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Thread: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

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    Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Talk Coffee has just added the espresso parts precision baskets which are apparently laser cut. Id love to hear some reports from users as to how they compare to the VST, Synesso and others, as they are cheaper than both. Welcome any kind of technical, measured, anecdotal etc thoughts.
    Thanks!

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    To address the inevitable whats the difference? question upfront, these are not VST baskets any more than the Chinese rip-offs of the our Barista tamper are the real deal. Every basket, VST included, has variations in hole size and shape no matter how its made. Once manufactured, VST baskets are imaged in high resolution to check hole size / shape / consistency (this data is used to produce the spec sheet supplied with each VST basket) and yes some VSTs do get rejected. This is a slower and more expensive process than just manufacturing and shipping but its what ensures perfect consistency basket to basket which is the whole reason VST baskets were made. As thats all a patented process you can be certain no other baskets get that, meaning theres no more guarantee of consistent performance than there is with any other basket.

    For 1/3 of the price these units may well suit some people so it will be very interesting to hear what the results are. Some VST users have found their technique doesnt lend itself to good results from VST baskets so some of those may drift towards these units. But dont for a moment be under any illusion theyre the same thing as a VST.

    Hopefully this will answer the obvious questions upfront and the rest of the thread can focus on the in-the-cup differences.

    Greg

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 524750524540595958545B350 link=1333414508/1#1 date=1333415945
    To address the inevitable whats the difference? question upfront, these are not VST baskets any more than the Chinese rip-offs of the our Barista tamper are the real deal. Every basket, VST included, has variations in hole size and shape no matter how its made. Once manufactured, VST baskets are imaged in high resolution to check hole size / shape / consistency (this data is used to produce the spec sheet supplied with each VST basket) and yes some VSTs do get rejected. This is a slower and more expensive process than just manufacturing and shipping but its what ensures perfect consistency basket to basket which is the whole reason VST baskets were made. As thats all a patented process you can be certain no other baskets get that, meaning theres no more guarantee of consistent performance than there is with any other basket.

    For 1/3 of the price these units may well suit some people so it will be very interesting to hear what the results are. Some VST users have found their technique doesnt lend itself to good results from VST baskets so some of those may drift towards these units. But dont for a moment be under any illusion theyre the same thing as a VST.

    Hopefully this will answer the obvious questions upfront and the rest of the thread can focus on the in-the-cup differences.

    Greg
    Absolutely Greg,

    We added them to our range because theyre not VST.

    I am on record as not being a fan of the VST- in fact I sold my final 7? of them for $100 and was glad to see the back of them. I would personally take a Synesso any day, any time. Love the visual quality of the VST, but it ends there for me. Its a horses for courses argument. :-?

    These suit my style far better and I nailed a pour on #1 attempt. I have continued to do the same today- triple or double. Rather than hard sell them, people can buy one if they choose and come to their own decisions.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    No problems with any of that, as I said they may well suit some people. Theyre obviously a copy so as in any comparison where two visually similar products are vastly different in price, people are naturally going to want to know the difference. Hence my explanation of such.

    Im not surprised to hear theyre easier to drive than the VSTs but I suspect the same would be true for many traditional baskets including the Synesso. Those are more forgiving than VSTs because they hide more flaws, simple as that. Some people are fine with that and are happy with the shots, others like to know about the problems and fix them. Both views are fine. As Ive always said at the end of the day the person drinking the coffee has to decide what suits them. Its not up to us to try to force either of them to change, but simply for people to be educated about what theyre using and then make their own decision as to what suits their needs. Our only responsibility is to make sure that education is accurate so people know how a rip-off differs from the real thing and can decide if thats important to them.

    As an aside I have big ethical issues with someone selling a rip-off of a product someone else has worked hard to develop, but thats a separate argument to this discussion.

    Greg

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 2732252730352C2C2D212E400 link=1333414508/3#3 date=1333423905
    Im not surprised to hear theyre easier to drive than the VSTs but I suspect the same would be true for many traditional baskets including the Synesso. Those are more forgiving than VSTs because they hide more flaws, simple as that.
    Without wishing to turn this thread into a theoretical debate, thats an extremely difficult argument to support. Its sadly consistent with the sort of spin and hype that has surrounded the marketing of VST baskets and has lead to widespread debate about such claims both here and on public forums like HB.

