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Thread: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

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    Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    My shiny new Rancilio Silvia arrived yesterday! *I have been working on my coffee technique for about 6 months, but have only had a Sunbeam burr grinder & a cheapo domestic machine until now. *I went through 250g of beans before I got two decent cups, but I am happy with the machine so far.

    Questions:
    • Can anyone tell me why it has two water inlet pipes (2008 model)? One is easy to manage, but the other is short and wont stay on the bottom of the tank.
    • I want to start making quality coffee. *What is the best shot size & coffee cup size to use?

    Thanks in advance

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    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Gday tts,

    And welcome to CoffeeSnobs!

    1. The short tube is the return from the overpressure valve. This valve keeps the pressure into the coffee at the required amount by diverting excess water back into the tank. It doesnt need to go to the bottom of the tank cause water comes out of it!

    2. Use the double basket, dose right, and make the shot size and cup size that taste best to you. A search of the site will give you lots of tips, but the best tip is "its whats in the cup that counts".

    Greg

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks Greg, those are very helpful answers. *tts, *hmmm, I like that :D

    Its interesting you say to use the double basket. *On my old (small) machine I never bothered with the single basket. *I just made a single shot from the double every time. *With this new one I am not sure as I like a strong cup but I want to make sure I am making the best coffee possible (at my skill level). *Would you suggest making two full shots from the double basket and pouring them both in to my mug?

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 3C29232D263C202D3B252D2F480 link=1249093026/2#2 date=1249102567
    Thanks Greg, those are very helpful answers. *tts, *hmmm, I like that :D

    Its interesting you say to use the double basket. *On my old (small) machine I never bothered with the single basket. *I just made a single shot from the double every time. *With this new one I am not sure as I like a strong cup but I want to make sure I am making the best coffee possible (at my skill level). *Would you suggest making two full shots from the double basket and pouring them both in to my mug?
    NOOOOOOooooooo


    You take a standard shot using the double basket..

    1: 50 to 60 sec should give 50 - 60ml

    However many of us like to cut the shot short at 40 - 50 sec, as it is does / can produce a good full bodied coffee without the acidity / bitterness that the extra caffeine can give.. *The longer you run it, the more caffeine you will get.. (GENERALISATION I know, but a rule of thumb.)

    As GW said... *Do a search and look for posts on the Silvia.. 99% of your questions will be answered already.

    How to search is here http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1248646363

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks this is helping me too... I struggle to dose right - I have Rancilio grinder and machine - if I tap too much while dosing and them tamp down it seems to be too much and it struggles to get through - drips. If I dont tap enough it under-doses and blondes too soon.

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    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 705F5654437C505F5056545C545F45310 link=1249093026/3#3 date=1249103430
    Quote Originally Posted by 3C29232D263C202D3B252D2F480 link=1249093026/2#2 date=1249102567
    *Would you suggest making two full shots from the double basket and pouring them both in to my mug?
    NOOOOOOooooooo


    You take a standard shot using the double basket..

    1: 50 to 60 sec should give 50 - 60ml
    Im not sure if AM misunderstood what you were trying to say or if he got it right, in which case Ill take his interpretation and say that if you want two full shots, after running the first shot, fill the basket again with freshly ground coffee and then run the second shot.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Just so there is no confusion, when using the double filter basket you should be aiming for a total of 50 - 60ml in 25 - 30secs. ie. if you have a measuring glass under each spout you should be getting 25 - 30 ml in each glass.

    Cheers,
    Alan

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Im not sure if AM misunderstood what you were trying to say or if he got it right, in which case Ill take his interpretation and say that if you want two full shots, after running the first shot, fill the basket again with freshly ground coffee and then run the second shot.

    Thanks TG... Yep, could be read either way... As to teh Question and or my response...

    Quote Originally Posted by 2633282C322338410 link=1249093026/6#6 date=1249119778

    Just so there is no confusion, when using the double filter basket you should be aiming for a total of 50 - 60ml in 25 - 30secs. ie. if you have a measuring glass under each spout you should be getting 25 - 30 ml in each glass.

    Cheers,
    Alan
    Thanks..


