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Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

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  • #16
    Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

    Relax, grapsta... Im pretty sure that the place 2mcm was talking about wasnt your place but the coffee stand with the cold coffee stored away.   8-)

    By the way, coming to a website called coffee snobs is probably the wrong place to get info like this as the people here are friendly, but also looking for the perfect coffee.  The best way to find out would be to put a few shots in the fridge yourself, heat the milk and test it out and see if its ok to serve to customers... hope all goes well and best of luck with your business!  

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    • #17
      Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

      Maybe you should look into a fully automatic machine that grinds beans and does your milk for you. (never thought id recommend one) as things pick up. This would be quicker than plunger. Maybe someone who has used one could chime in here and validate whether they are good for this number of people. I think at your stage this would be ideal. One of the sponsors could help you with this.

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      • #18
        Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

        Originally posted by 2F3A29383B3C29480 link=1240105425/13#13 date=1240150044

        .......and scoota girl - 2 points : " if people really want something they are prepared to wait" .. you gotta be kidding - have you ever worked hospitality - Im guessing not.
        Grapsta...

        You guessed WRONG...

        I do work in hospitality...have worked in it for a very long time.

        Im sorry youre working with impatient Sydney people. So, youre telling me that they wont wait for you to make pizza or a coffee? Well, theyre probably customers you dont want anyway, I reckon.

        Have you thought about taking their coffee orders when you take their pizza orders?

        You know, I dont know what your experience is in this game but you tell us some pretty basic information and we can only go on that. Even what you say about how you currently run your staff has got me puzzled because I have friends who run restaurants that only have two staff...the chef and the waiter and they seat 40 people. Everyone gets served and also gets great coffee...

        Maybe you need to go to a few other businesses and see how they are doing it...

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        • #19
          Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

          .....
          Originally posted by 4F5A414E4E5B5C4D5A280 link=1240105425/15#15 date=1240151961
          Relax, grapsta... Im pretty sure that the place 2mcm was talking about wasnt your place but the coffee stand with the cold coffee stored away.   8-)

           
          ....oh - . to be honest when my friend told me of a coffee stand doing that i found it hard to believe...those carts in cbd usually make good coffee - they have to - theres so much competition. Ive been meaning to go and check them out...maybe it was for an iced coffee

          have thought about automatic machines....If I had a grand Id buy one...although guess the 2-3 grand ones are really the go

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          • #20
            Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

            grapsta

            I just read All the posts and depending on where you mind set was... I can see how some of the comments may or may not been taken the way their meant..

            I guess the issue for people who are passionate about coffee, is about doing it right and short cuts only where the true coffee essence is not compromised..


            The issue I see is that not all the variables have been taken into account...

            1: You Coffee equipment is not meant for more that a few people in a row..
            2: The proposed effort to pre pour and then store and then steam and then serve is NOT cost effective or efficient.  It also introduces any number of unknowns..
            3: You pre do 10 shots, but 20 turn up 4 coffee or You do 10 and only 5 want coffee
            4: Having to refill ever couple of steams...

            A machine not unlike this one http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1239776171 would be a step in the right direction...

            Thus any of the so called time restrictions are covered off.

            1: Will steam much quicker
            2: Will allow you to steam and pour at the same time..

            I could go on... But I wont...

            The other point is that if people ask how you do your coffee and or think your cutting corners in one area... Their thoughts will be that may be you also cutting corners in other places as well...

            Coffee is not your main focus...  But it is a complement to great Pizzas etc so give it some level of importance in the pizzeria.

            AM





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            • #21
              Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

              Originally posted by 76637061626570110 link=1240105425/18#18 date=1240184436
              .....
              Originally posted by 4F5A414E4E5B5C4D5A280 link=1240105425/15#15 date=1240151961
              Relax, grapsta... Im pretty sure that the place 2mcm was talking about wasnt your place but the coffee stand with the cold coffee stored away.   8-)

               
              ....oh - . to be honest when my friend told me of a coffee stand doing that i found it hard to believe...those carts in cbd  usually make good coffee - they have to - theres so much competition. Ive been meaning to go and check them out...maybe it was for an iced coffee

              have thought about automatic machines....If I had a grand Id buy one...although guess the 2-3 grand ones are really the go
              Hi grapsta,

              Pizza and coffee go together. If you have a good business, shell out for an espresso machine or if you must, align with a company which will provide "free on loan" and hopefuly will provide you with decent quailty beans. You will pay, just more slowly.

              The issue as I see it is not the time factor, its training. You do everything and your staff are just gophers, no?  :-?