    Making a sweeping statement that most products work better and are more forgiving because they hide more flaws is counter intuitive at best.

    No one doubts the fact that VST baskets have holes that are made to a higher precision with regard to individual sizing and distribution on the basket, what is very much in doubt is whether that has any empirical effect on pour quality and taste.

    The thinly veiled implied suggestion that these baskets are nothing but a cheap chinese copy - while arguing that this is why they are more forgiving to use - is one I am not comfortable with.

    Ultimately anything that delivers more choice to consumers would seem to me to be a positive, its really up to us as consumers to test the marketing and see whether or not we find the claims for products are reproducible for us.

    Personally my experience is that there are far greater gains to be found in the cup in areas other than basket selection, and usually more cost effective as well - improving ones technique is pretty cheap!

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 637661637471686869656A040 link=1333414508/3#3 date=1333423905
    Theyre obviously a copy....
    As are Swift, VST, Synesso et al baskets- all are attempts to improve on the original. Just like evolutions of tampers be they the first of a particular style or subsequent "copies".

    Quote Originally Posted by 7E6B7C7E696C7575747877190 link=1333414508/3#3 date=1333423905
    Those are more forgiving than VSTs because they hide more flaws
    Or perhaps because they present a far larger bullseye.* :-?

    Quote Originally Posted by 485D4A485F5A4343424E412F0 link=1333414508/3#3 date=1333423905
    As an aside I have big ethical issues with someone selling a rip-off of a product someone else has worked hard to develop, but thats a separate argument to this discussion.
    100% out of line.* >:(

    In the interests of not turning this thread into a sh!tfight, might I suggest that we revert to my first suggestion Greg. Let the consumer decide. As for being a Chinese ripoff, these are different baskets and for me, and a quite a few people I admire, do the job.

    Lastly, I know a damn good shot from a bad one and to suggest that a basket might mask flaws is utter BS. Ill leave this for the mods to pull. Hopefully they will take your posts as well. I have read enough rubbish today. ::)

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Hi Galumay,

    This thread is about how people have found the results from those baskets. I merely explained the differences between them. Theres a lot more Id like to say about these but am not permitted to do so so if you choose to disagree thats fine. I stand by my comments and I believe in time theyll be shown to be accurate.

    I repeat from my earlier post what you repeated in yours, that at the end of the day each person can choose what they want to use.

    Quote Originally Posted by 787E736A727E661F0 link=1333414508/4#4 date=1333427692

    Making a sweeping statement that most products work better and are more forgiving because they hide more flaws is counter intuitive at best.
    My comment was in the context of baskets, it wasnt a sweeping statement about most products. And I didnt say more forgiving products worked better either. Products that are more forgiving are generally so because they require less of the operator, but they rarely give the same quality of results as something requiring more operator skill. The operator decides whats important to them and chooses accordingly. We make this application every day to super-auto machines vs manual machines, and even to pressurised baskets; I dont see why its so hard here. But again feel free to choose whichever path youre happy with.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Seems this is an emotive little subject, I hadnt quite reckoned on such strong feeling on the subject. Quite happy for it to be deleted / closed / whatevered if someone wants to but the questions only going to be asked again by someone else.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    FYI
    when dealing with Espresso Parts, make sure you get the product or the money back.
    Sounds like common sense but dealing with Espresso Parts is far from that.

    I have had difficult dealings with them.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    If I were to buy them Id get them from a local importer and reccome d that others do so as well - partly cause theyll be cheaper with postage but also for ease.

    I didnt want this thread to turn into a brawl.
    VST did a great job with their workmanship, some people like the results in the cup, some prefer Synesso et al. The espresso parts baskets dont look like a VST imposter to me, more like the love child of a VST and a Synesso, trying to take the best of both worlds. And thats the purpose of the thread - users opinions on whether or not what ends up in the cup is worth it compared to ALL other baskets theyve used, not just against the VST.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 4864676265545C0B0 link=1333414508/8#8 date=1333433554
    FYI
    when dealing with Espresso Parts, make sure you get the product or the money back.
    Sounds like common sense but dealing with Espresso Parts is far from that.

    I have had difficult dealings with them.
    So far, I have had only good dealings with them. The plus is that these baskets are coming in bulk to Australia. Supplies of these are via site sponsor Bombora, so they will no doubt be more widely available*as more sponsors order them.

