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  • vyapada
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 7E4146415C495B5B4D280 link=1293652029/19#19 date=1293944491
    Originally posted by 4F405849585D58390 link=1293652029/18#18 date=1293943989
    There are also specialty robusta coffees
    From a learning point of view could you recommend any that might bely the harsh, course reputation of what is usually considered a lesser bean used as cheap filler in cost cutting blends?

    Not being sarcastic at all... if its good I definitely want to try it. After all... good is good regardless of tags or labels.
    Sorry I only know about them, havent tried any to my knowledge.
    IIRC there are occasionally some in beanbay and Ive seen sweetmarias sometimes stock some... the shipping would likely be a deal breaker, though.

    Leave a comment:


  • A_M
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 0C2329344D0 link=1293652029/24#24 date=1293960065
    Originally posted by 6D424B495E614D424D4B49414942582C0 link=1293652029/22#22 date=1293957843
    Then I would suggest that, only where the MAJORITY of the beans roasted by the facility - meet the requirements of "Specialty Grade Green Coffee (1): "can they be called such
    51% of total sales figures or 51% of volume?

    :-?
    Or by weight Green vs Roasted ;D :

    ROFLMFAO

    Happy New Year 8-)

    Leave a comment:


  • Andy
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 6D424B495E614D424D4B49414942582C0 link=1293652029/22#22 date=1293957843
    Then I would suggest that, only where the MAJORITY of the beans roasted by the facility - meet the requirements of "Specialty Grade Green Coffee (1): "can they be called such
    51% of total sales figures or 51% of volume?

    :-?

    Leave a comment:


  • Vinitasse
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Just to flesh out the SCAA Specialty Grade Stadards (Nov 2009 revision) to see how your own beans stack up:

    The SCAA Specialty Standard for All Arabica Coffee

                                   STANDARD        CONDITIONS

    Primary Defects         0
    Secondary Defects     maximum 5        350 gm sample green coffee
    Moisture Content        10-12%             (11.5% is optimum)
    Cup Evaluation           80 points +        100 gm sample roasted coffee
    Quakers                     0                      100 gm sample roasted coffee

    A here is an "exchange rate" chart for defects:

    SCAA DEFECT CATEGORIES

    (Sample Size 350 g.)

    CATEGORY 1

    Black                    1 = 1
    Sour                     1 = 1
    Cherry/Pod               1 = 1
    Fungus                   1 = 1
    Severe Insect Damage     5 = 1
    Foreign Matter           1 = 1

    CATEGORY 2

    Part Black               3 = 1
    Part Sour                3 = 1
    Parchment                5 = 1
    Withered                 5 = 1
    Slight Insect Damage    10 = 1
    Broken/cut               5 = 1
    Floaters                 5 = 1
    Husks/Hulls              5 = 1
    Immatures                5 = 1

    Leave a comment:


  • A_M
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 436C667B020 link=1293652029/21#21 date=1293955694
    Specialty Grade Green Coffee (1):
    Specialty green coffee beans have no more than 5 full defects in 300 grams of coffee.  No primary defects are allowed.  A maximum of 5% above or below screen size indicated is tolerated.  Specialty coffee m ust possess at least one distinctive attribute in the body, flavor, aroma, or acidity.  Must be free of faults and taints.  No quakers are permitted.  Moisture content is between 9-13%.
    AND

    Originally posted by 436C667B020 link=1293652029/21#21 date=1293955694
    o if that is the definition of specialty coffee then what is a Specialty Coffee Roaster?
    Then I would suggest that, only where the MAJORITY of the beans roasted by the facility - meet the requirements of "Specialty Grade Green Coffee (1): " can they be called such :

    Some how I think that may cause even further discussion  

    Now lets toss in " BOUTIQUE " Roaster ?  ( a small shopping outlet, especially one that specializes in elite / highly desirable items)

    HOWEVER- I am afraid it is like Engineer Or Barista etc etc. Marketing comes into play along with name dropping and unless it is ILLEGAL  OR A Part of CERTIFICATION that is regulated.  

    Then people can call themselves what every they want  :

    PS. Do I agree with it... NO!!!!!  

    Can I do any thing about it - Only voice my view and then walk away.

    Leave a comment:


  • Andy
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Officially the term "Specialty Coffee" happens before the cupping forms, it happens during at the green bean sample according to SCAA (who as I mentioned AASCA follow seemingly blindly)

    Their take is:

    Specialty Grade Green Coffee (1):
    Specialty green coffee beans have no more than 5 full defects in 300 grams of coffee. No primary defects are allowed. A maximum of 5% above or below screen size indicated is tolerated. Specialty coffee m ust possess at least one distinctive attribute in the body, flavor, aroma, or acidity. Must be free of faults and taints. No quakers are permitted. Moisture content is between 9-13%.

