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Thread: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

  1. #1
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    What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi all!

    Firstly I know my "subject" sounds kinda obvious! I work as a barista, and use a commercial coffee machine most days. I was wanting to a coffee machine to use at home as well, so I can enjoy a nice coffee when not working :D I know little about domestic machines (apart from browsing this site.

    Temp surfing seems to be a much bigger problem with domestic machines hense the PID on some machines? With the commercial machines if you run a couple of seconds worth of water through it between shots the temp is stable due to the huge boilers.

    The steam pressure etc will obviously be compromised compared to a commercial machine to im asuming.

    My question (finally I had a laugh), is, what price/machine would be straight forward operation like a commercial machine? Im not too worried about steaming/brewing the same time, more about quality of the shot, and not to fiddly to use. Temp surfing seems like it would be overly fustrating, if you cant just run water through the machine for the boiler to be at the correct temp?

    Iv been reading about the Sunbeam 6910, the Silvia, and the E1 Rocket, the rocket seems like an over kill though!

    PS: I would get a good grinder, not one with "steps". Probably after a machine to make 1-2 coffees at once. Any help would be great 8-)


  2. #2
    A_M
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Sorry but my comments will not answer your question as you have not really provided enough info..

    In the first instance, Commercial vs Domestic;

    1: *comes down to your use of the machine...

    2: *Reliability / Build / Throughput...

    If I could I would have a G3 at home = Domestic also = domestic argument that I can not win.

    First off, I would follow up with some real training with one of the sponsors.. * Over there to the left * <-----

    Then, Space Vs Tank or Plumbed Vs Boiler or Thermo block Vs Throughput Vs Steam and Milk Vs Black Vs Beans Vs Water system Vs Noise Vs etc Vs $$$$

    Oh, then add in the step less grinder *at $$$$

    So your pocket is how deep ?


  3. #3
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 16393032251A36393630323A323923570 link=1237716292/1#1 date=1237723878
    If I could I would have a G3 at home
    Me toooooo!!!! Teamed with a Robur (although my LC/DRM isnt that far short..... except for throughput ;))

    Yep, agree with AM...... domestic vs commercial as a criteria is a little short on information.... and then you can throw "prosumer" machines into the mix as well..... which sit somewhere between the two in generic classification.

    What do you actually want to use the "whatever" for..... and as AM says..

    "So your pocket is how deep ?"

  4. #4
    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Ill say it again my way (plus a bit more).

    - How much are you willing to spend (including grinder)?
    - How many coffees do you expect to make at a time and per day?
    - What type of coffees? Flat whites? Espressos? Long blacks?
    - How long do you expect your home machine to last?
    - Working as a barista do you get to adjust the grinder?
    - Do you have access to good, freshly roasted coffee?

    Quote Originally Posted by 626962697E63405348525540210 link=1237716292/0#0 date=1237716292
    the rocket seems like an over kill
    Overkill means not having to upgrade.

    Temperature surfing is not a problem at home if you choose the right machine.




    P.S. Welcome to Coffee Snobs.

  5. #5
    TC
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Hi CHCH and welcome,

    It saddens me that the term "barista" is used way too broadly in Australia...

    For me, the term implies a body of experience and understanding. I know how to cut fish. I also know that Im not a sushi chef as I have little experience and I understand that real sushi chefs have at least 7 years of training.

    There are lots of button pushers in the big world making coffee, many of whom have little understanding of the process. The "baristi in training" are the ones who embrace the learning with passion and surround themselves with great mentors to so as to experiment and learn together.

    I must have pulled a million shots in my time over way too many years. Do I call myself a barista? Dunno..

    What I do know, is that I learn about espresso and coffee every week.

    Now, back to your questions. The answer to the majority of them is: not neccessarily ;)

    There are a whole heap of passionate sponsors over yonder <<<<<<. Many stock a range of machines in your price bracket and most have lots of understanding. Use their expertise and learn from them! Some of them may even be baristi... ;)

    Good luck!

    2mcm



  6. #6
    A_M
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 7C233B2D262D2128282B2B232F204E0 link=1237716292/4#4 date=1237726086
    Hi CHCH and welcome,

    It saddens me that the term "barista" is used way too broadly in Australia...

    For me, the term implies a body of experience and understanding. I know how to cut fish. I also know that Im not a sushi chef as I have little experience and I understand that real sushi chefs have at least 7 years of training.

    There are lots of button pushers in the big world making coffee, many of whom have little understanding of the process. The "baristi in training" are the ones who embrace the learning with passion and surround themselves with great mentors to so as to experiment and learn together.

    I must have pulled a million shots in my time over way too many years. Do I call myself a barista? Dunno..

    What I do know, is that I learn about espresso and coffee every week.

    Now, back to your questions. The answer to the majority of them is: not neccessarily ;)

    There are a whole heap of passionate sponsors over yonder <<<<<<. Many stock a range of machines in your price bracket and most have lots of understanding. Use their expertise and learn from them! Some of them may even be baristi... ;)

    Good luck!

    2mcm

    2mcm... You stated what I was thinking... No offense to those that may call themselves a Baristi or are employed as one... But many I deal with / come in contact with are not...

