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Thread: Bezzera BZ10 - give me some reasons why this isn't the right machine for me!

  1. #1
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    Bezzera BZ10 - give me some reasons why this isn't the right machine for me!

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hey guys, I posted a thread about 6 months asking for some recommendations on machines. I got a few good points and ideas from that and started doing some research. Now I definitely have a better idea of what I am after. I finally found time to visit two coffee machine sellers here in QLD this week and I think I've decided on the BZ-10...

    To recap - my budget is around $2000 for the machine only. I already have a good grinder. I do mostly milk based drinks and often do several at a time as we often have visitors so a HX machine makes sense to me. I was a barista in another life and feel very at home behind a big commercial machine. Currently running a Gaggia Classic which is about 8 years old and while it makes 2 coffees for hubby and I easily it falls down big time once I have visitors.

    I like the BZ10 because:
    - short warm up time
    - doesn't take up too much more bench space than the Gaggia I've been running for the last 8 years.
    - easy to service and there is a seller here in Brisbane that does the servicing too
    - good reputation and seems to be a lot of love for it in the many reviews I've read.

    I'm hesitant to purchase because:
    - not E61 group head so from what I've read the group can maybe be a bit finicky (??). My hubby is not a barista (I used to run Cafe's so am pretty comfortable with most machines) so ideally I'd like a machine that isn't too precious
    - hot external parts (I have young kids and I'm a complete and utter clutz) but I think most of the machines in this range are going to have similar probs yeah?
    - I read a few forums on here where there was talk about the pressure being too high on this machine - is this easy to adjust on my own?
    - We are planning a full kitchen reno in the next 2-3 years (not immediately) and we would probably be keen on plumbing a machine in at that point. I guess I could always upgrade at that point?
    - which leads me to my next point, how quickly am I going to outgrow this machine and want to upgrade? 2K is a big investment and ideally I want to be keeping this next machine for 5+ years but if I do get hit with the upgrade bug will the BZ10 give me an ok resale price?

    I can't afford to go above 2K at the moment but I am happy to continue saving for a few months and then purchase a machine around the 2.5K mark if that's a better fit for me? The Gaggia works and I can make damn good coffee with it despite it's limitations. I don't have a problem being patient.

    Would love some feedback - even if it's just to tell me that I'm overthinking this and I should just call the store now and order the BZ10! Thanks!! :-)
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  2. #2
    Senior Member JMcCee's Avatar
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    You can keep looking until the cows come home and just keep seeing more choices but any Bezzera is a rock solid machine and the 10 will do all you want it to and more. The Bezzera head is a variation of the Elektra head with proprietry differences and is a great design and a worthy alternative to the E61. It is also easier to clean and self service than the E61, imho :-D
    zeezaw and NicoleL like this.

  3. #3
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    I started looking at the BZ10 and ended up the Bezzera Magica (Mitica).

    Im over the moon with it, great machine to use. e-61 group head and really, I doubt the heat up time would be much different. I wait 20mins but could probably do 10mins.

    Its very solid, quiet and well made.

    I picked it over the BZ-10 as I wanted the common E-61 group head. The thermo siphon is a tried and tested method. And less to go wrong as oppose to the electric heating element.

    If it was me, I’d save a few weeks and get a machine with a E-61 group head.

    If if I had my time again, I’d get the rocket apartmento but tbh I can’t fault the Magica.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sten186 View Post
    I started looking at the BZ10 and ended up the Bezzera Magica (Mitica).

    Im over the moon with it, great machine to use. e-61 group head and really, I doubt the heat up time would be much different. I wait 20mins but could probably do 10mins.

    Its very solid, quiet and well made.

    I picked it over the BZ-10 as I wanted the common E-61 group head. The thermo siphon is a tried and tested method. And less to go wrong as oppose to the electric heating element.

    If it was me, I’d save a few weeks and get a machine with a E-61 group head.

    If if I had my time again, I’d get the rocket apartmento but tbh I can’t fault the Magica.
    Thanks for this feedback! I had my eye on the apartmento too

  5. #5
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    Most welcome. Hopefully it was some help, but personally I would stick to a E-61 machine. Nothing wrong with the Bezzera, but personally I think the rocket is a step up.

