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Thread: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

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    EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Approx 18 Months old...regularly cleaned with Sunbeam Tablets.

    For the past couple of months, when the machine struggles to extract (grind too fine, or too heavily tamped)...rather than show a constant "Im doing it tough" reading....the guage bounces as if it is letting off pressure.

    There does not appear to be any leaks but I have since replaced the seal to see if that was an issue. *Same thing still happening.

    Ideas ?

    And yes...coffee is till tasting fine.

  2. #2
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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Hey,

    Mine does that also. It pulses and the needle appears to move in time with the pump. Not sure why it is doing it. Nothing suprises me with the sunbeam. So many issues already and now it wont even turn on >:(

    Good luck.

    Nick

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Crap / coffiee fines in ya system.

    A full strip and clean to fix.. Time consuming.

    May or may not cause problems later on.

    Try a descale... Not just a back flush.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 76595052457A56595650525A525943370 link=1268774965/2#2 date=1268776427

    Try a descale... Not just a back flush.
    Did the descale with my last clean

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 5275747F696E455D7B607B1A0 link=1268774965/3#3 date=1268788947
    Quote Originally Posted by 76595052457A56595650525A525943370 link=1268774965/2#2 date=1268776427

    Try a descale... Not just a back flush.
    Did the descale with my last clean
    Sounds like the Solenoid / T piece to teh gauge needs to be cleaned.... However it also depends on how much of a bounce ya getting..... If ya really pushing teh limits and it is at max the pump / valve will struggle.. Not a true 3 way...

    The old BZ99 never even had a gauge etc..

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Agree with the above.

    Also, just because a descale has occurred following instructions on the packet, that does not necessarily imply that all traces of scale will have been removed from the OPV or anywhere else for that matter. Its still quite possible that the opv, or solenoid or gauge could be the answer.

    2mcm

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 537C7577605F737C7375777F777C66120 link=1268774965/4#4 date=1268789358


    Not a true 3 way...
    Yes...thats what I keep telling my Wife....just thinking about it doesnt make it a true 3 way *:)

    But back to the original topic......not pushing the limits...probably just past the "ideal" reading. But would expect the pump to continue to struggle, or blow a gasket. The bouncing has me confused.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 0324252E383F140C2A312A4B0 link=1268774965/6#6 date=1268795083
    Yes...thats what I keep telling my Wife....just thinking about it doesnt make it a true 3 way *
    Not going there... Say again; not going there!!!!

    As said before; can only think that there are some fines caught.. I never used the standard de-scaler.. As has been stated previously... Some loosen and some dissolve..

    Those that loosen scale do a job; but can add to the problem.

    Sorry; but hard to recommend any thing other than a de-scale with some real stuff * :o

    If ya was here; then thats different as I use a binary division process (some call a "Split Half Search" ) *to actually get to the Root Cause.. *That however takes time and one needs hands on access.



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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Mate mine was pulsing like mad and it got to the point where the pump would actually stop then start again. It was only a couple of months old. Took it back to HN and demanded a new machine, which I was given. The state rep reckons it was a five min repair to one wire ??? but since it couldnt be done instantly, I stuck to my guns and got a new machine, which I might add has just crapped itself. Now the steam jet is weak as. Just happened. Great one minute, crap the next.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    I think the pump gauge is not supposed to be very accurate.

    Lately, when i pull shots it takes ages for the pour to start but the gauge only goes to 10-11 o clock position.

    Before you ask, i clean and maintain my machine very well.

    After all, its what in the cup that counts. They coffee tastes great :D

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    the gauge is only there as a guide

    if the gauge is bouncing, coffee clean and descal the machine.
    a sunbeam can never be tooooo clean

    the sunbeam has a plastic opv that isnt as reliable as better quality ones

    the sunbeam does have a 3 way solenoid valve, but only uses 2 off the ports not three. (the third one is plugged up)

    graham

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    A couple of months later and the problem appears to be pretty permanent now. *Every shot causes pump guage to bounce between 12oclock and 2 oclock positions (nowhere near the Red Zone)....not just "visually", you hear the pump beating in synch with the guage *;D *Looks like a visit to the repairer soon *:(

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    its a genuine pressure gauge and works like one. I religiously use mine as a guide. My dose/tamp regime always brings the needle between mid/high of the brown. If I cut corners with the dose/tamp it falls below the brown and I can taste the difference. In the yellow and its a weak washed out espresso.

