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Thread: Breville Dual Boiler

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    Breville Dual Boiler

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Breville are soon to release a new coffee machine and there has been lengthy discussion at: http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1301294820

    Perhaps someone from Breville might like to contribute to this new discussion with a comprehensive list of the specifications...

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Ive only seen pics of the machine here on CS and have not used it and I was going to buy a Silvia to replace my Saeco V V but now I will wait and have a good look at the Breville when they hit the shelves. Are they only going to be sold in the big department stores?

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 2B303126326E5F0 link=1306475432/1#1 date=1306504334
    Are they only going to be sold in the big department stores?
    Nope. Talk Coffee and Cuppacoffee will be selling them and would not be surprised if several others sponsors will be doing the same.


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    TC
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Ill start the technical off with a link to Mark Princes excellent and comprehensive review

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    That is the most comprehensive review Ive seen yet.
    The only thing I still really want to know is the steaming ability. Given there is a recognised problem and it has been addressed in the production machines, I guess we have to wait for an answer.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I would like a mailing list set up so when the special CS pricing is announced, I will be alerted so I can run to the computer and empty my wallet online.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 192C2126120E222B2B28284D0 link=1306475432/3#3 date=1306532929
    Ill start the technical off with a link to Mark Princes excellent and comprehensive review
    Agreed, its a great review, and thanks for the link! I hope the family councillors and the like are ready for some work - with that many features to play with I can see a lot of coffee enthusiasts spending many happy hours tweaking and tasting and ignoring the rest of the world- all good fun ;).

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 3139373F3D27273B373F540 link=1306475432/4#4 date=1306539778
    The only thing I still really want to know is the steaming ability. Given there is a recognised problem and it has been addressed in the production machines, I guess we have to wait for an answer.
    Even with the steam problem it does a better job then a Expobar Minore Dual Boiler.

    So at worst the Breville is still awesome.

  9. #9
    KJM
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I have to chuck in my $0.02 on this one too. It was really nice to have this machine on the bench at Beanology. I know Andy had a big machine setup in the room next door, so that anyone who felt suddenly de-caffeinated could scoot over and discretely pull a shot. Anytime.

    But the Breville was just sitting there, and I reckon everyone who attended pulled most of their coffee from that machine.

    Id give it a full 10/10 on the shots - the COE was just lovely and the Yemeni was, well, awesome. The thing stood up to the beating without even looking like something might go wrong, heated up quickly and yielded a perfect shot etc etc.

    At the time, I hadnt read the CG review and was wondering how itd last. 15K cycles is a pretty impressive testing regime.

    I think when I replace my Silvia, thisll be a potential #1 contender. Seems robust and has superlative temperature control. What more could you want?

    /Kevin

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 525354190 link=1306475432/8#8 date=1306556546
    I have to chuck in my $0.02 on this one too.* It was really nice to have this machine on the bench at Beanology.* I know Andy had a big machine setup in the room next door, so that anyone who felt suddenly de-caffeinated could scoot over and discretely pull a shot.* Anytime.

    But the Breville was just sitting there, and I reckon everyone who attended pulled most of their coffee from that machine.

    Id give it a full 10/10 on the shots - the COE was just lovely and the Yemeni was, well, awesome.* The thing stood up to the beating without even looking like something might go wrong, heated up quickly and yielded a perfect shot etc etc.

    At the time, I hadnt read the CG review and was wondering how itd last.* 15K cycles is a pretty impressive testing regime.*

    I think when I replace my Silvia, thisll be a potential #1 contender.* Seems robust and has superlative temperature control.* What more could you want?

    /Kevin
    ....and faultlessly at the shed too this morning Kevin.

    Every shot I poured was on the Breville. The steam may be a tad slow on this pre-production machine but its almost impossible not to produce perfect microfoam. We know that steam performance has been attended to.

    Its sad that there are a whole heap of keyboard experts who have yet to even lay hands or eyes on the machine and yet seem to want to talk it down. Tall poppy syndrome is ugly. Today, quite a few cynics may well be chowing down on their hats.

    Said it before, and Ill say it again. This machine will be a category killer.

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    Roz
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I am interested to find out how much faster the steam is on the production model, the machine itself has everything going for it, its certainly going to make itself a name when its been on sale for a few months given all the reports people have shared.