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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    As it has been said "its about whats in the cup that counts"!
    Keep working on getting ur dose and tamp consistant combine that with the right grind and a bit of temperature surfing and you will pulling great shots in no time!!!
    Keep practicing and working on them! Before u know it u will be roaring ur own beans too!! :D

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks for all the answers people. *I did mean two shots at the same time from a double basket. *I think with my old machine (small Breville) a double shot was more like a single shot on a Rancilio. *I will experiment tomorrow with a double basket, making 50-60ml :)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I hope I am posting this question the correct place.
    I am researching for a new machine, and it looks like Silvia is the girl for me. Can someone tell me, besides a PID, what accessories should I purchase at the same time? Do I need a special basket for cleaning or other bits and pieces? I am unsure what comes in the box with the Silvia.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I hope I am posting this question the correct place.
    I am researching for a new machine, and it looks like Silvia is the girl for me. Can someone tell me, besides a PID, what accessories should I purchase at the same time? Do I need a special basket for cleaning or other bits and pieces? I am unsure what comes in the box with the Silvia.
    :)

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    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 687A71717B767A1F0 link=1249093026/10#10 date=1249170357
    I hope I am posting this question the correct place.
    I am researching for a new machine, and it looks like Silvia is the girl for me. Can someone tell me, besides a PID, what accessories should I purchase at the same time? Do I need a special basket for cleaning or other bits and pieces? I am unsure what comes in the box with the Silvia.
    Everything you need will come in the box
    But users will probably advise you to ditch the single basket *
    However you will need a
    Grinder & a good Tamper

    Most sponsors will supply you with a kit of back-flush chemical, starter bag of beans, & if you are lucky a milk frothing jug and cleaning cloths

    KK

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    You may need to get a blind cup to put in the group head for back flushing. it didnt come with my machine but the new ones might?

    Good tamp is also a accessory I would look at getting 1st

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    True, true. *The tamper that came with it is annoying me right now. *It does the job but leavs a lot up to guessing. *I have now ordered a nice one from Coffee Parts :D

    Btw, I went through a 250g bag of beans (from big coffee chain) and got mediocre results. *Then yesterday I went to my usual local roastery and got some nice beans. *The first cup I made was far far better without any adjustment. *I was quite surprised by this.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 52474D4348524E43554B4341260 link=1249093026/14#14 date=1249173182
    I went through a 250g bag of beans (from big coffee chain) and got mediocre results.Then yesterday I went to my usual local roastery and got some nice beans.The first cup I made was far far better without any adjustment. I was quite surprised by this.
    You havent read enough here then. This is no surprise, because the beans from your local roastery are fresher.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Remember as AM will no doubt jumpin and say......the coffee bean was a living fruit, it goes stale, just like all other fruit, FRESH is always best....with some days to de-gas that is I had a laugh its such a science! :D

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Whats the best way to store the beans? I keep them for up to a month in an air tight jar or rolled up in the supplied bag in the cupboard.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 03040F0F1809080D0D610 link=1249093026/17#17 date=1249174649
    Whats the best way to store the beans? *I keep them for up to a month in an air tight jar or rolled up in the supplied bag in the cupboard.
    One way valve bags is one of the best ways to store roasted beans

    KK


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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    the ones I brought from Cosmorex have that valve thing in them - but what about after I open the bag? The best one can do is seal it with pegs or something.

    Also I have started a thread in this forum on cleaning the grinder - thoughts would be GREATLY appreciated!

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Get some one way valve bags with a zip seal

    KK

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Sponsors have everything you need
    <----------over there!, coffeeparts is a great place to get the bags, and their delivery time is awesome!

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I have a question about the boiler. *I usually make a cappuccino for myself every morning :D *But I usually also make a hot chocolate for my wife at night. *Is it a bad idea to turn on the machine and just start steaming? *I always keep plenty of water in the tank. *Do I need to run any water through first?

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I guess I am trying to clarify ways to kill ones boiler so as to avoid doing so. *E.g. when the machine is not is use, does the boiler stay full? *When steaming, does fresh water continue to come in from the water tank? *Cheers

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Speaking of which, today I had to prime my boiler for the second time in a row. Basically I am a bit of a slacker and will often drink my coffee before returning to give everything a good clean (inc remove coffee cake). I have found that on returning and turning the machine on, no water will run once I remove the group head. Thoughts?

