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Thread: Silvia V1 upgrades - which are worth the $?

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    Silvia V1 upgrades & mod's - which are worth the $?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi all,

    I've just picked up a really well looked after v1 Silvia. So far, so good, but just after opinions from those with experience with these machines, and all the upgrades/mod's that are possible, to see which you think are worth the $ - keeping in mind that you can get a new v3 for around the $500 mark these days (or so I've read!), so it's hardly worth spending a whole lot of money on the v1 to try and get it up to v3 specs.

    With that in mind, just as an example, I'm not sure I could justify the steam wand upgrade at around $150. This machine will likely just be another stepping stone until I decide whether to sink a more significant amount of $ into my coffee equipment - I wasn't really looking, but came across this machine for around $200, and I couldn't pass it up!

    The sorts of things I know are possible, and seem cheap enough, are things like changing over the thermostat's (which I believe are set differently in later models), gronking, changing over the shower screen screw. Also unsure about whether to look at the OPV?

    Anyway, over to owners and former owners of the earlier Silvia's - interested to hear what you guys think are the most significant (and cost effective) tweaks to be made to improve the machine.

    Cheers,
    Damien

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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    From what I read around, the Silvia is similar to the Gaggia Classic in terms of function and capability, so you may want to look at installing a PID rather than buggering around with new thermostats - you can DIY a PID for $40 all up.

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    Thanks for the input guys... @Dragunov21, where did you source the parts to PID for $40? PID is obviously one thing that would make life easier, and produce more consistent results, and if it could be done for < $50 then makes more sense than gronking, IMO.

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    evilBay with a K-type thermocouple I'd guess...

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    nothing wrong with a K-type, as long as you don't expect the temperature to read out accurately (but will read out consistently).

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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    For the benefit of anyone else interested, searching "A Set Dual Digital PID Temperature Controller OMRON relay & 25A SSR & K Sensor" will provide a couple of likely results.

    You can just use the existing thermostat like a screw terminal if you like, otherwise search for "Brass Standoff Spacer M4 Male x M4 Female 10mm" for something you can drill a hole down the centre of to mount your thermocouple bead.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hildy View Post
    nothing wrong with a K-type, as long as you don't expect the temperature to read out accurately (but will read out consistently).
    You only need consistency, because you won't necessarily be setting your PID to the brew temp you desire regardless due to the lack of thermal stability of the group/boiler.

    The PID I currently use (not the one suggested above) is a relay-only output, operating much like a fine-band thermostat, so I have it set to 108C. It peaks at 122-123 when the group is all warmed up so when I see it peak that high I open the steam valve to drop temp to 107 and I start a pull as soon as the element kicks in. This provides a 60ml shot starting at 94-95C with a ΔT of 1-2 from start to finish as measured at the shower screen with a calibrated Fluke 52 (it usually rises half a degree then drops 0.5-1.5).

    Unfortunately, after a quick flush to clear the shower screen, it takes a bit longer to stabilise than it takes me to weigh/grind/prep a new shot, but that's the nature of the beast.

    With genuine PID (pulse-width-modulated output) control I'm not sure how closely the boiler temp would match the actual brew temp, but either way the offset isn't too concerning unless you want to apply your variables to other machines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hildy View Post
    nothing wrong with a K-type, as long as you don't expect the temperature to read out accurately (but will read out consistently).
    True, K-types are at least very consistent, I still prefer my T-Types though

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    I'm using a K-type for gronking. I'm pouring shots at 100 but I haven't correlated this to actual brew temperature yet.

    the k-type I use for roast logging is definitely overreading - my 1st and 2nd crack temperatures are a good 10-15 degrees higher than what most people publish. but as long as I can consistently get the same roast profile I'll be happy.

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    Hi Damien,

    I've got a V2 Silvia and found that upgrading your regular Rancilio basket to a Synesso double ridgeless, or VST basket makes a fairly significant difference for a smallish outlay. They allow you to pack in a few more grams of coffee per double shot giving you a fuller, 'bigger' flavour. If you get a 'ridgeless' basket you will need to get a stronger spring to hold it in place in your portafilter. Cost you around $25-30 for basket and spring.

    All the best with your Silvia!

