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Why cant cafes get the temp right!

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  • Why cant cafes get the temp right!

    So many cafes, good one seem to make coffees on the cool side of warm.. Its annoying paying for a quality cup and have to drink it fast it its cold!
    What happened to a thermometer to get it right?
    Thats my rant.

  • #2
    Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

    Probably its a learned response to many non-snobs complaining that their latte is too hot

    or something silly like that :

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    • #3
      Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

      Originally posted by 64495D4F4041464F695C6E495C4D280 link=1327368369/1#1 date=1327369523
      Probably its a learned response to many non-snobs complaining that their latte is too hot

      or something silly like that  :
      Or the that one persons "too cool" can be another persons "too hot". Subjective measurements relative to prior conditioning of some sort. So maybe the many cafes that are making it on the "cool side of warm" by your perception, are spot on for a majority of people.

      GrahamK

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      • #4
        Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

        On the contrary I find most cafes make the coffee too hot so that it burns (although this is less common than it used to be). GJs seem especially bad here and they have thermometers. Depending on the cafe I ask for a "warm, not hot"

        ... actually I ask for a "small capuccino, freshly ground. No, those grinds arent freshly ground, your doser is full and nobody has bought a coffee for 10 minutes at least. Please dont brush the grinds off the bench back into your doser. The doser is the bit that has your stale grinds in it... oh, and not over extracted, and warm, not hot. Please. Why are you looking at me like that?"

        now I just have one at home before I go

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        • #5
          Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

          It might sound like im coming across as some newby with no idea but thats not the case. There is a temp thats range that coffee should be made at and there is a big difference between one that you have to drink in one mouthful nearly and one that you can sit and enjoy..

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          • #6
            Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

            Are you talking about the temperature of the milk or the temperature of a straight espresso?

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            • #7
              Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

              I went back to what used to be the best cafe near my work yesterday after not being there for many weeks as I rarely get a chance to get away from work. It seems they have changed owners. My double shot flat white must have been about 100 degrees celsius. And the shot it was based on was pure swill. Worst coffee in a long time - had to throw it out. Terribly disappointing.

              In my area, Id have to agree with iaindb - most cafes make it way too hot and ruin the taste.

              As for the full doser thing - the cafe inside my workplace always has a full doser and it is always stale (just one of many reasons why I never buy coffee from there). I was gobsmacked the other night, I was there to buy a snack at closing time and saw the staff member fill the hopper to the brim, then grind the doser full, and proudly comment to her co-worker that she had the coffee all ready to go in the morning! The coworker commented - "good work, thanks." I couldnt believe my eyes.

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              • #8
                Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                thats worse than the local "fresh bean" retailer at the markets who I saw emptying the grind catch tray back into the doser during a quiet period... needless to say the doser was quite full anyway.

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                • #9
                  Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                  Yeah, not sure where the OP buys their coffees but my experience is that of some of the other comments, that coffee (milk based) is too hot at most cafes that I visit. Interesting thing about thermometers as a side note...I have one and the range seems to be above what I have been told by many people to be the right range. The marked area on the thermometer is 60-70C, and Im told that 55-60C is the ideal range for milk to avoid burning or breaking down the sugars, and to avoid overdoing the espresso shot(s).

                  For me personally, anything milk based over ~62-63C is too hot for my tongue and burns my tastebuds (leaving that lovely furry-tongue feeling). So thats at the bottom of the "ideal" range given by my thermometer.

                  And on the topic of "cafes being unable to get things right" it sounds like there are some other snobs like me who like to watch bad (non-existent) barista skills at work. I stood and watched a the team at a local GJ doing their thing a few weeks ago. I was on an upper shopping center floor and had a great vantage point to observe. The biggest positive going for the team was their speed and efficiency. Two girls on the three group machine, were smashing out the shots...pity the quality wasnt there...but they were smooth to watch. Scary thing was that they were using digital stopwatches mounted to the upper face of the machine (on an auto-shutoff machine), and were pulling shots in well under 15 seconds. So the machine was set to stop the shots at that time, and the extraction was almost clear water in that time. EEEK! But of course they just fill their gigantic cardboard cups with half a litre of milk and people are none the wiser. Another interesting thing I observed there was dosing/tamping/polishing (with good consistent technique, but wrong grind setting/dose), followed by sprinkling of cocoa powder over the polished puck before locking the handle into the head. Wonder if thats how they make their mocca? Cant imagine thats good for the extraction process. Anyway, slightly OT, but I was quite intrigued by what I saw.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                    I suppose everyone has differing opinions, but using your hand to check your temp will differ from one person to the next and from one day to the next, its just not consistent..anyway, I aint complaining..

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                      Originally posted by 5B546C6B6B7860190 link=1327368369/0#0 date=1327368369
                      So many cafes, good one seem to make coffees on the cool side of warm.. Its annoying paying for a quality cup and have to drink it fast it its cold!
                      What happened to a thermometer to get it right?
                      Thats my rant. 
                      Seems to me the cafes you have frequented arent working to a (the) standard.  Simply put, either they have the education and know the standard but choose not to use it, or they dont have the requisite coffee education.  There can then be many other interpretations around that. Another that springs to mind, is they are not cupping their own coffee with a view to seeing what their clients might think of it, or they dont care what their clients think and decide to simply push what they want to..... You have the choice to tell them how you like it, and they have the choice to oblige or lose a client. So its not all about the coffee, its business too!

                      Hope that helps.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                        The usual problem I have with cafes is overheated/scalded milk on top of a terrible espresso which would have so many factors wrong I wouldnt be able to tell which is causing the biggest problem.

                        Usually when I hear about people complaining about (milk based) coffee being too cold, its because they are used to overheated, undrinkable (without risking burns) coffee.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                          Originally posted by 1C132B2C2C3F275E0 link=1327368369/9#9 date=1327390961
                          I suppose everyone has differing opinions, but using your hand to check your temp will differ from one person to the next and from one day to the next, its just not consistent..anyway, I aint complaining..
                          I actually found that my "hand to jug" technique was too cold, and I often made "cold" coffee even for myself, putting it down to a cold cup or something else. I bought a cheap digital food thermometer of ebay and found I could go an extra 5-10 degrees, so I adjust my "hand to jug" technique to make a few presses but not hold continuously. I guess even humans need calibrating

                          Originally posted by 2A3F3D315E0 link=1327368369/11#11 date=1327451100
                          Usually when I hear about people complaining about (milk based) coffee being too cold, its because they are used to overheated, undrinkable (without risking burns) coffee.
                          I agree, and as much as you may want to educate them, if thats still how they want it then thats how they should get it - after all they are the paying customer. I once heard a lady order a "extra hot capuccino" followed by "I know thats not how its supposed to be, but thats how Id like it". To which the barista complied. Thankfully he made mine well.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                            Notwithstanding, there are enough cafes around that do serve an unnacceptably "cool" milk coffee.....that is one that really is only luke warm.

                            There is an acceptable range of temperature outside of which no matter whether it is hotter or cooler, it is just not acceptable to most, individual preferences aside.

                            Some cafes that serve unacceptably "cool" milk coffees, are also the ones that make a song and dance to their clients about serving it at the "right" temperature (some even have a sign on the wall)  as if to educate the client about whats good for them. In those instances, and they do exist, their attitude is misguided and unacceptably condescending. Just like some cafes that refuse to serve decaff because they say its not real coffee......Place yourselves in the consumers shoes.

                            Good (commercial) coffee goes hand in hand with good business acumen.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Why cant cafes get the temp right!

                              Agreed. I look forward to the day when I have my own coffee-related business, hopefully Ill get it "right"!

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