    Before everyone jumps down my throat: I do plan to remove the coffee cake quickly once I get a knocking tube :)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 766369676C766A67716F6765020 link=1249093026/24#24 date=1249250902
    *Basically I am a bit of a slacker

    I do plan to remove the coffee cake quickly once I get a knocking tube :)
    dude you just droped what $750+ on a coffee machine, thats not gonna help its life any.

    why not AT WORST, once you steam your milk (or before imo is best)
    pull out the group handle, run a *2 sec flush and leave the puck in the filter on the bench....

    leaving it in for 10 mins in the head, and turning off the machine is bad news, coffee oils and grinds are gonna gunk the head up like no tomorrow and your gonna be doing some heavy cleaning.

    change your routine for the better and your coffee will be better to

    glad you put noob in the title, this could be in for a flaming session

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    another good step IMO, is once steaming is complete and you have cleaned the wand.

    pour your milk, then

    RE-Prime the boiler then and there and clean he head etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by 23363C3239233F32243A3230570 link=1249093026/23#23 date=1249249523
    I guess I am trying to clarify ways to kill ones boiler so as to avoid doing so. *E.g. when the machine is not is use, does the boiler stay full? *When steaming, does fresh water continue to come in from the water tank? *Cheers
    the boiler is only full when you prime it, if you steam you remove water (as steam) it does not refill while steaming.

    it does pump water in when you make a shot, but imo there may be some loss over a few shots.

    i would not steam more than 2 cups of milk without repriming my machine (Brasilia lady 300ml boiler, much the same as a silvia)

    imo make re-priming a priority in your routine
    no better way to kill a machine than dry heating


    my method
    turn on
    prime boiler and heat up
    fire a few flushes to warm everything through GHead and Ghandle
    grind coffee and tamp etc
    run flush to bring hot water into head (might help balance heat?)
    insert Ghandle and make shot
    pour milk to jug while shot runs
    remove Ghandle empty puck rince under Ghead
    press steam and wait 15 secs (clean head with cloth if time)
    purge steam and steam it
    clean wand, purge some steam to clean wand
    RE-PRIME BOILER NOW
    run flush to clean again
    turn off machine (or not)
    pour milk

    drink coffee and relax

    sure its a new machine and you need time to get used to the new machine, but dont abuse it from the start

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks for the replies Maheel. *Re: cleaning, when you put it like that....my poor Silvia! *I guess I was thinking a week or so until I get some good cleaning tools wouldnt make much diference. *I have now run 1lt through it, and soaked the group head in boiling water :)

    Cheers for the boiler into. *I think I will start priming it when I turn on & before steaming.

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    Senior Member benandfaith's Avatar
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Hi TTS, good to hear you asking the right questions!

    My routine is pretty similar to maheel, but a few slight differences.

    1. Machine on, prime (simply flick brew switch until you see water coming out of group head)
    2. Insert group handle (group handle)/Group handle -loosely- (if too tight, as things expand with increasing heat, could do damage to rubber ring in the group head)
    3. Either wait 15-20 minutes or periodically flush hot water through the system for around 8-10 mins (search google cheating miss silvia) to get up to temperature. This is how I warm my cups also.
    4. Grind, distribute, tamp.
    5. I feel like the optimum temperature for brewing is when the light (indicating the element is heating) has just gone off and I flush through just enough water (2 secs?) for the flash of hot steam to be released (which indicates the temperature to be at ~100C). Optimum brew temp is around +/-90C.
    6. I lock in group handle and flick brew switch. Usually a double ristretto, so 40-45ml in 25 secs.
    7. Flick off brew switch, flick on steam switch.
    8. At 30 secs, I purge wand until steam seems dry. Youll be surprised how much water is purged - I think at least 30ml (rough guesstimate!). I start steaming 35-45 seconds after the switch has been flicked BEFORE the steam element light goes OFF. With the element still running when you start steaming, it will stay on for longer = more steam generated.
    9. I would never steam more than 300ml of milk without re-priming. I prime boiler by flicking the hot water switch.
    10. Finished steaming, (attempt to) pour latte art. Clean steam wand, remove group handle, bang out puck, flush water through over the group handle which doubles as priming of boiler.
    11. Leave group handle somewhere, leave machine on or not (depending if next coffee session is within the hour or not).
    12. Enjoy my coffee!!!

    *All timings are approximate - Im not that anal
    * I dont beat myself up too much if I forget one of these steps or do it in the wrong order
    *** EXCEPT leaving the steam switch on and forgetting to turn it off after steaming = BAD!
    *** EXCEPT turning on the boiler element with NO water in the boiler and not priming = BAD!

    Thats my system! Hope it helps! (And if anyone notices any grevious error or ommission, please feel free to correct my post)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    if making coffee you can make shot then steam, no need to prime (imo) as boiler "refills" while pumping shot (as long as you prime at start or end etc)

    if just going to steam hot chocy milk at night then i would prime prior and after

    if you prime when you begin and are finished (anal I may be) then its always full. by doing a few extra flushs you help keep it clean.
    I flush to a cup so i dont need to worry about the drip tray all the time.

    you might be able to push out 4+ cups of steam i dont know for sure, why risk it. unless you are mad temp surfer it will rebound the heat fast enough to keep up imo.