  6. #6
    Senior Member JMcCee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleL View Post
    Thanks for this feedback! I had my eye on the apartmento too
    There are some good deals on the Apartmento thru CS sponsors for a few hundred more than the BZ10. Though if you step up to that next level it's a whole new rabbit hole of choices. If the budget is not set in stone and there's no urgency I'm with sten186.

  7. #7
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    Hi Nicole,

    I bought a BZ10 at the start of the year and am quite happy. With respect to your points-

    Positives
    - The quick warm-up time with the electrically heated head is really important for us, and was the major selling point. While you can always put an E61 machine on a timer for the morning... for random drinks during the day the quick warm-up is super useful. This factor, together with the great deal I got on the BZ10 (under $1600 new), is what sealed it for me.
    - I've already had the group head apart, and it is a very simple 1-minute job (three hex screws). I'm not worried about the risk of the electric group head element dying - it looks very easy to replace.
    - Doesn't require too much bench space.
    - Dual pressure gauges useful.
    - Great steam power.
    - Makes very good coffee (once you are on top of it).
    - Good drip tray capacity, solidly built, decent water tank capacity.

    Negatives
    - It took me a couple of months of experimenting and practice to get the grind, dose weight and height, tamp, basket selection and timing right. Once set-up, I've found the machine to be very consistent. But it did take a while to get there.
    - I haven't adjusted the pressure down as yet. But if you don't get your basket distribution right, the factory-set pressure does seem to easily induce channelling in the puck.
    - My group head collar seems to have some excessive play in it. Until I figured out how to counteract that, it caused the portafilter to reseat during shots. But this could just be my unit.
    - I can confirm some external parts do get quite hot if the machine is left on for a long time, but it hasn't really bothered us or caused burns. Perhaps if you left your hand on the hottest bits for more than 5 seconds or so you might get a burn(?). But due to the quick warm-up, we find little need to leave it on for extended periods, so it rarely gets that hot.
    - Hot water wand and its lever handle are quite close together. Can be awkward to use.

    All things considered, for our use case I'd probably still buy a BZ10 if purchasing again. But, if I was going to leave the machine on all day, or not in a hurry for coffee on the spare-of-the-moment, then I'd look towards an E61.
    HorseFD, JMcCee and NicoleL like this.

  8. #8
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    Hi Nicole,

    Wherea bouts in the country are you? I had no local suppliers so I purchased mine froma site sponsor. They made it very easy and shipping was not a problem.

    I dont know your financial situation, but either choice will bea good, cant really go wrong. If you want a machine now and dont want to spend more, the BZ-10 will be great. If you dont mind spending more, the Rocket, Profitech, ECM, Bezzera all make great HX machines which are on par with each other.

    Again, I have the Bezzera Magica, and its great, but do regret not getting the Rocket. Only purely for a very few small personal things. I am very happy with the Magica.

    also, remember, that you need a quality grinder to match.

  9. #9
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    Another happy BZ10 owner here. I find that it makes superb coffee and is very easy to live with. Favourite bits: fast heat up, steam/hot water levers, 3L water reservoir, well designed and quality build. The bad parts: I can't imagine it's going to give me an excuse to upgrade any time soon.

    Reports of excessive pressure have been greatly exaggerated but the OPV is certainly adjustable should you feel the need. The group head, while not invented in 1961, is also tried and tested.

    Hope this helps.
    NicoleL likes this.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by sten186 View Post
    Hi Nicole,

    Wherea bouts in the country are you? I had no local suppliers so I purchased mine froma site sponsor. They made it very easy and shipping was not a problem.

    I dont know your financial situation, but either choice will bea good, cant really go wrong. If you want a machine now and dont want to spend more, the BZ-10 will be great. If you dont mind spending more, the Rocket, Profitech, ECM, Bezzera all make great HX machines which are on par with each other.

