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Thread: Upgraditis .............down to the final few

  1. #1
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Upgraditis .............down to the final few

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Like many before me I've been struck down with an acute case of upgraditis. It's not the first time it's happened to me but unlike previous occasions, I've not only got some cash, but also have approval from the home financial controller to do something about it

    Here's my situation. I have the Breville Dual Boiler and the matching smart grinder and in all honesty, it serves me well and I can make better coffee than just about any I can buy here on the central coast......but upgraditis is not about logic. I make between between 6-10 coffees per day whilst I do enjoy the odd espresso, the regular drink is Latte so steam is important.

    After extensively reviewing the forums, I've decided that I would prefer to upgrade to a HX machine. It seems the value for money is hard to beat. I have a budget of $3500 which would include the right grinder but could stretch it to 4k if it meant a significant upgrade in quality. I don't have any issues with noise in the house so don't see the need to pay for a rotary pump. Also, any machine I get would need to have it's own water tank (i.e. not plumbed) My choices are as follows.

    Rocket Giotto Premium Plus V2

    ECM Manufacture Technika IV Profi

    Bezzera Domus Galatea

    I plan to visit one of the site sponsors shortly to see which one I like the best in the flesh. To fully inform my choice, I would love to hear any pros and cons on one vs the other from any CS-ers who may have had experience with two or more of these.

    Cheers

    DS

  2. #2
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    That most pleasant of afflictions.............

    Not too many CSers will have long term access to any two current models on your short list to be able to give you informed, unbiased advice of the calibre you are seeking. Nearly all machines at that price bracket are fantastic, are built really well, perform to specs and look great on your bench. No-one other than yourself is qualified to tell you what you like or what is good for you.

    You could ask an independent service/repair tech about which of the machines come on to the bench more than the others, that information might be helpful. They might also be able to tell you whether any of them have 'better' internal build quality and access and whether any of them have superior components to the others, this may sway your thinking but none of these machines are vastly inferior to the others, if at all.

    The rest is up to you; try each machine, get your hands on them and visually appraise them, when you do this you will probably find yourself drawn to one, over the others. Don't make a purchase, yet.
    Factor in the grinder, a Macap?, a Compak?, a Mazzer?, something else?

    Go and have a coffee, sit and reflect, buy the the one that you keep thinking about.
    Trust your senses and choose accordingly.


    Cheers.

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    It appears that you are moving to an E61 based machine..but, you are aware that you will be losing dual boiler, PID temp adjustment, and volumetric shot functionality with your upgrade choices. ?

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    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    It appears that you are moving to an E61 based machine..but, you are aware that you will be losing dual boiler, PID temp adjustment, and volumetric shot functionality with your upgrade choices. ?
    On the one hand you a Toyota Camry with climate control, cruise control and an automatic transmission... and anyone's grandmother can drive it (and does). It will get you from point A to B in comfort but don't expect to have too much fun getting there. On the other hand you have a Ferrari with a notchy manual transmission, a heavy clutch, grabby brakes and dodgy air conditioning. The engine block dates back many decades (much like the e61), it takes a touch of art and finesse to master but driving it will be exhilerating, highly rewarding and very memorable. But is it an upgrade...? You betcha!!!
    axisa and whykickamoocow like this.

  5. #5
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    DS makes it quite clear that, in his view, 'upgraditis is not about logic'.
    Upgraditis is often more about want than need and his choice shows its' own brand of logic anyway.
    Like Vinitasse says it's about the box branded Camry vs the bling of the Ferrari.
    There is just something more authentic about a home machine that looks like a professional one and
    that isn't for sale in every department store. Makes people feel good and cures upgraditis,... for a while. ;-)
    If making good coffee is all about PIDs and dual boilers then 90% of us have never had great brews....
    and that simply is not true.

    And to add......the Camry goes like a car but the Ferrari..............
    like a Rocket!!!