    I have also found that doing the exact same dose/tamp regime with old stale beans (more than a month post roast) its almost impossible to get the gauge into the brown.


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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Downloaded and read the previous articles by AM and Matrix showing how to pull apart the beast and was preparing myself for a "busy" weekend.

    Last night I gave the Clean and Descale another shot.....and I think the Descale has done the trick :D

    No bouncing gauge...and the needle is getting up around the higher end of the scale...so pressure appears to have returned.

    Im almost disappointed I dont get to rip my machine apart :(

    I said almost ;)

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 456263687E79524A6C776C0D0 link=1268774965/13#13 date=1276301571
    Downloaded and read the previous articles by AM and Matrix showing how to pull apart the beast and was preparing myself for a "busy" weekend.

    Last night I gave the Clean and Descale another shot.....and I think the Descale has done the trick
    Great to hear...

    Most do not do it often enough or correctly..

    Quote Originally Posted by 456263687E79524A6C776C0D0 link=1268774965/13#13 date=1276301571
    No bouncing gauge...and the needle is getting up around the higher end of the scale...so pressure appears to have returned.

    Ya pressure would have been there; it is the issue of coffee fines in teh valve and in the gauge line... As they move about the gauge will flutter..


    Note: Pulled two down over last week.. The amount of coffee fines in teh lines and valves were a bit of a surprise... Both users stated they clean often.. ( Note: one group was black and even teh graeme was dirty on both sides / shower screen was filthy)...

    The one with suss steam pump issues... dribbled like an old tap with a split washer..... Like a trooper now... Double flush / chemical clean of steam lines etc..

    This will be my Spare EM69AMB for ME....

    FIX stated it, I have said it, TG and a number of others...

    Clean ya machines and do it more often than not... Also good water..

    The other sunbeam had pump issues due to dried up scale on teh solenoid slug..

  16. #16
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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Yep, real happy now. So tell me AM...is this limited to the Sunbeam ? Im assuming it would occur in all brands.


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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 5275747F696E455D7B607B1A0 link=1268774965/15#15 date=1276325485
    Yep, real happy now. *So tell me AM...is this limited to the Sunbeam ? *Im assuming it would occur in all brands.
    NO.....

    The issue is one of plumbing and how / where the gauge etc is mounted and the operation of valves etc..

    Do coffee fines and scale cause issue for other machines YES..

    But as one moves up... Often cleaning an maintenance becomes teh norm; rather than the exception..

    Not to say you not careful...

    But in addition; a thermo block system is different to a Single boiler to a HX to a dual boiler..

    And what ya get on teh gauge Vs what ya get at the head / group may not always be the same..

    Tis the nature of the world...


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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    most home machines do not get the necessary cleaning they require

    some say that because they only do small number of coffees, that it isnt needed

    this isnt true

    most machine problems are associated with LACK of CLEANING

    graham

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 737C6D150 link=1268774965/17#17 date=1276404034
    most home machines do not get the necessary cleaning they require

    some say that because they only do small number of coffees, that it isnt needed

    this isnt true

    most machine problems are associated with LACK of CLEANING
    So true...

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 242B3A420 link=1268774965/17#17 date=1276404034

    most machine problems are associated with LACK of CLEANING

    graham
    Which raises the question of just how often this is required. *My current machine (No.4) was supplied by Sunbeam in July 08.

    During that time it has had 8 Cleaning Cycles with Sunbeam Tablets (approx every 2-3 months).

    However, looking at my own records, I am ashamed to say that the Descale had been a lot less frequent for the first year *:-[.

    This was remedied in the 2nd year at approx 4 month intervals (which falls within Sunbeams advice of 4-6 months).

    And as per my posts above, my latest issues definitley appear to have been associated with the "Scale" issue.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Gaza..

    Ya need to be closer ;D

    Quote Originally Posted by 6047464D5B5C776F495249280 link=1268774965/19#19 date=1276482298
    Which raises the question of just how often this is required. *My current machine (No.4) was supplied by Sunbeam in July 08.