    Again, I have the Bezzera Magica, and its great, but do regret not getting the Rocket. Only purely for a very few small personal things. I am very happy with the Magica.

    also, remember, that you need a quality grinder to match.
    Thanks for the reply, I'm in Brisbane. There is a store here that has the BZ10 for $1950 at the moment which seems to be a good price when compared with other stores and sponsors etc. If I was going to go up to the next level of machine I'd probably need to save for another few months as the budget is pretty tight right now.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Erimus's Avatar
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    Not sure where you are in Brisbane? It would be worth having a look in Neli Coffee at Clontarf. You'll get really good advice off Ed with no high pressure to buy. Also you get to drink great coffee and buy fantastic fresh beans at very competitive prices.
    NicoleL likes this.

  12. #12
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    Also, keep in mind that when you are at this level or prosumer range of machines, they will actually be very close in quality, so could even come down to size and looks for you. You wont be dissapointed in your decision if you go for the BZ10, and for an extra $1k, you wont be making coffee's that taste 1/3 better. Diminishing returns if you know what I mean.
    NicoleL likes this.

  13. #13
    Site Sponsor Casa Espresso's Avatar
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    The BZ10 will always be a good choice.

    If you are going to where i think you are going in Brisbane they will look after you.

    The BZ10 group head is clever design, it is both thermosiphon and electrically heated.

    Also some of the previous comments about over pressure on the pump where a non issue, more about people not understanding how a vibe pump works an dthe relationship of guage pressure and group head pressure.

    At sub $2k it is great value for money

    Cheers

    Antony
    www.casaespresso.com.au
    Yelta, HorseFD, NicoleL and 1 others like this.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Bezzera have an excellent reputation for quality, longevity and ease of use, I've owned a Galatea for almost 10 years now, never a regret.

  15. #15
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    I've read a few times that the BZ10 can be "finicky", but with little information explaining why or how. Does anybody have any idea about this?

  16. #16
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HorseFD View Post
    I've read a few times that the BZ10 can be "finicky", but with little information explaining why or how. Does anybody have any idea about this?
    Don't believe everything you read Horse, those with little skill or ability are quick to criticise.

    Haven't used the BZ10 but very much doubt Bezzera would have dud machine in their range.
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  17. #17
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    Thanks for all the clear and constructive comments! I'm no closer to a final decision but I'm satisfied that if I do decide to buy the BZ10 I will be getting a machine that I'm happy with. I'm probably a bit more impatient now after doing all this research so probably will just bite the bullet and buy the BZ10 soon
    Dundas likes this.

  18. #18
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    Upgraded from a Silvia to a BZ10 (bought second hand from here) and can't fault it - fantastic machine.

    The fast heat up time is really good. If guests rock up unexpectedly you can simply flip the machine on and buy the time every sits down and gets comfortable you can start pulling shots.

    Recovery time between shots is good - the only time I've struggled is using the hot water dispenser a few times consecutively in a row as you end up pulling too much fresh water into the boiler so it takes a little longer to recover.
    HorseFD likes this.

  19. #19
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    I am looking at a BZ10 , can any owners confirm how long the heat up time is under real conditions ? Thanks

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by buderim11 View Post
    I am looking at a BZ10 , can any owners confirm how long the heat up time is under real conditions ? Thanks
    Ive had mine for around 18 months. I'd say 10-12 minutes.
    buderim11 likes this.

  21. #21
    Senior Member CafeLotta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HorseFD View Post
    I've read a few times that the BZ10 can be "finicky", but with little information explaining why or how. Does anybody have any idea about this?
    From what I recall there was some discussion regarding the thermostat controlled electric cartridge heating elements in the BZ10 group-head. Apparently the thermostat had a decent operating temperature dead band which was said to allow overheating of the group-head at times. This can also happen on some E61 Hx machines if the thermosyphon circuit isn't calibrated properly by design or through service mods.

    There was some experimenting with replacing the thermostat with an RTD sensor and adding a PID on a Bezzera Strega Lever which uses a similar group-head heating system as per this link - https://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-e...ra-strega.html

    more on this type of mod - https://www.home-barista.com/levers/...ga-t41686.html

    I seem to remember that Casa Espresso used to sell a BZ10 with PID which probably had this sort of mod. Anthony could confirm if he sees this.

    Just found this. See post #6 by Casa Espresso - https://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-e...ra-magica.html
    Last edited by CafeLotta; 2nd May 2019 at 06:19 PM. Reason: Corrections.
    buderim11 likes this.



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