  6. #6
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies so far. The dual boiler is a well thought out machine with many great attributes. It makes great coffee but I have made the decisions to move to a HX and am comfortable with that. As much as anything, I am looking forward to a whole new world of learning that will come with the change. It's all part of the coffee experience and building my knowledge as much as the coffee it produces.

    Chokkidog, I really think it's going to be like you said. The shortlisted machines will all make great coffee. The one that I feel the most attached to (probably which I think looks the best) will be the winner. Having said that, I'd still love to hear from anyone that has some experience comparing two or more of these machines.

    Cheers

    DS

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    I was not suggesting that DS sticks with his "Camry" , but was concerned that he realize the he will be trading some very useful features for basic traditional "bling"....when it is entirely possible to have some of both !
    ...IE.. an E61 group dual boiler with PID !
    Some Ferraris do come with Auto trans and aircon !!

  8. #8
    TC
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    Great news d_s, you have some terrific e-61 machines in your shortlist. As you have stated, you really can choose the one you like.

    I think you could even add the Rocket Evoluzione if you want and be well within budget. With a rotary pump, you get silence and the ability to plumb it in at some point in the future should you choose to. You might also consider the Diadema Junior Extra (vibe pump) which is at the very top of the tree on build quality and finish IMHO.

    FWIW, I wouldn't worry about using a HX machine at all. We have come a long way in Australia in the last 5 years with temperature management. Sadly, I read and receive misinformation every day- cooling flushes and the like. This is not relevant on well configured machines which you will walk up to, rinse and simply use. Opinions of "manual v auto" just don't apply. This is just one of the services you receive from switched on Australian companies- importers and resellers alike. Just avoid the box sellers. They generally don't know and/or don't care.

    Enjoy your new kit. I am sure that you will never look back!

    Chris
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    Member danzx6r's Avatar
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    What no Minore?? *cries*

    I would perhaps jump in with a grinder. There is a Mazzer Mini for sale on here which would be a great upgrade.

    Dan

  10. #10
    TC
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    Quote Originally Posted by danzx6r View Post
    What no Minore?? *cries*

    I would perhaps jump in with a grinder. There is a Mazzer Mini for sale on here which would be a great upgrade.

    Dan
    I could have said "Why no Alex Duetto or Diadema Junior Extra Dual Boiler" et al, but the OP has briefed that he has chosen the HX path. I respect his choice.

  11. #11
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by danzx6r View Post
    What no Minore?? *cries*

    I would perhaps jump in with a grinder. There is a Mazzer Mini for sale on here which would be a great upgrade.

    Dan
    I did see that grinder and the Mazzer Mini is the grinder I'm hoping to get but I was really wanting to go doserless such as Mazzer mini E as I really only make a few coffees in the morning. Perhaps it's a topic for another thread but is the standard mazzer mini suited to my situation?

    DS

  12. #12
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    I could have said "Why no Alex Duetto or Diadema Junior Extra Dual Boiler" et al, but the OP has briefed that he has chosen the HX path. I respect his choice.
    Thanks Chris, you're right in that have pretty much locked in on the HX. Before I pull the trigger though, do you think that if I could stretch myself to the Duetto, i'd notice the difference? Is it another case of all the machines will make great coffee but the one that I connect to the most is the one that I should get, or us the Duetto in another class?

    DS

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    Quote Originally Posted by double_shot View Post
    Thanks Chris, you're right in that have pretty much locked in on the HX. Before I pull the trigger though, do you think that if I could stretch myself to the Duetto, i'd notice the difference? Is it another case of all the machines will make great coffee but the one that I connect to the most is the one that I should get, or us the Duetto in another class?

    DS
    Hello d_s,

    As always, I'd recommend that you view the machines in the metal and make your call from there. It's about what is right for you.

    There are quite a few owners who have moved from HX to Alex Duetto and they are really the only group who can offer you some insights into their experiences. Pretty much all else is just opinion- too often without first hand experience!

    Cheers...

