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Thread: Tanzanian Njari Wami - any guides

  1. #1
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    Tanzanian Njari Wami - any guides

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    I purchased these beans a few weeks ago and tried my first roast today. I use an FZ-RR-700 Baby Roaster.

    1). It came out a bit patchy 2). I couldn't find any info on how dark to roast these beans so just took a guess and pulled the roast about 15 sec into second crack.
    If there are any Coffee Snob guides out there who can offer suggestions, I would be very grateful.

    And - okay, I'm pushing my luck here - but any thoughts on how long to leave it in the one-way valve bag (given the special properties of the the FZ-RR-700) and how fine to grind it (I use a Mazzer Mini, manual version) would be very welcome.

    Cheers
    Jeremy

  2. #2
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    Jay, I don't know this bean though I have roasted and enjoyed the Tanzania Machare Estate (which tasted best after 10 days). I would expect this to improve with age, so perhaps leave it in the bag for around 5 days and then begin to cup. It should continue to improve for around 3 weeks. Let us know how you go with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    Jay, I don't know this bean though I have roasted and enjoyed the Tanzania Machare Estate (which tasted best after 10 days). I would expect this to improve with age, so perhaps leave it in the bag for around 5 days and then begin to cup. It should continue to improve for around 3 weeks. Let us know how you go with it.
    Many thanks Smokey. Any clues on how dark to roast these beans?

  4. #4
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    I always go just to start of second crack, I love the dark roasts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    I always go just to start of second crack, I love the dark roasts.
    Thanks. I pulled the roast about 15 sec into the second crack. Some of the beans look like they are roasted nice and dark on the outside but not on the inside. Last cry for help... any suggestions?

  6. #6
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    How long was the overall roast time?

    Darker outside than in suggests the roast was too quick.

    What time interval between 1st and 2nd crack? Scorching = too hot between 1st and 2nd crack.

    15 seconds into 2nd might be 14 seconds too long?

    Despite using the baby your roast still needs to rest, wait until day 7, at least, roast enough to make it to R+7.

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    Thanks Chokkidog. Much appreciated.
    I'll try a lower flame next time (first crack was around 8 min and second about 1 min later). Happy to let it rest for 7 days. Not too sure what you mean by 'Roast enough to make it to R+7'. Apologies for my ignorance.
    Cheers
    Jeremy

  8. #8
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    No.....I'm sorry Jeremy..... just meant for you to roast enough quantity so that if you get stuck in early you will
    have enough to make it to day 7! ;-)

    Aim for 11-12 mins to 1st crack and then 3&1/2 -4&1/2 mins to start of 2nd crack.

    Post up your results from next time!

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    Thanks.
    I still have enough Monsooned Malabar and Sulawesi blend to keep me going so no risk of digging into this batch too early. Thanks again. I will definitely slow the roast and put the results up on this thread.
    Cheers
    Jeremy

  10. #10
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    Jay, please keep us informed how it goes, sounds like a good rest will make a bit difference in taste as Chokkidog says.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    Jay, please keep us informed how it goes, sounds like a good rest will make a bit difference in taste as Chokkidog says.
    Absolutely. Will do. And thank you both for all your help.

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    Another go. Similar result.

    Another go today. I roasted two batches of the Tanzanian Njari Wami and two batches of the Monsooned Malabar. Both on a lower flame so a slower roast - first crack at 12 min in all four roasts.

    The MM came out fine. It always seems to (with hardly a gap between first and second crack). With the Tanzanian Njari Wami there was a minute or so between first and second crack, but the result was similar to last time; very dark on the outside but still looking like it is not roasted properly on the inside.

    Anyone got any thoughts on this?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  13. #13
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    The top line of beans look quite well roasted, but I shall leave the judgement to our experienced roasters.

    If you break them in half, what do they look like? Post a pic if you can.

    The generally accepted remedy for under-roasted beans is to leave them longer before using, and use in an aeropress or plunger rather than espresso.

    Your timing sounds OK, but lets look at some cracked beans first and check that out.

    EDIT:= that top line of beans have white/cream coloured chaff stuck in the centre crack, thats very normal, and it doesn't really go brown until it falls off into the chaff tray. I gather from the sizes that the top line is Tanzania and the bottom is Monsoon Malabar?

