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Thread: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

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    VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    This machine has a massive learning curve, particularly for someone coming from a Sunbeam Cafe Crema!!
    I bought the cheapest beans in the supermarket because I wanted to practice my grind/dose/tamp - but they were so bad/stale that it was a complete waste - brew pressure ran low around 4-5 bar, even with various degress of grind. Changed to fresh St Ali roasted Brazillian Cachoeira Yellow Bourbon and noticed a massive difference.
    I would love to hear what other users of this machine have found works well...
    Do you leave the machine on 24/7?
    How long do you wait before the machine is ready after turning on?
    How many shots do you pull before you drink your first one of the day?
    Given the low shower screen, what is your PF loading technique?
    Have you perfected the VBM steamer? Do you adjust the amount of steam based on size of jug?

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    All this info and more should be easily & quickly available from your retailer by way of a quick phone call.

    That of course is not to say that owners shouldnt get together for interesting, useful, entertaining, informative, social banter!

    Regardz,
    FC.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by fenners link=1192537898/0#0 date=1192537898
    This machine has a massive learning curve, particularly for someone coming from a Sunbeam Cafe Crema!!

    I bought the cheapest beans in the supermarket because I wanted to practice my grind/dose/tamp - but they were so bad/stale that it was a complete waste - brew pressure ran low around 4-5 bar, even with various degress of grind. Changed to fresh St Ali roasted Brazillian Cachoeira Yellow Bourbon and noticed a massive difference.
    Yes fenners- sadly, thats typical of supermarket swill- generally loooong past peak....

    I would love to hear what other users of this machine have found works well...
    Do you leave the machine on 24/7?
    How long do you wait before the machine is ready after turning on?
    How many shots do you pull before you drink your first one of the day?
    You can leave your machine on 24/7, however there are a couple of things to keep in mind:

    1. The pressurestat has a finite number of cycles and you will reach that number at least twice as rapidly if your machine is always on. Why not grab a time switch and have the machine turn on and off according to your needs? A 30 min warm up is great but you can squeeze a shot out quicker by flushing the group to speed heating of it and the group handle.

    2 Black balloons.... The VBM has an 1800W element. A heap of energy is wasted if youre not using it. Would you feel compelled to switch 36 x 50W light globes off if they were burning unused for a good period of the day, 24/7?? ;)

    As for start up shots; In a cafe, good practice is to ditch the first few shots on each group whilst dialling in the grinder. These seasoning shots lay down fresh coffee oils in the group as you should backflush with chemicals at the end of the shift. I suggest a daily water backflush and less frequent chemical backflush at home, so in theory, the first shot can be consumed if you happen to get it right. Nevertheless, some choose to call #1 of the day a sink shot....

    Given the low shower screen, what is your PF loading technique?
    Have you perfected the VBM steamer? Do you adjust the amount of steam based on size of jug?
    I tap gently against my palm while filling (no bench tap), brush off, settle with only the mass of the tamper, fill, brush off and then tamp. If you find that you habitually overfill, perhaps brush off with the base of your finger 2nd time or get some dosing tools....

    The wand tip of the VBM could have improved porting IMHO and does take a little longer to learn. I do adjust the pressure according to what Im doing (I have a 100ml macchiato jug ;)) but the key is to create a whirlpool (swirl) when you get started and keep the wand in the good sound area- just under the surface and then adjust the stretch as required.

    Another few options are to:
    - block one hole with line-trimmer thread (I suggest the rear hole) to slow things down while you learn your machine
    - re-drill the existing holes to force the porting to be more vertical
    - silver solder the 2 holes and then re-drill them at a more Giotto like angle- say 15 deg from the vertical. This final option works well and transforms the tip...


    Hope this helps!