  14. #14
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Morning DS, for what it's worth I went through this process about 2.5 years ago, after a lot of research and shopping around I went with the Bezzera Domus Galatea and have never regretted the move, makes great espresso, running as well today as it was on day one, built like a tank and looks great as well as super easy to access and clean/replace the seal/shower screen.

    Having said that I'm sure there are other machines that meet these criteria as well, just that the Bezzera seemed head and shoulders above to me.

  15. #15
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Hi DS,

    Looks like you're on track. My choice of grinder would be the Macap M4d, I have not used the Mini
    but have a much bigger Mazzer on my bench, so I'm familiar with the quality of build and results.
    You won't go wrong with either, however, the Macap has some functionality advantages, admittedly
    small time, such as the pf prongs which are nice, the compact nature of the digital timer
    and the activation of the grinder motor by push button with the group handle. Nice bling too.
    I have owned two M4ds in the past, the original still producing awesome coffee next door, at
    my neighbours, 4 years after purchase, with no faults or issues ever.

    I have also had two HX Isomac Mondiales in the past and currently have an Alex Duetto II.
    They are all Ferraris, with working aircon and smooth transmissions.;-0

    With the Isomacs, there was a build quality issue, both the boilers leaked. They had hand cut
    and welded end plates. They now use robots, so problem solved. They also went through a
    couple of pressurestats more than necessary. They now use better components.

    But the coffee? Awesome! Right from the get go.
    Temp stability was great with only a .05 bar fluctuation on the p/stat.
    More recently manufactured machines (of various brands) have even better stability than this.
    Lots of of work room at the front and the drip tray design was great for back flushing, no mess.
    Nice height to the group as well, when using spouted p/fs.

    Oodles of steam that was easy to produce great micro foam with.
    Nice porting on the two hole tip (hot wand). They made a lot of coffee,
    one still going strong, (with new boiler) at my daughter's workplace.
    Bling/design value almost second to none. They look awesome.
    I'm not suggesting you add this machine to your list, your list is fine as it is.

    The Alex II, not as nice to look at, more boxy.
    Internal build quality is excellent and I've only had to replace an OPV. This issue has now been rectified
    at the factory. More cramped as a work station and spouted p/fs restrict height from group
    to drip tray, which, like a lot of compact m/cs, is too short.

    It's a steam monster, which has been challenging for some owners.
    I had to adjust my technique and now use an after market tip for small amounts of milk (175ml in 300ml jug).
    The milk is still not quite as dense as the Isomac but it might be the wide angle porting of the
    two hole tip. I use, at times, some commercial m/cs and don't have any technique issues.

    As far as the PID goes it's very temp stable and as I have a small amount of clients for my little
    roastery, it gives me the opportunity to see how my coffee performs in different temp
    management environments that I find out on the street. It allows me to 'temperature calibrate' my coffee so I know what temps to advise my clients.

    Do I temp surf for fun? No, I don't have the time as coffee at home is as much about
    QA as about getting a fix and indulging my passion. If I was just a home user I might........
    would it be a priority? No. It seems that the flavours I like and want to express in my
    coffee can be found in a narrow band of 92*-94*, so 93* is the general setting.

    Dual boiler for a home machine? I'm yet to be convinced of the necessity and the advantage.
    When I'm putting a new roast or new blend through its' paces then yes, recovery time and stability
    play a part but I'm talking 10-20 coffees in a row. If you like to geek things to the max then PIDs
    and dual boilers are a must........ each to their own. For some they are just status symbols.
    To get the most from the Alex, I would have a dedicated 15A circuit so it can run both boilers
    simultaneously. It is very quiet.

    With the vibe pump on the Isomacs a 'natural' preinfusion occurs as the pump comes up to pressure,
    using the Alex Duetto (rotary pump) if you want to preinfuse for the same amount of time (about 8 secs) you have to actuate the pump cam lever 'til it clicks then elevate it a bit more but before the pump cuts in. This will allow internal line pressure water out of the group. When your first drip appears ( or the 'ring' with a naked) pull the lever fully up and pour your shot.