    Paul

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steiny555 View Post
    Hi Damien,

    I've got a V2 Silvia and found that upgrading your regular Rancilio basket to a Synesso double ridgeless, or VST basket makes a fairly significant difference for a smallish outlay. They allow you to pack in a few more grams of coffee per double shot giving you a fuller, 'bigger' flavour. If you get a 'ridgeless' basket you will need to get a stronger spring to hold it in place in your portafilter. Cost you around $25-30 for basket and spring.

    All the best with your Silvia!

    Paul
    You can gronk, PID, nekid or PF, at the end of the day Paul's suggestion " upgrading your regular Rancilio basket to a Synesso double ridgeless, or VST basket" is the easiest to do and will also have the biggest positive affect on coffee quality, along with learning how to use the machine as it came, out of the box.

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    You guys are the best, thanks

    By the sounds of it, upgrading to the better basket, and gronking will come in at less than $50 total outlay, so this might be a good place to start. I like the idea of gronking for the minimal outlay, and easy install, to be able to see what the boiler temp is doing, and help improve my consistency.

    Cheers,
    Damien

    P.S. any clear winner out of the VST and Synesso, or both similarly good for the same sorta money?

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by damienh7 View Post
    You guys are the best, thanks

    By the sounds of it, upgrading to the better basket, and gronking will come in at less than $50 total outlay, so this might be a good place to start. I like the idea of gronking for the minimal outlay, and easy install, to be able to see what the boiler temp is doing, and help improve my consistency.

    Cheers,
    Damien

    P.S. any clear winner out of the VST and Synesso, or both similarly good for the same sorta money?
    Just to put the cat among the pigeons Damien, I use these baskets Talk Coffee &mdash; Precision filter basket 58mm- Espresso parts from Chris at Talk Coffee, excellent baskets at reasonable price.

    Tried the VST and found them a little finicky, much prefer those from Espresso Parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Just to put the cat among the pigeons Damien, I use these baskets Talk Coffee — Precision filter basket 58mm- Espresso parts from Chris at Talk Coffee, excellent baskets at reasonable price.

    Tried the VST and found them a little finicky, much prefer those from Espresso Parts.
    Appears no-one disagrees too strongly... no replies to argue the merits of the other brands yet

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    Senior Member robusto's Avatar
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    Best improvement I did to my Silvia was the Auber PID.

    Simple to do and cheap.

    Digital temperature read out is OK for knowing what's going on, but a PID will not only tell you that, it will also regulate to the desired temperature.

    Bigger baskets I like, but overdosing may not be to everyone's taste. Literally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Just to put the cat among the pigeons Damien, I use these baskets Talk Coffee &mdash; Precision filter basket 58mm- Espresso parts from Chris at Talk Coffee, excellent baskets at reasonable price.
    I started using this double basket from Talk Coffee a few days ago- already the results seem a lot better than the standard basket, which I had been using for a long time already. I haven't tried any other baskets yet but I am very happy so far with the improvement from this one (plus the price is a lot less than for a VST)- I'm sure my results will improve even more as I get more experience with it. Should definitely have purchased a replacement basket earlier in retrospect

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    Quote Originally Posted by papagoose View Post
    I started using this double basket from Talk Coffee a few days ago- already the results seem a lot better than the standard basket, which I had been using for a long time already. I haven't tried any other baskets yet but I am very happy so far with the improvement from this one (plus the price is a lot less than for a VST)- I'm sure my results will improve even more as I get more experience with it. Should definitely have purchased a replacement basket earlier in retrospect
    Good stuff, always nice to hear of a positive outcome.

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    Silvia V1 upgrades - which are worth the $?

    Quote Originally Posted by robusto View Post
    Best improvement I did to my Silvia was the Auber PID.

    Simple to do and cheap.

    Digital temperature read out is OK for knowing what's going on, but a PID will not only tell you that, it will also regulate to the desired temperature.

    Bigger baskets I like, but overdosing may not be to everyone's taste. Literally.
    Where did you get your Auber PID and do you remember how much it was.

    Thanks Kevin

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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    PID Temperature Control Retrofit KIT for Rancilio Silvia [KIT-RSRTDNb] - $152.00 : auberins.com, Temperature control solutions for home and industry

    $150.

