're not doing anything wrong - you've probably just found the limit of the AP in making "espresso-like" coffee as an immersion brewer. You certainly won't get the same output from an AP as a moka pot - they're at almost opposite ends of the spectrum really.

    Personally I find the AP makes an acceptable (to my taste) "espressoish" tasting flat white style drink with the right beans* and technique** - but of course what's to my taste may or may not be to yours.

    If the moka pot is delivering results you're happy with, you could persevere with that or consider one of the portable espresso devices (Minipresso, Airpresso etc).

    *I generally find that something with plenty of heavier chocolate, caramel etc notes but balanced with a bit of fruity sweetness works best for milk-based AP drinks - not too dark roast. Blends intended for milk-based espresso generally work well.

    **in case you want yet another recipe... I generally use 20g beans and a fineish grind between espresso and filter.

    Invert AP, steep with 50ml water at a little over 90° for 30 seconds, stir then add another 100ml water and steep for a further 60 seconds. I also generally use the fine Able disc. Preheating everything with boiling water prevents any sourness from creeping in.
    Thanks so much. I am currently using Cleanskins Saint beans which describes it as: Full chocolate, velvety body with hints of fresh butter that sits heavy on the palate. Elegant Cedar sweetness, with hints of tobacco acidity. Dark chocolate after taste that finishes sweeter than it starts.
    and says that it is recommended for milk drinks so I am thinking that changing beans again won't help hugely.

    I will give your recipe a go although I suspect you are right, I may just have to get used to using the two different devices for my different drinks. I do have to say I am slightly addicted to the Moka pot process. It takes longer but there is something strangely satisfying and addicting about it. I am already on the hunt for my next 4 cup for when I have a friend visit.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by roburu View Post
    Hi Poena,

    Have you tried using the inverted AP technique and increasing the steeping time?
    I use 17 g of coffee, fill up the cillinder with water, steep for 3 minutes and extract. The result is a fairly strong coffee but I can make it a lot stronger by adding more coffee, using less water or grinding finer.
    Yes I have tried the inverted method. Honestly find it safer to use it right way up and do the vacuum technique that I saw on a youtube video. You put the plunger in and then pull it back slightly and it creates a vacuum suction and means that no coffee drips through at all. It is pretty cool.

    The inverted method wasn't dangerous until I tried to gently push the plunger higher while it had coffee in it and was still upside down. Ended up with coffee EVERYWHERE and thankfully my hands survived without any serious burns. Was not the smartest move, but someone did it in one of the videos I watched along the way and I clearly didn't assess the possible risks very well before attempting it myself....my idiocy got the best of me.

  6. #6
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    Aeropress says "makes espresso" (words to that effect) on the box, but it doesn't. It's a great immersion method, but to say it makes espresso coffe is misleading.
    a latte is an espresso based drink. You need an espresso shot to start with, which your moka pot will give you much more effectively.

    enjoy your real coffee!

  7. #7
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    I have managed to achieve a holiday flat white with the aeropress very similar to what I make on the machine at home. You do need to use espresso roasted beans for this - filter type roasts won't work. I never drink espresso roasts black through the aeropress - find them too toasty. But perfect for this…

    Around 18g coffee, ground closer to espresso than plunger.
    Inverted method.
    Coffee in - fill to 2.5 (just over half). A little stir with a spoon - press right away (it should be slow at this grind setting - maybe 30-40 secs to pour).
    Split between two cups. Heat and froth milk (or soy in our case) with a microwave + single cup plunger combo.

    This should give two 'magic' sized brews, around 160-180ml each. From my own espresso roasts I've ended up with very similar strength and flavour with both methods - can even pick the bean varieties etc.

    I agree aeropress is not espresso - but no reason with good technique and the right beans you can't get a nice strong brew!