    Premium Coffee Grade (2):
    Premium coffee must have no more than 8 full defects in 300 grams. Primary defects are permitted. A maximum of 5% above or below screen size indicated is tolerated. Must possess at least one distinctive attribute in the body, flavor, aroma, or acidity. Must be free of faults and may contain only 3 quakers. Moisture content is between 9-13%.

    Exchange Coffee Grade (3):
    Exchange grade coffee must have no more than 9-23 full defects in 300 grams. It must be 50% by weight above screen size 15 with no more than 5% of screen size below 14. No cup faults are permitted and a maximum of 5 quakers are allowed. Moisture content is between 9-13%.

    Below Standard Coffee Grade (4):
    24-86 defects in 300 grams.

    Off Grade Coffee (5):
    More than 86 defects in 300 grams.


    Primary Defect # equal to one full defect
    Full Black 1
    Full Sour 1
    Pod/Cherry 1
    Large Stones 2
    Medium Stones 5
    Large Sticks 2
    Medium Sticks 5

    Secondary Defects # equal to one full defect
    Parchment 2-3
    Hull/Husk 2-3
    Broken/Chipped 5
    Insect Damage 2-5
    Partial Black 2-3
    Partial Sour 2-3
    Floater 5
    Shell 5
    Small Stones 1
    Small sticks 1
    Water Damage 2-5

    ...Thats the "SCAA (ergo AASCA) official definition Specialty Coffee".
    As mentioned, its a silly spec as some of the best coffee that I have ever tasted would score badly following those rules including nearly every dry process coffee and nearly every wet hulled one.

    So if that is the definition of specialty coffee then what is a Specialty Coffee Roaster?

    Leave a comment:


  • Vinitasse
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    I think the word "Specialty" in reference to either coffee or roasters implies a quality statement. My understanding is that the SCAA was established in order to drive quality in the industry. With this goal in mind they had to set out semi-concrete means by which to differentiate crap coffee from quality offerings. They evolved standards that focused greatly on the grading of processed green coffee. Setting standards for such things as the number of defects allowed per sample size forced coffee growers to shift their focus from maximum tonnage per hectare to a focus on quality grading and processing as any coffee beans meeting the higher standards set by the SCAA would be able to fetch far higher prices on the coffee trading market. Of course a nicely polished green bean screened at 18 or above does not necessarily provide a guarantee of excellence in the cup and this is where specialty roasting comes into play. A factory cranking out tonnes of hot air blasted brown beans on a daily basis probably hasnt been able to take that green bean to the same potential level of coffee perfection that a small batch specialty roaster is able to achieve with the extra artisan level attention he or she is able to invest in the bean. I guess I am saying the bottom line for me is QUALITY... quality beans of traceble origin (simple geographics) and pedigree (reputation and experience) from quality growers roasted in a manner respectful of the terroir and character of the bean... that to me is Specialty Coffee

    Leave a comment:


  • Vinitasse
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 4F405849585D58390 link=1293652029/18#18 date=1293943989
    There are also specialty robusta coffees
    From a learning point of view could you recommend any that might bely the harsh, course reputation of what is usually considered a lesser bean used as cheap filler in cost cutting blends?

    Not being sarcastic at all... if its good I definitely want to try it. After all... good is good regardless of tags or labels.

    Leave a comment:


  • vyapada
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    No.
    There are also specialty robusta coffees.

    Leave a comment:


  • Vinitasse
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Would we all be agreed in that anything labelled as Specialty Coffee should not include any Robusta?

    Leave a comment:


  • GrahamK
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    To be honest, Im not really qualified to buy into this discussion, but I have re-read what Attilio wrote, and what has been misquoted as him saying. You suggested he wrote:

    Originally posted by 3932203C3D20303B363F272620530 link=1293652029/14#14 date=1293924908
    its roasters who buy specialty coffee  
    But in fact he did not use the term "speciality coffee". He said roasters had access to "different types of coffee", but that there was a difference between a "Commodity Roaster", and a "Speciality Roaster". I do not know the SCAA and AASCA "rules" to which you refer, but just based on what I read, I cannot see the "Doublespeak" to which you refer from that statement.

    I have a family member who has been a "Speciality Roaster" for over 15 years, and they refer to the fact they are a specialty Roaster not a roaster of "speciality beans" necessarily. It may all be semantics, and thats about as much as I know.