    Im having a hard time trying to think about purchasing one of these though when I have already set my sights on a VBM Jnr, I am coming from a PID Silvia which I am sick of the wet steam and inconsistent microfoam efforts, the footprint of the VBM and its sexy style is what Im after and its a machine that hopefully would end my suffering but the Breville is an attractive option :-/

    Time will tell for me, but I would love to have a play with the machine, if Im in Melbourne before Im ready to purchase Ill be visiting your shop Chris :)

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 66696E736F64010 link=1306475432/10#10 date=1306592193
    I am interested to find out how much faster the steam is on the production model
    150ml of milk from ~8degC to 65degC was 36secs, now 33secs. Its now faster than an Expobar Minore dual boiler. Also the Expobar steam boiler had to have its standard pressure raised from 1.2bar to 1.5bar as the steam output didnt match the total area of the holes in the steam tip.

    Seems to be a lot of focus on the speed of the milk here, but not much on the quality of the textured milk.

    As a side note, I just enjoyed some Intelligentsia "Black Cat" off the DB this morning that was kindly sent by Stef from our LA office!

    Cheers, Phil

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I am disgusted how everybody continues to talk down this machine. Why cant people just wait until it is out before making their judgement on it.

    I think it will be an awesome machine, based on what I have read. I find it interesting that this website has been used by Breville as a pre launch marketing tool, however the first useful write-up on the machine was posted on a different coffee website (albeit a link placed on this site eventually to the article). I would have thought that someone who had used the machine would/could have done a comprehensive review on this site to appease the masses. Instead there have been pages and pages of repeated basic information.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 1D1C4958582C0 link=1306475432/12#12 date=1306619503
    I am disgusted how everybody continues to talk down this machine.* Why cant people just wait until it is out before making their judgement on it.

    I think it will be an awesome machine, based on what I have read.* I find it interesting that this website has been used by Breville as a pre launch marketing tool, however the first useful write-up on the machine was posted on a different coffee website...*
    Too right 10ett. Many who talk it down havent even seen it, let alone used it. Many of them have a completely different and irrelevant agenda- which sadly has nothing to do with the machine. Small things- as they say ::).

    As for the review, Mark Prince knows his stuff- and then some. His body of work on the Dual Boiler represents many hours and any susbsequent review could only reinvent the wheel. His review is full of positives and having spent quite a few hours with the machine now, I can only endorse it.

    Heres hoping that this thread will remain about the machine and will in time become a comprehensive resource for new owners of the machine.

    I am hoping we will be able to make a pre-purchase offer soon for those who are ready to jump on the boat.

    Chris

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 08095C4D4D390 link=1306475432/12#12 date=1306619503
    I would have thought that someone who had used the machine would/could have done a comprehensive review on this site to appease the masses.
    I think the difficulty in doing so was that we simply didnt have enough time with the machine. Im glad that in the end the comprehensive review from Mark Prince.

    Quote Originally Posted by 545A5257505E514D49390 link=1306475432/11#11 date=1306616864
    Seems to be a lot of focus on the speed of the milk here, but not much on the quality of the textured milk.
    I agree Phil. Id rather spend a few more seconds to create milk with fine texture, just as we do to grind on demand and have fresh coffee.

    The steam tip holes are ultra fine and the configuration as a whole allows more control and very fine, silky milk, easily.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    The design and thought behind the machine sounds excellent. Some people, like me were disappointed in the price point as its out of the current coffee machine budget, no matter how good it is.

    Given the track record of western designed, Chinese built products some of us have what appears to be a legitimate* worry about quality control issues. Dare I say that poor steam in a small run of pre production models raises some concerns. If there can be problems in quality control of a gasket when the numbers are small enough to individually cheek each item before they are shipped, what does that say about large prduction runs? A significant number of the smart grinders have required shims. An easy fix, yes - but again it raises worries about quality control in a well designed product.

    Ive been bitten before by quality control issues with otherwise well thought out things from well known makers(Apple and Canon to name two). So I feel quite justified and comfortable both wishing for this product to be the hit that Breville and others think its going to be, while also giving it a year to six months before I consider buying one, both so I can save up for it, and see how the early adopters find things. Hopefully it willbethe machine that its promoters think it is and I will end up owning one.

    Dismissing such opininons as "talking the machine down" is I think unfair.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Just to confirm, the quality of steam on the PP unit wasnt something that slipped through and had nothing to do with a gasket. I was there for the pilot run and subsequent QC process. As this build is part of the development process and not final production, there were known issues at this point and there always is. I cant remember another time when Breville allowed PP units out for public inspection....maybe it was a mistake.