    Why are we doing it? I asked Bernard for a good ridgeless alternative to Synesso a few months ago. This is the result.

    We got the heads up and ordered before they were officially available and received stock yesterday. The first lot shipped today and we receive more tomorrow.

    I hope users will take control of this thread once they receive them and I look forward to reading opinions of owners, not retailers. ;)

    Chris

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 7B4E4344706C4049494A4A2F0 link=1333414508/10#10 date=1333438329
    Why are we doing it? I asked Bernard for a good ridgeless alternative to Synesso a few months ago.
    Just out of interest, why do we need an alternative to Synesso baskets.

    This whole VST debate just makes me nauseated. I can appreciate both sides of the argument - and I will qualify by saying I havent used one. But Chris point is a valid one. Whilst as coffeesnobs we always strive to do our best and improve things ie were all anally retentive. The question must be asked "after all the effort of ensuring an ABSOLUTE PRECISION grind, dose, distribution and tamp for the VST to produce a flawless pour and then cross our fingers and pray to god that we can repeat the process flawlessly again for our next shot - at the end of the day IS IT NOTICEABLE IN THE CUP?? Greg I would hope that after all that effort in perfecting technique there is actually some objective improvement in the cup??? Is there? Or does slight operator variability between shots render the accuracy of the VST useless? No matter how much we would like to be like robots when preparing our shots its not always possible.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 52555E5E554444300 link=1333414508/11#11 date=1333449976
    ust out of interest, why do we need an alternative to Synesso baskets.
    Thats an easy one bennet, so Ill grab it for you.

    Bernards a great guy and I like doing business with him. I choose Bombora over other businesses where I could get Synesso. My Synessos are a bit rough in that there are holes where I cant see daylight. The Espresso parts ones are better finished. Yes, I could get a stick, but no, I cant be bothered!

    I have no issues with a laser being used to do that job for me and thats not copying, its just common sense given that the technology exists.

    I have seen the Coffeelab copied and then the Bogav too- but then they probably copied aspects of other earlier examples. Baskets are no different.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 1025282F1B072B22222121440 link=1333414508/12#12 date=1333450483
    Quote Originally Posted by 52555E5E554444300 link=1333414508/11#11 date=1333449976
    ust out of interest, why do we need an alternative to Synesso baskets.
    My Synessos are a bit rough in that there are holes where I cant see daylight.
    Id agree Chris. Many baskets out there have this problem so if theres a basket that will at least give all open holes consistently thats a good start and one reason to consider changing.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 4C4B40404B5A5A2E0 link=1333414508/11#11 date=1333449976
    The question must be asked "after all the effort of ensuring an ABSOLUTE PRECISION grind, dose, distribution and tamp for the VST to produce a flawless pour and then cross our fingers and pray to god that we can repeat the process flawlessly again for our next shot...

    Or does slight operator variability between shots render the accuracy of the VST useless? No matter how much we would like to be like robots when preparing our shots its not always possible.
    Its not rocket science, it doesnt take absolute precision, microbalance, electron microscope and other hyperbolae. Ive never used any of those in my VST setup and get excellent shots. It just needs a good technique thats repeatable and a preparedness to improve that technique if necessary (if the technique is already right for these baskets it may not need any refinement at all). Youll actually find plenty in the VST thread mentioning this but they dont make so much noise as those who have had difficulties so it tends to go unnoticed.

    Quote Originally Posted by 4C4B40404B5A5A2E0 link=1333414508/11#11 date=1333449976
    - at the end of the day IS IT NOTICEABLE IN THE CUP?? Greg I would hope that after all that effort in perfecting technique there is actually some objective improvement in the cup??? Is there?
    Absolutely. Tested and verified. Again this is in the VST thread but spend 10 minutes of your life reading http://coffeegeek.com/opinions/markprince/04-29-2011 and much of what you (and others) have asked will be answered. He had initial problems, he took some humbling advice and changed his technique and started seeing results that stood up to a number of blind taste testers.

    Those who find VSTs too hard to use would strongly empathise with the first part of the article. I just hope they spend the extra five minutes to read the rest of the article and take the advice themselves.