    I like to think that after steaming you have a very hot boiler, when you prime it again you lower the heat and warm the incoming water ready for the next shot. By the time you get set for the shot it should have heated or cooled enough to be close to right. Thats my simple temp surfing method, but each to there own method for temp as there is plenty of info on temp surfing.


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    Senior Member benandfaith's Avatar
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 697C7678736975786E70787A1D0 link=1249093026/27#27 date=1249256224
    Thanks for the replies Maheel. *Re: cleaning, when you put it like that....my poor Silvia! *I guess I was thinking a week or so until I get some good cleaning tools wouldnt make much diference. *I have now run 1lt through it, and soaked the group head in boiling water :)

    Cheers for the boiler into. *I think I will start priming it when I turn on & before steaming.
    Hi TTS, in case youre not sure what cleaning equipment to get...

    Backflush: need blind filter; backflush with water regularly, with backflush solution weekly or less often depending on usage. Solution only to be used for group head and through the GH into the 3-way solenoid, etc.
    De-scale: to be done once in a while (every 3 months? depending on how hard your water is? Not sure... someone feel free to correct me) with de-scaling solution. I used to use diluted food-grade citric acid, but Im not sure if that is kosher anymore!

    General cleaning: group head brush to scrub, cloth for wand cleaning, cloth for polishing! *:)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks benandfaith & maheel. *I will feel a lot more confident using the machine from now on :D

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Okay, I am probably jumping the gun here seeing as I dont even have all the crap I actually need. *But when I watch youtube espresso techniques, they often have a bottomless group handle. *I can see one is available off-the-shelf for the Rancilio. *Is this something I should be adding to my list of "to get"? *Most of the time I am making a double-shot for a single cup. *What are the benefits? *Cheers

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    A_M
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 74616B656E746865736D6567000 link=1249093026/32#32 date=1249303839
    Okay, I am probably jumping the gun here seeing as I dont even have all the crap I actually need. *But when I watch youtube espresso techniques, they often have a bottomless group handle. *I can see one is available off-the-shelf for the Rancilio. *Is this something I should be adding to my list of "to get"? *Most of the time I am making a double-shot for a single cup. *What are the benefits? *Cheers
    Do a search for naked portafilters or naked group etc ..

    While it can look smooth and trendy, it really is a teaching aid...

    Is it a MUST HAVE / NEED Vs would be nice / want ?

    The naked will highlight issues with your method/s and allow you to see the outcome... Will it tell you whats wrong...

    NO...

    But if you understand all the principles, it will assist you in pin pointing what you need to be looking at..

    Then again, it does look good ;)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Cheers. *I guess I will leave it until last, and put it on the maybe pile

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    My shiny tamper arrived today, which has already improved my brew. However I am getting some coffee grit at the bottom of my cup. Is this a sign something is wrong? And if so how do I fix it? Cheers

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    1: *Over flow, if leaking around the group head seal

    2: Dirty Group head or *basket etc ?

    3: Too fine a grind..

    Hard to pinpoint without a visual *:D

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I can only guess the grind is too fine?, how hard are you tamping, i ask because im guessing your getting the old 25ml in around 30 sec or so, so if grinds are escaping through the pinholes in the bottom of the basket the coffee would have to be fine, and if your tamping between 10-15KG ish then it would most likely choke the silvia......if this is the case and your grinding really fine and tamping light, i would suggest you grind courser and tamp a little harder to maintain teh 25 in 30 seconds.....
    hope this helps

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Thanks for the tips. I will double-check those points.

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    I watched it this time and did notice a small leakage over the side. *I guess I wasnt putting it in hard enough - it was lass than perpendicular.

    ...such a long road to coffee perfection. *But it sure beats instant: tar with coffee in first, or weak tar with milk in first *:P

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 6C79737D766C707D6B757D7F180 link=1249093026/39#39 date=1249371895
    I watched it this time and did notice a small leakage over the side. *I guess I wasnt putting it in hard enough - it was lass than perpendicular.

    ...such a long road to coffee perfection. *But it sure beats instant: tar with coffee in first, or weak tar with milk in first *:P
    Thanks for the feedback... Some times it can be so slight... That ya miss it..

    I made lots of coffee at my work and teh only one I did not lock in and flooded with grinds was the one that was for teh Director ;) :D ;D 8-) :o ::) :P

    Every one had fun at my expense... But his second time round was OK and he got some art as a bonus...

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 14010B050E140805130D0507600 link=1249093026/39#39 date=1249371895
    I watched it this time and did notice a small leakage over the side. *I guess I wasnt putting it in hard enough - it was lass than perpendicular.