    Please check out a unit from mass production and see what you think of the steam quality....hopefully it doesnt disappoint

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    If you havenít had a chance to put your hands on a machine or get a good look at a Breville Dual Boiler yet, here are some things we have been told about it.

    This is not an official Breville document and the specifications are not complete.

    This is not a review, just a list of what we have been told is in the BDB.

    I have put it here to give readers a better chance to make an objective comparison with other machines.

    This is what you would find if you could look under the bonnet or give it a trial run.


    The heat up time from switch on is about 7 minutes.

    Brew boiler is 300ml 600W, PID temp controlled. With 15 bar vibe pump controlled to 9 bar.

    Steam boiler is 950ml, 1000W, thermister controlled. Half full of water, half steam. 3 bar vibe pump. Auto refill. Steaming control is by a leaver and a ball valve.

    Both boilers are stainless steel.

    Both pumps are made in Italy as are some valves and other parts.

    Heat exchanger in steam boiler feeds the brew boiler with about 80 deg water to reduce thermal shock.

    Grouphead is actively heated. Element is 100W, temp controlled by a second PID.

    Group head is die-cast aluminium with cast-in heating element. cast-in stainless steel tubing for the water paths through the group. Where water can contact the alloy, it has been Teflon coated.* *

    Full 58mm filter basket sized portafilter.
    Portafilter is cast stainless steel polished inside and out.
    Bayonet ramps inside the group head have Nylon inserts to stop galling or adhesive wear.

    The temperature control used has allowed the use of smaller boilers and gives shorter warm up time than usual.
    *
    Extraction temp is programmable in 1 deg C increments between 88 & 95. Stable to within 1 deg. Current group temperature can be monitored on the readout screen.

    Each machine is scaced at the factory to check temperatures.

    Pressure gauge with Bar 0 to 13.

    The boilers cannot run dry. A sensor will cause them to be automatically filled. If the main water tank is about to run dry, the machine will let you finish your current activity and then close down.

    There is a very obvious visual water gauge centre front, behind the group.

    When the drip tray is about full, a very obvious yellow flag floats up.

    Hot water comes from the brew boiler. Control knob on left switches on tap and pump. The short hot water spout is between the steam wand and the group.

    Internal clock can turn on the machine and time brewing and steaming.

    Water tank, removable 2.4 litres capacity can be filled from front or back.
    Retractable wheels help to rotate the machine for rear access to the water tank.

    Power cord storage is built in.

    A tamper is supplied that is held into the machine by a magnet, like the 860.

    Water filter supplied is an ion exchange resin filter for scale prevention. If chlorine etc. is of concern then use additional water treatment.

    Readout screen on front of the machine shows settings, times, temp, etc.

    During testing, Breville simulated an average 10 year use of brewing 15,000 cappuccinos with this machine.

    The outside case has a classic Breville design a little larger than the BES860. It is brushed stainless steel with curved edges over a hard plastic frame.

    The machine measures 385mm front to back along the base of the machine, and is 375mm wide in front, tapering to 330mm wide at the back. Height is 380 mm.
    Empty weight is 13 kg.

    Pre-release offer is promised for early June.

    It should be available in mid July.

    Recommended price $1,500.

    If you find any errors here please let us know here.

    Barry

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 1716435252260 link=1306475432/12#12 date=1306619503
    I am disgusted how everybody continues to talk down this machine. Why cant people just wait until it is out before making their judgement on it.
    800+ posts on the other thread and only a very few could be considered talking the machine down. For every post that could be percieved as negative, there are another 10 posts that quiclky dismiss or counter-argue the other. It seems that there is more talk against those talking down, then there are actually people talking down. Most of the issues raised were legitimate and could harldy be called talking down. Actuall talking down is very limited and has been blown out of porportion. Hell, there is even a Toyota/Ferrari comparison, need I say more.

    Most are looking foward to seeing this machine hit the market, because aside from maybe asthetics and a proven history of reliablity, its in category of its own.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 4F727676621B0 link=1306475432/18#18 date=1306646723
    Hell, there is even a Toyota/Ferrari comparison
    Im thinking that the BDB may become the Lexus of coffee machines.