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    Thanks Smokey

    Turned out to be a great suggestion of yours to break those beans in half. A big thank you. Slightly embarrassing... when I opened them, they are well roasted inside and it's just a bit of chaff that made it appear that they weren't. Ah well, we learn best by our mistakes, and even more by our public ones.

    The lower line you referred to is the Monsooned Malabar beans, which I tend to roast more lightly. I prefer the flavour that way and the crema is still amazing.

    Cheers

    Jeremy

    Just saw your edit - after I posted my response. The RF-ZZ-700 doesn't have a chaff tray. Can I use that as an excuse?
    Attached Images Attached Images
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    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    Jay, they look awesome don't they, that crack-in-half trick works a treat

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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    Jay, they look awesome don't they, that crack-in-half trick works a treat
    They do indeed Smokey. Now you've solved that little problem for me and I know they are roasting fully, I may try pulling them a tiny bit earlier next time.
    Thanks again for all your help.

  17. #17
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Sounds like you're in the ball park JRM! Just some fine tuning needed?
    When taking a section through a bean I bite it in half then 'polish' the bit I'm left holding with an emery board,
    then blow/brush the powdery bits away. Magnifying glass or macro lens photo..................

    Here's one I did a couple of weeks ago, trying to sort out a high grown Bolivian bean that is quite
    fresh and high in moisture. A hard bean but it doesn't like too much heat early.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Emery board? I'm in enough trouble as it is for using my wife's makeup brush to clean the chute of my Mini Mazzer grinder!
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  19. #19
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Have to try that myself! Looks like some cool 'coffee art' for the wall
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  20. #20
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayReyMe View Post
    Emery board? I'm in enough trouble as it is for using my wife's makeup brush to clean the chute of my Mini Mazzer grinder!
    But you could make it up to her with some nice smooth fingernails? ;-D

    An emery board would be a shoe-in.... :-D

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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    An emery board would be a shoe-in.... :-D
    Or it could result in my next espresso having unmistakeable overtones of nail polish remover.

  22. #22
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    Sounds like you're in the ball park JRM! Just some fine tuning needed?
    When taking a section through a bean I bite it in half then 'polish' the bit I'm left holding with an emery board,
    then blow/brush the powdery bits away. Magnifying glass or macro lens photo..................

    Here's one I did a couple of weeks ago, trying to sort out a high grown Bolivian bean that is quite
    fresh and high in moisture. A hard bean but it doesn't like too much heat early.
    chokkidog, I am very curious at this procedure, what does the cross section your posted a picture of tell you? What are you looking for? What profiles tell you under, over or just right?

  23. #23
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    Here is a good little article looking at internal roast defects, with some of the cross section pics like chokkidog.

    http://bootcoffee.com/wordpress/wp-c...int_July05.pdf

    It is a good habit to get into if your a roaster. Depending on degree of roast, most of the time I just use a very sharp knife to cut a few beans open. Darker roasts / dryer beans tend to shatter more.
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  24. #24
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve82 View Post
    Here is a good little article looking at internal roast defects, with some of the cross section pics like chokkidog.

    http://bootcoffee.com/wordpress/wp-c...int_July05.pdf

    It is a good habit to get into if your a roaster. Depending on degree of roast, most of the time I just use a very sharp knife to cut a few beans open. Darker roasts / dryer beans tend to shatter more.
    Awesome article, thanks Steve82.

  25. #25
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Here's my attempt at an internal shot (this one is a Kenyan) - but I will now have to work out what I'm looking for! This was just cut with a very sharp knife.
    Those articles are good Steve… he has lots of cool info. Will have a read through that one too now

    DBC-Kenyan-.jpg

  26. #26
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    Well, according to the 'Boot' article, I'd say that looks like evidence of Internal Scorching Matt...

    How that translates into the particular roast profile you used, and any changes that should be applied (if any), I have no idea. Maybe Chokki can shed some light on it...

    Perhaps, according to additional info in the Boot article, the batch of beans you used may have contained differentiated moisture content patches throughout the bean, causing the inconsistent roasting throughout the bean. You could try what he suggests in this situation, and control the early part of the roast to slow down the temperature rate rise to give the beans a chance to 'normalise' the moisture content, and then increase the rate rise in the latter stages.

    It is all very interesting though...

    Mal.

  27. #27
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    Well, according to the 'Boot' article, I'd say that looks like evidence of Internal Scorching Matt...

