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Thread: Hand lever espresso machine

  1. #1
    Junior Member KopiOkaukau's Avatar
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    Hand lever espresso machine

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Saw this machine this morning on Taobao. I think might be interesting to share.

    Machine Ned comes with 58mm IMS shower screen with 58mm coffee basket. Brew group make by entire 304 stainless steel with pressure gauge to monitor the brew pressure.

    USD300 per setA2A6C4BF-BB49-4B40-BB00-C49B565C2EBD.jpeg16B15868-A4AF-4085-A847-CB3E4CD54001.jpegD85BE4E3-7E25-4F63-8A23-FC9385EACBB8.jpegACE1B3DB-4465-4B63-A67F-BEA165B5DE12.jpeg115062F7-2C4A-4C66-86A1-CD7FFFB6C6F3.jpeg

  2. #2
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    This and your last post are simply advertisements, not even close to trying to present them as something else.

    Nobody in their right mind is going to purchase a rip off Chinese machine for $300 USD on a website completely in another language.
    Dimal and 338 like this.

  3. #3
    OCD
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    Love the simplicity.
    I'm guessing you'd pour hot water in through the top.
    Would be great for camping if it worked.

    Ps if it worked.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    chippy and Kjarsheim like this.

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    Being a manual coffee makers geek that I am, I can see it's far from being a knock-off. It's completely different on many levels. 58 mm portafilter (Flair doesn't use a portafilter and has 41/46mm basket), one-piece cylinder (instead of multiple pieces), a completely different roller bushing mechanism connected to the piston (whereas on the Flair they're completely separated)...Don't think you'd want to put this in your backpack for camping/travel use (unlike the Flair).

    I do wonder how to preheat the machine with what seems like a significant amount of metal there, but intriguing enough!
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  6. #6
    OCD
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    Quote Originally Posted by samuellaw178 View Post
    ...Don't think you'd want to put this in your backpack for camping/travel use (unlike the Flair).
    Off grid maybe.
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  7. #7
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    Even nastier knock off of the Newton Espresso from New Zealand. That cylinder mass looks as though it would present major temperature issues. Is that a thermal insulating cover of some sort in the first photo? However, I do like the idea of a traditional twist in portafilter holder which should make for a good work flow and ease of cleaning. Isn't enough to part me from my Robot though.
    pyrmontboy200 likes this.

  8. #8
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    As Otago said itís actually a copy of the Newton rather than the Flair. Itís not a perfect copy, but is clearly Ďinspiredí by the Newton. If you want something like this Iíd support a small business thatís making high quality gear in the garden shed in Napier, New Zealand. (Itís a fairly fancy shed to be fair).

  9. #9
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    It's not like a lever manual espresso machine is a new concept; they are all derivative of something else. The machine in the OP is, in my opinion, an interesting design and has significant advantages over the Flair and Newton in that it uses a standard portafilter and screen. Machines that use a smaller diameter portafilter tell me that the designer doesn't understand physics very well.

    I think it interesting that even though this is made in China they have chosen to use an IMS screen: to me that is very smart marketing, signalling that they are serious about what they are doing.

  10. #10
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Actually, many years ago, a CSer knocked up something very similar in his workshop; at least 10+ years ago...

    Mal.

  11. #11
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    The other machine that has been plagiarised is the Strietman.

    Lyrebird, aren't the smaller diameters used in some machines aimed at achieving higher pressures from simple lever arrangements? And what is the purpose of the greater depth to diameter ratio in smaller diameter baskets?

  12. #12
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otago View Post
    Lyrebird, aren't the smaller diameters used in some machines aimed at achieving higher pressures from simple lever arrangements? And what is the purpose of the greater depth to diameter ratio in smaller diameter baskets?
    Hydraulic work is pressure x volume, so the work required to produce say 40 ml of espresso at 900 kPa is 36 Joules.

    Force on cylinder = pressure x area. Distance (stroke) of cylinder = volume / area.