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi Fenners,
    I am no expert but have had a VBM for a few months now and am very happy with it.
    Changes I have made :
    I increased the bolier pressure to 1.25 Barr and changed the steam tip to a 2 hole ( previously 4 hole) -I had to change the arm to do so -$40. Both made steaming milk a breeze
    I bought a Pullman tamper - excellent
    The latest purchase is a naked PF - I am now learning how to settle and tamp properly . You soon see when channelling occurs and this helps technique a lot
    I turn it off at night and on in the morning- It is ready to go after about 30 mins
    Best wishes
    Dr Dave

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I dose basically as 2mcm says, works well. Usually too lazy to bang out many shots dialling in, unless its drastically out (eg when changing beans).

    Usually switch on when I get home from work, and turn off at bed time (after a decaf or hot choc)

    Settings are at 10.5 bar and 1.2 bar.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt King link=1192537898/0#4 date=1192684898
    I dose basically as 2mcm says, works well. Usually too lazy to bang out many shots dialling in, unless its drastically out (eg when changing beans).

    Usually switch on when I get home from work, and turn off at bed time (after a decaf or hot choc)

    Settings are at 10.5 bar and 1.2 bar.
    Hi Matt,

    One thing to keep in mind is that the 2nd reading is system pressure rather than at the group head. In my experience, this gauge will typically read 1.0-1.5 Bar higher than when using a portafilter pressure gauge.

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    One of the things I have changed with dosing for the single basket is that I dont collapse it at all. Simply dose until full, level with my finger and then tamp.

    Before I adopted this pour would choke, now it is just about perfect every time. Also means I dont have to adjust grind for single and double.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1192537898/0#5 date=1192685090
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt King link=1192537898/0#4 date=1192684898
    I dose basically as 2mcm says, works well. Usually too lazy to bang out many shots dialling in, unless its drastically out (eg when changing beans).

    Usually switch on when I get home from work, and turn off at bed time (after a decaf or hot choc)

    Settings are at 10.5 bar and 1.2 bar.
    Hi Matt,

    One thing to keep in mind is that the 2nd reading is system pressure rather than at the group head. In my experience, this gauge will typically read 1.0-1.5 Bar higher than when using a portafilter pressure gauge.

    Chris
    hence I have it set to 10.5 ;) (No sarcasm, I based that on you previously making that statement). But to clarify in case anyone is confused, yes Im talking about the reading of the gauge on the machine.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Oh yeah, is it possible to get different steam tips for the VBM, without resorting to modification?

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    The coffeeparts ones fit.
    I sometimes use their 2-hole tip, however its harder to clean. The VBM tip is great that way, nothing sticks to it.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    One week down and this machine is absolutely fantastic.
    Practice makes perfect - I can see no reason to replace the steam tip.
    I have found consistency if I place the wand in the same place each time - thats obvious but not so easy as it has quite a large range of movement.
    I found that if the wand is just off vertical, I get best results.

    Im now trying to master my dose and get a consistent 30ml in 30sec shot. Im not finding this easy with the low shower screen.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I was also having trouble with this at the start, so now I use a lower dose (normally between 14 and 16g) Just grind, level around and tamp. I tried countless other methods and this one worked the best for me.

    It compacts down to around the bottom of the ridge or a mm below it on the double basket.

    I really like this method too, as I have found the fewer the steps the easier it is to be consistent.

    All other suggested methods resulted in the shower screen ripping the surface of the puck to pieces as it was loaded into the group.

    John.


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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I am using the same method as John.

    I simply could not get the group handle on using the other methods suggested.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I happened to have a power measuring device sitting at home for a few weeks, so I used it to measure the energy usage of my VBM Domobar super. I guess it would be interesting to share what I have recorded.

    For the power side of the reading, that is in Watts:

    The heating element: around 1780W
    The pump: 53.1W - 60W


    Now for the energy consumption, that is in kWh:

    30 mins from the start(when the boiler is in room temp): around 0.33kWh

    After making a latte: add another 0.1kWh

    leaving idle for 30 mins: add another 0.09kWh

    cleaning it (back flushing it 3 times, 5s each time): add another 0.1kWh

    I use (roughly) around 0.62kWh of energy every day to make coffee.
    That s like 9 cents a day. I guess I can afford that. ;)


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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi everyone,

    I have now had my VBM super since July and In my opinion I think that I have mastered it pretty well ...... but........Now it is time to fiddle!!