    Greg

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 322730322520393938343B550 link=1333414508/14#14 date=1333505450
    Those who find VSTs too hard to use
    I didnt find my 18g VST hard to use, however I prefer my La Marzocco, results in the cup were very similar, the LM knocks out cleaner and is easier to remove from my PF. :)

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    I have 2x 18g EP baskets.
    Also have VST and Synesso.

    I swap between VST and Synesso baskets.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 5874777275444C1B0 link=1333414508/16#16 date=1333533811
    I have 2x 18g EP baskets.
    Also have VST and Synesso.

    I swap between VST and Synesso baskets.
    Does this mean you dont like the EP baskets? How do you find they compare to the VST and Synesso?

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Been a while since I used them actually. They came with some stuff I bought from EP about 9mths ago.

    Ill get one out and have a play with it tommorow.

    If I remember correctly I put it away as a silent protest to the terrible service I received, even after spending quite a bit of coin with them

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Ok so Ive just had a good look over and some shots through each Synesso, VST and the EP* baskets. All sold as 18g baskets
    I was limited to the amount of coffee I have on stock and was planning on grabbing some more today, but alas Easter is on us and the local roaster is closed.

    Visuals
    VST- is clearly the winner in this stake, looks the best with all holes evenly spaced and yes you pay extra for that.
    Synesso- My synesso is a few years old and looks it. That aside, the holes closer to the edge are inconsistently punched with some not at all. some unevenly spaced holes. Not bad tho, same as my LM basket.
    EP basket- was surprised to find some holes were not punched through. Evenly spaced though.

    All three baskets are different shape with the VST being the most vertical and smaller radius on the bottom, Synesso has the most angle on the sides. The EP basket was more vertical than the Synesso but has a much larger radius on the bottom.

    Taste (remembering that I had limited coffee and didnt get the best from the shots, but I believe I got the idea)
    Using a Mocha Java style blend* I had enough for a few shots each. A blend of Ethiopian, Colombian, PNG and Guatemalan coffees. 13 days post roast.

    Synesso basket- I think this style of blend suits the synesso basket best. Nice choc/caramel notes. 19 grams in 35 gram shot in 27 sec at 92deg is the sweet spot for me.

    VST basket- I think this basket suits the brighter coffees best, for me its what I use for SOs that are fruity or acidic eg berry, apple, citrus etc. With the coffee I had, it highlighted the brighter notes in the blend, the Ethiopian and Colombian brightness for me dominated the cup muting the choc notes of the blend. As usual had to grind finer with this basket and dose needs to be a little more compared to the synesso, or you get sloppy pucks. didnt quite get the best from this but needed the coffee for the EP basket.

    EP basket- Similar grind and dose to the VST basket, a little larger than the synesso. Similar flavors to the VST basket but perhaps not quite as bright and slightly flatter. Didnt quite get the best from this basket either but ran out of coffee. I did achieve a similar shot the the VST though so Id say it is comparable.

    So my preference is still the Synesso for a Mocha Java style coffee, and Ill still stick with the VST for the SOs I have that are brighter. I guess that means for me at least the EP basket will go back into the box for now.

    Everyone has different palates and preferences, Id say the EP basket is worth a try if you like to play with more variables to find your god shot. Its not difficult to use, but I havent found any of the baskets hard, just different. Keep in mind the dose and grind will probably change when you change baskets.

    I hope you appreciate that I will now be without coffee for probably 3 days as I have none :(, even if I roasted my own it wouldnt be ready, will have to see if other roasters are open this weekend in Brisbane :o

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 517D7E7B7C4D45120 link=1333414508/19#19 date=1333779954
    EP basket- was surprised to find some holes were not punched through. Evenly spaced though.
    Sounds like you might have received a dud from EP Ronin.* :-?

    FWIW, we have close on 100 of them and I have checked every single one today. Not a closed hole to be seen. They all look pretty good to the naked eye.

    I have been using them in the GS/3 and now in our Alex Duetto demo which has come home to stand in for it (its dead....again ::)) and I like the results in the cup.

    Our intention is to keep them on range.

    Chris

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Id say I got 2 duds there Chris.
    Both baskets are missing holes which in my experience with lasers (not much but I have used them) is a faulty laser or programming.

