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Thread: EM6910 not setting itself

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    EM6910 not setting itself

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    My 3 year old EM6910 has a problem. It would not set itself. That is, when machine switched on, the power button light flashes as normal, but it just did not set itself to indicate its ready for use(ie.power button would not stop flashing). Thinking the problem was faulty PCB, replaced said part, but to no avail. Any suggestions on other possible solution.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 47555F5D140 link=1292624538/0#0 date=1292624538
    My 3 year old EM6910 has a problem. It would not set itself. That is, when machine switched on, the power button light flashes as normal, but it just did not set itself to indicate its ready for use(ie.power button would not stop flashing). Thinking the problem was faulty PCB, replaced said part, but to no avail. Any suggestions on other possible solution.
    What is ya location ?

    Which PCB did you replace ?

    Depending on teh flash rate and other symptoms it could also be that a thermal fuse has failed or A Thermistor disconnected and thus NO feedback to either Steam or Group.

    What is ya background as this is playing in the 240V area and should not be done unless Electrical Standards and Safety are met.

    Power flashing red:

    = Either Thermistor disconnected from PCB, reconnect
    = Thermoblock did not reach specified temperature within specified time, Replace MAIN PCB (Software issue)
    = Either Thermistor unable to read correct temperature, Replace thermistor

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Thanks for the reply. I am in Adelaide. PCB replacement was part# EM6910114

    Power flashing GREEN

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 0C1E14165F0 link=1292624538/2#2 date=1292633672
    Power flashing GREEN
    In heating mode...

    If never gets to RED and stable then - Thermister or an element has blown OR thermal fuse.

    My guess is a Thermistor or Thermoblock... 5 min to see if either Steam OR Group get Hot or NOT...

    If your not ELECTRICAL or Electronics trained / Qualified. You can cause more problems AND or cause damage to machine and or self.




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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    The Group Head gets hot quite quickly.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 7163696B220 link=1292624538/4#4 date=1292642910
    The Group Head gets hot quite quickly.
    And teh STEAM block ???

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    No, the STEAM block not heating up.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 0012181A530 link=1292624538/6#6 date=1292654809
    No, the STEAM block not heating up.
    Then as stated....

    It will be in the steam cct

    Steam Thermister, *Steam Theremal fuse, Element in Steam block or the Steam OT thermostat...

    I have a spare Steam Thermoblock and a few other bits, if needed... PM me.


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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Thank you so much for the advice AM. Ill see what I can do from my end, I will keep your kind offer in mind. As I said, thanks for the replies.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 06141E1C550 link=1292624538/8#8 date=1292659203
    Thank you so much for the advice AM. Ill see what I can do from my end, I will keep your kind offer in mind. As I said, thanks for the replies.
    And the outcome is ?

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    I now have the same problem.

    Same symptoms as described. Light flashing and does not indicate ready.
    Machine gets hot after a while.
    Am not electrically or mechanically minded so i am going to take it to FiveSenses Coffee to get it fixed.
    May get it thoroughly serviced while its there too. Will see what Ashley says.

    Will let everyone here know of the outcome...costs, what got replaced etc. so that you are informed of how this process goes from my experience.

    Gary at G.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Dropping it off tommorow. Will let everyone know how long it took too.

    Quoted worse case scenario (replacing steamer thermoblock) quoted at $180. Forgot to ask whether the initial inspection ($75) is included, but i suspect its not.

    Quoted turn around is 3-5 days.

    Gary at G.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Dropped machine off last Thursday 6th Jan. Have not heard from them despite calling twice. They said they will get in contact with me but so far have not.
    Not a good omen from a reputable company.

    Im sure someone out there has gone through the same situation.

    Have been very polite in my calls to them as being impatient is not good for a pleasant outcome.

    To be continued.... :(

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 253F323321372F2525560 link=1292624538/10#10 date=1294810123
    Same symptoms as described. Light flashing and does not indicate ready.
    Machine gets hot after a while.
    Am not electrically or mechanically minded so i am going to take it to FiveSenses Coffee to get it fixed.
    May get it thoroughly serviced while its there too. Will see what Ashley says.

    Will let everyone here know of the outcome...costs, what got replaced etc. so that you are informed of how this process goes from my experience.
    Fingers crossed for you...

    I have seen strange things happen when sensors go Open OR one of the safety cut-outs / thermal fuses trip....

    Would be handy to know is both problems (SAKI and Gary at Gala) have the same fix ?