    I dropped the boiler pressure down to 1.15/1.2 bar at the pressure guage (3 turns in for the pressurestat screw)

    I opened up the OPV valve 1/8 turn which dropped the guage reading down to 10.5 bar (was reading 12 bar), I know this reading is a little optimistic and a portafilter guage is really necessary for very accurate readings..........

    These are the only changes made ie grind, dose, tamp are all as before.

    The improvement to the shots with all the various coffee that I have has been dramatic, better crema, no channeling, drier pucks etc etc.

    The question is : Have any other CSs made similar adjustments, and if so what are your conclusions ?

    Cheers Gazz






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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazz link=1192537898/0#14 date=1196246246
    Hi everyone,

    I have now had my VBM super since July and In my opinion I think that I have mastered it pretty well ...... but........Now it is time to fiddle!!

    I dropped the boiler pressure down to 1.15/1.2 bar at the pressure guage (3 turns in for the pressurestat screw)

    I opened up the OPV valve 1/8 turn which dropped the guage reading down to 10.5 bar (was reading 12 bar), I know this reading is a little optimistic and a portafilter guage is really necessary for very accurate readings..........

    These are the only changes made ie grind, dose, tamp are all as before.

    The improvement to the shots with all the various coffee that I have has been dramatic, better crema, no channeling, drier pucks etc etc.

    The question is : Have any other CSs made similar adjustments, and if so what are your conclusions ?

    Cheers Gazz
    Hi Gazz,

    We have been shipping VBM and 9.5 bar and about 1.2 bar. A p/f gauge is definitely useful as the second gauge reads system pressure rather than group pressure. I leave them at 9.5 bar as i have noticed that some pressure is frequently lost as the pump "beds in".

    I trained a client on an older pre ECA VBM and all I can say is that there were dramatic differences with the older machine shipped at 12.5 bar (via p/f gauge) and 1.25 bar, running red hot and huge cooling flushes. We ultimately dialled it back to 1.0 bar and it was a little better- but not the same as ECA stock. Peter Cairis told me that he had done a fair amount of work on VBM thermostability and I think I see the results of that....

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I just picked up a VBM Domobar Super Lever today :)

    Thanks to Renzo, Ofra and my wife for their help in working out which one to get.....

    Di Bartoli also lent me a dosered grinder while I work out which grinder to match it with...........problems problems :D

    Now for a name....

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Nice one Identity - but isnt a bezzera and a domobar a tad greedy? :)

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis link=1192537898/15#17 date=1196335683
    Nice one Identity - but isnt a bezzera and a domobar a tad greedy? :)
    This from a man who has just bought 3Kg Diedrich Home-Roaster..... :-? ;)

    Mal. ;D

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Well... one for home, one for the office. Im not sure I like the Domobarerman...it bit my wallet.

    *cough*... says Mal with the La San Marco & BZ-35!

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi All

    Ive had my VBM Super Lever / Mazzer Mini combo for a couple of months now!
    There was a bit of a learning curve :o(upgraded from a Silvia / Rocky (both very good units)).

    I experimented with the dosing for a while; I think I have it down pat now. :) Im getting very consistent shots regardless of which beans Im using. ;)

    The steam wand has to be used a more vertical than most, steams milk in an instant (almost).

    All up, Im very happy with the machine (combo)!

    Chris (Talk Coffee) was very helpful leading up to and post sale, hes customer service is 2nd to none!:D

    I would recomend this machine to anyone, once the dosing is right the shots are spot on (30ml in 25~30 seconds) you will be enjoyng great coffee at anytime you wish (espresso or milk based). Problem is friends and family will visit more (too) often, just for a great coffee. ::)

    Warren.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I am now a proud member of this group (thanks Chris!). I have set my brew pressure to 10.5 bar on the built in guage, and boiler pressure to a 1.05 - 1.25 bar cycle.
    Unfortunately I have only enough beans for my wake up call tomorrow morning, so no experimenting yet! Ill have to go and find a local roaster soon though because I dont think Ill sleep tonight without having a go with this!