    Barry

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    KJM
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 7C494443776B474E4E4D4D280 link=1306475432/13#13 date=1306620628
    Too right 10ett. Many who talk it down havent even seen it, let alone used it. Many of them have a completely different and irrelevant agenda- which sadly has nothing to do with the machine. Small things- as they say .

    As for the review, Mark Prince knows his stuff- and then some. His body of work on the Dual Boiler represents many hours and any susbsequent review could only reinvent the wheel. His review is full of positives and having spent quite a few hours with the machine now, I can only endorse it.
    I have to lay some cards on the table here - Im an engineer - and I dont give a rats whose name is on a piece of kit. If it works, it works.

    The machine at beanology was damn near faultless - even the steam. I did a couple of jugs of milk and I cant see what the whinging about slow steam is about. Coming from a Silvia, the steam is quick. Coming from our 2 group Wega in the T-room, it is a bit slower. But the microfoam was perfect.

    The temperature stability seemed perfect too. Id love to stick my homemade "scace" work-alike on it just to see... Chris - do you have a temperature profile for it (I assume you have something for measuring shot temps..). Just curious! But I think itll end up a very nice flat graph at about 92.5C or whatever the temperature is set to!

    I suspect the BDB will suffer from a certain level of snobbish indifference because it isnt made in Italy :o

    /Kevin

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 19181F520 link=1306475432/20#20 date=1306657662
    I suspect the BDB will suffer from a certain level of snobbish indifference because it isnt made in Italy* :o

    /Kevin
    Not from this kid either Kevin.... ;)

    I too appreciate the detailed engineering that has realised the culmination of this machine. There may well be some production line bugs to knock out of the first few machines produced but the overall design and implementation looks spot-on to me.... 8-)

    Mal.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Geez havent I been saying from early on that the other half of me being an engineer has said that Breville has done a bloody good job, oh sorry Im only a pleb so of course our opinion isnt worth anything, besides the fact that in the last year he has been head hunted at least five times!

    I guess I shouldnt grumble, after all WE were the ones that were offered a direct invitation from Breville to see the Dual Boiler for ourselves and for that I am so thankful :)

    The bottom line, yes there is a lot to learn from people that have been an industry for a long time BUT you shouldnt discount newbies as you never know what and who they are!

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    TC
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I agree shapeshifter.

    I worked for a full day and then crammed in a return flight (almost missed the one home :o ;D).

    It was great to meet some respected CSers and old friends there and to to meet and congratulate the Breville team.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I dont think many people on the other thread have talked the machine down. Someone here on this thread has used a quote from one of my posts suggesting that i am one talking it down. This is not correct i simply stated that i wasnt buying the Duel Boiler and stated my reasons why. I simply didnt want to be an early adopter and to me the look of the machine didnt go well with my new kitchen. I look forward to reading further when this machine is released to the public and hope it gives many years of very happy service to anyone who buys one.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 0722272B1916342335322928460 link=1306475432/16#16 date=1306632136
    I cant remember another time when Breville allowed PP units out for public inspection....maybe it was a mistake.

    Please check out a unit from mass production and see what you think of the steam quality....hopefully it doesnt disappoint
    Hi Adam,

    I dont think it was a mistake at all. From what I can see, this has been one gutsy project and this was just another example of the confidence of the team in a great product.

    After a full week in the wild, those who have sampled or used the machine have been overwhelmingly positive.

    At the shed yesterday, I had the option of pulling shots on the pimped Faema e-61, Izzo Pompeii or the Breville. I used the Breville all day and it held its own. There was not a single negative from those who sampled the coffee and we now have a number of clients who were looking for their first machine or upgrading from a single boiler machine who have decided to wait for a month. I think they are making a very wise decision.

    As always, its about buying the right machine. The Dual Boiler will be the right machine for many.

    Chris

  27. #27
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I also havent inferred too much talking down from any posts in either thread. Ive seen legitimate concerns aired and answered. Anyone who has the time or energy to feel disgusted with the tone of posts, or feels the need to spend time and energy jumping to the defense of a machine that isnt even for sale yet... I envy you! I would like from this thread more pictures, more shots of shots and more info from the lucky few whove used the thing.

    E61s Shuttle didnt get this sort of attention and yet that little expedition into a Site Sponsor having a new Chinese made machine wasnt without controversy. Why is this machine release so different? Sit back folks and enjoy the ride. Positive or negative posts are irrelevant for the time being because none of us can toddle down to Myer/HN and seek the truth. Theres a phrase Ill go to Hell for...