    In the end, with good technique, great coffee and any of the above mentioned machines
    you will achieve awesome results. A PID and or DB alone, won't do it for you or make your coffee any better.

    If buying a dual boiler will compromise your grinder budget then my advice is..... don't.
    If you can afford both I still wouldn't advise you to go the DB path. That comes down to
    personal preference and motivation and only you can answer that.
    Last edited by chokkidog; 21st January 2013 at 12:43 PM. Reason: preinfusion times vibe vs rotary

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    ...using the Alex Duetto (rotary pump) if you want to preinfuse you have to actuate the pump cam lever 'til it clicks then elevate it a bit more but before the pump cuts in. This will allow internal line
    pressure water out of the group. When your first drip appears ( or the 'ring' with a naked) pull the
    lever fully up and pour your shot.
    ?? why do you feel this is necessary ?
    The E61 is designed to pre-infuse, even with a Rotary pump. !

  17. #17
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    If I want an 8 second pre infusion. I didn't say it was necessary but meant to convey that
    if you want the same preinfuse time as the vibe in the Isomac.
    The difference using the technique above, to just a straight actuation of the pump cam lever,
    is 3 seconds but can be made longer if you want.
    The difference is in the cup!
    Sorry for not making it clearer. I can see your confusion.
    I like to play with my machine and explore all that it can do! 8-o
    Post 15 edited with clearer language. ;-)

  18. #18
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Thanks again all for your replies. I really appreciate all the thoughts as I fine tune my choice.

    The short list I have feels solid and now I just need to get in and see the machines. The current favourite is the bezzera but I'll stay open minded until I've seen it in person ( so to speak).

    Based on Chris's input, the evo might also be worth a look. Should I think of it as a quieter Giotto or is the difference more than that.

  19. #19
    Coffee+carbon=heaven Mono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by double_shot View Post
    Thanks again all for your replies. I really appreciate all the thoughts as I fine tune my choice.

    The short list I have feels solid and now I just need to get in and see the machines. The current favourite is the bezzera but I'll stay open minded until I've seen it in person ( so to speak).

    Based on Chris's input, the evo might also be worth a look. Should I think of it as a quieter Giotto or is the difference more than that.
    Quieter Giotto with plumbility if you so desire.......I think that is the only differences

  20. #20
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    ?? why do you feel this is necessary ?
    The E61 is designed to pre-infuse, even with a Rotary pump. !
    Thanks again all for the rich high quality feedback. Chris's comments above on the Rocket Evo really got me thinking but as I explore this and other rotary pump options, some questions emerge which I can't find clear answers to and they relate to this comment by blend52 and Chokkidog above.

    From what I read, the E61 naturally facilitates a level of preinfusion regardless of pump type. The vibe pump provides additional preinfusion as it builds up pressure more slowly. On the rotary, you can manipulate the preinfusion by opening the valves exposing he coffee to line pressure before you flick the switch to brew. My first check in is to see whether I have interpreted all of this correctly.

    My next questions stems from the fact that I will only be able to go with a "tanked" option and not plumbed in. If my understanding above is correct, then ill be forgoing preinfusion flexibility on any rotary option that I consider. Is this really going to be an issue? Will I be forgoing an option that could vary what comes through in the cup? Or am I over thinking this and just need to focus on the right grind and dose and then the results will come?

    Cheers

    DS

  21. #21
    TC
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    Hi DS,

    You will get preinfusion anyway- as it's part of the design of the e-61 group.

    Once plumbed, you also have line pressure to play with. Some play with extra preinfusion by lifting the lever to the centre and then letting line pressure do the rest.

    Cheers

    Chris

  22. #22
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Hi DS,

    My comments were not meant to add confusion about preinfusion!! Your interpretation is correct except you will be able to manipulate
    times with a tanked version as there is internal pressure at the group whether it is plumbed or not.
    It is simply an added tweak to your arsenal when it comes to extraction. I discovered the tweak
    when I asked a question about the different standard preinfusion times ( 5 and 8 seconds rotary/vibe)
    between the two pump types and machines that I had. Don't let side issues such as this colour your decision making!
    You may well find that if you put two different machines side by side, one rotary one vibe, that the preinfusion times will
    be different to what I had on my two machines.
    It's more a lead into playing around, thinking outside the square and getting the most from your coffee journey.