    Cheers Matt

  8. #8
    Senior Member Magic_Matt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortblackman View Post
    Aeropress says "makes espresso" (words to that effect) on the box, but it doesn't. It's a great immersion method, but to say it makes espresso coffe is misleading.
    Well, there's that video of some guys using a ~2m long lever to extract an espresso shot using an AP... I doubt that would be a long-term solution though

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortblackman View Post
    Aeropress says "makes espresso" (words to that effect) on the box, but it doesn't. It's a great immersion method, but to say it makes espresso coffe is misleading.
    a latte is an espresso based drink. You need an espresso shot to start with, which your moka pot will give you much more effectively.

    enjoy your real coffee!
    Thanks I certainly am! I adore the coffee I am getting out of it but am finding that I am drinking far more a day than I normally would... I am really enjoying the processes as well, the tinkering and trial and error is kind of fun. My kids are starting to roll their eyes at me and my coffee "addiction" now but it is all so interesting and the coffee being AMAZINGLY yummy makes it all worthwhile.
    shortblackman likes this.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DesigningByCoffee View Post
    I have managed to achieve a holiday flat white with the aeropress very similar to what I make on the machine at home. You do need to use espresso roasted beans for this - filter type roasts won't work. I never drink espresso roasts black through the aeropress - find them too toasty. But perfect for this…

    Around 18g coffee, ground closer to espresso than plunger.
    Inverted method.
    Coffee in - fill to 2.5 (just over half). A little stir with a spoon - press right away (it should be slow at this grind setting - maybe 30-40 secs to pour).
    Split between two cups. Heat and froth milk (or soy in our case) with a microwave + single cup plunger combo.

    This should give two 'magic' sized brews, around 160-180ml each. From my own espresso roasts I've ended up with very similar strength and flavour with both methods - can even pick the bean varieties etc.

    I agree aeropress is not espresso - but no reason with good technique and the right beans you can't get a nice strong brew!

    Cheers Matt
    Thanks Matt, I will give it a go in the morning and let you know how it goes. Might just be a taste preference thing but so far I feel like I am drinking just frothy milk with a slight coffee flavor. I have found for a standard coffee (dash of milk added) it is really hitting the mark and is so nice and quick and easy. So I am not going entirely wrong thankfully.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DesigningByCoffee View Post
    I have managed to achieve a holiday flat white with the aeropress very similar to what I make on the machine at home. You do need to use espresso roasted beans for this - filter type roasts won't work. I never drink espresso roasts black through the aeropress - find them too toasty. But perfect for this…

    Around 18g coffee, ground closer to espresso than plunger.
    Inverted method.
    Coffee in - fill to 2.5 (just over half). A little stir with a spoon - press right away (it should be slow at this grind setting - maybe 30-40 secs to pour).
    Split between two cups. Heat and froth milk (or soy in our case) with a microwave + single cup plunger combo.

    This should give two 'magic' sized brews, around 160-180ml each. From my own espresso roasts I've ended up with very similar strength and flavour with both methods - can even pick the bean varieties etc.

    I agree aeropress is not espresso - but no reason with good technique and the right beans you can't get a nice strong brew!

    Cheers Matt
    Ok that was better than I have gotten so far. Would still like to get a little more strength to it but it is pretty close to great. Still prefer the Moka pot for strength but it'll do in a jiffy. Thanks heaps!

  12. #12
    Vik
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    The Aeropress can make a very strong cold-brewed concentrate (though it is a bit of a chore). You can use that for a regular latte or just pour in a bit of milk and drink it cold, which is my personal favorite.

    I usually make a large batch of concentrate that lasts me for a couple of days. Take 1 cup of coffee grounds, 2.5 cups of water, mix them in a tightly sealed container and leave them in the fridge for 12+ hours. It's a good idea to remove the course grounds with a sieve, before going through the Aeropress filter, since the cold mixture doesn't go through it that easily. The process takes a bit of elbow grease, but I think it's worth it, if you have the time and energy to spare.

    Cheers

  13. #13
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    Or you can do this! Cold drip Aeropress set up:

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  14. #14
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Down in the nations capital and enjoying a 'camping cappuccino' from the aeropress with soy heated in the microwave and frothed with a single cup plunger. Very nice

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