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 445F564752445F5E51435245370 link=1306475432/22#22 date=1306661530
    The bottom line, yes there is a lot to learn from people that have been an industry for a long time BUT you shouldnt discount newbies as you never know what and who they are!
    I always look forward to your posts and responses to others shifter :). It has always been obvious to me that you make contributions from a position of knowledge and therefore worth the time spent ensuring that I read them (your posts) properly.

    Mal.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I must admit if it is as good as people suggest it will have the potential to change the game when it comes to coffee machines.

    Certainly breville have the resources to make this work

    I will need a change in circumstance before I will be buying one. :-[

    Will breville ever make a 2 or 3 group machine?

    I would think just the thought of it will make some manufactures of coffee machines uneasy.

    Will Sunbeam come up with a credible reply?

    Only if they think they can make money from it.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Thank you Mal :)

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Seems this thread is now just as much off topic as the one it replaced ;D

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Like a few of the others above here I failed to see any real bagging of the actual product in the other thread from those who had actually used it. There was some minor niggles raised about it that were agreed with in the main by all sides and as above from Breville some are being addressed pre release.

    This site is about discussion be it good bad or otherwise and all points of view on a product deserve to be heard. If you just want the glossy brouchure sales version then there are non forum sites you can look at.

    Looking forward to having a play with a production model when they get here :)

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    When this model becomes available for sale to the general market, my suggestion would be to buy one ASAP because we all know what happened to the BES400 Ikon...it was too good for the money and went poof.

    $1500 for a machine of this specification - double boilers, high-level temperature control and stability, and espresso extraction - thats an utter steal. I was seriously expecting to pay like $2000 for an outfit of this quality.

    When they come out, get one quick. You dont want to sit on your hands for too long because they might just go poof as well.

    Markets almost always have ways and means of settling inefficiencies. A machine of this caliber isnt going to be priced that low for very long. If this machine is still on the market in 2-3 years, in other words - hasnt been discontinued - you can rest assured without reservation that itll be more than $1500. Maybe $1800, or even $2000 if you like.

    You see, quality stuff doesnt stay low priced for long. Ive seen this with so many markets ranging from things like reptiles, dogs, cameras, microwaves, to fruit and vegetables and meat. When something is of too good value, its price just never ever goes down due to economy of scale. In fact, not surprisingly, the opposite happens. As more and more people recognise this machine has basically slaughtered machines that are almost twice its asking price then the demand for this machine will scale up - and so the story goes - the price scales up too ;)

    Look at what gold has done in the past year alone. Up from 1100/oz to over 1500/oz. Why? Demand has scaled up - paper currencies just seem to pale in comparison to the durable and wealth-preserving quality of gold, so guess what? Kabooooooooom! Up goes its price!

    In a couple of years when you cant buy a BES900 for < $1800...well, lets just say I warned you.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    I still dont see or feel a $1500 machine, seriously Id have been prepared to faun all over it had there been a sub $1200 tag with retailers doing $999 deals on it at some point, but I still just see something maid inn chinna, being less clever than your average microwave oven.

    Yeah still a downer, but seriously the way some of you talk its like you want/expect everyone to lump praise on this thing, just cause err, well, now thats a thought, why do some just expect us all to faun all over something with no proven track record, and in a current unproven price range, with as of yet no real in home use or long term torture testing?.

    Tongue in cheek just a bit, seriously you can love this thing to bits, but Im finding the digs taken at anyone with a neutral or negative comment a little hypocritical, you have to realize just being called a Breville is enough to turn off 50% of your possible market, regardless of how well it does anything in the end.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 2522292D7577777F470 link=1306475432/32#32 date=1306736629
    When this model becomes available for sale to the general market, my suggestion would be to buy one ASAP because we all know what happened to the BES400 Ikon...it was too good for the money and went poof.
    Certainly if you can foresee the future you have a rare talent perhaps it depends on if the factory they are made in can produce 2000 or 2,000,000 per month.

    Eventually if they become expensive enough sunbeam may come up with a similar machine.

    It will be interesting to see what happens but I think there will still be a market for sub $300 coffee machines.

  36. #36
    Senior Member Bosco_Lever's Avatar
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 03040F0B53515159610 link=1306475432/32#32 date=1306736629
    When this model becomes available for sale to the general market, my suggestion would be to buy one ASAP because we all know what happened to the BES400 Ikon...it was too good for the money and went poof.