    Cheers.

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    I just got my hands on a fairly cheap Domobar Super Lever. It was used as a house machine making a few coffees a day I also have a very handy local business that re-polished my extremely scratched up BZ35 to brand new condition, because I saved so much on the purchase I'll get the whole thing totally re-polished and I'll spend some time descaling it thoroughly to bring it back to it's newer days. As I have done a previous coffee machine rebuild I am confident that the money I saved in the purchase as compared to a new machine will pay for any spare parts that I may need in the near future as it is a couple years old.

    I was in the exact same boat as you are, totally unsure on what I wanted to purchase. My shortlist was almost identical except I had the Domobar in there, I initially wanted a plumbed in machine like the ECM or Evoluzione but I just purchased the first 2nd hand machine that popped up on my list. Now if I am not happy with the Domobar I'm confident I'll get an identical sale price as to what I paid then I can cross it off my list

    I know this probably isn't the ideal way to go about it but if I purchased the wrong machine I would be totally devastated.

    I'm not recommending to you to do this, I'm just sharing. I wouldn't recommend this because if you haven't got any knowledge of the internals you could find yourself in a pickle. If an ECM came up for sale 2nd hand I would most definately purchase it, clean it up and compare the 2 side by side for a month or so and sell of the one I don't want


    Also a little bit curious as to why the Domobar isn't on your list? It's a great looking machine has all the capabilities of the machines you have mentioned and is very highly regarded around here. Thoughts?

  24. #24
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Hi all and thanks again to those that have taken the time to post. It's been tremendously helpful. Before I head in for the hands on review of the machines, there's one more variable I'd like to explore with this community. During the most recent home board meeting, the financial controller (and the CEO if I'm truly honest) has said that is ok to spend a few hundred more on a volumetric machine. Not sure if this is good or bad.

    Her rationale is that she doesn't want to be watching shots - just push the button. There's real value in that for her. My thoughts are that if I have everything set up right and ensure her workflow is consistent, most times the coffee will be great. Whilst I can't say I'm fully on board, I wanted to explore this further.

    My question is whether there's a fundamental difference in the way the E61 functions if its operated electronically or mechanically via the lever and will that have an effect on the quality of the extraction. To be specific if it helps, the machine in mind is the ecm elektronika.

    Cheers

    DS

  25. #25
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brendogs View Post
    Also a little bit curious as to why the Domobar isn't on your list? It's a great looking machine has all the capabilities of the machines you have mentioned and is very highly regarded around here. Thoughts?
    Hey brendogs, thanks for your post. It was provocative. In answer to your question re the Domobar, I haven't seen one in the flesh but the images I have seen just don't do it for me. As they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

    Cheers

    DS

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    Hi Double Shot - sorry to hijack your thread, but I'm in the same boat as you. From speaking/reading around the ECM has some advantages over the Rocket (the other main one I was looking at). Levers for steam (though this is a preference I imagine). Pressure gauge dials easier to see at the top of the machine (vs the Rocket, at the bottom), and a bigger drip tray(I think) than the Rocket. Only advantage (non-whats-in -the cup-wise) is that the Rocket has nicer hips. I'm curious to see how you go, I'm leaning to the ECM atm. I imagine a volumetric will be less reliable than a straight lever (more electronics), but I can see the advantage you speak of

  27. #27
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Hi DS,

    There is nothing wrong with volumetric machines, it's more a style of operation choice.
    My neighbours have a volumetric single group, in a word; boring.
    The machine, with it's touch pad also has a very different look but the coffee is fine, very fine, after all, it's my roast!;-)
    Still, it's about the grind, dose and tamp and will always be that way. A volumetric will have no bearing on the quality
    of the coffee from incorrect technique, you'll just get 30mls of it, every time.

