does that mean the thermoblock isnt heating at the same time the boiler is?Originally Posted by 784D4047736F434A4A49492C0 link=1279089566/0#0 date=1279089566
Watch out Silvia?
New into Talk Coffee today:
I have collected our evaluation unit. Now to see if I can break it ;)
Interesting in that we have a PID controlled boiler of 500ml, which is much bigger than the Silvia and thermoblock steam. The steam is quick and nice and dry, but Ill have to be sold on thermoblock. I got perfect milk texture in a 400ml jug, but Id say leave the 1L one in the cupboard....
More info and internal pix to come....
- Micro-computer control system
- LCD display screen. 1oC control of brew temperature
- Adjustable pre-infusion function, Set single, double time. It even has a POD setting ::)
- Manual Milk texture, single hole rotating steam wand.
- 58mm group, offset p/f lugs
- 3 way solenoid valve
- Italian pump
- #304 stainless steel boiler
- AC Power AC 220~240V
- Water Boiler 1100 Watts
- Steam thermoblock 700 Watts
- Max. Consumption 1100 Watts
- Boiler construction: Stainless Steel
- Capacity of Boiler:500cc
- Capacity of Tank: 2.0 Litres
- Pressure of Pump: up to 15 bar
- Dimensions h x w x d: 353x280x425mm
- Net Weight: 8.5 kgs
- Gross Weight: 9.5 kgs
Setting the machine up:
does that mean the thermoblock isnt heating at the same time the boiler is?Originally Posted by 784D4047736F434A4A49492C0 link=1279089566/0#0 date=1279089566
That would be right....Otherwise it would be drawing 1800W. The thermoblock has be used so that you can go straight from shot to steam...Originally Posted by 2E262E292325470 link=1279089566/1#1 date=1279090932
I had heard this was coming, although didnt think youd be the first to post about it Chris. Definitely interested to hear how it performs since I know a couple of people who might be interested.
Very interesting machine Chris.... 8-)
Where-abouts are they manufactured?
Its Asian Mal. I think China? *:-/Originally Posted by 072A2E222F430 link=1279089567/4#4 date=1279110815
Ill check and confirm....
 Apologies- Manufactured in Taiwan [/edit]
So far so good....Originally Posted by 425541404E260 link=1279089567/3#3 date=1279106015
I am about 20 shots in and so far, so good...
The baskets are not pressurised but the holes are pretty small. Ill try to get a p/f gauge onto it, but I reckon it might be running at over 9 bar. I can get a really good shot out of it, but the dosing latitude is tight.
Milk texture is perfect, but I have only tried a 400ml jug....It feels slooooow compared to the GS/3, but thats no surprise.
A big tick on programmable preinfusion and setup is excellent. I had it sussed in about 2 min without consulting any instructions....
Taiwans good....Originally Posted by 65505D5A6E725E57575454310 link=1279089567/5#5 date=1279111065
They know about quality in those parts 8-)
But I was thinking this: youve warmed up the machine (boiler and block), and pulled a shot. Now you straight away go to froth some milk, so the thermoblock will kick in because cold water is coming in the inlet. This means the boiler isnt re-heating ready for the next shot until youve stopped frothing your milk.Originally Posted by 16232E291D012D24242727420 link=1279089567/2#2 date=1279091555
Just a thought as to the speed. But it is what it is - and no doubt priced accordingly - Im just thinking :)
Wait...Taiwan = China.
Yes and no. It depends what side of an intensely political fence you sit on WotB. Either way, Taiwan continue to buy missiles, tanks and warplanes from Uncle Sam to ensure they are not China nor become so anytime soon.Originally Posted by 57696E655F6F665F7468655F4265616E000 link=1279089567/8#8 date=1279156707
Now, on to more relevant things. Production quality in Taiwan far exceeds that of China. Taiwan retains the lions share of technical, complicated assembly and production (electronics, etc). All things being equal, Id take a Taiwanese made product over a Chinese one anyday. Whilst China is constantly improving, they still have quite a gap to close.