    $1500 for a machine of this specification - double boilers, high-level temperature control and stability, and espresso extraction - thats an utter steal. I was seriously expecting to pay like $2000 for an outfit of this quality.

    When they come out, get one quick. You dont want to sit on your hands for too long because they might just go poof as well.

    Markets almost always have ways and means of settling inefficiencies. A machine of this caliber isnt going to be priced that low for very long. If this machine is still on the market in 2-3 years, in other words - hasnt been discontinued - you can rest assured without reservation that itll be more than $1500. Maybe $1800, or even $2000 if you like.

    You see, quality stuff doesnt stay low priced for long. Ive seen this with so many markets ranging from things like reptiles, dogs, cameras, microwaves, to fruit and vegetables and meat. When something is of too good value, its price just never ever goes down due to economy of scale. In fact, not surprisingly, the opposite happens. As more and more people recognise this machine has basically slaughtered machines that are almost twice its asking price then the demand for this machine will scale up - and so the story goes - the price scales up too Wink

    Look at what gold has done in the past year alone. Up from 1100/oz to over 1500/oz. Why? Demand has scaled up - paper currencies just seem to pale in comparison to the durable and wealth-preserving quality of gold, so guess what? Kabooooooooom! Up goes its price!

    In a couple of years when you cant buy a BES900 for < $1800...well, lets just say I warned you.
    Hi benjamind2008. Where did you get your degree in Economics? ........."Hogwarts"???

  37. #37
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Hello Bishop,

    All I can suggest is that the best bet if the machine is of interest to you is to gain some first hand experience with it.

    If it doesnt rock your boat, thats fine. If it does, thats great too. One way or another, if you have sampled the machine, you validate your opinions. Without that experience, placing a value on an unknown machine must by nature be speculative.

    I have experienced both the Dual Boiler and the 6910 and for me, there is no way Id entertain thermoblocks at any price. A single boiler machine would do my head in as well. We entertain too often. If I had only $1.5 k to play with would I have a Breville? Absolutely, as with even double the spend, Id be compromising on the feature set.

    I saved hard and I have a GS/3 on my home bench and nope I wont be swapping. I love my machine but am also realistic. I have little doubt that 50% of the value of my machine lies in the brand plates on either side of it!* ::)


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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 1017020D00630 link=1306475432/35#35 date=1306757035
    Hi benjamind2008. Where did you get your degree in Economics? ........."Hogwarts"???
    No economics degree required. Just plain old fashioned common sense.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 27202B2F7775757D450 link=1306475432/37#37 date=1306840608
    Quote Originally Posted by 1017020D00630 link=1306475432/35#35 date=1306757035
    Hi benjamind2008. Where did you get your degree in Economics? ........."Hogwarts"???
    No economics degree required. Just plain old fashioned common sense.
    On the basis of that comment, I reckon you should turn him into a slug Ben....Garn, do it!* ;D

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 37020F083C200C05050606630 link=1306475432/36#36 date=1306757910
    I have experienced both the Dual Boiler and the 6910 and for me, there is no way Id entertain thermoblocks at any price. A single boiler machine would do my head in as well
    For some people $600 is a lot of money to spend on a espresso machine, and the em6910 does represent the best value machine for a large percentage of that market.* The em6910 is likely going to be responsible for creating a percentage of the market for the Breville DB, as people have developed their appreciation for coffee on the em6910 and want to upgrade.*

    Others might find that a single boiler is the best value machine for them, and could never justify spending $1500 on a coffee machine.

    Their is no comparison between thermoblocks/single boiler machines and dual boiler machines at twice the price.* I dont really understand what you were getting at?* (nice friendly tone in that last part) :)* The DB is a far superior machine.* Its kinda like sayin I will never buy a vehicle with high ks, cloth interior and standard sound system, it just doesnt compare to my new leather filled Audi with Bose sound system.*

    There will always be a market for cheaper machines even if they are inferior.

    As for the price of the DB going up? Im no economics expert but I think there are massive holes in that theory.* Should I rush out and buy a ute full of blu-ray DVD recorders before they stop producing them and* prices sky rocket?

    I think the DB will be excellent value, very keenly priced and it will probably have to be.




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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    No argument from me ryjodal apart from...