    Or you can get a $40 PID/SSR/TC kit off eBay (PM me if you want a link) which you'll have to figure out and connect yourself (rather than the Auber, which appears to be plug-n-play with all fly-leads provided and terminated.

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    TC
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    Nar, that's not an upgrade. You PID it, but only after after fitting a separate steam boiler which then feeds the original brew boiler. Just solve the thermodynamics, add the requisite autofills, a tank, a couple of gauges, wiring etc and get the whole shebang to talk to a control board. You then have Frankensilvia, Coffee Machinist style.

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    Haha!

    Thanks Chris, I am pretty stoked with it. Not what I would call a sensible upgrade decision though, but it's great as a one-off just to see whats possible. Having fitted an Auber to a customer's machine just recently, I was impressed with the scace results at the group. With enough time allowed for the group casting to heat properly and for the PID to recover between shots, there is definitely some semblence of repeatability in shot temperature. Not that this can't be done with a stock Silvia, an LCD temperature meter on the boiler and a bit of finesse though.
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    http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-eq...tml#post497100

    WOW that is a work of art. Great craftsmanship!

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    TOK
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    Or, cheapest possible scenario: you could just learn how to use it how it is. There wasnt anything much wrong with the original silvia in the first place and it's an excellent training ground for any barista to learn the ropes. Mods are for AFTER you learn how to use something and have worked out the reason why you might want to modify it.
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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    Is temperature surfing a skill you believe is important for baristas/coffee-enthusiasts?

    I view it as something a coffee-enthusiast learns to overcome inherent limitations in small/cheap machines. Removing the variable of temperature by controlling it and making it visible enables you to concentrate on your technique as your temperatures are repeatable.

    Do you feel that commercial/luxury machines are cheating their users out of a learning experience because they employ designs that allow great thermal stability?

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOK View Post
    Or, cheapest possible scenario: you could just learn how to use it how it is. There wasnt anything much wrong with the original silvia in the first place and it's an excellent training ground for any barista to learn the ropes. Mods are for AFTER you learn how to use something and have worked out the reason why you might want to modify it.
    Well said TOK, but of course that's not the answer the inveterate tinkerers are looking for.

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragunov21 View Post
    Do you feel that commercial/luxury machines are cheating their users out of a learning experience because they employ designs that allow great thermal stability?
    Not at all, however I have found that those who have come up through the ranks, starting with a modest machine, learning to make the most of it and upgrading when the desire/funds are available have a better knowledge of things espresso than most who are able to walk in and buy a top of the range machine first up.
    Pretty much a case of (where to from here?)

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    I know what you mean, my position is simply that of all the things a barista needs to know how to do manually, maintaining stable/correct temperature during a pull isn't one of them, because there's no art to it as far as I'm aware; you simply want to keep it constant throughout the shot and accurately determine what it is as you might prefer it slightly higher or lower for different coffees.

    If anything, a thermally unstable machine robs you of the opportunity to experiment with pulling shots at different temperatures and determining the effect on the end result as you can't say "this shot was pulled at 94, this at 95, this at 96. The 94 was the tastiest therefore I will pull my shots at 94 in future for this coffee".

    I don't think that wasting time/coffee trying to troubleshoot my PF prep technique before realising I was pouring shots at 79-89 degrees has benefited me in the least.

    Coming at this from a controls/automation perspective:

    - If you can read temperature at the puck, that tells you exactly (from a practical perspective) what temp you're extracting at.
    - If you can read temperature at the boiler, that is one step removed and introduces lag into your measurements as heat soaks from element to boiler, then boiler to water and boiler to group, meaning that the information available to you is less useful.
    - If all you can do is manually energise an element for x amount of time at a point where the boiler has dropped to a certain temperature, that's two steps removed from the variable you want to control (extraction/puck) temp.

    I think that manipulation of extraction temperature to obtain different attributes in the cup is a barista's skillset.
    I think that compensating for a lack of information two steps removed from the extraction temperature is a "skill", kinda, but one that is useless the moment you upgrade your machine and one that retards development of the skill of intentional temperature manipulation of a thermally stable machine.