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Interesting. My machine has just done the same thing. Its about 3 years old as well.

    I was going to tinker around with it myself to see what was wrong, but I might just drop it off at the service centre...

    Im wondering if its time to upgrade. Ive replaced the group collar three times and now this. Its been a great machine though...

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    My machine just got the same problem - light flashing green - the machine is hot. Did anyone find out what the actual problem was? I just spent $200 at the sunbeam repairer 2 weeks ago getting the collar fixed so am not looking forward to fixing this now.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Got my machine back at last on the 24th.

    $71.00 later and the problem with my machine was loose wiring.
    Am a lucky man it wasnt anything serious.

    As AM was listing possible causes, mine was more like quote"= Either Thermistor disconnected from PCB, reconnect" unquote.

    For you guys hopefully its a simple fix.

    I was told worse case scenario would be to replace the steam thermoblock which would come to $180-190 all up.

    Turando and freaky namuh, where are you located?
    I got mine fixed at Five Senses Coffee in Rockingham near Perth,WA.
    They did a check up on the rest of the machine as well.

    My machine is more than 3 years old. Other than that problem cheaply fixed, have had nothing else happened, touch wood. *:-X

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Sorry AM for not getting back with final outcome. Replaced steam thermoblock for $95(supplied from service agent). Everything seams OK.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 64767C7E370 link=1292624538/17#17 date=1296081569
    Sorry AM for not getting back with final outcome. Replaced steam thermoblock for $95(supplied from service agent). Everything seams OK.
    Well done and at a good $.

    Seems that a few are having some strange problems and the fix seems to be every thing from loose wiring ? to the Steam block and some with very different pricing.

    I guess this just helps in demonstrating the different levels of service support that is out there.

    AM.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Looks delicious Gary at G - I am excited about getting into roasting, just gotta wait for my bank balance to recover before I buy some roasting equipment!



    Gary S

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Thanks Gary S.

    Roasting your own adds another dimension to the whole coffee enjoyment and experience.

    Theres plenty of CSers right thru this country who will be willing to help you along the way.

    Maybe cu on Sunday, not Saturday. Dates changed.

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    $95 all up cost including the thermoblock and labour? *:o

    Youve done well there. You must have done that Ikea lady who looked quietly surprised at the bill and made a hasty rush back to the car.
    "Start the car, staaaart the carr...."

    Sorry AM, i cant donate my 6910 to you just yet. The girl has quite a bit left in her yet *;), maybe another 3 years....

    So the list of things that may be causes of the OP,

    Electrical: Loose wiring(in my case)
    * PCB
    * Thermistor faulty
    * Blown element in block
    Mechanical: Anything mechanical that may directly/indirectly affect the electrics?? Hence my question.

    God shots to those with good news about their repairs *:)

    For those who are pulling their hair, spill your guts here. Well listen to you.

    S/beam EM6910 anonymous club. ( or should it be synonymous?)

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Gary S, if you have $52 - the cheapest way to start is:

    1 - get onto beanbay and buy a starter pack $32
    1 - go down to Kmart and buy a popper $20
    2 - take it home, put in some green beans and start roasting

    Youll never look back ;D

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated. Im in Melbourne. Might take it back to the Heidelberg repairer tomorrow or Monday.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 647E737260766E6464170 link=1292624538/12#12 date=1295329244
    Re: EM6910 not setting itself
    Reply #12 - Jan 18th, 2011, 4:40pm Mark & Quote Quote
    Dropped machine off last Thursday 6th Jan. Have not heard from them despite calling twice. They said they will get in contact with me but so far have not.
    Not a good omen from a reputable company.

    Im sure someone out there has gone through the same situation.

    Have been very polite in my calls to them as being impatient is not good for a pleasant outcome.

    To be continued....Sad
    Date today:29th January 2011,

    Well, i knew in my gut feeling that this problem does not go away.
    This time, the machine indicated ready, i went to water garden to give the machine time to warm up....came back in after 10 minutes and found the Power button light flashing again !! "oh, here we go again".
    This time i managed to get Ashley on the phone surprisingly rather than the friendly lady taking my details and having to wait for another day before i have to ring again.
    From what i gather from my conversation, its an intermittent problem.
    He mentioned he fixed the problem by re-connecting a loose wire, then did a test on the machine to make sure everything else was working fine.
    I asked him how he did it and why the problem has re-surfaced again.
    Said a multimeter was used to check, and visibly looked at other components, and the reason why the problem came back is due to it being intermittent.