    Ive also received other duds from EP but I will never again receive anything from them. I hope your dealings with them are better than mine and others Ive heard of.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 1935363334050D5A0 link=1333414508/21#21 date=1333921145
    Id say I got 2 duds there Chris.
    Both baskets are missing holes which in my experience with lasers (not much but I have used them) is a faulty laser or programming.

    Ive also received other duds from EP but I will never again receive anything from them. I hope your dealings with them are better than mine and others Ive heard of.
    Yep- sure sounds like it Ronin :(

    Ill leave it to Bernard to deal with them ;)

    Cheers

    C

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Ronin, I assume you contacted EPNW about this? I appreciate your frustration but not every vendor monitors every forum and should be given an opportunity to address a problem via direct contact.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    They are fully aware of the problems Ive had Greg. They have had over 9 mths of regular contact (bi-weekly) and I was more than helpful on my end IMOP. Waiting for things that have been paid for and even having trouble getting a refund after 9 mths proved to be an issue in itself. Difficult for me to understand when a client has spent money but not received the goods, not a small transaction either.

    The main issue was not with these baskets though but is only a secondary issue.

    I will say again that the baskets themselves are worth a try. Ill not be getting rid of them and will prob take them to work at some point to fix the holes and try them again.

    Im not trying to turn people off using Espresso Parts, just asking people to be wary.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    All good. Sometimes people experience a difficulty with a vendor and vent on a forum but dont give the manufacturer / retailer the opportunity to hear about and then fix the problem. Ive even read comments along the lines of "Im surprised XYZ hasnt bothered to address the concerns in this thread" on other forums, when chances are they dont even know it exists! Sounds like youve dotted all the Is and crossed all the Ts. The fact the problem took that long to resolve is a concern though.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    So far, we have not received a single defective basket.

    If we should, it will be returned, not shipped!

    Chris

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Gday all,

    We have a quite a few of these out in the field. Keen to get some more out there for some more comments- be they good or bad.

    The first 3 CSers who PM with name and delivery details* can have a pair (double and triple) on the house- on the condition that you you promise to add to this thread with your comments.

    Cheers

    Chris

    Done and dusted. All 3 sets are now spoken for.

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 1A2F2225110D2128282B2B4E0 link=1333414508/27#27 date=1334988770
    Gday all,

    We have a quite a few of these out in the field. Keen to get some more out there for some more comments- be they good or bad.

    The first 3 CSers who PM with name and delivery details* can have a pair (double and triple) on the house- on the condition that you you promise to add to this thread with your comments.

    Cheers

    Chris

    Done and dusted. All 3 sets are now spoken for.
    Thanks Chris,

    I was one of the three lucky ones, just happened to be logged on at the right time.
    Looking forward to giving the baskets a test drive. :)

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Received my EP baskets courtesy of Chris this morning.
    At first glance they look very nicely finished with all holes present and correct.
    Immediately pressed the double into service and without going into detail at this stage my first shot with it (a long black made my way) was spot on.
    Will post more about them over the next week or so. :)

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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    I, too, was the lucky receiver of the two baskets from Talk Coffee (thanks, Chris!)

    They arrived on Tuesday, just in time to have a good play with them over the next five days, as I managed to score a couple of days leave after ANZAC Day.

    The first thing I did, of course, was to check the holes on both baskets and I was impressed. Every single hole was punched through on both baskets and extremely uniform - a much better job than was on my Musica baskets. After using them for five days straight, none of the holes have clogged up so far.

    One of the reasons I put my hand up for the baskets was because Id discovered that, when I sold my Maver and it was picked up, Pete had managed to give away the Synesso (or was it a VST?) ridgeless that I got with my Pullman Tamper, as well as my blind! >:( but I hadnt quite got around to replacing it, so saw this as a good win/win solution. For those that ask why it made much of an impact, it is because I find that pucks knock out so much more cleanly with a ridgeless basket, and I missed not having to wipe out the basket to get rid of leftover grinds - just a quick rinse under the tap and away I go!

    I have noticed that I need to grind a bit finer than I did with the NS baskets by one full turn on the Macap - not sure why? Maybe finer holes so more pressure build up? The coffee does come out nice and syrupy, though and seems to be less aerated than from the NS baskets.

