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Thread: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

  1. #1
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    E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    The E61 lever group is the most popular group on the more serious machines yet most Aussies consume milk based drinks so why the popularity of the E61 lever which you have to manually turn to stop the pour. With volumetric once the volume is set one just needs to adjust the grinder so the pour stops within 25-30 seconds, the machine looks after the pour while the barista is steaming the milk.
    The E61 lever is heavy lump of brass with a preinfusion chamber and a gicleur, but the E61 solenoid group is the top half, it also has a gicleur for flow control and if combined with the ramp up characteristics of a vibe pump wouldnt that suffice for preinfusion, is there that much difference in the quality of the espresso between the two groups?
    OK theres more to go wrong with volumetrics and E61 levers do look the goods but it just seems strange to me people buy HX and DB machines that can steam and pour at the same time yet nobble it by hanging a manual group off it.
    I have singled out the E61 lever and solenoid groups because they a so similar but of course there are other groups LaSpaz comes to mind but the E61 type of group is the most popular.
    Just to fill you in on where Im coming from I recently participated in a barista course, continuous quantities of milk based drinks were produced on the commercial machines, I now look at volumetric dosing in a whole new light.

  2. #2
    brett230873
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    The reason I chose E61 Lever as opposed to Volumetric was because the Lever was and is IMHO so very sexy. I love it an wonder what I did before I had it. Personal preference is a powerful motivating force and very often a habitual yet unquantifiable element.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Coffee2Di4's Avatar
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    I, too, went for an E61 because it was recommended, but went for the lever arrangement purely based on looks and the more manual feel of it.

    I seriously consdered the Diadema Jr Plus before getting the Maver, and - had I gone down this route - would have gone for the DJR+ with the lever, even though the volumetric was available and slightly cheaper.

    Whilst not much of a comparison, I had a semi automatic volumetric in the Sunbeam, but always used the manual button because I prefer to watch my pour and how it is progressing, rather than letting it do its thing whilst I steam my milk.

    I figure that while Im only pulling shots at home and not in a heavy traffic cafe environment pumping out the coffees at a frantic pace (although I can get very frantic for a coffee in the morning!), what does it hurt to take it at a slower pace and pay my shots the due and proper attention.

    And I havent regretted it for a second - I still love watching the pour: its one of my favourite forms of entertainment!

    Cheers
    Di

  4. #4
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    Even if a volumetric pad is available I still cut my shots my self. This keeps me on my "A Game". It forces you to look at/check each and every shot while it is pouring (and not to become lazy and let the machine cut the shot). It is easy to steam milk with one hand and cut your shot with the other.
    If you go manual over volumetric: there are less electronics to fail, they do look better (if that is important to you) and they cost quite a bit less.

    My preferred set up is a manual machine with a chronos feature (shot timer).


  5. #5
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    My preferred set up is a manual machine with a chronos feature (shot timer).
    Hey thats what Ive got Silvia with PID/shot timer :)

  6. #6
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    Id be watching each shot to get the optimum pull anyway, so the only thing a volumetric would save would be the lever movement, but would add a button press. :D

    I drive a manual transmission car too, and ride a manual tranny motorcyle--all for the sense of control and the fun that manuals provide.

    Greg

  7. #7
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Re: E61 Lever or Volumetric which is better?

    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Quote Originally Posted by 6A757F6E737D71796E1C0 link=1252041420/0#0 date=1252041420
    The E61 lever is *heavy lump of brass with a preinfusion chamber and a gicleur, but the E61 solenoid group is the top half, it also has a gicleur for flow control and *if combined with the ramp up characteristics of a vibe pump wouldnt that suffice for preinfusion
    I just prefer the Leva Group because of its simplicity but can see advantages in opting for the Volumetric/Electric Solenoid version.

    I believe that there is more than one version of the E-61 Electric Solenoid Group out there though. Most of them have the Solenoid Valve mounted on the underside of the Group Head and do away with the Pre-Infusion Chamber. I have seen some though (on the Net), that use a Group that is almost identical to the Manual Group in that a Solenoid Actuator is mounted where the Leva Shaft normally sits and operates the mechanism in an almost identical fashion to the Leva. I havent got a clue as to whether these are available here in Oz though....

    Quote Originally Posted by 6A757F6E737D71796E1C0 link=1252041420/0#0 date=1252041420
    is there that much difference in the quality of the espresso between the two groups?
    With a Vibe Pump, I doubt it but with a Rotary Pump and their inherent capacity to deliver much greater flow volumes, I imagine the pressure build-up profile will be quite a bit steeper unless great attention is paid to the gicleur size... This would apply to manual Leva Groups too I would imagine, where Rotary Pumps are used.

    Quote Originally Posted by 6A757F6E737D71796E1C0 link=1252041420/0#0 date=1252041420
    OK theres more to go wrong with volumetrics and E61 levers do look the goods but it just seems strange to me people buy HX and DB machines that can steam and pour at the same time yet nobble it by hanging a manual group off it.
    This hasnt been an issue for me vr with either the Bezzera or my new DJE.... My manual dexterity is severely depleted but even so, I am able to pull shots and texture milk at the same time with either machine (the Bezz is also a manual machine but not an E-61). Most times, I finish texturing the milk before the shot is completed and even if it beats me, Im standing right there and its a simple matter to reach across and flip the leva down.

    I think youre seeing problems where none exist mate, to be honest.... ;)

    Mal.



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