    How that translates into the particular roast profile you used, and any changes that should be applied (if any), I have no idea. Maybe Chokki can shed some light on it...

    Mal.
    Hi Mal
    Yeah - that is how it would read. In the cup, I did find that batch a little aggressive compared to the smoothness of my usual profile - but not burnt or baked. But maybe that is the results of internal scorching?
    This is going a bit off topic - should move it back to the other thread …

    Sorry all!

    I do have some Njari I think - should roast some then come back to comment

  28. #28
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    chokkidog, I am very curious at this procedure, what does the cross section your posted a picture of tell you? What are you looking for? What profiles tell you under, over or just right?
    Looking for evenness/similarity of colour inside to outside. If the bean is darker inside than out then
    the bean has had too much heat too early and requires a mod to the profile ( same turn temp, lower initial heat value).

    Beans dark inside will show an ashiness/burnt taste or bitterness/harshness/'roughness' from the roast defect.

    Beans lighter inside will have a roast defect sourness that is not related to a lighter roast level sourness.

    With this particular bean?......... Shows me I'm in the ball park; need to section a couple more beans from the same roast
    to check trend but if it cups good ........ then all's ok. Maybe next roast take initial heat down from 80% to 75%, (first roast was 100%)
    and take another look.

    This was the second roast of the Bolivian, first roast was a write off..... ashy aftertaste :-( .........but that's how you learn.
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  29. #29
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Well, back on track, and trying to juggling two thread directions
    Did a batch of the Njari Wami tonight, profile & section photo included.
    This profile is a slightly faster ramp than the usual baseline profile, which I'm starting to do more with the SO Tanz and Eth beans - it just seems to maintain the fruits better in them. So about 2-3mins faster all up in a 750g batch.
    And if the photo is anything to go by, this profile should give a much better result than I achieved with the Kenyan! Much more even in colour… truly fascinating!
    FWIW the Kenyan was a hard start profile with the heat trailing off (by accident really) while this is a slow start / ramping roast. I find a ramping roast suits most beans - it's just the degree of ramp that changes origin to origin
    I'll update when it's in the cup!

    Have a great evening
    Matt

    20140401-TanzNjariWami-21amb.jpg

    DBC-Tanz-Njiri-Wami.jpg

    PS is it just me, or do most ethiopians/tanz beans need more heat through first crack to maintain temp through rolling first crack? Almost dropped to 2° RoR with the same setting that carried 7° the blend batch before!
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  30. #30
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Although Boot discusses internal scorching as a result of improper processing he doesn't quite
    get around to talking about how internal scorching can result from the application of an incorrect
    profile to any particular bean.

    We know that different beans/origins have different levels of moisture and hardness depending on altitude,
    season (rainfall etc), age and geography, so it would stand to reason that internal scorching can also be
    a direct result of roaster/roast error, even when the beans have been processed properly and well.

  31. #31
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Totally agree. I thought the article, while very interesting, didn't give a lot of practical roasting trouble shooting or solutions. Guess there's other article to read!
    But this internal scorching is an interesting one - that you don't normally see until you look. But you sure can taste it!
    Wish I'd cut a bean open years ago - might have developed my profiles more quickly! Have to keep a stanley knife with the roasting kit now too
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  32. #32
    Senior Member smokey's Avatar
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    DBCoffee, looks perfect to me!

    Chokkidog, I know this is off topic, but how could a roaster cause that internal burning that you mentioned?

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    DBCoffee, looks perfect to me!

    Chokkidog, I know this is off topic, but how could a roaster cause that internal burning that you mentioned?
    Hi Smokey
    I'll take a stab… please correct me Chokkidog if I'm way off!
    I think the 'plumbers crack' is a weak point in the bean casing. The smooth outside is protected by the chaff/harder surface early on - but if you put too much heat in early, that all goes straight into the softer core through this weak point - scorching the softer inside. However, if you go gently with the heat early on, the interior is able to give off it's moisture and expand gently, closing up the 'plumbers crack' - which then protects the inside from the hotter part of the roast towards first crack.
    That is certainly evidenced in my two roasts…!
    Cheers

    Matt
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  34. #34
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey View Post
    DBCoffee, looks perfect to me!

    Chokkidog, I know this is off topic, but how could a roaster cause that internal burning that you mentioned?
    Hi Smokey, the context for the term 'roaster' in post #30 is the human not the machine.

    Plenty of room for error in the human species..... :-D



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