    As far as in the cup goes, I havent noticed any major discernable difference, but I guess my pallete isnt as well honed as some peoples may be in that regard. To my way of thinking, to get an accurate comparison, youd have to go to great lengths to ensure everything was exactly the same for two side by side coffees and, with having to adjust the grinder, this would be nigh on impossible - particularly with two rugrats distracting you!

    So, in a nutshell, I have to say that I would have been more than happy to pay the money for these baskets and definitely wouldnt have been disappointed when theyd turned up.

    Much, much better than the supplied NS baskets, thats for sure, particularly when it comes to clean up time!

    Cheers
    Di

  32. #32
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Ive been using and comparing all three of my 18 gram baskets (EP, LaMarzocco and VST) over the past week, the EP and VST are nicely finished and the LM is a little industrial but to be quite honest there is very little between them when it comes to whats in the cup, I would be quite happy using any one of them, however having said that my preference is still for the LM, only because it knocks out cleaner and easier than either the EP or VST.
    As far as choosing between the EP and VST! there is very little between them, toss a coin. :)

  33. #33
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Well I was the lucky last to get in on Chris generous offer and I am the last to post my initial thoughts as per the deal. Ive been a tad busy with work and life in general so havent used the double a great deal and havent yet touched the triple.

    I should also point out that I dont have a lot of experience, having only ventured into the wonderful world of making good coffee around August last year. However, I was keen to take up the offer from Chris as I had been keeping an interest in the various discussions on CS around the various precision baskets and wondered if theyd make a difference for someone like me.

    My final disclaimer is that in my play with the EP baskets so far, I have also changed a couple of other variables from my normal routine including the use of a naked portafilter and a new (to me) Behmor-roasted bean.

    Ive probably highlighted all these disclaimers up front because the end result for me has so far been no discernible change. Ive actually found the double basket (dont use the single) that came with my Rocket Giotto Evo quite good (as compared to the tamp that came with it) and Ive become familiar with it. This familiarity can only come with practice and Im sure it will be the same with the EP baskets, or any other basket for that matter.

    My assessment is if you like to try new things or you have crappy baskets then an EP basket is a pretty inexpensive bit of kit that may provide you with some joy. However, if your coffees are crap now and you think that a new basket will magically solve your problems then you might need to think again!

  34. #34
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Thanks Jon., Di and xpanner for taking the time to reply in this thread. Im glad that youre experimenting and having fun. Do add any further comments f you feel so inclined.

    Seems they are doing well. Bernard aka Mr Bombora mentioned at MICE that the first shipment sold out in days and he had placed an order for more.

    I have continued to use mine and they have displaced the baskets in my LM at home as well.

    What I was looking for was a ridgeless basket that was better than my Synesso. I am happy that I have found one which suits a variety of dosing strategies and styles and is inclined to forgive rather than penalise. They also fit my Bogav tampers really well.

  35. #35
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    I should state first that I have never used a Synesso nor VST, so I wont comment on comparisons between the performance of those against the EP.

    Got an EP basket from Chris yesterday, and had a play this morning.* Compared it against the light, the holes definitely look very consistent, cant spot any differences by eye.* The VBM basket I have on the other hand, though all punched through, I can already spot by eye a couple of holes that appear smaller than the rest.* The finish of the EP basket is beautiful compared to the VBM though.* I am guessing in therms of polished stainless steel, 180 grit finish on the side walls and 240-360 grit finish on the rest of the basket (no measuring instruments, just guessing).* Read: very nice finish.

    Wont be able to say this too without being accused of biasedness - it fits my tamper very well.* The new Assassins are machined to 58.5 rather than 58.3 and its perfect.* Any 58.5 tampers from other brands will do the same.* Dont know what future batches will be like though, depending if the internal diameter of the basket is part of the precision in the EP baskets.* Having said that, seeing that the holes do not go all the way to the edges of the basket, to a certain extent, I dont believe you need a snug tamper to make this basket work; the risk of channeling is reduced by the positioning of the holes itself.* Also love the straight walls and ridgeless, as this means your tamp will always be pressing on your puck rather than bottoming out on the tapering walls of the basket.* An essential feature if you have tampers machined larger than 58.0mm.*

    Now the important bit: in the cup.* Pulled three shots of double ristretto: 1) EP, 2) VBM, 3) EP.* All shots poured nicely, the second and third poured a tiny pinch better, prob because I didnt purge enough before pulling the first shot - old grinds left in the grinder. Did the milk in one jug so its as fair as I can make it, split before pouring into cups.