    A few comments/questions:
    • The pump noise isnt nearly as bad as I had expected after reading a lot of reviews/user guides. I think the pump is quieter than my Silvia anyway (my only benchmark). There is a black rubber bit underneath the back of the cup tray that would dampen the sound.
    • Steaming power wasnt all it was hyped up to be by the same reviews. I came from a PID Silvia, steaming with as much pressure as I could before the heater turned off. The VBM certainly has more, but I still managed to steam as well as I ever have on the first try... It does steam a lot quicker... wasnt exactly hard to control though. The most difficult part was adjusting to the wand being on the other side of the machine! :P
    • The pressure stat noise. I was used to the silence of a solid state relay for so long. Now I have my pressure stat clicking on and off all the time! On for 11s, off for 1m40s, repeat. Im afraid the contacts will wear out! Does that cycle time sound right?
    • Ive noticed that in the 15 min or so after steaming or drawing water, the pump turns on for a second or so at a time, as if its refilling the boiler. It seems strange that the pump flicks on and off like this (probably happens 3 or 4 times after doing anything with the machine), I would think once the boiler is full, it remains full. Leads me to imagine leaks - but both wands are closed and theres no visible leakage from anywhere on the machine I can see.
    • When the heater is on the you can hear the boiler bubbling (understandably) but when the heaters off you can still hear the occasional bubble/creak/drip (cant quite tell what it is). Is this normal too?


    Just making sure my new baby (tank) is OK!! A little protective perhaps ;)

    Cheers,
    Sam

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Sammus link=1192537898/15#21 date=1197346648
    I

    A few comments/questions:
    • The pressure stat noise. I was used to the silence of a solid state relay for so long. Now I have my pressure stat clicking on and off all the time! On for 11s, off for 1m40s, repeat. Im afraid the contacts will wear out! Does that cycle time sound right?
    • When the heater is on the you can hear the boiler bubbling (understandably) but when the heaters off you can still hear the occasional bubble/creak/drip (cant quite tell what it is). Is this normal too?

    Sam
    Hi Sammus,

    The PS clicking is something you will get accustomed to and the cycling time is about right 11 on/ 1.40 to 2.00 off

    The pump will start occasionally to maintain correct water levels, it also starts when the water cools in the boiler if you have the switch in the #1 position, all this is normal.

    when the heaters off you can still hear the occasional bubble/creak/drip (cant quite tell what it is). Is this normal too? all this is the same as mine, It all has to do with thermo-dynamics.

    BTW welcome to the club.

    ps take off the cup warming tray and insert a very small wooden wedge (end of a clothes peg) each side between the outer case and the boiler cover this will stop the case vibrating when the pump is on.



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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi, having never owned an HX before, and having recently purchased one, I have done a bit of reading on this hx flush business. (The article on Home-Barista comes to mind).

    Now I was expecting an obvious spluttery/steamy water dance from my VBM, but alas, even when fully warmed up and idle for a while, I can flush some water, but it just runs nicely from the beginning. Sure you can see a bit of steam rising from around the group, but not from flash boiling (unless this fancy new HX can flash boil a lot of water!).

    Basically, I was hoping to notice a steamy spluttery flow, then be able to time the post sputtery flow to be able to (at least semi-) consistently hit temps. This isnt happening though, so basically... how much do you (all of you! ;)) normally flush? Do you have a technique to hit consistently hit different temps?

    Cheers!

    Sam

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    You should only need a short flush 60ml or so after more than say 15 min idle time, I usually do a quick squirt of 2-3 seconds between shots.

    Cheers Gazz

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi guys,

    Just bought a Vibiemme super lever today. It is the first coffee machine I have purchased. Never used a coffee machine before. So I guess I need to watch youtube clips and learn how to use it :)

    Ill definately be following this thread.

    Allblitz.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazz link=1192537898/15#24 date=1197360210
    You should only need a short flush 60ml or so after more than say 15 min idle time, I usually do a quick squirt of 2-3 seconds between shots.

