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Thread: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

  1. #1
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    Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi guys,

    I have been doing a lot of reading and trying to differentiate the different e61 hx machines available. I am wondering if all (or most) e61 hx machines have pre infusion and a flow restrictor? Or is this only on certain models? I get the impression that both of these features is standard on the e61 design but maybe this is not the case as i havent seen these features advertised on the specs of all e61 hx machines.

    Reading some web sites it has been suggested that non-plumbed e61 machines dont utilitise the mid-level lever position for pre infusion, and that perhaps pre infusion on these is electronically controlled.

    Perhaps those with an e61 tank model could do a test by moving the lever to the middle position and seeing how much, if any water comes out.

    If anyone has a definitive answer, let us know.

    Currently I am looking at the Expobar e61 lever, Isomac Tea II, VBM Domobar Junior or even a Bezzera Domus.

  2. #2
    TC
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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Hello Rival.

    I found this one on HB- which may be useful.....

    http://www.home-barista.com/espresso-machines/can-anyone-explain-preinfusion-on-e61-t5472.html

    2mcm

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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    ill do a test when i get home from touch in about an hour mate...... ;)

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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Great link, thanks for that. Seems its probably different in each case (pre infusion) depending on the design.

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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Hello rival81,

    you are asking about an individual manufacturers set up for their models.

    They are all different depending on the manufacturers philosophy.

    In addition individual importers may want the machines they inmport from a manufacturer, to perform in a certain way to accommodate for the market they are to be sold in.

    So even *machines of the same brand and model can be set up differently depending on the market they are being built for or the individual importer.

    Ultimately you dont need to worry about these kinds of "specifications being listed on a pamphlet, because you cant use these kinds of informative specs to compare from one machine or model to another. The only way to do that is to see how a machine peforms in toto in comparison to another. You cant get that from spec sheets.

    I notice our Diadema Junior Plus machine is not on your short list. If you compare it to the others you may find it is "better" for your individual needs or taste in comparison to the others (or not)! It has mechanical pre infusion, and it also has a flow restrictor of a particular size to make it perform in a certain way for our market. The way it performs, the standard of design and build, ease of use, size or build of drip tray, are all realistic ways of comparing it to the others rather than to compare theoretical specs.

    Some modern E61 machines with the "electric" E61 group (ie solenoid operated) still have the mechanical pre infusion built in and functioning, but when offered as an electronic touchpad model they also have the electrical pre infusion capability which can be switched on or off at your preference from the touch pad. Unecessary really, as they already have the mechanical pre infusion working anyway......are 2 pre infusions working apparently simultaneously better than one???????? Who knows, but it might sound great as a specification! *:)

    Confused? Thats why you need not bother with specs like this, just make sure that whatever you buy works / performs well or as you expect in the flesh!

    Regardz,
    Attilio
    very first CS site sponsor




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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Good explanation. I suppose the reason im comparing these things on paper is that here in brisbane we dont have any specialist home barista retailers as such, like you do down south, just a couple places here and there that sell a handful of machines and even most of those dont have demo machines you can actually try before you buy. Makes it a little more challenging to compare! :) Im yet to see any giotto or VBM demo machines, though i know merlo do sell them (but only at full RRP, and no demo).

    Hopefully one day we have a great home barista retailer where you can walk in, see a bunch of machines on the bench and test them with your own hands before taking one home. :)

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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 607B64737E2A23120 link=1268628448/0#0 date=1268628448
    Perhaps those with an e61 tank model could do a test by moving the lever to the middle position and seeing how much, if any water comes out.
    Quote Originally Posted by 4541677E7E7B64737C120 link=1268628448/2#2 date=1268640496
    ill do a test when i get home from touch in about an hour mate...... ;)
    Now im not too sure on the mechanics of it, but when i place my lever in the middle, it secretes around 25ml of water in about 15 seconds(with no PF in place), i would imagine(no experience to back this up) that this is enough to soak the puck........ but.......when i then move the lever to the full brew position, it seems to take some time for the pump to "fill"? the grouphead again with water and then start pouring......as i said, im not 100% on the mechanics of it......

    Someone may be able to fill me in on the theory behind this mechanical function?

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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 455E41565B0F06370 link=1268628448/5#5 date=1268647568
    Good explanation. I suppose the reason im comparing these things on paper is that here in brisbane we dont have any specialist home barista retailers as such, like you do down south, just a couple places here and there that sell a handful of machines and even most of those dont have demo machines you can actually try before you buy. Makes it a little more challenging to compare! :) *Im yet to see any giotto or VBM demo machines, though i know merlo do sell them (but only at full RRP, and no demo). *

    Hopefully one day we have a great home barista retailer where you can walk in, see a bunch of machines on the bench and test them with your own hands before taking one home. :)

    Rival, I apologise about having to cancel our previous appointment but had to fly up to Cairns on very short notice. Hope the weekend away went well?

    If you are yet to see a Giotto in use then you are more then welcome to make a new time and get your hands dirty on ours. And no you wont ever pay full RRP. *;D I know we are a little out of the way at Yatala but always have great coffes on hand.

    Our display stock is a little low at the moment with the pending refit but we will also have a display Domus Galatea to compare as well as Compak and ECA grinders.

    I agree that there is no other specality Home Barista stores in the whole of SE QLD except stores that "put them on the shelf" and thats why we believe a growing number of people in Brisbane and Gold Coast are visiting us and walking away happy with our prices, machines and services. *:)

    Hope we can fill the void for you at Supreme Roasters.

  9. #9
    A_M
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    Re: Pre-infusion and flow-restrictor - on all e61 hx machines?

    Quote Originally Posted by 6B5B404E415D4C5B7A404D4C290 link=1268628448/7#7 date=1268652481
    Quote Originally Posted by 455E41565B0F06370 link=1268628448/5#5 date=1268647568
    Good explanation. I suppose the reason im comparing these things on paper is that here in brisbane we dont have any specialist home barista retailers as such, like you do down south, just a couple places here and there that sell a handful of machines and even most of those dont have demo machines you can actually try before you buy. Makes it a little more challenging to compare! :) *Im yet to see any giotto or VBM demo machines, though i know merlo do sell them (but only at full RRP, and no demo). *

    Hopefully one day we have a great home barista retailer where you can walk in, see a bunch of machines on the bench and test them with your own hands before taking one home. :)

    Rival, I apologise about having to cancel our previous appointment but had to fly up to Cairns on very short notice. Hope the weekend away went well?

    If you are yet to see a Giotto in use then you are more then welcome to make a new time and get your hands dirty on ours. And no you wont ever pay full RRP. *;D I know we are a little out of the way at Yatala but always have great coffes on hand.

    Our display stock is a little low at the moment with the pending refit but we will also have a display Domus Galatea to compare as well as Compak and ECA grinders.

    I agree that there is no other specality Home Barista stores in the whole of SE QLD except stores that "put them on the shelf" and thats why we believe a growing number of people in Brisbane and Gold Coast are visiting us and walking away happy with our prices, machines and services. *:)

    Hope we can fill the void for you at Supreme Roasters.
    Yea, for teh size of Brisbane... It is a bit of a pain.... But strangle enough; I keep hearing good things about those down at Yatala.

    I guess I might need to take leave and plan a trip down that way... Refreshments to and from Mt T.



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