    Anyway, I'm repeating the same stuff over and over so I should probably leave it at that and agree to disagree

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragunov21 View Post
    I know what you mean, my position is simply that of all the things a barista needs to know how to do manually, maintaining stable/correct temperature during a pull isn't one of them, because there's no art to it as far as I'm aware; you simply want to keep it constant throughout the shot and accurately determine what it is as you might prefer it slightly higher or lower for different coffees.

    If anything, a thermally unstable machine robs you of the opportunity to experiment with pulling shots at different temperatures and determining the effect on the end result as you can't say "this shot was pulled at 94, this at 95, this at 96. The 94 was the tastiest therefore I will pull my shots at 94 in future for this coffee".

    I don't think that wasting time/coffee trying to troubleshoot my PF prep technique before realising I was pouring shots at 79-89 degrees has benefited me in the least.

    Coming at this from a controls/automation perspective:

    - If you can read temperature at the puck, that tells you exactly (from a practical perspective) what temp you're extracting at.
    - If you can read temperature at the boiler, that is one step removed and introduces lag into your measurements as heat soaks from element to boiler, then boiler to water and boiler to group, meaning that the information available to you is less useful.
    - If all you can do is manually energise an element for x amount of time at a point where the boiler has dropped to a certain temperature, that's two steps removed from the variable you want to control (extraction/puck) temp.

    I think that manipulation of extraction temperature to obtain different attributes in the cup is a barista's skillset.
    I think that compensating for a lack of information two steps removed from the extraction temperature is a "skill", kinda, but one that is useless the moment you upgrade your machine and one that retards development of the skill of intentional temperature manipulation of a thermally stable machine.

    Anyway, I'm repeating the same stuff over and over so I should probably leave it at that and agree to disagree
    Ummmm, OK.

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    Not a Shoe Jimmytheboot's Avatar
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    Changing the screen bolt is a good cheap mod, even if the pucks not hitting that ugly bolt its just annoying to see it.

    Bottomless portafilter is alot of fun too, not that cheap for what you get, but if you take care of it you can sell it later without loosing too much.

    And ignore Yelta, get a PID

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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Ummmm, OK.
    ??

    *EDIT* Whups, wrong thread - there was another one that I said pretty much exactly the same thing and I didn't want to harp on is all.
    Last edited by Dragunov21; 16th April 2013 at 02:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragunov21 View Post
    Is temperature surfing a skill you believe is important for baristas/coffee-enthusiasts? I view it as something a coffee-enthusiast learns to overcome inherent limitations in small/cheap machines. Removing the variable of temperature by controlling it and making it visible enables you to concentrate on your technique as your temperatures are repeatable.
    You temp-surf with a HX machine (with cooling flushes).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmytheboot View Post
    Changing the screen bolt is a good cheap mod, even if the pucks not hitting that ugly bolt its just annoying to see it.

    Bottomless portafilter is alot of fun too, not that cheap for what you get, but if you take care of it you can sell it later without loosing too much.

    And ignore Yelta, get a PID
    Yep I agree, changing the screen bolt is a good move.

    Bottomless PF, not so much, they have novelty value and help entertain visitors, mine lives in the drawer full of (stuff that never gets used)

    "And ignore Yelta, get a PID"
    Waste of time and money, learn to use the machine out of the box.

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    A stopwatch costs more than a thermocouple probe. or is your intrinsic time sense so good that you can count out ten seconds accurately?

    I love my bottomless PF - it helps me tamp evenly (because I don't have to balance it on the spout when tamping).

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    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    I found that using a bottomless PF helped a lot in getting my distribution/tamp down. Still need a lot of practice but you can't fix a problem you don't know exists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hildy View Post

    I love my bottomless PF - it helps me tamp evenly (because I don't have to balance it on the spout when tamping).
    Nor do I, made this up about 6 years ago.


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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragunov21 View Post
    ??

    *EDIT* Whups, wrong thread - there was another one that I said pretty much exactly the same thing and I didn't want to harp on is all.
    I imagine these come under the heading of WTF posts.

  36. #36
    TOK
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    ".....Waste of time and money, learn to use the machine out of the box....."

    Right on brother.

    Too many people worrying that something they might be doing (as in, read in a forum) is affecting their coffee detrimentally, so better fix it. Fix what? Learn the machine and proper coffee making technique. All problems solved without need to spend money on mods. Its a great home machine straight out of the box. Its not a "small/cheap" machine. Its one of the best home use machines around.

