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  • Domestic coffee machine question

    A lot of domestic coffee machines come with a 15bar pump. What does "15bar" mean? Is that mean the pump can produce max 15bar of pressure within the group head when brewing coffee? Im confused.

  • #2
    Re: Domestic coffee machine question

    Good question, and this topic covers one of the great marketing coups of the century.


    Let me explain:
    Lets say you originate the furphy by putting on the side of your box that your pump is 14 bars.

    I then counter by putting on the side of my competing box that my pump is 15 bars.

    You eventually counter by upping the side of your box to 16 bars.

    I eventually counter by putting 18 or 19 bars on the side of mine............

    In reality:

    irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant,irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant, irrelevant............

    The figure is the maximum rated pump pressure that pump can produce.

    The machine DOES NOT make coffee at the max rated pump pressure that the pump can produce. All machines that I know of have some kind of pressure bleedoff to reduce the pump pressure to the working pressure at which it makes coffee, that the manufacturer chooses to set.

    ie it is the most useless piece of information that the clowns in the marketing departments have ever thought up to hoodwink the general public with. Mind you theyre not telling you any lies, theyre just not telling the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth....

    In additon there are very few companies making pumps for this purpose and they ALL do the job no matter what their maximum rated pressure is.

    Your question therefore simply needs to be not how many bars does it have, but, can it be demonstrated to make espresso properly. If it makes a good espresso when operated by someone that knows how, who cares what the max rated pump pressure is?

    Hope this helps, another frustration vented!

    Regardz,
    Attilio
    first / original CS site sponsor.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Domestic coffee machine question

      Sweet~~spot on to what i want to clairify
      Thx~~~my friend

      Tony.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Domestic coffee machine question

        i have a cheap machine (one of 4 that i have) and i find that due to lack of pressure the water just seems to trickle through the beans and the coffee is watery. the better quality machines that i have seem to really push the water through and consequently i get a pretty good crema and stiff coffee. so to me it seems that pump pressure is quite important for a good end product. am i incorrect with this line of thought?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Domestic coffee machine question

          You certainly need adequate pressure to get a good extraction. These days that is commonly said to be 9 bar at the group head.

          This is why the difference between a 12 bar pump and an 18 bar pump is marketing. Both pumps will have the over-pressure valve set to provide the right pressure and the rest just pumps water either to waste, or back into the tank!

          Greg

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          • #6
            Re: Domestic coffee machine question

            Originally posted by ijz917w link=1226554583/0#3 date=1226905042
            i have a cheap machine (one of 4 that i have) and i find that due to lack of pressure the water just seems to trickle through the beans and the coffee is watery. the better quality machines that i have seem to really push the water through and consequently i get a pretty good crema and stiff coffee. so to me it seems that pump pressure is quite important for a good end product. am i incorrect with this line of thought?
            You may need to use a coarser grind or a lower dose. Alternatively, your machine might have a pressurised portafilter that artificially reduces the flow to a trickle so that it looks like garbage preground coffee can actually do a good job.

            Cheers,

            Luca

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Domestic coffee machine question

              a person at a coffee machine store told me that most machines have some sort of limiter that only lets them go to 12 bar pressure anyway. He said nearly all machines will only actually go up to this. (Domestic Machines I assume).

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Domestic coffee machine question

                Originally posted by C-Train link=1226554583/0#6 date=1226918323
                a person at a coffee machine store told me that most machines have some sort of limiter that only lets them go to 12 bar pressure anyway. He said nearly all machines will only actually go up to this. (Domestic Machines I assume).
                Read the second top post... Domestic and Commercial.... (Always some exceptions)

                Peer pressure and the old boys school of; mine is bigger than yours.


                It is a little like a gear box with a speed limiter... Does not matter how big or many horse power, the speed will be the same.

                With domestic units in general, it is set by the manufacturer; in the better machines the user will have some ability to change and tweak a little.

                Some may say that a pump that can deliver more, is better made or will last longer... However that is not always the case.

                Then again there is the old issue of how do you explain all this to a potential client, when they have their own perception and may have been told / sold on other reasoning...

                Hence the frustration of Fresh_Coffee and others in the trade.

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