              FWIW, I dont see this as a good business model. You get ill, hit by a bus or simply need a night off? Then what?

              I have run a number of successful businesses and the mantra is make yourself redundant mate. Then you will have well trained staff who can fall into any role in your business as required. You are sitting on a ticking time bomb....

              Have someone come out to visit you or better still, pay to send your staff to a good training course so that everybody can make a very good cup.

              You will make good margins on both the pizza and the coffee that way.

              Business #101 as I see it

              2mcm

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              • #22
                Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                Originally posted by 227D657378737F767675757D717E100 link=1240105425/20#20 date=1240185048
                The issue as I see it is not the time factor, its training. You do everything and your staff are just gophers, no?  :-?

                FWIW, I dont see this as a good business model. You get ill, hit by a bus or simply need a night off? Then what?

                I have run a number of successful businesses and the mantra is make yourself redundant mate. Then you will have well trained staff who can fall into any role in your business as required. You are sitting on a ticking time bomb.....


                2mcm

                no its not training its time...I think I said somewhere that everyone multi tasks. have chef and kitchen hand who also  does back up  deliveries when necessary. upfront is my girlfriend and me who are both run off our feet on busy nights doing phones,dough,pizza,tables. once business jumps we can get separate dough guy or 2nd driver which will free up my girlfriend to do coffees...but that could be a while off..so  I was just thinking if there really was a way to heat pre expressed ( is that right?) coffee with steam wand then I could do it myself....despite what many of you have said this would save loads of time...could do 4 or 5 at once..then froth milk for 4 or 5. no one has told me what will happen during this process that will spoil the coffee. I will experiment with it and if it isnt acceptable i wont serve it. As far as the machinery goes as I said Ive been offered a free commercial machine - but only if Im going to pay to get it hooked up to plumbing and actually use it

                ...I understand your point about making yourself redundant and no doubt thats a good way to build a business model...but its not my way. My role model is  Pizzeria Bianco rather  than  Crust or Pizza Hut ....I do have emergency back up from business partners who run another restaurant...but theres plenty of people who start small businesses who simply cant really take sick days for first couple of years..Im okay with that...havent had many sick days in last 10 years anyway. .....besides its hard to find people who have the same concern that every pizza comes out perfect...another reason why I wont be training the non coffee drinking kitchen staff anytime soon to make coffee

                appreciate all the advice though. thanks

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                • #23
                  Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                  Perhaps then, youre just 1 staff member short.

                  Everything you say sounds good and I appreciate the dough process as a friend runs a place in Melbourne which won Epicure pizzeria of the year. If youre aging them, that takes time...

                  Get rid of the domestic machine and do it properly- even if you do need to go down the free on loan route or lease or whatever. You will find the milk texture process is much faster and can be completed in the time you pull the shots.

                  Just as a domestic oven wont cut it for pizza, I think that you need a 2 group machine. Perhaps there might be a passionate CSer or two around who would like a bit of part time a little later in the evening when coffee time arrives...Worth a thought  :-?

                  Seems you dont want to cut corners with the pizza. At least do good coffee. Its profitable, will help sell desert lines, grappa/limoncello etc (If you do that) and will help you to grow and complete your business.

                  I cant think of how many great food experiences I have had where the last memory of the evening was awful coffee. Some of those were enough to ensure that I never returned.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                    Originally posted by 500F17010A010D040407070F030C620 link=1240105425/22#22 date=1240255058


                    Just as a domestic oven wont cut it for pizza, I think that you need a 2 group machine. Perhaps there might be a passionate CSer or two around who would like a bit of part time a little later in the evening when coffee time arrives...Worth a thought  :-?
                    I cant think of how many great food experiences I have had where the last memory of the evening was awful coffee. Some of those were enough to ensure that I never returned.
                    I think this is good advice too Grapsta. There are plenty of Passionate people willing too volunteer or accept minimal wage to do coffee.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                      2much coffeeman your right - we are 1 staff member short...but it will stay that way for little while as too many quiet nights when everyone is standing around or going home early ( I could roast , grind and make coffees on these nights )

                      ...see this is the thing with training staff to make coffee...you can pay $100 for a 1 day course to teach your wait staff to make a good coffee...but you cant teach them the passion to make sure every coffee they make on a busy stressful night is a good one - theyre waiters not barista....thats why Id really rather do the coffee myself .... and I think for this reason its a bit harsh to not return to a restaurant that gave you good food but bad coffee ...although admittedly they should be endeavoring to be good at everything

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                      • #26
                        Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                        Hi

                        Originally posted by 62776475767164050 link=1240105425/24#24 date=1240278918
                        ... theyre waiters not barista....thats why Id really rather do the coffee myself .... and I think for this reason its a bit harsh to not return to a restaurant that gave you good food but bad coffee ...although admittedly they should be endeavoring to be good at everything
                        Not to return to a restaurant that gave bad coffee, but good food though, is what people do - harsh or not. I had a very nice hamburger at a Mittagong place on my way back from Wombeyan but they made the espresso and I could see it sitting there waiting ... when it was delivered there was no crema at all and it tasted flat. I wont be going back as that coffee was as important as the meal - its a single experience for a consumer.

