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Thread: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

  1. #1
    Flo
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    Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi All! Long time no see!

    A mate of mine has a Rocket Giotto that has an issue with steam pressure during milk stretching. The pressure drops to about 0.4 bar or less.. The pressure was sitting at about 1.2 bar with the machine static (cycling between about 1.0 and 1.2) I adjusted the pressurestat to about 1.3 but it seems to have made little difference when steaming..

    I have an ECM Giotto Premium and mine stays up around 0.9 or 1.0 or such during steaming..

    Anyone?

  2. #2
    TC
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 7E5457380 link=1262000452/0#0 date=1262000452
    Hi All! Long time no see!

    A mate of mine has a Rocket Giotto that has an issue with steam pressure during milk stretching. The pressure drops to about 0.4 bar or less.. The pressure was sitting at about 1.2 bar with the machine static (cycling between about 1.0 and 1.2) I adjusted the pressurestat to about 1.3 but it seems to have made little difference when steaming..

    I have an ECM Giotto Premium and mine stays up around 0.9 or 1.0 or such during steaming..

    Anyone?
    Hi Flo- long time ;)

    Which Giotto? Premium (with or without upgrade) or Premium plus?

  3. #3
    Flo
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Hi Chris (btw..my Giotto is going along just fine!!)

    I dont know exactly which model his is.. Can you point out some differences?

    His machine has the Sirai pressurestat, vibe pump, boiler pressure gauge.. Sorry not much help..

  4. #4
    TC
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 5872711E0 link=1262000452/2#2 date=1262000841
    Hi Chris (btw..my Giotto is going along just fine!!)

    I dont know exactly which model his is.. Can you point out some differences?

    His machine has the Sirai pressurestat, vibe pump, boiler pressure gauge.. Sorry not much help..
    Okey doke.....sounds like a premium plus. The Sirai has a bigger dead band than the Mater fitted to the Premium. It (the Sirai) may go to 0.5 or 0.4 bar on a 900ml jug, but will recover by the time youre ready to pull the next shot.

    If its a very early GPP, they were not wired with 240V to the pressurestat and this can make them slower. Revised wiring was suggested by ECA for the GPP early in the peace and its now recommended for all more recent Giottos running the Proelind control board and those which have been fitted with replacement boards. Id be surprised if the selling dealer hadnt rectified this on a GPP. A mere handful of machines were affected and ECA was onto it immediately.

    The wiring fix is easy and quick and we now upgrade the wiring to send 240V to the pressurestat on every Giotto containing the Proelind we see. Its a small tweak which makes for even better performance and promotes longevity of the control board as well.

    Chris

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 72474A4D79654940404343260 link=1262000452/3#3 date=1262001254
    The Sirai has a bigger dead band than the Mater fitted to the Premium. It (the Sirai) may go to 0.5 or 0.4 bar on a 900ml jug, but will recover by the time youre ready to pull the next shot.
    whats your opinion on the two chris? pros/cons

    cheers mate
    warren

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    TC
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 1C183E2727223D2A254B0 link=1262000452/4#4 date=1262003309
    Quote Originally Posted by 72474A4D79654940404343260 link=1262000452/3#3 date=1262001254
    The Sirai has a bigger dead band than the Mater fitted to the Premium. It (the Sirai) may go to 0.5 or 0.4 bar on a 900ml jug, but will recover by the time youre ready to pull the next shot.
    whats your opinion on the two chris? pros/cons

    cheers mate
    warren
    Sirai pros- longevity, servicability
    Sirai cons- larger proportions and 0.2 bar dead band, more exxy than Mater

    Mater pros- smaller and 0.1 bar dead band
    Mater cons- wont last as long as Sirai and its a chuck out when it fails.

    Both are fine Warren.

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 7C56553A0 link=1262000452/0#0 date=1262000452
    The pressure drops to about 0.4 bar or less.. The pressure was sitting at about 1.2 bar with the machine static (cycling between about 1.0 and 1.2)
    My VBM Junior is doing the same thing. I figured it was because the boiler is <1.5l but, after reading this, Im not so sure. Any ideas?