    Cheers Gazz
    Are you sure? Maybe I need to lower my boiler pressure. With an hour or so idle my flushes sometimes run up to 20-30 seconds depending on what temperature I want.
    I use a non-pressurized thermo filter which is calibrated properly and normally after a long time idle I get max temperatures of 101 and I normally flush to around 96 then wait 20 or so seconds for the shot.

    My thermostat is at 1.25 bar at the top of cycle.

    Any suggestions?

    John.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi John,

    You can run it as low as 1.0 bar....You will still have heaps of steam ;)

    NB- to lower pressure with this pstat, you turn clockwise

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Thanks Chris,

    Ill give it a try at maybe 1.1 for a week or so and see how it goes.
    Steam is fine no matter what I have it set at, just sometimes I have to wait for the machine to catch up when making multiple drinks in a row, especially if I am pulling ristretto-ish shots. The extra 5 or 10 seconds you let them run you lose a noticeable amount of heat from the group and can take a while to recover (I was leaving it nearly 3 minutes before the temperature was the same as the shot before.)
    I cant remember what the pstat was set to then it could have been as low as .9 or 1.0.

    Finding the right setting seems to take a lot of time and experimenting...

    What have others with this machine found to suit them with the boiler pressure?

    Thanks,
    John.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    btw. With the boiler set at 1.0 and the standard VBM tip, steaming is a bit harder as you have to time the steaming with the boiler cycle otherwise the pressure drops to an unusably low level for the critical "stretching" phase of the milk.
    ie. you have to fully open the vale just before the element clicks off, so it is running the whole time you are texturing.

    The coffeeparts 2 hole tip works fine with this boiler setting but is painfully slow.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazz link=1192537898/15#22 date=1197350295
    ps take off the cup warming tray and insert a very small wooden wedge (end of a clothes peg) each side between the outer case and the boiler cover this will stop the case vibrating when the pump is on.
    Man I need to do that! The RHS panel at the top front corner (ie next to the pump gauge) vibrates something chronic when the boiler is filling! >:(

    I dont get it as nothing is in contact with it to cause it to vibrate so much. Obviously it hits a perfect resonance though. Maybe some Dynamat on the panel will alter its frequency and damp it a bit?

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Man I need to do that! The RHS panel at the top front corner (ie next to the pump gauge) vibrates something chronic when the boiler is filling! *>:(

    I dont get it as nothing is in contact with it to cause it to vibrate so much. Obviously it hits a perfect resonance though. Maybe some Dynamat on the panel will alter its frequency and damp it a bit?
    Just reorientate the pump Matt,

    Its probably contacting the body....

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I found the copper coil from the gauge was the culprit, it wasnt even touching anything, just resonating like a guitar string in mid air!
    (which in turn causes the gauge to "rattle" on the cover. You can tell if your one is doing this by seeing if the rattling stops when you press down in the centre of the gauge with your finger.)

    It also does not help that the gauges are not fixed to the front panel, they are just sitting there.

    I got a small piece of sticky foam I forgot where I put it, but then used a cable tie to gently hold the copper tube to it which stopped the noise. (think - turned one thing that can resonate into two things with a frequency twice as high needed to cause resonance
    You can also just try moving the copper tube to the gauge a bit too, it seems to get worse depending on where it is.
    I guess you could also put a drop of glue under the gauge too i you thought it would help...

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    One thing Ive noticed (to my disappointment*) about this machine is the group idle temp. One of the reasons I chose to buy this machine over other machines in the same price bracket was because of somthing that was mentioned in all the wonderful reviews I read from US based websites - that is the thermosyphon restrictor, which makes the group idle and a lovely 93C, requiring next to no flush before pulling a shot.

    Silly me forgot that everything is different over there and I shouldnt expect the same thing here. My group idles at about 102C and requires me to flush about 300ml through it before pulling a shot before the shot temp is within an acceptable temperature range. Ive reduced my boiler pressure from 1.05-1.25 bar to 0.9-1.1 bar to see if it makes much of a difference.

    *note that I am in no way disappointed with the machine on the whole, I still love it and it would still be my first choice even if Id known this before hand.