    Had a friend a long time ago with a similar problem with his car. Electrical intermittent problem which the mechanics couldnt trace.

    I write this with my blood pressure back to normal and my use of language toned right down in a gentlemanly manner.

    I feel this is something that will re-surface again when the problem is fixed again....or am i wrong?

    At this stage, i dont mind opening the thing up and having a go at testing it with the DMM logger, but i dont know where to start.

    Just feel something not quite right when someone tells you a thermoblock is being ordered and on the way, and then being told it was a loose wire.

    Now i know that cheap fix is too good to be true.

    Any advice or your experiences are appreciated here. :) Thank you.

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 243E333220362E2424570 link=1210561912/113#113 date=1295959112
    Got a technique for frothing milk on the EM6910 in "Milk, Froth and Bubbles"which i hope to share with you and others in the near future using photos which is a important factor for artwork Yash.

    To be continued ...Wink

    Gary at G
    Hi Yash,

    The machine has developed the same re-setting problem...again.
    Was planning on doing a photo tutorial on steaming milk on the EM6910 to assist anyone doing latte art on their EM6910, but will have to wait a little, or a lot longer.

    To be continued...

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Have opened it up, tested the resistance using the Coffeesnobs DMM logger (knew it would come in handy somewhere else).

    Steam thermoblock terminal to heat element: 51.00 ohm

    Brew thermoblock terminal to heat element: 47.30 ohm

    Solenoid: 2.236 Kilo ohm

    A bit worried about the solenoid, sounds a bit high.
    Im not electrically minded, so hopefully someone else can comment on these results.
    Can post pics if required.

    Gary at G.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 302A272634223A3030430 link=1292624539/26#26 date=1296196466
    Have opened it up, tested the resistance using the Coffeesnobs DMM logger (knew it would come in handy somewhere else).

    Steam thermoblock terminal to heat element: 51.00 ohm

    Brew thermoblock terminal to heat element: 47.30 ohm

    Solenoid: 2.236 Kilo ohm

    A bit worried about the solenoid, sounds a bit high.
    Im not electrically minded, so hopefully someone else can comment on these results.
    Can post pics if required.

    Gary at G.
    Post pics and I will do some testing and report back.

    Check the Steam and BREW block temp thermistor ! *At room temp they should be about *85K ohm

    If I remember correctly you can do a Single measurement and it will take into account the Heating element and the thermal fuse etc so that your sure there is a *true cct and you not confusing your self. *

    This is between one side of the Solenoid and from either of the two wires that are soldered onto the SUB board. *One wire is steam and the other is Head.

    I got 47 ohm for steam and 54 ohm for Group... This minor differenced is not an issue.

    Thus it could be;

    A: The board is stuffed - The bigwarehouse have them for $70

    B: Thermistor is playing up and not seeing that it has reached temp?

    C: The THEMOSTAT is playing up and not letting it get to the right temp but is measuring OK at *room temp when when you do the test I described. *From the same place ss above $18

    So the trick is to confirm what is getting hot and what is not and then you can focus on the right path.

    Much of all this can be done with the unit disconnected *and removed from any Electrical power supply OR without having to pull electrical connections apart etc.


    If and When it comes down to a live test: That is for an Electrician and no one else.....






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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Can I add that it could still be the thermoblock as the heating element could be cracked/broken internally in such a way that when cool it measures OK but as the thermoblock expands when heating up it goes open circuit.

    It could also be the same type of fault in the crimped connectors on the ends of the wires attaching to the thermoblock.

    Either of these could well cause an intermittent fault as the wires/elements would shift ever so slightly every use due to thermal expansion/contraction and vibration (From the pump).

    Peter

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 7E646D667C677D0E0 link=1292624539/28#28 date=1296268843
    Can I add that it could still be the thermoblock as the heating element could be cracked/broken internally in such a way that when cool it measures OK but as the thermoblock expands when heating up it goes open circuit.

    It could also be the same type of fault in the crimped connectors on the ends of the wires attaching to the thermoblock.

    Either of these could well cause an intermittent fault as the wires/elements would shift ever so slightly every use due to thermal expansion/contraction and vibration (From the pump).

    Peter

    Heating elements usually fail in a much more hard core manner... As to the terminals... Always a possibility but rest assured if intermittent it is more likely to be in teh board rather than the element or connectors.