    Thanks

  8. #8
    Flo
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 192C2126120E222B2B28284D0 link=1262000452/3#3 date=1262001254
    Okey doke.....sounds like a premium plus. The Sirai has a bigger dead band than the Mater fitted to the Premium. It (the Sirai) may go to 0.5 or 0.4 bar on a 900ml jug, but will recover by the time youre ready to pull the next shot. *

    Well it definitely drops that low. It just sounds really breathless. I supposed Im used to my Giotto though. I suggested he get a 300ml jug and see how that goes as he uses a 600ml jug now.



    Quote Originally Posted by 192C2126120E222B2B28284D0 link=1262000452/3#3 date=1262001254
    If its a very early GPP, they were not wired with 240V to the pressurestat and this can make them slower. Revised wiring was suggested by ECA for the GPP early in the peace and its now recommended for all Giottos running the Proelind control board. Id be surprised if the selling dealer hadnt rectified this. A mere handful of machines we affected and ECA was on to it immediately.
    From what I understand the machine was only purchased within the last 4 months or so.. Is there a tell-tale that would indicate that there is 240V going directly to the pressurestat?

    I was also wondering today if it might be that the water level sensor needs to be adjusted?

  9. #9
    TC
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 260C0F600 link=1262000452/7#7 date=1262081223
    Well it definitely drops that low. It just sounds really breathless. I supposed Im used to my Giotto though. I suggested he get a 300ml jug and see how that goes as he uses a 600ml jug now.
    Thats not normal Flo...

    It should handle a 600ml jug easily, but will drop to circa 0.5 bar and then recover straight away. If this isnt the case, I think he should take it back to the selling dealer and check its performance against their demo.

    Chris

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    Flo
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Thanks for that Chris.

    To be fair, once he stops steaming then it does start to recover, but the pressure does decay fairly steadily when the steam is being used. By the time he has stretched using his 600ml it is down below 0.5. I saw it go to zero but that was because the boiler auto-filled adding cool water.

    Is there a reason why the Sirai drops to 0.5 bar?

    Does adjusting the position of the water level sensor in the boiler have any effect in a situation like this?

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Did Flo get a resolution to this? :-?

  12. #12
    kbc
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    I have a 2007 ECM Giotto. Steaming pressure drops to 0.5 bar then stabilises (at 0.5 bar) when steaming with a 900ml jug. It recovers very fast so I dont have a problem with the performance.

  13. #13
    kbc
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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Correction - I heated 600 ml of milk in a 900 ml jug and the pressure dropped to 0.8 bar then stabilised. Plenty of pressure for me :)

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    I have a Giotto Premium Plus and have been watching how it behaves. For heating 600ml of milk, it tends to make its way slowly down to about 0.7, then stays around there for the remainder of the steaming time. It then recovers within around a minute.

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 3C2D3A323E3C3736313A5F0 link=1262000452/13#13 date=1266537432
    For heating 600ml of milk
    is this for 600ml of actual milk in say a 1lt jug or 300-400 in a 600ml jug? theres always confusion when it comes to steaming amounts ;Dlol

    Mine, when i first got it, struggled to steam 600ml of milk in a 1 lt jug, it has got a lot better, i can steam that amount easy now, dont know why :-/, what i tend to do is purge, wait a few seconds till the pressure peaks just before the boiler turns off i hit the steam.......very quick and amazing recovery! i love my GPP! :D

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 4145637A7A7F607778160 link=1262000452/14#14 date=1266540164
    is this for 600ml of actual milk in say a 1lt jug or 300-400 in a 600ml jug?
    This is for 600ml in a 900ml jug.

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    Re: Rocket Giotto steam pressure dropping

    Quote Originally Posted by 7045484F7B674B42424141240 link=1262000452/5#5 date=1262033487
    Quote Originally Posted by 1C183E2727223D2A254B0 link=1262000452/4#4 date=1262003309
    Quote Originally Posted by 72474A4D79654940404343260 link=1262000452/3#3 date=1262001254
    The Sirai has a bigger dead band than the Mater fitted to the Premium. It (the Sirai) may go to 0.5 or 0.4 bar on a 900ml jug, but will recover by the time youre ready to pull the next shot.
    whats your opinion on the two chris? pros/cons

    cheers mate
    warren
    Sirai pros- longevity, servicability
    Sirai cons- larger proportions and 0.2 bar dead band, more exxy than Mater

    Mater pros- smaller and 0.1 bar dead band
    Mater cons- wont last as long as Sirai and its a chuck out when it fails.

    Both are fine Warren.
    Cheers Chris, took me a while to see your reply ;)



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