    Grahamk

    Leave a comment:


  • Andy
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 1F2B3C2A31061A363F3F3C3C590 link=1293652029/1#1 date=1293653281
    Its not "specialty coffee"! Every roaster has access to all the different types of coffee. It is up to the roasters what coffees they choose to deal in, the type of business they want to run, ad the type of image they want to portray.
    How many kilos (@ $40/kg green) Cup of Excellence would you like to put into your next house coffee to sell at $25/kg? Let me know because well happily buy it!

    Originally posted by 33382A36372A3A313C352D2C2A590 link=1293652029/14#14 date=1293924908
    I can give examples, but it would require names of companies that are not site sponsors and being kicked off this site again would be tedious.
    Tedious is people talking cheap shots in public space. Simple rules exist for a reason Jason, dont break them and we all get along just fine.

    Originally posted by 33382A36372A3A313C352D2C2A590 link=1293652029/14#14 date=1293924908
    If youd like to see your ideas included in the definition, approach the SCAA or AASCA and make a case for it.
    Thats an interesting thought.
    I dont like your chances of getting SCAA to ever change their mind but I have always wondered why AASCA have to follow their lead instead of cutting their own path. I for one would like to see the definition changed because if the SCAA grading process is followed to the letter all dry process coffees score low. The SCAA scoring will always rate something like a Jamacian Blue Mountain higher than a wild dry process Harrar and as we all know... One mans coffee fault is another mans fruit and berry pleasure.

    Originally posted by 1F2B3C2A31061A363F3F3C3C590 link=1293652029/1#1 date=1293653281
    there are commodity coffee roasters and SPECIALTY coffee ROASTERS
    I can understand that concept too. Having a quick look though the membership list of Austral Asian SPECIALTY Coffee Assn (AASCA) roasters you would have to assume that most of their membership is basing their status on that too.
    :

    I guess that leads to the next quesiton of:

    How many Speciaty coffees should a roaster roast to call themselves a specialty coffee roaster?

    1 a year? 5 every week? 20% of their annual turnover? only ever roast specialty coffee?

    Leave a comment:


  • jasonscheltus
    Guest replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 437760766D5A466A63636060050 link=1293652029/1#1 date=1293653281
    Its not "specialty coffee"! Every roaster has access to all the different types of coffee. It is up to the roasters what coffees they choose to deal in, the type of business they want to run, ad the type of image they want to portray.

    Ergo....there are commodity coffee roasters and SPECIALTY coffee ROASTERS.  The word specialty refers to the roaster not the coffee.  

    Other opinions?
    This makes no sense to me at all.

    Firstly not everyone has access to the same green coffee, I can give examples, but it would require names of companies that are not site sponsors and being kicked off this site again would be tedious.

    Secondly, how can you say first that its not "specialty coffee" its roasters who buy specialty coffee that make them "specialty coffee roasters"? You need to define "specialty coffee" to define "specialty coffee roaster"! Youre confusing the argument with doublespeak.


    Specialty coffee is defined as coffee that scores 80 points or above on either the SCAA form or the COE form.

    The term gets highjacked a lot and substituted for gourmet waaay too often, incorrectly. You might have different ideas as to what you think specialty coffee should be, but bringing these ideas up on a forum as if they were true is misleading and confusing. If youd like to see your ideas included in the definition, approach the SCAA or AASCA and make a case for it.

    Leave a comment:


  • pressurestat
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 407C617A707166737B70140 link=1293652029/12#12 date=1293748737
    Originally posted by 262A232E2E274B0 link=1293652029/11#11 date=1293743462
    is there a food rule that says you have to have a best / use before date?
    Off the top of my head yes.
    Some types of food have Best Before and others have to have Use By (fresh food, meat, milk etc?).

    EDIT:
    http://www.foodauthority.nsw.gov.au/consumers/food-labels/label-facts/best-before-and-use-by-dates/



    Oh was wondering why they never had an expiry date on a can of tuna.... well according to

    http://www.foodauthority.nsw.gov.au/consumers/food-labels/label-facts/best-before-and-use-by-dates/

    If the shelf life is longer than 2 years, no date mark is required at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • Thundergod
    replied
    Re: Speciality Coffee????

    Originally posted by 262A232E2E274B0 link=1293652029/11#11 date=1293743462
    is there a food rule that says you have to have a best / use before date?
    Off the top of my head yes.
    Some types of food have Best Before and others have to have Use By (fresh food, meat, milk etc?).

    EDIT:
    http://www.foodauthority.nsw.gov.au/consumers/food-labels/label-facts/best-before-and-use-by-dates/

    Leave a comment:

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