Er NO and very different to deal with generally. Epic has it spot on in 10 years time it will be a different thing and we will be bagging Indian products then over Chinese ;)Originally Posted by 7A44434872424B72594548726F484C432D0 link=1279089567/8#8 date=1279156707
Looks interesting Chris. Finally what looks like a quality alternate to the Sunbeam 6910 in this area without the wait a while hastles of single boilers :)
Whats the circa price point Chris?
Hi Roger,Originally Posted by 6959424C435F4E5978424F4E2B0 link=1279089567/11#11 date=1279172043
RRP is $940, but there will be a few discounted ones for early adopters ;)
We are working with Craig of 9 bar on this an the initial import was only very small. A few are out for evaluation, so only small numbers will be available if it passes muster. So far, all is good. I was even surprised that it ships with a really nice albeit light machined tamper. Its all black- I presume some sort of composite or plastic, but its good and it works! :)
So far, so good!
Were a good 50 shots in and I havent broken it yet. I hammered it in a 1 hour session today and it will definitely give the Silvia a run for its money.
Love the programmable preinfusion. Dont like the pump pressure as its running at circa 15 bar... We can fix that.. ;) It ships with a correctly sized, real tamper! :o
Come and have a gander on Saturday morning if youre keen to see it in the metal.
Well, that is closer than visiting craig :)
Does it have a hot water dispenser? *
Is it and E61?
Ive been lurking around CS for a few weeks now... I am researching which machine to buy to upgrade for a very old and basic krupps (I know its known as Krapps on here, but it was $20 brand new at a trash and treasure stall!)Ive narrowed down to the lelit or the rock/silvia combo...
I live in sydney and this new machine looks very interesting, is there somewhere in sydney that i can come and see it? or even better, somewhere that i can try and compare the lelit, silvia and this new one all at the same place?
Also, how is it for steaming? I usually have a double cap everymorning and love a hot chocolate at night, so steam is important!
Also, anyone got any idea on the warm up times for each of these? do they vary much?
hmmm... sorry for going off topic a bit, lots of questions i havnt gotten around to asking yet...
She has that Gaggia baby look a like thing goingminua the digital display. :D
My concern is the longevity of the machine. Is up against the Silia which willlast a lifetime.See how she goes.
I think theres a new drug to cure that ::) ;DOriginally Posted by 6565656B676E6E6D6D080 link=1279089567/17#17 date=1279372114
any news on when the internal pics are coming?
I have had a thermoblock sunbeam and a lelit with boiler.. (Feel free to correct me if Im wrong)- but Im pretty sure if steam is important to you then youll find a boiler to be more effective in a shorter space of time as it builds the steam pressure before opening the wand and unleashing it. With a thermoblock it does on the fly steaming so doesnt create built up pressure as effectively and hence builds up while you steam. (Youtube videos help for understanding this in a practical sense).Originally Posted by 5143454D4D4647131B1A11220 link=1279089567/16#16 date=1279258975
As for warm up time. Most people on here would suggest at least 15-20 minutes before even trying a shot.. Personally, my Lelit is hot in 5 or 6 minutes..which is about when the indicator light switches off to tell you its ready. Touching the portafilter (if its in the group head) is burning hot in 10 minutes - this as Ive read is because the boiler actually sits directly on top of the group head in the lelit ,whereas on the silvia its offset. ;)
Yes Luke, all valid points...Originally Posted by 534A545A485E4D52080E0E3F0 link=1279089567/20#20 date=1279708398
However, the aspect of the design of this machine is that it has both and from what you write, your experience is limited to either, not both together as in this configuration.
Today, I pre-heated the thermoblock for steam and then switched back to shot which had maintained the 94oC I had set while playing with a few shots..