    However only a critical review and test will determine the real cause. In teh mean time I have seen many get told rather interesting stories that often astound me.. 30 years in teh Electronics field... Some times it is a case of Generalisation by a repair person and other times it is a big bow they were pulling...

    Still waiting for Gary @ G to get back to us...


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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Thanks for waiting gentlemen :)

    Here are more tests i did.

    You talked about the situation being intermittent AM, i turned the thing on to see if it was heating up. Turned out it went back to normal, ie. Power light flashed, then all lights on, not blinking. Brew block felt damn hot. Thermoblock felt damn hot.
    If this situation is an intermittent problem, it may be all is well now, but may and will re-surface in the near future.

    When i rang service at Five Senses when it reared its ugly head again, he said its an intermittent problem. Cant fix it if unable to trace blame of source if its working well.

    As promised, heres more pics with the multimeter, and im sure you will comment and advice AM. Thanks again.

    Here is a list of results from resistance reading on the DMM logger:

    Group element 47.30 ohm
    Steam element 51.00ohm
    Solenoid test 2.236 kohm
    Red box thing (pump for brew??) .100ohm
    Brew thermistor 87kohm
    Steam thermistor 91.00kohm

    Pics as follows:










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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Just want to be sure, the black box is the solenoid?

    Not sure what the red box is, is it part of the pump for the brew dept?

    And the blue box below closer to steam thermoblock, is it to do with the steam function?








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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Errr * oooooo * Could we have the travel sick bag up to QLD please ASAP ;D :D


    Interesting Shorts and !!!!!!!

    Lets hope this was not all done in the out house *:o

    5 Senses are correct. *With out a hard fault you could replace every thing and still miss it.

    When it next failes again... Measure ASAP and see what changes..

    My gut feel is that it is the Thermostat....

    Main Group is a 110C and teh Steam is 200C. If these happen to go open and do not reset for some reason. And then after sitting and getting cool or a bit of a knock it resets. That would explain it... They also have an interesting rivet construction and that could also be part of the problem...

    I will try to send Pics *( No shorts or belly) *in the next day or two. * I have an 18th on tonight and then allowed to visit a special correctional centre. Thus you get a back seat.

    AM

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Hee hee. This was all done with machine off and the machine faulty prior to tests done. Each wire was unplugged then tested for resistance then re-plugged, one at a time.

    Then when i turned machine on just for the heck of it, i noticed both group and steam was hot.

    All tests done indoors. Just so happens it is raining buckets outside now :o

    BTW. sexy shots of belly and shorts belong to stepfather. He is a qualified electrician working for BHP Billiton.

    Hes just not familiar with the innards of a coffee machine but he did recognize electrical components.

    As for me, i have a clause to my contract that says i will not expose more than my hands and arms until available in full for the Coffeesnobs Corner of Beanscene Magazine ;D

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 203A373624322A2020530 link=1292624539/33#33 date=1296285836
    BTW. sexy shots of belly and shorts belong to stepfather. He is a qualified electrician working for BHP Billiton.

    Hes just not familiar with the innards of a coffee machine but he did recognize electrical components.

    As for me, i have a clause to my contract that says i will not expose more than my hands and arms until available in full for the Coffeesnobs Corner of Beanscene Magazine *
    giggled like a schoolgirl... YEA right... Sound great !!!!! Cheque is in teh Mail ???


    Ok... With what you said, and am even more inclined to think THERMOSTAT...

    Confirm if it is teh Group or Steam and I have one or two sitting around...

    Thus I can send you a replacement to get you working and to confirm - Send Snail mail addy ASAP via PM...

    PS. As to CS corner... Until the fees and STAR status, go up a bit, I am continuing to ignore the begging and pleas :D ;D

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Havent taken my machine in yet - my husband will need to drop it off after work on Monday hopefully. But I was thinking maybe my fault happened when I did the settings to increase the temperature of the water, steam, wetness. I put them all on the highest settings. Im thinking maybe it stuffed up the temperature thing?

    My husband is thinking to change machines now. Its probably going to cost another at least $150 and we just spent $200 getting the collar and seal fixed. Quite depressing!

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 6E6F687B747E751A0 link=1292624539/35#35 date=1296301082
    Havent taken my machine in yet - my husband will need to drop it off after work on Monday hopefully. But I was thinking maybe my fault happened when I did the settings to increase the temperature of the water, steam, wetness. I put them all on the highest settings. Im thinking maybe it stuffed up the temperature thing?