    There are ways around your wife's concerns.
    1. A shot timer.
    2. A shot timer, coupled with a latte glass such as a Libbey Duratuff Endeavour 207 ml (7 oz no. 15709)
    http://coffeesnobs.com.au/general-co...tml#post490632 see post no. 112
    You'll see that it has a moulding around the lower part of the glass. It's right at 30mls!
    3. After a while, you both will come to recognise what is a good pour just from seeing how it emerges from the p/f.
    Some will be better than others but....... hey! When you're in the groove things will go pretty well. You'll still sink some shots
    but once again you'll still sink shots (say that 10x really fast :-o) from a volumetric.
    4. Are things that busy that 25 secs is too long for a Zen coffee moment? :-) I'll ask but it's not for me to answer............

    Hopefully, some one else with a better answer will post but that's my take on it, for home.
    My opinion only, a choice like this is too personal for anyone else to answer.

    cheers.
    Last edited by chokkidog; 6th February 2013 at 08:15 PM.

  28. #28
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Hi Chokkidog et al,

    thanks again. It sounds like I have nothing to worry about with the machines on the list, it just comes down to the one that I like the most. I am hoping to get into one of our sponsors tomorrow afternoon and have a good look at these machines. I have all sorts of thoughts and points of view but once I get see the actual machines, I hope that one just stands out for me. Pretty sure that the grinder will be the Macap M4D

    Cheers

    Peter

  29. #29
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by double_shot View Post
    Hi all and thanks again to those that have taken the time to post. It's been tremendously helpful. Before I head in for the hands on review of the machines, there's one more variable I'd like to explore with this community. During the most recent home board meeting, the financial controller (and the CEO if I'm truly honest) has said that is ok to spend a few hundred more on a volumetric machine. Not sure if this is good or bad.

    Her rationale is that she doesn't want to be watching shots - just push the button. There's real value in that for her. My thoughts are that if I have everything set up right and ensure her workflow is consistent, most times the coffee will be great. Whilst I can't say I'm fully on board, I wanted to explore this further.

    My question is whether there's a fundamental difference in the way the E61 functions if its operated electronically or mechanically via the lever and will that have an effect on the quality of the extraction. To be specific if it helps, the machine in mind is the ecm elektronika.

    Cheers

    DS
    G'Day DS, from one who's been in a similar position.
    Bought a Bezzera Galatea and went through the process of teaching SWMBO how to operate it, no great drama, it's an easy machine to use.
    About a fortnight later she came home from a shopping expedition with a container of instant, when I asked the question she told me she couldn't be bothered with all of the stuffing around and the brand of instant she had chosen was almost as good as that produced by the Bezzera, she hasn't used the machine since.
    However she still enjoys a nightly cappuccino (made by me) and claims it beats anything produced by most cafe's hands down.

  30. #30
    Coffee+carbon=heaven Mono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    G'Day DS, from one who's been in a similar position.
    Bought a Bezzera Galatea and went through the process of teaching SWMBO how to operate it, no great drama, it's an easy machine to use.
    About a fortnight later she came home from a shopping expedition with a container of instant, when I asked the question she told me she couldn't be bothered with all of the stuffing around and the brand of instant she had chosen was almost as good as that produced by the Bezzera, she hasn't used the machine since.
    However she still enjoys a nightly cappuccino (made by me) and claims it beats anything produced by most cafe's hands down.
    Yep, sounds like female logic at work :-) :-)...........

    Steve

  31. #31
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    I don't spend a lot of time in Sydney but was working there on Friday so planned to finish early and visit a sponsor to make the choice from the short list. As it turns out, got held up at work and arrived at 4:55 and really had no time to do anything other than eyeball the machines. So no purchase yet.

    It's not all bad though. I was pretty clear on my choice of grinder so picked up a brand new Macap M4D so I think at least I am part way there! Found it straight forward to dial in. Great new addition

    DS

  32. #32
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    You must be champing at the bit DS!!
    It'll make it that much sweeter when it happens tho'!!
    Congrats on the grinder.........great choice.