The shot was terrific now that we have the machine down to 9 bar. On selecting steam, it was ready to go immediately and coped really well with 400ml jug I chose for my breakfast coffee. For mine, Id actually prefer this as there in no degradation of the shot while you wait for the boiler to come to pressure.
This machine rewrites the rulebook in a whole heap of ways. Ultimately, it doesnt have quite the steam pressure of a Silvia, but its more than adequate. There is no need to prime the boiler either as its always full. This also means far less risk of cooked elements as well.
Its a really clean and simple build and impressive in its capabilities. At this point, I am 99% certain that if I had Silvia money, I wouldnt buy one as I can have this and temperature control for the same price. It doesnt compete with a Silvia, it competes with a PIDed Silvia and beats it on functionality. Would I buy one if I had $2k to spend? Nope. If the budget was closer to $1k, I see this and a K3T and thats the first combo were going to offer.
Pics will come, but they wont happen until after Aromafest.
Thanks for all the info so far about the Gee, and the info about sunbeam vs silvia vs lelit!
Chris, will this machine be at the aroma fest?
I am definitely leaning towards the lelit at the moment, but would definitely consider paying a little extra for this new machine and the K3T grinder... how much are you planning on selling this combo for? when will it be available to buy?
Fraid not for Aromafest...It landed too late...Originally Posted by 1103050D0D0607535B5A51620 link=1279089567/22#22 date=1279758986
Details on our early adopters offer are at http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1163933911/14#14
We are hoping that it will be ranged in Sydney as well.
You want take take the plunge and upgrade to a real machine from your Presso. You do all the research, compare machines, watch the YTube vids, decide you want a Silvia ... Then this comes along.
Whats a CSer to do?
I had a laugh - buy both and then sell the one you dont want ;)
or take my approach and procrastinate as long as you can... something cool always comes along
Maybe you take the risk and give this one a go because it could be just as good if not better? Or you purchase the Silvia knowing that theres so much support out there and you KNOW it will last you (in the right hands).Originally Posted by 2930282C3C6860590 link=1279089567/24#24 date=1279843230
Also being sold by *9 Bar Espresso Services
Originally Posted by 0F3A37300418343D3D3E3E5B0 link=1279089567/0#0 date=1279089566
What type of material is the thermoblock? Stainless or aluminium?
Ill see what I can find Seno.
My knowledge of boliers is a whole heap better. As I understand, they are generally (all? :-/) Aluminium, its just whether the channels are stainless lined or not. Ill see if Craig can shed any light on it...
The boiler of this machine is stainless though...
The thermoblock itself is aluminium with a stainless lining through it.
The more time I spend with this machine, the more I am impressed with it.Originally Posted by 2A517261130 link=1279089567/30#30 date=1280727911
I have run shots at different temperatures, played with preinfusion and produced terrific microfoam as well. It does take some time to get to know and a couple of minutes to program and after that all is good.
It even ships with an ergo, well shaped and perfectly fitting tamper *:o Its a plakky one, but of excellent design and a great start for an excellent machine. We have it on special this month. See our sponsor area for more info...
Hi Chris, I was interested to know if you still have an early adopter price going for the Gee.
I was going to PM you but I need to have at least one post on the system *before it will allow PMs - so here is my first post :)
Sure do teratory,Originally Posted by 75647360756E7378010 link=1279089567/32#32 date=1281162281
Dennis of Cuppacoffee in Sydney is the man for NSW sales though ;)
Looking at the GEE pictures seemed familiar... ::)
then I went back to Randy Gs website and noticed his posting about a new Silvia Killer from Bill Crossland, apparently formerly of La Marzoco. The GEE and the Crossland look identical. :)
FWIW, that seems like a pretty good endorsement - if any potential purchasers out there are worried about being an early adopter.
review on chinese website of Gee espresso
click on [ch25353][ch36889][ch35041][ch27298][ch35222][ch22294][ch29255] link to open pics, has pics of internals boiler, thermal block pcb , pump etc and group head , showers screen etc
can put through google translate but its very rough translation.