    Thus force x distance = Pressure x area x volume / area = Pressure x volume.

    Decreasing the area decreases the force required for a given pressure but increases the stroke. The same can be achieved by changing the lever ratio.

    I am not sure what the purpose of the smaller deeper baskets is but the big companies use them in their cheap machines and revert to standard diameter in the upmarket models.

    If you can design the machine to use the standard diameter, why wouldn't you?
    Last edited by Lyrebird; 22nd April 2019 at 09:36 AM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyrebird View Post

    I am not sure what the purpose of the smaller deeper baskets is but the big companies use them in their cheap machines and revert to standard diameter in the upmarket models.

    If you can design the machine to use the standard diameter, why wouldn't you?
    Ask Izzo. The Alex Leva / Vesuvius use a 54mm basket and the coffee they produce tastes great (certainly at least the equal of the 58mm CMA / Astoria / Bosco / Londinium / Achille group.....which I have). I'm guess that the deeper puck improves the evenness of extraction, and probably also give you a bit more margin for error on dosing.

  14. #14
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    I think all machines should move to 62mm group heads. 58mm is just too small.
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  15. #15
    Senior Member noonar's Avatar
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    Hi LB,
    Just out of curiosity. What would happen if a basket was wide enough, for example, that it allowed for only an even one particle high puck across the whole basket using the whole dose? How wide the basket would be? alternatively what would happen if the basket was so narrow and tall it allowed only one particle width for the whole length of the basket, with a single hole? I presume Machine designers and associates, all stakeholders, (some financial) do their sums, all things considered, each approach to sizing is optimised in the best interests for - success - ideally - however that has been defined.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    That's an argument by reductio ad absurdam, it seems very unlikely either extreme would work.

    I'm not claiming 58mm is some magic number that works better than any other size, it just makes sense to me to stick to the standard to maximise available options.
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  17. #17
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noonar View Post
    Hi LB,
    Just out of curiosity. What would happen if a basket was wide enough, for example, that it allowed for only an even one particle high puck across the whole basket using the whole dose? How wide the basket would be? alternatively what would happen if the basket was so narrow and tall it allowed only one particle width for the whole length of the basket, with a single hole? I presume Machine designers and associates, all stakeholders, (some financial) do their sums, all things considered, each approach to sizing is optimised in the best interests for - success - ideally - however that has been defined.
    I think one particle width or height are going to create more problems due to the non-cylindrical shape of coffee grounds. When you've got a 58mm x 10mm (or thereabouts) the gaps left between the particle and the wall are negligible. With one particle you'll only have the point of the particle touching, you'll also have particles not touching each other neatly or evenly. By the time you have 10mm+ it all averages out quite evenly (or you get channeling). I can only imaging a single particle width would mostly flow around the sides and underextract. One particle height would just fine the particles that touch the least and channel like mad, you'd also need to have the shower screen hold the particles in position or they'd just fly out of the way.

  18. #18
    OCD
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    Quote Originally Posted by noonar View Post
    ...Just out of curiosity. What would happen if a basket was wide enough, for example, that it allowed for only an even one particle high puck across the whole basket using the whole dose? How wide the basket would be? alternatively what would happen if the basket was so narrow and tall it allowed only one particle width for the whole length of the basket, with a single hole...
    My guess would be:
    On the one hand it would gush on a huge disc of a basket. On the other hand it would choke part way down a very long narrow unbasket like tube (water is more viscous than one might think).

    Ps 49mm works ok on my Cremina.
    Dimal likes this.

  19. #19
    Junior Member KopiOkaukau's Avatar
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    Here is the heater if you ever need one. 1555842921798.jpg

  20. #20
    Junior Member KopiOkaukau's Avatar
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    Here is the video for coffee extraction https://v.youku.com/pad_show/id_XMzc...6059.1&source=

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    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    I am from the home of the Newton espresso machine, how did I not even know about this!



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