    ...such a long road to coffee perfection. *But it sure beats instant: tar with coffee in first, or weak tar with milk in first *:P
    Certainly sounds like the PF is not locked in tight enough. Handle goes past perpendicular for me - more like 5 Oclock looking from on top of it.

    As for the long road, it all begins somewhere! At least now with some good gear, you have cut out a couple of factors... with good fresh beans, the rest is up to you!

    I found the thing that helped me most was watching someone who did it well do it in front of me and with me a couple of times, just to make sure. Perhaps a trip back to the place of purcahse for some training or perhaps a local CSer? Where are you situated?

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 436C6567704F636C6365676F676C76020 link=1249093026/40#40 date=1249377374
    Thanks for the feedback...Some times it can be so slight... That ya miss it..
    Indeed, I probably wouldnt have noticed if you hadnt suggested I look :D

    Quote Originally Posted by 60676C636C6664636B766A020 link=1249093026/41#41 date=1249378239
    As for the long road, it all begins somewhere! At least now with some good gear, you have cut out a couple of factors... with good fresh beans, the rest is up to you!
    Yes, I just realised that tonight - only thing left to fix is me ;) *But every cup has been better than the last (give or take). *That said, I havent made anything yet that I would happily offer to a guest.

    Quote Originally Posted by 60676C636C6664636B766A020 link=1249093026/41#41 date=1249378239
    I found the thing that helped me most was watching someone who did it well do it in front of me and with me a couple of times, just to make sure. Perhaps a trip back to the place of purcahse for some training or perhaps a local CSer? Where are you situated? *
    I purchased it off Coffee Parts, but I live in Brisbane North. *Burpengary to be exact.

  44. #44
    A_M
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 2C39333D362C303D2B353D3F580 link=1249093026/42#42 date=1249389467
    Quote Originally Posted by 436C6567704F636C6365676F676C76020 link=1249093026/40#40 date=1249377374
    Thanks for the feedback...Some times it can be so slight... That ya miss it..
    Indeed, I probably wouldnt have noticed if you hadnt suggested I look :D

    Quote Originally Posted by 60676C636C6664636B766A020 link=1249093026/41#41 date=1249378239
    As for the long road, it all begins somewhere! At least now with some good gear, you have cut out a couple of factors... with good fresh beans, the rest is up to you!
    Yes, I just realised that tonight - only thing left to fix is me ;) *But every cup has been better than the last (give or take). *That said, I havent made anything yet that I would happily offer to a guest.

    Quote Originally Posted by 60676C636C6664636B766A020 link=1249093026/41#41 date=1249378239
    I found the thing that helped me most was watching someone who did it well do it in front of me and with me a couple of times, just to make sure. Perhaps a trip back to the place of purcahse for some training or perhaps a local CSer? Where are you situated? *
    I purchased it off Coffee Parts, but I live in Brisbane North. *Burpengary to be exact.
    Ya coming to teh Meet and Greet ??

    Only just down the road... Wooloowin ;)

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 17383133241B37383731333B333822560 link=1249093026/43#43 date=1249389622
    Ya coming to teh Meet and Greet ??

    Only just down the road...WooloowinWink
    Depending on the date and time. *Link??

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions


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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Hmmm, cant do Sunday mornings, church etc. *But will try and come to the next one :)

  48. #48
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 3B2E242A213B272A3C222A284F0 link=1249093026/46#46 date=1249391208
    Hmmm, cant do Sunday mornings, church etc. *But will try and come to the next one :)
    Hey tts, where do you church?

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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 383F343B343E3C3B332E325A0 link=1249093026/47#47 date=1249428152
    Hey tts, where do you church? *
    http://www.southpinechurch.com/

  50. #50
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    Re: Rancilio Silvia - noob questions

    Okay, coffee this morning was a complete write-off. *Six wasted double shots and no joy! *The only thing I have changed is turning the group handle until the spouts are in the correct position (tighter). *Over the six tries I slowly reduced the grind, reduced the dose, and reduced the tamping (all very slightly each time). *Each time it was taking too long for coffee to start coming out. *The coffee looked good, but it would have taken about 45 secs or more to get 60ml. *The last shot was scary - like water with visible oil on top. *Before that they looked good. *For dosing I am using two level Silvia scoops into the Sunbeam grinder. *Started at 13 grind, went down to 9. *I know the beans are fresh, and I even got the last few scoops from the big bag (I keep a smaller one near the machine).

    Suggestions?? *:(



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