    During that time it has had 8 Cleaning Cycles with Sunbeam Tablets (approx every 2-3 months).
    If I did my cleaning at that interval - I would be peeling gunk off the insides...

    2 + 2 = 5 (the 2s are variable and never teh same)

    Quote Originally Posted by 6047464D5B5C776F495249280 link=1268774965/19#19 date=1276482298
    However, looking at my own records, I am ashamed to say that the Descale had been a lot less frequent for the first year *.
    Ya keep records :o :o :o :o

    Quote Originally Posted by 6047464D5B5C776F495249280 link=1268774965/19#19 date=1276482298
    This was remedied in the 2nd year at approx 4 month intervals (which falls within Sunbeams advice of 4-6 months).

    And as per my posts above, my latest issues definitley appear to have been associated with the "Scale" issue.
    2 + 2 = 5 ;D

    Dont ya just love to hate me ;D ;)

    Fix has stated it.. I have, Fresh_Coffee as well as others..

    Cleaning is not cleaning... Many variables..

    Usage :-/
    How used ::)
    How many chokes :o
    Water :-X
    Water filter :-X
    Chemical back flush with teh RIGHT blind ::)
    De Scale :-X

    Do you leave on all teh time or turn on only when needed ?

    They are all variables that may well impact on how often and with what you should use to clean..

    As some stated in another topic.. I check my group handle and basket.. If its getting dirty I do a chemical back flush..

    My mate does his Shop machine at least 2 time a day and on busy days 3 times.... Spare groups etc have been ditched in favour of my special method..

    Save time and does two / 3 jobs at once.... For him this is through put and Quality giving less downtime and better service to the customers.....

    Shsussss No one else knows 8-) 8-) 8-)

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    after not cleaning mine once for a good 2 years straight :-[ and after suffering the inevitable consequences, I would recommend a chemical backflush (Cafetto) every 2-3 weeks regardless of how much its used. Its the build up of organic oils left after every shot that needs to be removed regularly.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Mines just started to pulse. If I put any pressure on it, the pulsing begins. So Im drinking gushers at the moment which sort of sucks. It gets Sunbeam liquid descaled once per month( including steam wand) and tablet group head clean once a week. It hardly ever gets choked, if no extraction appears after 3 seconds ( after infusing) I abort the shot and go coarser on the grind. My dose is the same level in the basket regardless of grind. Why the hell cant someone make a machine that is like a ute, practical and reliable, that doesnt need to be teated with kid gloves. Am I doing something wrong with my servicing or is the 6910 just on this earth to frustrate people. Is cafetto a powder ?, easily available in Brissy ?, better than the sunbeam tablets for cleaning the group ?

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 29283F3F242128354D0 link=1268774965/22#22 date=1276775324
    Is cafetto a powder ?, easily available in Brissy ?, better than the sunbeam tablets for cleaning the group ?
    Yes, Yes and YES

    Veneziano Caffe

    QCMS - La Nuova Era

    Di Bella Coffee

    Supreme Roasters

    And others can all supply.. A powdered back wash cleaning solution..

    1/4 tea spoon at max ...... *I always make sure I add a bit of water and a slight mix/stir before locking in and running the cleaning cycle..

    Some charge as much as $7.50 for 100g..... Thus cheep as chips and no excuse not to clean...

    Also re charge the water filter... It does help with reducing scale; it does not stop teh problem.....

    Quote Originally Posted by 29283F3F242128354D0 link=1268774965/22#22 date=1276775324
    Why the hell cant someone make a machine that is like a ute, practical and reliable, that doesnt need to be teated with kid gloves.
    Instant... Does the job... Just not fresh

    Plunger... Exceeds ya technical specks and then some...

    Wife / Partner ... Oops does not meet all teh specks

    Machine... They all need some amount of TLC


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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Cheers AM. Im believe Im descaling mine often enough to not worry about water quality or the condition of the filter. Once a month may sound like overkill but no such thing as too clean Im betting. So with the cafetto, just to confirm, its double basket, rubber blind, 1/4 teaspoon mixed into a paste ? then lock in and start cycle ? just a straight swap over from the tablet ?