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Sammus link=1192537898/30#33 date=1197873297
    One thing Ive noticed (to my disappointment*) about this machine is the group idle temp. One of the reasons I chose to buy this machine over other machines in the same price bracket was because of somthing that was mentioned in all the wonderful reviews I read from US based websites - that is the thermosyphon restrictor, which makes the group idle and a lovely 93C, requiring next to no flush before pulling a shot.

    Silly me forgot that everything is different over there and I shouldnt expect the same thing here. My group idles at about 102C and requires me to flush about 300ml through it before pulling a shot before the shot temp is within an acceptable temperature range. Ive reduced my boiler pressure from 1.05-1.25 bar to 0.9-1.1 bar to see if it makes much of a difference.

    *note that I am in no way disappointed with the machine on the whole, I still love it and it would still be my first choice even if Id known this before hand.
    Hi Sam,

    FYI I plan to work on a set of thermostability mods for the Vibiemme in the New Year. As it runs well out of the box and is easy to calibrate, I think that we should be able to get some good results pretty rapidly and fairly inexpensively....

    Stay tuned!

    Chris

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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1192537898/30#34 date=1197873554
    Quote Originally Posted by Sammus link=1192537898/30#33 date=1197873297
    One thing Ive noticed (to my disappointment*) about this machine is the group idle temp. One of the reasons I chose to buy this machine over other machines in the same price bracket was because of somthing that was mentioned in all the wonderful reviews I read from US based websites - that is the thermosyphon restrictor, which makes the group idle and a lovely 93C, requiring next to no flush before pulling a shot.

    Silly me forgot that everything is different over there and I shouldnt expect the same thing here. My group idles at about 102C and requires me to flush about 300ml through it before pulling a shot before the shot temp is within an acceptable temperature range. Ive reduced my boiler pressure from 1.05-1.25 bar to 0.9-1.1 bar to see if it makes much of a difference.

    *note that I am in no way disappointed with the machine on the whole, I still love it and it would still be my first choice even if Id known this before hand.
    Hi Sam,

    FYI I plan to work on a set of thermostability mods for the Vibiemme in the New Year. As it runs well out of the box and is easy to calibrate, I think that we should be able to get some good results pretty rapidly and fairly inexpensively....

    Stay tuned!

    Chris
    Sounds great! :)

    PS got the jug today cheers ;)

  37. #37
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Wooohooo!!

    After weeks of snooping on your conversations and absorbing every word of your infectious enthusiasm with this magical machine (much of which I have yet to comprehend), Ive taken the plunge, thrown out the plunger and joined this elite club.

    Unfortunately I had to use a little marital subterfuge to get my precious VeeBeeEmey over the line. My unsuspecting wifes Christmas present is distressingly gathering pine needles on itís bright green and red wrapping paper under the tree. Since I cant imagine how I can trick her into unwrapping it for another week, Im torturously having to practice my Stockfleth technique on a wineglass, a very poor Portafilter substitute (I think she believes itís a pre-christmas nervous twitch).

    Truth is Iím a baristacratic virgin, other than a couple of shoddy pours in Renzoís backroom at DeBartoli while he was showing me the basics. I hope I havenít bought too much machine for my tender years. It was a toss-up between this and the Ms Silvia/Rocky combo and I blame the hole in my pocket on all of you who unwittingly steered me down this noble but pricy road. I will have to coax out at least a couple of reasonable Organic Skim Soy Capís to pacify the sticker shock by the time the credit card statement arrives (I know, I know sheís a philistine, but Iím working on her).

    Worse still weíre going on holiday so I will have to heft that lump of brass up to the Central Coast for itís Christmas morning unwrapping ceremony and inaugural Java juicing. Then back again to be set-up in our old home (for a week) before we move to our new home. Any ideas on how well the Domobar travels?

    Assuming we all survive the first few weeks, Iíll be back to connive some cunning counsel from you battle scared beanies. Looking forward to sharing more inevitable frothy frustrations.