Google and Chrome - the translation was OK..
Some interesting pics and like teh approach to the group head and shower dispersion etc..
This is certainly an interesting machine.
Ive bene living with a Ascaso Steel for 3 years now which is a boiler/thermoblock combination machine - the thermoblock in the ascaso is brass and produces pretty good steam. If my memory serves me right they are a little more expensive than the Gee.
Does the Gee make the "thunk thunk" as the water is passed through the thermoblock (like the Sunbeams do) ?
Sure does GS,Originally Posted by 70766D7E797048647862637F170 link=1279089567/37#37 date=1282525025
As I understand, its inherent in all thermoblocks.
Actually the Ascaso doesnt suffer that problem - I dont know how they do it but the thermoblock is relatively silent - outside the pump. No thunk thunk.
Had to take the cover off the make sure it was actually a thermoblock.
First time post and would appreciate some information and advice.
I want to upgrade from a Gaggia Classic and Sunbeam em grinder and Im considering purchasing the GEE with the K3.
Is the upgrade a worthwhile one? I understand upgrading the grinder on its own will provide an improvement in coffee quality but would the machine also make a noticeable contribution.
Just also wanted to know what kind of warranty the machine has and whether you believe it has the kind of lifespan a well looked after silvia would (never owned one just going by how well people say they are built)?
Finally is there anybody here that has purchased the unit? I know it is relatively new just wanted to hear some consumer feedback.
I too am interested in the longevity or otherwise of this machine.
I am in the market to replace my deceased Sunbeam and have been given tentative approval to purchase one of these. Have you heard of any reliability issues from OS, where I imagine they are more common. Or would I be better off buying a Silvia or a Lelit?
Originally Posted by 1A090B4C0 link=1279089567/40#40 date=1283049333Commercial interests stated at the outset as I am the NSW Distributor of the GEE. I believe that with this commercial interest comes responsibility, and I only did so having made my own assessment of the machine.Originally Posted by 0E292D27293E7B784C0 link=1279089567/41#41 date=1283815449
The GEE carries the same warranty period of 12 months as most other machines. I would expect that any faults regardless of whether its a GEE or any other machine, become evident during that time.
The machine is well manufactured and I would expect that with regular, routine maintenance there is no reason why the mechanical parts should not last as long as they do in other machines.
I also recommend the use of a good water softening system for any machine, though particularly for this and other machines that include a thermoblock system.
Internally, the machine is well laid out and any work that may be required is a simple and easy process that translates to low cost.
The ability to program the machine means there is an electronic board inside which is basically plug in/plug out. How long the average lifespan of this component is, Im not sure. It really is a bit the same with any electrical piece of equipment. For some reason Ive used light bulbs that last 50 hours and others that seem indesctructible! Again, if the need were to arise, its not a big or expensive job.
My personal belief is that it is capable of and does make a better coffee than the Gaggia and Sunbeam, and texturises milk well too.
Hope that helps a little.
I have seen the sticky thread and recommendations from the vendors in a few threads.
However yet to hear any feedback from Joe Public about the performance/value of this machine.
Anyone? I wonder how many units have been sold to date...
Welcome to Coffee Snobs skwaler.
Hopefully Joe will be along soon to give you his impressions.
How about you introduce yourself to us in the Hi! Im new here. Go easy on me! thread.
Would be great to see this machine in action!
To me theres something dated about the look of the machine .. but thats just the vibe it gives me from looking at pictures of it... However, all the specs sound great.
Ive looked at the videos on the GEE website and their commercial machine seems interesting too...
Are you a prospective GEE test pilot?
[*]Youre Melbourne based and you own a Silvia and good grinder or even better still, a PID Silvia.[*]You know how to pull a great shot and can prove it ;)[*]Youre keen to look at the GEE machine to see how it compares with your machine[*]Youre prepared to come visit us to collect the GEE and then return the machine at the end of your week.