    Taste wise: I wouldnt say by a mile, but the EP wins on both counts.* 1) & 3) were in my opinion showing floral/spice characteristics a little clearer (Ethiopian Yirgs Special Prep).* 2) was great coffee too, but flavour was slightly clouded compared to 1) & 3).* Will I be able to tell the difference if not compared side by side?* Probably not.* But when done so, there is a difference.

    Did a test on the lovely missus too - she didnt see me pull the shots, had no idea what baskets I used for which shots.* She said 1) & 3) are sweeter and were her picks.* So I dont think it was Placebo paying me a visit. Could it be inconsistencies in my dosing/tamping that by fluke favoured 1) & 3)? Maybe.

    So theres my second crack worth.* Compared to the basic baskets, do I think the extra $3 odd for the EP is worth it?* Absolutely, I wouldnt even blink.* Even if I did fluke it and at the end of the day, it doesnt make a difference in the cup, the finish, the straight walls, and the positioning of the holes alone would be worth it. Would I spend up to $25 odd more to get the Synesso or VST?* At this point, no.* If i get a VST for free and shoot it out against the EP, then I can probably give a fairer conclusion, but at this point, its too much more money.

    Gavin.



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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Hey guys, grabbed 3 of these last week and thought Id share my initial thoughts from working with these over the last 3 days.

    Probably put 20kg through them.* Im using a 3gp Linea, Robur-E, and a super Jolly for Single Origins and Unleaded. No preinfusion, medium roast espresso blend that usually displays heaps of sweetness, dry cocoa and some lovely sharp fruit notes in the background.


    I changed to the ridgeless Synesso baskets a few months ago simply because I felt the massive inner ridge caused some channeling, and there was I believe a definite increase in consistency.*

    The Espresso Parts baskets seem to offer the same level of consistency - but with a few important benefits over the Synessos:

    1) They dont slip out of the PF as easily as the Synesso baskets.* (No more digging in the knock in the knock tube)

    2) They seem to be more solid.* The Synessos would get battered quite easily.* This metal seems tougher.

    3) The cluster of holes is packed a little bit closer to the centre.* I use naked PFs, and I feel this is an advantage when making double piccs or machs or rists etc - the initial drips from the outside of the basket are less likely to miss or dirty the cup - this saves me time so I dont need to hold the cup so high, I can dose the next shot while watching the pour.

    4) I can get more coffee in em. Using the Mazzer timer - I had to add about 10% more to the dose to acheive a similar pour...and a similiarly full basket.* (Note that I reckon you can get about 10% more again in the standard ridged triple baskets that all site sponsers sell). NOTE: I have not weighed the doses - I just went by the doser number and by feel.

    IN THE CUP:* Most importantly there is no real change in the flavour for my customers.* *The extra few grams of coffee adds a bit of length to the shot, and I think there may be a bit more BODY in the espresso...but the flavour profile is still the same(As you might expect - after all, these are just holes we are talking about...right* ;) )

    Overall, these are really good solid baskets, they surprised me - I would never go back to the Ridged or the Synessos.

    Ill update again next week after a bit more testing ....Ill try some other familiar origins through these and I will also slip the old baskets in for comparison during quiet times too.






  37. #37
    Senior Member argus's Avatar
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Are any Sydney based sponsors stocking these baskets?

  38. #38
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Quote Originally Posted by 1E253A222F384A0 link=1333414508/35#35 date=1339666894
    IN THE CUP:* Most importantly there is no real change in the flavour for my customers.* *The extra few grams of coffee adds a bit of length to the shot, and I think there may be a bit more BODY in the espresso...but the flavour profile is still the same(As you might expect - after all, these are just holes we are talking about...right** )
    Correct you are Topher. We are not going to tell you that they will turn water into wine, coffee into vodka or any other such waffle. They are just a really good, high-quality ridgeless basket produced to a better standard than Synesso. No more, no less and no PhD required. They are very easy to use.


    Quote Originally Posted by 3122372523500 link=1333414508/36#36 date=1339737390
    Are any Sydney based sponsors stocking these baskets?
    Hi Argus- as far as I know, were the only sponsor selling them at this point. $36 will get you a double and a triple via overnight express post- about line ball with the price of one of the others- before you factor in the cost of post.

