Keep us informed Bidtfaun DIY projects are always most welcome.
entertained myself by researching PIDs on espresso machines today..ended up buying a controller (with thermocouple included) and a solid state relay on ebay for a total price of around $95 delivery included...all i need now is an enclosure to put the unit in, wire the sucker into my machine, and set it up..cant wait for the bits to arrive...once bitten by the mod bug....theres no way of turning back...will post pics and results when fitted and running :D
Keep us informed Bidtfaun DIY projects are always most welcome.
getting everything ready for when the PID & SSR arrive...made a couple of looms..left one is for the relay to element power switching. right one is for PID power source and so the PID can switch the relay on and off
Your looms look good to me. Anxious to hear the final results.
Pay close attention to the connections between your new wires and the existing brew thermostat wires. The Silvias wiring allows the use of a fully insulated male 6mm flat connector, so no conductors can become exposed.
I think your Classic, however, might use a flag connector at the brew thermostat, so using partially insulated connectors (the red ones in your first photo) is probably necessary. Once youve joined the wires, though, inspect to be sure all the conductors are covered since these connections generally can move around a little.
thanks Jim :) yeah wherever I notice bare metal where AC power will be flowing, I will insulate accordingly to protect from zappage..a little heat shrink over the whole connection should suffice. I dont wanna know what AC feels like...nor does my wife or unborn child! I am waiting on my relay, and then the fun can begin...got my controller now...am going to be installing the PID into a PVC enclosure which wont look the best..but is electrically safe and easier to cut holes out of..
okie dokie...one PID & one relay..to be fitted tomorrow after breakfast... :D
After breakfast????? I reckon you should do it beforehand. Itll provide the incentive to work faster!
Good luck with it JimBob.
now now....I need coffee before i can start...silly person :P I had a laugh
You finished yet??
nup..about to start ....geez you old people have no patience do ya! :P
alright youve pushed me...all done..well nearly..I just have to get some of that whizzbang double sided tape you have Evan to mount it on the side of the machine..it is set to 107 deg, but will have to do the auto tune function during a few runs to teach it how the machine behaves...
edit: forgot to mention..the hardest bit of this build was creating a thermocouple that would fit into the original brew thermostat hole...the one that came with the PID had a 6mm threaded fitting which obviously wouldnt go into a 4mm hole..so a 4mm screw had to have a hole drilled down the center of the shaft (first go too 8-))...cut off the thermocouple fitting and the exposed wires threaded through to the other side, where they were twisted and soldered with lead free solder....I would have taken a pic but didnt, and now its too late as it is fitted in the machine and there is no way I am removing it (was rather awkward to get into the boiler)...
Great stuff mate. Now, it all looks pretty schmicko but have you pulled a shot yet??
cheers Evan :)just pulled a decaf for my wife & I, and it was bloody beautiful..I seem to have a pretty vicious steam too...so I had a fantastic microfoam too...well worth it...just have to autotune during a few shots to teach it a few things...
Very nicely done.Originally Posted by 0D262B3B292E3A214F0 link=1238569278/11#11 date=1239331955
I added a PID to a Gaggia a few months back (just for the experience and knowledge -- we do not offer kits). *I made a thermocouple probe very similar to yours, and found that it worked a little better than a washer-style probe fastened to the outside of the boiler.
FWIW, I found that with this style probe, a setpoint of 226F (btwn 107C and 108C) gave a brew temp of 200F (93C).
If you can find some 3M Dual Lock material, I have concluded that it is the very best stuff for mounting your enclosure.
did you find any difference to the steaming Jim? my steam for some reason is now REALLY strong....makes a huge difference to the milk 8-)
I left the stock steam thermostat in charge of steaming, so no change.Originally Posted by 153E332331362239570 link=1238569278/15#15 date=1239403048
odd that mine is stronger as I left the stock steam thermostat in too....
anyway..here is the finished result
Just to confirm: the Gaggia has a M2 (=4mm) thermostat hole?Originally Posted by 4C676A7A686F7B600E0 link=1238569278/11#11 date=1239331955
Just so I can order a fitting thermocouple...
i believe it is M4 (which is 4mm) x0.7 (I think the thread pitch) and is 6 mm long
4mm = M2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screw#Thread_standards)Originally Posted by 5E7578687A7D69721C0 link=1238569278/19#19 date=1240104261
which, as I just found out, matches the Gaggia spare part diagram (http://www.coffeeparts.com/gaggia/gaggia2.html).
interesting....i will PM you a link...
ahh I see you are looking at WRENCH size, not the diameter of the bolt which if you measure with some vernier calipers is 4mm..hence M4
upon close inspection of the parts page you linked to I see M4 under the thermostats, not M2
Apologies, I stand corrected.Originally Posted by 7C575A4A585F4B503E0 link=1238569278/22#22 date=1240135184
no probs...saved you from getting an incorrect thermocouple!
Originally Posted by 18333E2E3C3B2F345A0 link=1238569278/15#15 date=1239403048
Ive been thinking about why a pid on the brew temp might improve the steaming and I think the pid might help reduce the temperature stratification within the boiler as a side effect of making the temperature more stable over time. When the top of the boiler is at steam temperature then more of the water in the boiler is hot enough for steaming.
Im sorry to dig this fossil up.. Thinking of PIDing my gaggia. Just cant make up my mind on the PID to get. Im going for the cheap ebay ones. Cant seem to work out whether Im misreading the ads or if some of the PIDs come with built in SSRs. Either way, I dont know if prices have dropped significantly in the past couple of years or if Im looking at the wrong things. But yeh looking for a rough price of 30-40AUD for the whole lot PID, SSR + thermocouple.
I know i shouldnt be really posting this but heres what im looking at.
Then dont post it. eBay link removed per site posting policy
Yes the chinese PIDs are available for $25 -$30 with TC and free postage, likewise SSRs for $5 delivered.
You can actually find the bigger sized PIDs for inder $20 !!
I havnt come across any PIDs witha "built in" SSR, but most of them do have a built in "mechanical" relay, but usually only rated for a 3A max load.
however, i recently fitted one of these chinese cheapies ( XMT 7100) to my Silvia before my SSR arrived and used the inbuilt relay to switch the heater ( 1100W = 4.5 A).
It worked fine, but i only did it after i inspected the PID and noticed that the internal relay was actually stamped with a 7 A rating by its maker ( Panasonic).
I have since installed the SSR to see if the functionality changes.
I would suggest you carefully chose the thermocouple type ( K, Pt, etc) and tip size, since i believe the placement of this TC tip can make a big difference in temp control.
Go for it ! ;)