What were offering:[*]Come and grab our demo GEE machine and *keep it for a week. Well supply a kilo of browns of your choice to play with.[*]Compare and contrast and then write a comprehensive review here on CS, warts and all.[*]You get 1st dibs on the machine if you decide you need it.
Whats in it for CSers:[*]You get to read an unbiased review[*]If the machine doesnt go to the reviewer, CSers will have the opportunity to buy the machine at a substantial discount once it comes back to us. Best realistic offer gets the machine with the balance of warranty. This may well happen in a few different states ;)
Drop me a line if you consider yourself up to the task.
Ive signed up for one from Cosmorex in Canberra (+ a Rocky doserless). Saw it demonstrated and I was sold pretty quickly. Looking forward to the new arrival.
Didnt find that post but CoffeeGeek had a thread about it:
After wading through, it seems that Bill Crossland is marketing a modified (doesnt say how) and rebadged Gee. He is also working on something alse new but not much info available. Pictures of rebadged Gee and Crossland prototype around page 5 or 6 I think.
Another review of Gee (and very rough Google translation) here:
I thought Id post some feedback on the Gee - having owned one for almost two months.
Ive been using it every day, usually once in the morning and occassionally once in the afternoon.
Ill give my general opinion first, then ill describe the rest in further detail.
(All of this is just my opinion/impressions): The Gee seems to be great on spec, but a little rough around the edges. Im left with the impression that its like a test model for the marketplace to see how it goes. If successful, then maybe a more polished product will follow. Im concerned about the life expectancy of the machine, primarily due to the prototype feel of the machine and its reliance on a proprietary electonic/software inteface to drive the whole unit.
After 7 weeks of use by one person (me) in the home, the units control panel had started to behave eratically that made the unit effectively inoperable. I took it back for repair and the technician said he couldnt find anything wrong with it, but replaced the electronics just to be safe (next time Ill video/youtube first).
One other observation, and I dont know if this is how PID machines normally operate or not, but when I start to brew, the temperature is at 93C. By the time a double shot has been brewed (about 25 seconds), the temperature is down to somewhere between 77 - 81 according to the reading displayed on the panel. My impression is that PID machines are supposed to keep the temperature more constant (closer to the 93 that I had set it to). On the other hand, I know the PID is just a regulator and its up to the heating element to maintain the temperature. Nevertheless, I just thought Id mention this temperature fluctuation that I have observed.
- separate water boiler and a thermoblock for steam. This means theres very little waiting between brewing and steaming milk. Very convenient!
- The machine offers some automation features like pre-infusion, though you could probably do this manually on other machines (just let water run for ~1 - 2 secs, pause, then continue. yes?)
- I have made excellent espresso with this. Ive got it tasting as good or better than the best espresso I have found on Acland St (St Kilda).
- Steam sometimes comes out VERY wet. A few times it was simply shooting out hot water (no steam), despite the panel indicating that it was "OK" (ready) for steam. I would dispute that the Gee produces dry steam. Maybe if you open the valve and let it go for quite some time first...
- The assembly. Apart from the spartan finish, awkward looking drip tray (huge slots), protruding hardware-shop screws on the top panel, there is a significant gap (a few millimeters) at the top of the unit, directly above the electronics control panel. Although there is a metal lip before this gap, you had better make sure you dont get ANY water down this gap or, I believe, you could kill the electronics.
- My main concern is the proprietary software/electronic panel that controls the whole unit. If this develops a fault and the the company has deceided not to make any more of these then you may find yourself shopping for a new machine. At least with more established manufacturers/models its more likely that youll be able to get replacement parts.
- Im not sure if the temperature variation between start and finish of brewing is normal (from 93C at the start down to ~80 by the finish approx 25 secs later).
I hope youve found my experiences useful.