                        I dont know your staff but maybe they could be interested in serving good coffee. Giving them training will make them feel wanted and valued and if they are good they will try and maintain the coffee standards set in their training. (PS Is the Breville visible to customers !)

                        Mike

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                        • #27
                          Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                          Originally posted by 5A4F5C4D4E495C3D0 link=1240105425/24#24 date=1240278918
                          and I think for this reason its a bit harsh to not return to a restaurant that gave you good food but bad coffee .
                          I go out to enjoy the WHOLE experience... There are many places I will not return to due to ONE part of their service being well below par..

                          It shouts at me that they are not interested in ME, but THEIR bottom line...


                          A local place down the road does some good meals, but I do not suggest to any one to go for a meal, but only TakeWays at best.. The coffee is drip that has sat all day and they use a wisk to try to make frothy milk and pass it of as something else.. I wonder if the special sauce is a bulk purchase and frozen as well ???

                          They miss out on sit down clients and that great Atmosphere.. Another place, a bit further, does not do so good with teh food.. But the service is great, the smiles light the place up and the coffee is not bad...

                          Other places on either side; offer cheaper food, specials etc and while I have tried them... I dont bother to go back..

                          I am older, have some disposable cash and know what I want... I want the whole package, not just what some one else thinks I should have...

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                          • #28
                            Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                            Originally posted by 53465544474055340 link=1240105425/24#24 date=1240278918
                            .... and I think for this reason its a bit harsh to not return to a restaurant that gave you good food but bad coffee ...although admittedly they should be endeavoring to be good at everything
                            I disagree grapsta,

                            Apathy kills businesses and if you dont bite the bullet, it will ultimately kill yours too when someone sees an opportunity to outcompete you by doing what you do, but better.

                            You want to cut corners here, so I cannot but wonder where else?? :-?

                            Good luck....because I suspect youre going to need it...

                            2mcm

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                            • #29
                              Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                              I think the key to it here is either do it properly or better to say you dont.

                              My local pizza place runs a machine that gets used by the waitressing staff and they do a better than average job, the girls in particular have been at this place for over 3 years and their method is consistant which is the key. This is in a small country town and at a venue that seats anything from 2 to 40+ at a full house. I am happy to finish off a meal and leave them some more $ even though I have enough gear at home to open 2 coffee shops Tony the owner of the business never goes near the machine.

                              There is a fish and chip customer of Andys from Torqauy in Victoria that only does coffee when he is on the machine to maintain consistancy, there is nothing wrong with that either if your patrons get used to that.

                              Some of my favourite haunts in Lygon St in Melbourne you would order coffee at the end of the meal and ask for a Grappa or a Port generally this would bring the owner out with the bottle for a quick chat and a thanks for the meal and our patronage.

                              My idea of a good coffee to finish off a good meal is important and doing it in a half baked manner is best left alone. You will loose more than you gain done poorly.

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                              • #30
                                Re: Is it possible to refrigerate shots then add milk later ????

                                My turn to chime in.

                                I generally dont drink coffee after a meal so it wouldnt bother me if you didnt offer it.
                                I think I was conditioned a long time ago to expect bad coffee at restaurants so I just dont bother.

                                grapsta Im a process auditor (so you know my qualifications) and I have worked in hospitality.
                                I even used to manage a Pizza Hut in my younger days so know what its like to do 300+ orders of multiple pizzas plus sides on a State of Origin footy night when the rush is so fast you cant think you just do.

                                Ive been waiting to try a pizza joint that has a very good reputation for the food but left it to the last minute and didnt book.
                                I was happy enough on this occasion to order take away just to sample the food.
                                Ill go back and try the table service to see what a full service dining experience is like.
                                However they also have a rep for being "pizza nazis".
                                They have "Rules" posted on the wall.
                                Things like "NO half and half", "NO pineapple" etc.
                                The rules dont stop the place being packed out every night.

                                I see the answer to your problem, given what youve said, is to not offer coffee until you feel the business can afford the time.
                                Then do it properly.

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