    Note - Instant is banned from my house.
    - plunger has not seen the light of day for at least 5 years
    - appreciate that all things need TLC but if the 6910 were a car it would need servicing every 10 metres I had a laugh. ;D

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 5D5C4B4B50555C41390 link=1268774965/24#24 date=1276815394
    Cheers AM. Im believe Im descaling mine often enough to not worry about water quality or the condition of the filter. Once a month may sound like overkill but no such thing as too clean Im betting.

    Note - Instant is banned from my house.
    * * * *- plunger has not seen the light of day for at least 5 years
    * * * *- appreciate that all things need *TLC but if the 6910 were a car it would need servicing every 10 metres I had a laugh. ;D

    Do not assume... Only takes a bit a scale build up and BANG.. Besides unless you do a FULL de scale every months etc ... Then a chem backwash alone is not enough... Backwash is there to clean teh oils etc as that builds up faster in teh head etc.. Scale will build up where ever there is water and evaporation.. Thus a chem backwash may not even get to some parts of teh machine.. SAME for commercials...

    De scaler is a different compound and again... Without the filter / quality water your at high risk unless doing a full descale on a regular basis..

    Just ask any one here doing a re build..

    1: Group head etc = May or may not be clean..

    2: Parts leading to group - Usually scale and build up

    3: Tank - Errr just look at the pictures - Say no more.

    Water management is not great in many places...


    its double basket, rubber blind, 1/4 teaspoon mixed into a paste ? then lock in and start cycle ? just a straight swap over from the tablet ?
    Yes ... In essence that is correct..

    It targets Coffee oils..

    Thus when you do a de scale you need to watch out and clean the shower screen and head or you could and up like CH...

    A bit of scale in teh Over pressure / dump line and ya gauge will be out / bouncing/ etc and maybe no waste dumped... Also causing wet sloppy pucks and in worse case STEAM issues as well......


    if the 6910 were a car it would need servicing every 10 metres I had a laugh. ;D

    NO... If you use it to do teh local shopping / school and church on Sundays it is great..

    Carting heavy crap from Bunnings, the footy team to training 3 times a week or a mad dash of 200k every week and it will make you work for it 8-) ANd if ya miss out one thing... Call [s]the RACQ.[/s].. Err CoffeeHouse... See sig.

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    horses for courses AM. My 6910 makes 6 a day during the week and 10 a day on weekends. Is this considered a commercial amount ? doubt it. If I was making 20 per day then maybe I would expect trouble from a domestic machine - but I think its use falls into the local shopping trolley catergory rather than the tradies ute. What is the amount of cups / day when you need a serious $ 5000 machine in order to get reliability ?

    With the cleaning, yep full descale every month including steam. I was wondering though, because I do the chemical backflush once a week, every 4 weeks it coincides with the descale. Which one should I do first ?

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 65647373686D6479010 link=1268774965/26#26 date=1276851440
    With the cleaning, yep full descale every month including steam. I was wondering though, because I do the chemical backflush once a week, every 4 weeks it coincides with the descale. Which one should I do first ?
    De scale before a Chem Back flush..

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    ok cool. I thought maybe the other way round. Maybe the back flush might dislodge something that would then be flushed out with the descale. But you da man, so descale first it is.

    Cheers

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    Re: EM6910 - Pressure Guage "bouncing"

    Quote Originally Posted by 5D5C4B4B50555C41390 link=1268774965/28#28 date=1276865990
    ok cool. I thought maybe the other way round. Maybe the back flush might dislodge something that would then be flushed out with the descale. But you da man, so descale first it is.

    Cheers
    All care; NO RESPONSIBILITY.. ;)

    Crap can be loosened every time, by either product..

    Personally I feel the commercial de scaler is a bit more powerful as to cleaning of scale and the back flush focused on coffee oils....

    The pathways are different... But at least this way the final method is one of cleaning the coffee pathways as per normal... Also acts as another flush to a small extent.

    NOTE: Get a de scaler that dissolves ... Not just loosens... Loose scale is dangerous...

    PS. Remember to remove and clean the group head and screens..









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