  33. #33
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Done!! Finally got a chance to go in and play with these machines and after much deliberation went home with a brand new ECM Technika with rotary pump. Loved the look of the unit and was particularly partial to the steam levers. Got a good price too hence the rotary. Has matched up well with the MACAP and have already cranked out some great coffee. Now I have plenty to work on such as the various dose / grind combinations to find the sweet spot, and harnessing a step up in steam power.

    Thanks to all who helped me home in on the grinder and machine.

    Cheers

    DS
    Last edited by double_shot; 3rd March 2013 at 07:18 PM. Reason: Typo
    axisa likes this.

  34. #34
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by double_shot View Post
    Done!! Finally got a chance to go in and play with these machines and after much deliberation went home with a brand new ECM Technika with rotary pump. Loved the look of the unit and was particularly partial to the steam levers. Got a good price too hence the rotary. Has matched up well with the MACAP and have already cranked out some great coffee. Now I have plenty to work on such as the various dose / grind combinations to find the sweet spot, and harnessing a step up in steam power.

    Thanks to all who helped me home in on the grinder and machine.

    Cheers

    DS
    Congratulations DS, beautiful looking machine with a good reputation, I suspect you will be very happy together.

  35. #35
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    Update?

    Quote Originally Posted by double_shot View Post
    Done!! Finally got a chance to go in and play with these machines and after much deliberation went home with a brand new ECM Technika with rotary pump. Loved the look of the unit and was particularly partial to the steam levers. Got a good price too hence the rotary. Has matched up well with the MACAP and have already cranked out some great coffee. Now I have plenty to work on such as the various dose / grind combinations to find the sweet spot, and harnessing a step up in steam power.

    Thanks to all who helped me home in on the grinder and machine.

    Cheers

    DS
    How is SWMBO going with the Technika? I'm in very similar position to yours (with an almost identical shortlist). Current setup is a Lelit Combi with PID, but the CEO just can't be bothered. I'm wondering whether the volumetric Electronika would be likely to change behaviour.

  36. #36
    Doppio Ristretto
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    Fantastic choice on the ECM. Not that I'm biased or anything

    It should give you years of good service if well looked after.

    Don't forget to post pics of your setup for us

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    FWIW, I wouldn't worry about using a HX machine at all. We have come a long way in Australia in the last 5 years with temperature management. Sadly, I read and receive misinformation every day- cooling flushes and the like. This is not relevant on well configured machines which you will walk up to, rinse and simply use.
    you'll have to pardon my ignorance here, but are you saying cooling flushes are a myth and will not affect the quality of pulling a shot on a hx? And what entails a 'well configured' machine? proper pstat configuration? I'm curious because this whole rectifying the grouphead temp for a consistent brew business is rather unnerving for the uninitiated…

    thanks.

  38. #38
    Member double_shot's Avatar
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    Hi there,

    Many months in now with the new machine / grinder combo and I could not be happier with either of them. The grinder is very easy to use and the electronic doser is very consistent.

    The coffee machine produces exceptionally good coffee and is easy to use. Milk took me a bit of getting used to as it had a bit more grunt than i'd experienced for a while but I have it sorted now. I love the silence of the rotary pump, the steam levers work well, and it looks a treat sparkling and shining on my bench.

    Re the question about SWMBO, I shared your post when I asked what I should say, she said "it's like me asking you if my bum looks big in this dress"! Truth be known, she loves the coffee I make but for herself, she misses the peace of mind that she got from just pushing the dose button on the volumetric Breville Dual Boiler. It is a barrier stopping her using it but she is working past that and I reckon she'll be at ease with it in another 6 months or so.

    Despite her slow adoption of the machine, I couldn't speak highly enough of the machine and would recommend it to anyone that is considering it. Same for the grinder.

    Cheers

    DS

  39. #39
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    Time to get a roaster!
    nabsie likes this.



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