    Well not as in the true essence of the expected skill sets and knowledge and that as a CS, what I expect. Like many things today, Qualifications / Terms get dummied down for many reasons..

    I personally only know a few in Brisbane, but there are lots of operators who have undergone some very basic training... And may even have Baristi in the job title..

    Sorry... Off Topic. This could be an interesting thread...

  7. #7
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    One of the difficulties you are going to face CHCH is trying out the different machines to see which one suits your needs.

    Im assuming (like me) you are in Christchurch. As far as I am aware there are few places locally that sell "proper" coffee equipment (perhaps some of the local coffee roasters) and more over, not entirely sure if you can trial any of it. I know the likes of Harvey Normans etc have the machines on display, but only for display, not trial and Columus coffee in Riccarton also has some display equipment (Vibiemme & Silvia) but again, not sure if they are useable).

    Decide on how you intend to use the machine first (as above, espresso only, mix of espresso / milk drinks or predominantly milk drinks) then decide on how much you want to spend. It may have to be a leap of faith in regards to the final machine you finish with unless you know someone whom has one that you can use.

    Sen

  8. #8
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 6559445F555443565E55310 link=1237716292/3#3 date=1237725568
    Ill say it again my way (plus a bit more).

    - How much are you willing to spend (including grinder)?
    - How many coffees do you expect to make at a time and per day?
    - What type of coffees? Flat whites? Espressos? Long blacks?
    - How long do you expect your home machine to last?
    - Working as a barista do you get to adjust the grinder?
    - Do you have access to good, freshly roasted coffee?

    Quote Originally Posted by 626962697E63405348525540210 link=1237716292/0#0 date=1237716292
    the rocket seems like an over kill
    Overkill means not having to upgrade.

    Temperature surfing is not a problem at home if you choose the right machine.


    P.S. Welcome to Coffee Snobs.
    Wow lots of feedback! In hinsight, perhaps my first post wasnt detailed enough - sorry. Ill try to answer everyone *:)

    2muchcoffeeman, AngerManagement, - I totally agree too many people call themselves baristas. Anyone with a little bit of training can make a good coffee, its about being able to keep an excellent standard of coffee and to do this consistantly, at speed. Starbucks is probably one example over-using the barasta term? *Iv been workin as a barista for about 4 years now, I dont just "push buttons", the shots are extracted manually, not with a volumetric machine or with an automatic machine... I use a 3 group and 4 group machine. Your reply was pretty sarcastic I thought.

    Thundergod, thanks for your reply.
    Yes I do tweak the grind at work several times a day *;) Im not sure how much Im willing to spend at this stage. Im looking for a grinder on Trademe (NZs ebay). Iv been looking at the Rocky ($700 NZ new), though on TradeMe sometimes 2nd hand stepless grinders come up which would be ideal.

    I wouldnt be making huge amounts of coffees, normally 1 or 2 at a time. Probably a mix of milk based and black drinks. I could live with not being able to steam while brewing, as long as the steamer was good.

    Id hope the machine would last min 3-5years? And yes always fresh beans, and would grind fresh.

    Senator, thanks for your reply. Good to see another Cantab on here! Iv seen the Silvia in CHCH, Underground Coffee Co sell the E1 Rocket. A few other cafes/roasters around town sell various machines though mostly $2500 NZ. I didnt think of Columbus Coffee. Harveys sells the Sunbeam but like you say, I doubt they would allow a demo at all?

    Thundergod "Temperature surfing is not a problem at home if you choose the right machine." Thanks! Thats what I was wanting to hear, and what I was getting at when asked about domestic machines. Im after a machine that is build well, easy/no temp surfing a plus, good quality shot, good mircofoam when steaming.

    JavaB - Perhaps my post wasnt very clear. Im after a domestic machine, was meaning are domestic machines more "unstable" in regard to temp, and was meaning how are domestic machines different etc. Probably a non-plumbed in machine would be more suitable.

    The Sunbeam seems to be the only thermoblock machine Iv seen, though am thinking a boiler would be more stable?

    I dont know much about the different models out there, perhaps a Silvia would be good enough for what I want a machine for, or perhaps im looking for something better like the Rocket? *:-/

    Thanks

  9. #9
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    If you are TMing the moment, make sure you look in the business & farming / hospitality / kitchen & equip / coffee & beverage section, generally lots of used equip in there, in particular 2nd hand Mazzer SJs (although some want far too much). There is also an Expobar Minore 2 but as you point out, $2700 or so.

    I dont have any experience on a commercial machine, but I am very happy with the quality I get from my Sunbeam. Is it as good as a E61 HX machine, not likely (never used one so cant compare) or a Silvia (again, dont know) but for the modest outlay, as I say, its outstanding.

    Sen

  10. #10
    Senior Member redzone121's Avatar
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    Re: What is the difference? Commercial vs Domestic Coffee Machines?

    IMHO spend as much as you can first up and maybe you wont have to upgrade.
    I started with a Silvia and Macap then added a PID. Great shots but not always in a row. Then to VBM super lever with W10. Some would say overkill but I wouldnt agree, in fact if I had have gone here first would of saved quite a few dollars. Then again the Silvia is really good at teaching you patience.....

    Enjoy and drop me a PM if you need any more help.

    Chris NZ



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