    My husband is thinking to change machines now. Its probably going to cost another at least $150 and we just spent $200 getting the collar and seal fixed. Quite depressing!
    Not ya fault...

    What is your location ?

    If it is teh thermostat, then a $18 part and the issue of changing to the higest does suggest that if the thermostat was on the border line. Then this could do it...

    AM

  38. #38
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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Gee. Thanks a million AM. Ill take you up on the offer.

    Will let you know when it dies again which thermostat is responsible.

    Is the thermistor the same as a thermostat? Where is the thermostat located if its not the thermistor?


    Turando, I hear your pain. When it comes to the stage when it costs a third or more of the value of the machine to fix, you have to wonder if its all worth it.

    To me, i can get attached to something when it has been with me for some time, temperemental or not.

    Bottom line though, you want to enjoy making coffee, not waste time toying with it or fixing it.

    AM and I, we go through these processes of elimination and detective work in order to help the next person with their machine if they happen to have a problem with it and is willing to have a go at fixing it.

    When i get to the bottom of it eventually, theres a sense of achievement, and im sure it gives AM a good feeling when he shares his knowledge for the good of others.

    Gary at G

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Gary, the $95 was the part price for the thermoblock. Replaced mine and all seemed OK, but then I just might have got lucky, not knowing what the real problem was. It might have been loose wiring, and when I connected everything up it worked. I wasnt going to take everything apart again just to see if the old thermoblock is alright. What I can not come to terms with ii the cost of consumer replaceable parts {eg. anti-calc cartridge $30+. group-head seal $30+, filter basket $22+ and so on} as against what appear to be more intricate non serviceable parts (eg. PCB&wiring $69, Steam thermobloccl $95, Collar $58 etc.).

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    AM Im in Melbourne. Is the thermostat hard to change? I wouldnt mind doing it if it doesnt involve a huge amount of disassembling.

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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    Quote Originally Posted by 0B191311580 link=1292624539/38#38 date=1296349176
    Gary, the $95 was the part price for the thermoblock. Replaced mine and all seemed OK, but then I just might have got lucky, not knowing what the real problem was. It might have been loose wiring, and when I connected everything up it worked. I wasnt going to take everything apart again just to see if the old thermoblock is alright. What I can not come to terms with ii the cost of consumer replaceable parts {eg. anti-calc cartridge $30+. group-head seal $30+, filter basket $22+ and so on} as against what appear to be more intricate non serviceable parts (eg. PCB&wiring $69, Steam thermobloccl $95, Collar $58 etc.).
    Yea, the pricing appears all wrong in the first instance...

    However if like many in the white good area... Consumables are expected to be bought and used by users and teh Hardware only by Service agents.

    Thus one could assume that if hardware was cheep enough then Service and Repairs would also be cheep - SHOULD they ever be needed. However we all know it does not work that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2C2D2A39363C37580 link=1292624539/39#39 date=1296370300
    AM Im in Melbourne. Is the thermostat hard to change? I wouldnt mind doing it if it doesnt involve a huge amount of disassembling.
    The steam Thermostat is easy to get at and to change... The Main group Thermostat is ON top of teh head and thus requires the machine to have teh lid off.

    The thermistor is the temp sensor that is used to feedback to the brain.

    An electrician should always be involved or check the unit as to electrical safety before attempting to power teh system up.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2B313C3D2F39212B2B580 link=1292624539/37#37 date=1296320947
    To me, i can get attached to something when it has been with me for some time, temperemental or not.

    Bottom line though, you want to enjoy making coffee, not waste time toying with it or fixing it.

    AM and I, we go through these processes of elimination and detective work in order to help the next person with their machine if they happen to have a problem with it and is willing to have a go at fixing it.

    SO TRUE...

  42. #42
    A_M
    A_M is offline
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    Re: EM6910 not setting itself

    As per another post....

    Agents have seen blocked Steam Blocks BUT elements failed = VERY RARE.

    The symptom described "not setting itself" ALL lights flashing is due to teh system thinking that either teh Group OR Steam block is not to temp...

    The most common fault in older units is with those Thermostats... Yep that little can etc with the two tabs. Also if intermittent, then even more likely to be the thermostat.

    Get ya local electrician to replace !!!!! Group is 110C and Steam is 200C

    DO not remove teh cover or do any work on your machine if your not Qualified.

    Gary from Gala is OK as he has a Rel with a Special body type ;D :D ;) (Photoshop is not a core app).

    Take care all

    AM



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