    Terry

  38. #38
    Lez
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    I have had my Domobar Super for a couple of months now... and loving it!! I am pretty happy with my shots but the texturing of the milk has been a little more challenging. My steam tip has 2 holes which are on opposite sides of the tip. This seems odd to me - if the 2 steam holes oppose each other how can you get the milk to spin? My friend with a Giotto has 2 holes on their tip but the holes are on the same side (which makes sense to me). As I cant get the milk to spin I end up with milk that is a little to airy / frothy and not as silky as I would like it to be.

    I notice people have made suggestions regarding changing the tip but is it a technique problem or is it just easier to change the tip?

    Cheers,
    Lez

  39. #39
    TC
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Lez link=1192537898/30#37 date=1198010461
    I have had my Domobar Super for a couple of months now... and loving it!! I am pretty happy with my shots but the texturing of the milk has been a little more challenging. My steam tip has 2 holes which are on opposite sides of the tip. This seems odd to me - if the 2 steam holes oppose each other how can you get the milk to spin? My friend with a Giotto has 2 holes on their tip but the holes are on the same side (which makes sense to me). As I cant get the milk to spin I end up with milk that is a little to airy / frothy and not as silky as I would like it to be.

    I notice people have made suggestions regarding changing the tip but is it a technique problem or is it just easier to change the tip?

    Cheers,
    Lez
    Hi Lez,

    Microfoam with the VBM is doable but it does take a little longer than the Giotto wand to master.

    If its really irritatitng you, either silver solder the holes and re-drill with a 1.2-1.5mm drill at 15 deg from the vertical. Alternately, see if you can find a local jeweller or metal guy to do it for you...

    Good luck!

    Chris

  40. #40
    Lez
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Thanks Chris. :) Im not sure what silver soldering is so Ill have a chat with a jeweller.

    Lez

  41. #41
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Lez link=1192537898/30#39 date=1198098879
    Thanks Chris. :) Im not sure what silver soldering is so Ill have a chat with a jeweller.

    Lez
    Silver solder is a kind of solder with no lead in it, so its good for anything in contact with anything we eat/drink :)

  42. #42
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by Sammus link=1192537898/30#40 date=1198108850

    Silver solder is a kind of solder with no lead in it, so its good for anything in contact with anything we eat/drink :)
    Not quite true..... it doesnt have any lead is true..... but the high strength Silver solder contains Cadmium and that is far more poisonous than lead (it can kill very quickly if ingested :o)

    You have to make sure that the silver solder is cadmium free... designed for plumbing and other potable water systems..... best speak to a plumber - Not a jeweller or a mechanic ;)

  43. #43
    TC
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Interesting point Java,

    When speaking to my local metal wizard, he informed me that solder containing cadmium is no longer allowed into Australia....

    Any thoughts/info on this?

    Chris

  44. #44
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hi Chris.

    I believe BOC have stopped selling rods which contain Cadmium (fairly recently).... but that doesnt mean rods out there which have been bought some time ago dont.....

    I have the remains of a 50 pack in the shed which does.... bought a while ago for soldering boilers (but not the type on coffee machines.... the type that supply steam to human hauling live steam locos - the only thing that ingests the steam on those is the pistons)....

    Cadmium makes for a stronger weld.... but if used without due care can be very dangerous....

    And BOC (who I just spoke to) said cadmium containing silver solder can still be bought in some states from other makers (but not WA as the laws are very strict here)...

    So make sure the silver solder used has been freshly purchased from BOC and there wont be a problem.

  45. #45
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Cool. Learn somethin new every day :P

  46. #46
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Terry,

    Congratulations, you wont be sorry, they are a great machine.

    You will have lots of fun experimenting. I was going to elaborate on your virginal theme but resisted the temptation.

    As long as you keep the wand vertical, texturing should be fine.

    Well, almost resisted the temptation!

