Results 1 to 20 of 20
Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By TC
  • 1 Post By pecan

Thread: Rancilio Silvia problem

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20

    Rancilio Silvia problem

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Ive had my silvia since 2005 and love it. It has never missed a beat until now. i left it on while i was away for a day and cooked the element. I replaced the boiler (new element) and it still trips out the earth leakage. I can run it off a circuit breaker no problems. Also when I turn on the water switch to get hot water from the steam wand water also comes out of the group head. Ive checked the wiring, (I took photos before I replaced the boiler), and everything is definitely in the right place.
    If anyone has any idea what the problem is I would be stoked to know. I live in a country area and can't find anyone to look at it for me.
    Thanks

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    40
    Quote Originally Posted by pecan View Post
    Ive had my silvia since 2005 and love it. It has never missed a beat until now. i left it on while i was away for a day and cooked the element. I replaced the boiler (new element) and it still trips out the earth leakage. I can run it off a circuit breaker no problems. Also when I turn on the water switch to get hot water from the steam wand water also comes out of the group head. Ive checked the wiring, (I took photos before I replaced the boiler), and everything is definitely in the right place.
    If anyone has any idea what the problem is I would be stoked to know. I live in a country area and can't find anyone to look at it for me.
    Thanks
    tripping the earth leakage means (as you probably know) that the active phase reaches the ground.
    Typical reasons... water in the circuit or bad insulation.

    I would check if there is any visual water inside the machine (but try to avoid electricuting yourself - especially as you are out of the earth tipping protection).
    If there is no water in the machine and no bad insulation - I would question quality of new element or the way how it was installed. It looks that water gets inside the element.

  3. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    Thanks victor.
    No visible water anywhere. I have all the covers off and everything looks fine, have checked and double checked all wiring against my photos and wiring diagram, all good.
    I had my electrician check the element it comes up good.
    It heats up water fine but trips the earth leakage when the brew, hot water or steam switch is used

  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    40
    Quote Originally Posted by pecan View Post
    It heats up water fine but trips the earth leakage when the brew, hot water or steam switch is used
    Puzzling...
    - trips on steam (no pump involved, just heater)
    - trips on hot water (no heater, just pump)

    The only common denominator is the switch itself (and some common wires).
    Any water on the switch?
    Does it trip immediately or after a while?
    Any wires that are touching hot parts like boiler?

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Brisbane,QLD
    Posts
    113
    Could be a dodgy switch? Which of the wires did you have to remove? If any of these were put back incorrectly it would easily create a short circuit somewhere

  6. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    14
    Check you have not swapped neutral and active on the switches compared to the heater. When you switch anything on you are shorting active to neutral/earth, sure to drop anything off. Like the previous post, juts a bit more descriptive.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    40
    Also pls see relevant post from other thread..
    Quote Originally Posted by CafeLotta View Post
    My 2nd hand V3 Silvia had an element that read okay on the meter but would trip the Safety switch when heating up to steam. The welded-in V3 elements apparently were more suseptible to getting micro fractures in the top of the heating element's copper outer casing especially if constantly overheated through incorrect use. The micro fractures would open up with the increased temperature required to steam and allow water to contact the element's internals causing a short. A new boiler fixed this and confirmed the dud element even though the meter said it was okay.

    Thought this may possibly be of interest to others looking for an answer as to why their Silvia isn't playing nice anymore.

  8. #8
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    All wires definitely in there correct place. I have tried it with wires to the element disconnected, it still trips.
    What about the water coming out the group when hot water switch turned on? I have cleaned the solenoid valve

  9. #9
    TC
    TC is offline
    .
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    14,665
    I would recommend you take your machine to a tech who can safely repair it. 240V and inexperience are not happy bed partners...
    Dragunov21 likes this.

  10. #10
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    311
    I replaced my Silvia's boiler which solved my tripping the mains earth leakage problem, but your problem sounds a bit more complicated.

    I ditto Chris' suggestion, get an electrician to look at it, there may not be any coffee machine technicians your way but there should be an electrician somewhere...?

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    If you are confident to keep fault finding yourself,...I would disconnect the 3 way valve solenoid, and try again .

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Brisbane,QLD
    Posts
    113
    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    If you are confident to keep fault finding yourself,...I would disconnect the 3 way valve solenoid, and try again .
    ^ This.

    If water comes out the group with only the hot water switch on then something is suspect about that valve.

    If you were to disconnect the power to it, then the hot water and steam functions should still work okay.

  13. #13
    Senior Member gonzob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    226
    Quote Originally Posted by nicovington View Post
    ^ This.

    If water comes out the group with only the hot water switch on then something is suspect about that valve.

    If you were to disconnect the power to it, then the hot water and steam functions should still work okay.


    This is all good analysis, however, let's take a step backwards. This started when the unit was left on all day. That shouldn't have caused a problem on its own. Did the heating element actually fail, or did the earth leakage trip cause you to THINK the heating element had failed? Maybe something else happened - did it overheat and damage the 3-way valve seals, or short-out the coil windings, or fuse some wires together???

    If water comes out of the group head with just the water switch on, then a) the wiring to the 3-way is wrong (you say it is OK), or b) the wiring to the 3-way has fused to other wiring causing it to come on at the wrong time, or c) the seals in the 3-way are shot.

    Gonzo

  14. #14
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    Thanks everyone for your replies. I have bit the bullet and sent the machine off to be repaired. I couldn't stand the thought of not having it over the Xmas break.
    Gonzo, I like the way your thinking and was leaning this way myself. My electrician did test the original element and it was shot. I also pulled the solenoid apart and cleaned it and it appeared to be ok to my untrained eye. But I suspect there is something going on with it.
    i will post when I have a diagnosis from the tech. Thanks again everyone
    smokey likes this.

  15. #15
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    Well got my machine back a couple of days before xmas. It now has a new solenoid coil.
    It also has a new PID and pressure gauge which I had ordered before the solenoid died. Installed it all on xmas day and now producing the most consistently good shots i've ever had. I've been playing with the temp and am amazed at the difference it makes to the taste

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Brisbane,QLD
    Posts
    113
    Great outcome! What temp are you running the boiler at?

  17. #17
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    Still playing with it. At the moment 105 at the start of the shot, it drops to 102 by the end of the shot, 25 sec.
    it was preset at 103 and at 105 I'm getting a lot more of the chocolate taste
    i also insulated the boiler, top of the group and steam pipe

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Brisbane,QLD
    Posts
    113
    Wow that seems pretty stable! I use mine around 104-106 and I'm sure its under 100 by the end of a shot.

    What did you use to insulate it? I've been looking around for stuff but unable to find an affordable and easy option.

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    183
    Yeah, mine dips to around 98 by the end of a 25 sec shot. INterested to see what you've done

  20. #20
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    20
    I used a closed cell silicone foam. I bought it as a pre cut kit with the PID and pressure gauge from a site in the US. This guy was very helpful and even sent me extra pieces of insulation for the top of the boiler as I changed the boiler after he had sent the first lot and the new boiler was slightly different shape. He didn't charge anything for this and did it because he thought it would look better



Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •