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Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

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  • #16
    Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

    Agreed Andy- although the likelihood of seeing a grinder adjustment occur is minimal. In an air-con environment a beginning of the shift tweak may be all thats required. Open air is more challenging and I have done as many as 10 in a day. Id suggest that wed be looking for a great pour- and wed want to be in agreement as to what constitutes that. How many can pick channelling or pitting in the cup? Can we all distinguish sour from bitter? :-?

    I think that a thread in this forum may be appropriate but Id be way wary of publishing anything in print. Also regardless of the number of stars allocated- be it 3 or 5, the bottom line is that we only want to know about the absolute pinnacle: Some Melbourne examples- Im sure most would agree:

    St Ali
    Batch
    Headquarters (Optus Building- Simon James gig)


    Chris

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    • #17
      Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

      My business partner and I were talking about this very topic (a "seal of approval" etc) on the weegend.....and I must reiterate the sentiments of Chris & Andy that....it is a VERY delicate matter. We are not dealing with some kind of naive notion of coffee quality per se, but with egos and straight out plain and simple business relationships and income.

      If as a coffee supplier/roaster you heavy a cafe about the quality of the coffee (eg your coffee) that they are destroying, you lose the business if you dont handle it very very carefully and that is, instead of being able to negotiate with them to actually make better coffee thereby maybe gain clients & income and improve their name and the suppliers, you can very easily insult and lose them...after which they just go to the next supplier where they think the beans are "better".

      The other side of the coin could have an quicker negative effect for the supplier/roaster and that is, where an independent individual or body rates "seals of approval" and they approach a cafe about raising their standard, its more than likely the cafe will almost immediately change to their perception of a "better" supplier/roaster, rather than approach their incumbent supplier, because of their misunderstanding of the realites about coffee & quality.

      The improvement of standards generally in the market is an extremely very delicate matter with the easist & quickest result being that some supplier/roaster loses parts of his income base because someone said "the coffee" was not up to scratch.

      Tread carefully, think about it, these are very valid thoughts from the business end of the coffee town.

      Regardz,
      FC.

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      • #18
        Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

        Originally posted by Fresh_Coffee link=1134598251/15#16 date=1137623515
        My business partner and I were talking about this very topic on the weegend.....and I must reiterate the sentiments of Chris & Andy that....it is a VERY delicate matter. You are not dealing with some kind of naive notion of coffee quality per se, but with egos and straight our plain and simple business and income. If you heavy a cafe about the quality of the coffee ( eg your coffee) that they are destroying, you lose the business if you dont handle it very very carefully and that is, instead of being able to negotiate with them to actually make better coffee thereby maybe gain clients & income and improve their name and the suppliers, you insult and lose them...they just go to the next supplier where they think the coffee (beans) is "better".

        The improivement of standards generally in the market is a very delicate matter.

        Just some thoughts from the business end of town.

        Regardz,
        FC.
        ABSOLUTELY Attilio.....today I have a training gig in a prominent Melb Waterfront Cafe/Restaraunt. They are running a 40ml pour...in 6 seconds- including pre-extraction- topped with reheated milk crud. Bottom line is that I think their coffee is in the worst 2% in Melbourne, but clearly the coffee company would like to retain their business (at what cost to the brand  :-/. One only hopes that with a little palate work and some science, that they might begin to come around.... : Meanwhile they crucify the brand......

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        • #19
          Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

          Oops sorry Chris,

          While I reread my post and refined it a little... you quoted me on the first attempt! No worries, the sentiments are all the same!

          Cheers,
          FC.

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          • #20
            Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

            I think something along these lines would be a great thing to atleast set up on the CS webpage, given its own forum folder.. with a thread for each state. Cafes could be added to a poll and then voted on with a simple 5 star rating system, which doesnt need to get too finniky.. but has room to evolve.

            definately worth looking into IMO.

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            • #21
              Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

              I hadnt read this post in a while - looks like it exploded yesterday

              I was actually thinking that an "out of towners" thread may be useful, and would combine with this thread very well. Basically post a cafe/restaurant, its location and a rating - possibly with some comments.

              Im sure it would be useful for locals and out of towners.