  47. #47
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Re: Boiler pressure

    With the boiler at 1.1 (top of cycle) cooling flush is almost eliminated. Max temp out of group after idle is around 99 degrees (I guess this means the group is around 96-97 itself), I flush for 10 or so seconds to 96, then around 45sec to recover.
    The shot is around 95 degrees, peaking at 96.5 a few seconds into it.
    As long as I dont flush too much to clean the shower screen, the temp stays stable with anywhere from 30sec to 1min between shots, anything up to 5 min only needs a second or two "spritz" to lower the peak temperature.
    I also find after making 2 or 3 consecutive shots with 1 min or so in between, the temp seems to get more stable (only varying +- 1 degree or so) I am guessing this is the optimal way to brew on this machine, as the group is a little cooler than at the start and absorbs the heat from the water which is a little hotter (lowering the peak temp).

    I have not seen or heard any boiling water since winding down the pressure (except maybe that chhhh sound for a second when idle over an hour) I think I will be leaving it set like this for a while.

    For a higher shot temp, I just flush a little less for the initial shot, (to around 97 for 96 shot temp) and the opposite for cooler temps.

  48. #48
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Quote Originally Posted by itsme5k link=1192537898/45#46 date=1198723272
    Re: Boiler pressure

    With the boiler at 1.1 (top of cycle) cooling flush is almost eliminated. Max temp out of group after idle is around 99 degrees (I guess this means the group is around 96-97 itself), I flush for 10 or so seconds to 96, then around 45sec to recover.
    The shot is around 95 degrees, peaking at 96.5 a few seconds into it.
    As long as I dont flush too much to clean the shower screen, the temp stays stable with anywhere from 30sec to 1min between shots, anything up to 5 min only needs a second or two "spritz" to lower the peak temperature.
    I also find after making 2 or 3 consecutive shots with 1 min or so in between, the temp seems to get more stable (only varying +- 1 degree or so) I am guessing this is the optimal way to brew on this machine, as the group is a little cooler than at the start and absorbs the heat from the water which is a little hotter (lowering the peak temp).

    I have not seen or heard any boiling water since winding down the pressure (except maybe that chhhh sound for a second when idle over an hour) I think I will be leaving it set like this for a while.

    For a higher shot temp, I just flush a little less for the initial shot, (to around 97 for 96 shot temp) and the opposite for cooler temps.

    Ive had a different experience. I picked up one of erics thermometer adaptors (well known on H-B if nowhere else) just after buying my machine, and with the boiler set to 1.1 bar on the top of the cycle, my group idles at ~100C, and when I flush, it will run 100C for about 150ml before starting to wind down. I usually cut the flush when the meter reads 97C (which is about 94C from the group) then lock and load, after which it holds about 94C throughout the shot. If I let it idle for longer than about a minute then it requires at least a 60ml flush to (I think this is what it does -) clear the HX of superheated water.

  49. #49
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Maybe mine needs a descale? :/\/ Or maybe there is some variation between machines or the pressure gauges?
    Just ran some water with no filter in place (after around 2 hours idle) and it only was spluttering for about 2 seconds.

    I use a single PF filled with silicone and a bead type TC feeding in through the spout, so I am only getting the water out temperature not the actual group temperature. There is no headroom, the silicone basically touches the shower screen and the only exit is past the TC through the spout. I am guessing the readings would be fairly accurate.




  50. #50
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    Re: VBM Domobar Super - Users Group

    Hello; fellow vibiemme home baristas.

    Scott from Hobart, Tasmania.

    Decided to buy this machine over various others, with minimal knowledge of the advantages; and disadvantages associated with the heat exchange Vs twin boiler machines.

    At first, very dissapointed; however... after I set the dose right; and fined up the grind (didnt realise VBM has a very low shower screen), I gained the correct expansion of the puck up to the screen; and obtained the thick crema, and better looking shots with some nice dark red colours. Impressed.

    There are so many variables with boiler pressure affecting the brew temp; boiler pressure affecting the steam power, and brew pump pressure.

    Has anyone done any tests with these variables with conclusive results?

    Length is also something I want to look into; how can I gain length without using a triple basket? Temps? Pressure?

    I am keen to get to know a few home baristas with the domobar super machines and brain storm to obtain outstanding coffee!

    Scott.



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