    For the rest of it......too many "professional" coffee machine operators dont understand what they are doing. A good starter machine like the Silvia helps you understand that if you dont get your understanding and technique right, you dont get good coffee. I say a silvia straight out of the box is a fine educational tool for robot "barwristers" that dont understand what they are doing.

    About the only thing to do as already mentioned by others above, is ditch the standard coffee filters and replace them with deeper issue like standard cafe type. The extra couple of grams coffee grinds makes all the difference. On an older model, probably already been done.

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    Some people don't have the time or inclination to learn all the bad habits and idiosyncrasies that are involved on machines without stable temp control.

    The debate will go on forever, but the temperature of extraction has a massive impact on flavour. Considering, in my experiences most bad " professional " coffee I have had is burnt and or over extracted, a machine with accurate stable temp control, set a touch lower so they cant burn it, would see a big improvement.

    Anyone can be taught / learn good or bad techniques whether its a $50 sunbeam or $6000 GS3. The whole apprenticeship or right of passage BS people go on with is funny. Some people want to be able to experiment with repeatable and controlled parameters to get the best coffee possible every time.

    After playing around with my own roasted coffee on accurately adjustable,bigger temp stable machines and tasting the difference...No accurate temp control just doesn't do it justice any more for my tastes. If people cant taste the difference superior temp control brings, ignorance is bliss.
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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve82 View Post
    Some people don't have the time or inclination to learn all the bad habits and idiosyncrasies that are involved on machines without stable temp control.

    The debate will go on forever, but the temperature of extraction has a massive impact on flavour. Considering, in my experiences most bad " professional " coffee I have had is burnt and or over extracted, a machine with accurate stable temp control, set a touch lower so they cant burn it, would see a big improvement.

    Anyone can be taught / learn good or bad techniques whether its a $50 sunbeam or $6000 GS3. The whole apprenticeship or right of passage BS people go on with is funny. Some people want to be able to experiment with repeatable and controlled parameters to get the best coffee possible every time.

    After playing around with my own roasted coffee on accurately adjustable,bigger temp stable machines and tasting the difference...No accurate temp control just doesn't do it justice any more for my tastes. If people cant taste the difference superior temp control brings, ignorance is bliss.
    Or could it be that some people simply don't have the ability to come to terms with and maintain control over anything that needs a bit of cognitive input.

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    Silvia V1 upgrades - which are worth the $?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Or could it be that some people simply don't have the ability to come to terms with and maintain control over anything that needs a bit of cognitive input.
    I burst out laughing when I read that! I see this problem at work on a daily (hourly?) basis. ;-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by fruity View Post
    I burst out laughing when I read that! I see this problem at work on a daily (hourly?) basis. ;-)
    Yes, we have a resources manager who has a standard response when confronted with any task above turning a switch on. 1) Deny the asset exists 2) (if 1 doesn't succeed) deny that the asset is ours 3) (if 2 doesn't work) switch off asset and hope nobody notices, 4) if asset is a fluorescent light full of storm water....just leave it there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fruity View Post
    I burst out laughing when I read that! I see this problem at work on a daily (hourly?) basis. ;-)
    I know the feeling, before I retired I managed a geological sample preparation facility, we had over 30 people operating machinery which required some operator input to keep things running smoothly, a few (very few) were able to keep things moving all day without a problem, the majority were OK but a problem was lurking just around the corner, and, I suspect a few at the other end would deliberately instigate a problem so that they could have a smoke or whatever while the stuff up was being fixed.

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    Thanks for all the input guys... and the detour the thread has taken!

    Anyway, this is not my first single boiler machine, so I'm sure I could get away with using it "out of the box" and get pretty good results, but I also have a wife who sometimes uses the machine, and "just wants coffee", so it helps me if she can get a decent coffee from the machine with minimal fuss.

    All things considered, I've got a digital temp read-out to install. I also discovered I had previously bought one of the larger double baskets that I'd purchased while I was using my Silvia. I might pick up a new showerhead screw, but I think that'll be it for now. After a couple of weeks getting to know this particular machine, I'm starting to get consistently good results (the larger basket definitely has helped!).