              Grant

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              • #22
                Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

                I like the idea of rating, but it could be misconstrued and we would be done for. I have to say I am generally disappointed with the coffee makers in general in the ACT. Even to the point where a coffee name related cafe couldnt correctly produce a double ristretto. I watched it being made; it was a straight double shot. No crema. Sat there for three minutes (I timed it) while the bean monkey chatted with the wait staff.

                I do however take my hat off to the coffee cart people who work the machines in many of the government building lobbies. They cart in and out their own water, keep the workstations spotlessly clean and are really polite. Yes they do use the same jug but their turn over is a lot higher than the stingy ones who put a 600ml jug in the fridge until the next sorry sap comes along.

                At one stage I thought about leaving a CS card on the table with a rating, but I thought that might bring us into disrepute.

                There must be a way we can say this mob is better than that mob. Do we need to experts, hell no I say. Were better, were Coffee Snobs and we know what we like.

                If you make trash coffee, you get a trash score, get it twice and its buyer beware. How about some of these folders.
                1. Auto shot bots - That’s what the last owner said I should do / showed me / was on the video I saw / Im just earning a few bucks / Time what, I just press here…
                2. Bean monkey - Before they got so far up themselves they probably used to make decent coffee, now it’s all about ego and hair product…
                3. We have no idea. PFs on the drip tray, more flavours than customers, plants growing out of the knock tube…
                4. Organ grinder. Coffee cart pros who are able to turn a humble take away into a life giving entity given they have no permanent plumbing or refrigeration.
                5. Giddy up. Oh yeah, Ill have another, nuf said.

                Food for thought

                Boris

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                • #23
                  Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

                  tis an interesting thread.

                  St Ali
                  Batch
                  Headquarters (Optus Building- Simon James gig)
                  ...and if you read the barrage of CG & CS posts you would include Maltitude at the top of that post too.

                  Ahh... but the "coffee at the Malt is sh!thouse now" (quote - fromthebeanbag)

                  Places change hands, different people, different places, different times. It needs to be a more personal level than "this place does good coffee" with the exception of Boriss "Organ grinder" and one man shows who do a great job as a rule.


                  ...because someone said "the coffee" was not up to scratch.
                  Its not about "just" the coffee. I really was talking more about the process. Good pour, clean workstation and generaly showing an interest in creating the best result they can.

                  Im a CoffeeSnob but Ill drink most anything (even that instant stuff at "friends" houses) and I have left double espressos in the counters of shops before (after telling the owner how bad it was).

                  At the last cafe day we were drinking Coffex. It was fairly well prepared but was very disinteresting coffee as a double-shot. I would still give this place a thumbs-up.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

                    Originally posted by Andy Freeman link=1134598251/15#22 date=1137676825
                    tis an interesting thread.

                    St Ali
                    Batch
                    Headquarters (Optus Building- Simon James gig)
                    ...and if you read the barrage of CG & CS posts you would include Maltitude at the top of that post too.

                    Ahh... but the "coffee at the Malt is sh!thouse now" (quote - fromthebeanbag)

                    Places change hands, different people, different places, different times.  It needs to be a more personal level than "this place does good coffee"  with the exception of Boriss "Organ grinder" and one man shows who do a great job as a rule.


                    ...because someone said "the coffee" was not up to scratch.
                    Its not about "just" the coffee.  I really was talking more about the process.  Good pour, clean workstation and generaly showing an interest in creating the best result they can.

                    Im a CoffeeSnob but Ill drink most anything (even that instant stuff at "friends" houses) and I have left double espressos in the counters of shops before (after telling the owner how bad it was).

                    At the last cafe day we were drinking Coffex.  It was fairly well prepared but was very disinteresting coffee as a double-shot.  I would still give this place a thumbs-up.
                    Thats what makes it all the more challenging Andy  . You see, I probably wouldnt give them the thumbs up. The coffee was average at best (although "surgically enhanced") and the attitude and service there were pretty much as good as the coffee....not to mention the fact that they were unable to get the bill right and would have ripped us for $70 if wed paid the bill without checking. They did however do a great breaky!  ...so for me, they might have got 3/5...

                    Chris

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                    • #25
                      Re: Classic Quotes from a real-life Cafe.....

                      I didnt go, but having had a coffe with both these blokes Id say the place was a Bean Monkey venue. (see above).

                      Boris.

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