  39. #39
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Here is my take.
    I have now had one of these baskets (triple) for 3 days, and have pulled roughly 20 shots on the Silvia.
    So far, I have to give it a huge nod of approval.
    My reasoning for needing one of these baskets was for the ridgeless form. I have been suspecting the ridge in my prior triple basket for causing the odd channeling (possibly me being lazy on occasion), and wanted to put the two side by side to see if I could notice anything.

    So far, not one puck has shown channeling, and I am pleased with the results.
    Here is a couple of todays extractions.





  40. #40
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    Re: Espresso Parts Precision Baskets

    Been using the 21g EP baskets on our LM at work and loving them. Weve put our Synesso and VST baskets in storage for a nap. We tested a single EP for a week on our naked and it was heaven to use. Our espresso has improved since we made the switch.
    Ive got an 18g EP at home for my Minore also 8-)

  41. #41
    Senior Member specialpants's Avatar
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    Just wanted to add to this. I've used a few different baskets over the past year. The relevant ones for the purposes of this discussion include:

    Stock E61 basket
    Breville BES900 basket
    Espresso Part Double
    VST 18g ridge & ridgeless
    Synesso Double


    In short, I cant tell the difference in results in the cup. And here's my thoughts on the following aspects:

    In terms of look: VST ridgeless; the EP basket be next on the list - it would have been nicer to see more holes in the EP basket.
    In terms of build quality: VST wins here, followed closely by Breville & EP in no particular order. Synesso would probably be last on this list - rough finish, holes around the edge arent fully punched in etc.
    In terms of ease of use: Synesso + Stock E61

  42. #42
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    My new machine is a Quick Mill Achille 0996 which has been (surprisingly) a witch to tame. With standard double basket installed, shots were restricted to 16 gm or less of grounds. Shots EXTREMELY sensitive to bed preparation, light tamping and especially levelling. After a week or so of continually re-inventing basket preparation using trial and error to prevent channelling, I was getting a good shot most of the time. Not as good as a Cremina will deliver however.

    I have been using an EP double basket in my new machine for almost a week now. I now prepare the EP basket in the Achille the same way that I do with my Linea. 18 gm...tamp N,S,E and West... level and a hearty tamp straight on...ensure it is level...pre-infuse for 12 seconds...tigerstripe GOLD...every time.

    Nothing else has changed...just the basket. I bought a second for my Linea but haven't tried it yet...too busy loving the magic from the Achille.

    I find it hard to believe that a simple basket has been the missing part of this puzzle for me...for this machine...but it has.

    Thoroughly recommended by this user!

  43. #43
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    Glad you're happy Paolo,

    We make no promises for the baskets other than that they are a really well made ridgeless basket with very even hole sizes.

    What I do know is that they certainly don't make getting a perfect cup any harder than it needs to be. I have found them exceptionally forgiving and suitable for a broad spectrum of dosing techniques.

    I hope you continue to enjoy your new baskets.

    Chris

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Glad you're happy Paolo,

    We make no promises for the baskets other than that they are a really well made ridgeless basket with very even hole sizes.

    What I do know is that they certainly don't make getting a perfect cup any harder than it needs to be. I have found them exceptionally forgiving and suitable for a broad spectrum of dosing techniques.

    I hope you continue to enjoy your new baskets.

    Chris
    VERY happy Chris! Over a week with the new basket now and shots just keep getting better and better. Tigerstipes and lots of crema every time. As I get to know the Achille I am experimenting with pre-infusion here and there and can honestly say that since the new basket I have pulled an excellent shot each time without exception.

    They are a very forgiving basket that should be included with every Quick Mill Achille 0996 sold IMHO. Best money I could have spent to raise standard of shots from unpredictable to exemplary...they are only $13 each!!!

  45. #45
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    Just put an order in for a pair of these...will see how they compare to my 5yo Bezzera baskets :P

  46. #46
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebookfreak58 View Post
    Just put an order in for a pair of these...will see how they compare to my 5yo Bezzera baskets :P
    I found them to be a marked improvement over the baskets supplied by Bezzera.
    matth3wh likes this.

  47. #47
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    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    I like my double and tripple espresso parts precision baskets,I have a selection of different makes of baskets but prefer to use these .



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