    Quote Originally Posted by 49747070641D0 link=1306475432/39#39 date=1306911188
    the em6910 does represent the best value machine for a large percentage of that market.
    The 6910 may be the best marketed coffee maker at around that price, but I think the Lelit leaves it for dead as far as quality of construction, longevity, and for its ability to make good coffee.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Hi all, I think sunbeam will sit on its hands for a while a and see if the breville is sucessful. Free market research. If the demand is there and 6910 sales plummet I reckon sunbeam will respond and the battle will resume between the two. Either way, the more machines on the market the better IMO.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 6D7B7E7E6F6D6168686B6B0E0 link=1306475432/40#40 date=1306914610
    The 6910 may be the best marketed coffee maker at around that price .....
    With the nearing release of the Breville DB I think we have a new category killer in the marketing of coffee machines department ;)

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 505146465D58514C340 link=1306475432/41#41 date=1306917169
    Hi all, I think sunbeam will sit on its hands for a while a and see if the breville is sucessful. Free market research. If the demand is there and 6910 sales plummet* I reckon sunbeam will respond and the battle will resume between the two. Either way, the more machines on the market the better IMO.
    Sales on the em6910 shouldnt be affected that much because its in a different price range. Sunbeam will still have a big share of the 500-$700 market because Breville have not really gone into competition with that market but are competing with more high-end machines.

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 5A5B4C4C57525B463E0 link=1306475432/41#41 date=1306917169
    sunbeam will sit on its hands for a while
    Wasnt the BDB a 3+ year project?

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 774A4E4E5A230 link=1306475432/43#43 date=1306925377
    Sales on the em6910 shouldnt be affected that much because its in a different price range. Sunbeam will still have a big share of the 500-$700 market because Breville have not really gone into competition with that market but are competing with more high-end machines.
    That is incorrect. Heard of the Breville Fresca? Id call it a direct competitor to the EM6910.

    The Dual Boiler is however a competitor to what we have had in the marketplace with a plus $1k price tag.

  47. #47
    Senior Member matth3wh's Avatar
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Just wondering, if we can get a firm Pre-order pricing first? and a Delivery date second?
    or must the two go together? :)

  48. #48
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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 35392C2C306B2F30580 link=1306475432/46#46 date=1306934042
    Just wondering, if we can get a firm Pre-order pricing first?* and a delivery date second?
    or must the two go together?* :)
    Seems so Matty,

    Were still waiting on pricing from Breville and the most recent date quoted was early-mid July.

    Cheers

    Chris

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 6771747465676B62626161040 link=1306475432/40#40 date=1306914610
    I think the Lelit leaves it for dead as far as quality of construction, longevity, and for its ability to make good coffee.
    Some have complained about a level of negativity towards the BDB.* For me, your statement above is where I think the reservations stem from, at least for me - the perception that a brand like Sunbeam or Breville will not offer the same build quality, and longevity of a European name. I know your statement is specific to the 6910, which I get the impression has had more than its fair share of reliability issues.

    I dont think theres any arguments the BDB offers good bang for buck, and will be capable of producing great results, but Im not surprised some are taking the "wait and see" approach - sceptics, even, especially when were no longer talking about a $700 odd outlay.* To highlight my point, Im wrapt with my Breveille machine, and have no problems with the brand/company, but it cost me $250 odd (factory second), and I never bought it expecting it to last me 15 years!

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    Re: Breville Dual Boiler

    Quote Originally Posted by 65606C68646F6936010 link=1306475432/48#48 date=1306972474
    cuppacoffee wrote Yesterday at 17:50:

    I think the Lelit leaves it for dead as far as quality of construction, longevity, and for its ability to make good coffee.
    Some have complained about a level of negativity towards the BDB. For me, your statement above is where I think the reservations stem from, at least for me - the perception that a brand like Sunbeam or Breville will not offer the same build quality, and longevity of a European name. I know your statement is specific to the 6910, which I get the impression has had more than its fair share of reliability issues.
    I can see where youre coming from. You are correct in that my remarks were specifically directed to the 6910. Until recently, I would not have recommended any well known appliance brand for a coffee maker, apart from the Ikon which is now defunct. I havent used every machine under the sun, though have had enough experience to know what I like and what I dont. Im also always happy to make my own assessment on new offerings - regardless of where they are made.

    I have been praising the merits of the Dual Boiler since I had the opportunity to visit Breville and see it in action. I am by nature an early adopter. Its nice to see that others, like Chris, Mark Prince, and other industry professionals are also positive about the ability of this machine. I think this trend will continue.




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