  43. #43
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Morning Damien, the detour was simply a way of saying that---some people never experience a problem producing good coffee with a
    Silvia, most people will get along just fine after the initial learning period and the occasional glitch, and some will never get it and always seem to have a drama taking place.

    i.e. too course, too fine, too hot, too cold, basket too full/not full enough, tamped too hard/not hard enough, beans stale/poorly roasted, milk won't foam, steam tip wrong, must have a nekid PF, thermostat set too hot/too cold, must have a PID or at the very minimum gronked, the list goes on.

    These are the types who have trouble working out which is the sharp end of a knife and would probably be better off with a fully auto machine, even then they would probably manage to stuff the process up.

  44. #44
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    Silvia V1 upgrades - which are worth the $?

    Quote Originally Posted by damienh7 View Post
    Thanks for all the input guys... and the detour the thread has taken!

    Anyway, this is not my first single boiler machine, so I'm sure I could get away with using it "out of the box" and get pretty good results, but I also have a wife who sometimes uses the machine, and "just wants coffee", so it helps me if she can get a decent coffee from the machine with minimal fuss.

    All things considered, I've got a digital temp read-out to install. I also discovered I had previously bought one of the larger double baskets that I'd purchased while I was using my Silvia. I might pick up a new showerhead screw, but I think that'll be it for now. After a couple of weeks getting to know this particular machine, I'm starting to get consistently good results (the larger basket definitely has helped!).
    Indeed - I didn't need to PID my Silvia, but it made using it a lot easier for the better half!

    Not to mention I appreciate not having to count out the temp surf in my head every time I do a coffee. ;-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by fruity View Post
    Not to mention I appreciate not having to count out the temp surf in my head every time I do a coffee. ;-)
    My machine is situated right under a wall clock, with second hand, which is quite handy : )

  46. #46
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by damienh7 View Post
    My machine is situated right under a wall clock, with second hand, which is quite handy : )
    Crikey, what a good idea.

  47. #47
    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    With a little testing (ok, two hours) last night involving a bit of sponge, a calibrated TC and a 100-time-extracted puck, my process is like this (albeit on a Gaggia Classic, not a Silvia).

    With the PID set to a given temperature (92-96C), from any heated/overheated state, topping up the boiler through the steam wand then flushing a shot and waiting 1.5-3 mins will result in the next shot starting at <1C below setpoint. rising <0.5C above and dropping <0.5C degrees below throughout a 60ml shot, measured at the puck.

    Discard the puck and give three quick pulses to flush the showerscreen then wait at least 1.5 minutes, up to 3, and the next shot will be dead on setpoint, dropping <0.5C over the shot. This is indefinitely repeatable.

    It takes me ~1:30-1:40 to weigh, grind, dose and tamp so it works out perfectly. It's a bit artless, but it allows me to pull as many shots as I want without waiting before starting on milk.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Crikey, what a good idea.
    Yeah... although it wasn't necessarily planned, so I can't claim too much credit for the "good idea". The clock was there first.

  49. #49
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragunov21 View Post
    With a little testing (ok, two hours) last night involving a bit of sponge, a calibrated TC and a 100-time-extracted puck, my process is like this (albeit on a Gaggia Classic, not a Silvia).

    With the PID set to a given temperature (92-96C), from any heated/overheated state, topping up the boiler through the steam wand then flushing a shot and waiting 1.5-3 mins will result in the next shot starting at <1C below setpoint. rising <0.5C above and dropping <0.5C degrees below throughout a 60ml shot, measured at the puck.

    Discard the puck and give three quick pulses to flush the showerscreen then wait at least 1.5 minutes, up to 3, and the next shot will be dead on setpoint, dropping <0.5C over the shot. This is indefinitely repeatable.

    It takes me ~1:30-1:40 to weigh, grind, dose and tamp so it works out perfectly. It's a bit artless, but it allows me to pull as many shots as I want without waiting before starting on milk.
    So are you saying you find it necessary to temp surf a PID'd machine?

  50. #50
    Senior Member Dragunov21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    So are you saying you find it necessary to temp surf a PID'd machine?
    If you consider running a single cooling flush on a machine that's been sitting for a while "temperature surfing", then sure.

    If the following shots are pulled after 3 minutes then they're still at acceptable temps, just not within the 0.2 degree accuracy that is otherwise possible.



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