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  • Rate my puck?

    Hey guys,

    Having a little trouble reading my puck post pull.

    The details are:

    Silvia V3
    Rosco Hand grinder @ 0.65mm
    16.5g Fresh Nessun Dorma beans.
    Rancilio Naked PF handle
    Rancilio 14g basket

    Pic:


    Now, the grind scattered up the side of the filter and somewhat up on top of the lip makes me think too much head space and the top bit of puck is being allowed to swirl around a little.

    However, the fairly large indent of the shower screen bolt makes me think that it's overdosed?

    The pour formed fairly evenly and ran nicely at around the diameter of a large mouse tail. Only very minor sprays. I feel like it blonded a little quickly, but I'm not even 100% sure where the goldilocks zone for blonding is?

    How can I fix this? Also - someone please point out what the actual problem is - I assume there has to be one

    Thanks!

  • #2
    How did the espresso tasted?

    Comment


    • #3
      What's your tamping style? If you're're nutating or something, perhaps the sides of the grind are being pressed down or disturbed more than the centre, causing this disturbance. Does your tamper fit well in the basket? Those bits on the edge also sort of look like what's left over when a tamper doesn't fit the basket perfectly. I can see a tamper in your picture, looks like a good one so that's probably not it.
      How do the results change when you use that smart grinder in the picture? Any difference?

      That's pretty much all I've got, probably not very helpful. I mainly wanted to reply just to say that comparing the flow diameter of an espresso shot to that of a rodents tail is quite possibly the oddest comparison I've ever heard. Not that it's bad, it makes sense i guess, just sort of depends on different people's views on what constitutes a "large" mouse. Like, are we talking large field mouse, sewer rat, nutria perhaps? This can present a dilemma which I'm sure will provoke deep and philosophical conversation.

      Comment


      • #4
        What oki said. Plus if you really want a visual critique you'd be better off posting a video of the pour than a picture of your puck. (Bar for determining dosing)

        Originally posted by noidle22 View Post
        . Not that it's bad, it makes sense i guess, just sort of depends on different people's views on what constitutes a "large" mouse. Like, are we talking large field mouse, sewer rat, nutria perhaps? This can present a dilemma which I'm sure will provoke deep and philosophical conversation.
        That's what makes it so useful; great shots can be had from the tail-sizes of many species :P

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by DuaneDibbley View Post
          Hey guys,

          How can I fix this? Also - someone please point out what the actual problem is - I assume there has to be one

          Thanks!
          What actually is it you want to "Fix" ??

          Comment


          • #6
            More importantly, did you or any of your family get any sleep after consuming the Nessun Dorma beans? That'd be a tell-tale sign of failure (Lionel Hutz style).

            Comment


            • #7
              I am not a fan of the standard Rancilio double filter supplied with Silvia, and believe you get a better coffee from the larger standard industry commercial double filter. There's about a 2 gram increase in the weight of the dose of grinds (from silvia filter to commerial filter) which significantly improves the cup/s (my opinion).

              Silvia is very finicky about getting the right dose and studying your photo I am not sure your dose is big enough (for me) although it would otherwise appear to be very close... I dont take any notice of the indent of the locating bolt for the shower, and go more on the distance of the dose from the top of the filter down to the circlip groove (and of course the indent of the shower on the puk afterwards). Note if you go too high, Silvia will invariable leak...ie it tells you you if you dosed up too much.

              All that said, if the coffee is good, are you worrying about something that isnt a problem? As someone else said it is hard to judge anything else from this without seeing what you do, and for me that would include watching you grind, dose and tamp, in addition to watching the pour. Certainly you can (in my opinion) improve the coffee significantly just by the simple fitment of a standard commercial size filter as already noted.

              Hope that helps.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by okitoki View Post
                How did the espresso tasted?
                Everything you need to know, is revealed, in the cup...

                If the coffee is sublime? Or at the very least, you find it is very pleasant to drink?
                Who cares what the top of the puck looks like?

                FWIW, I often find the top surface of the puck can have significant features, almost like an underwater rift. Yet, on a good day the shot is tiger stripe, 100% Crema and to die for, in the mouth....
                If the coffee is good (to your taste), Who cares what the top of the puck looks like, post shot?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Keep your grind constant.
                  Dose 16.0g and then another shot with 15.5g. Observe the flow, and taste the difference in the cup.
                  Then make adjustments.

                  Read this:
                  Espresso 101: How to Adjust Dose and Grind Setting by Taste - Tips and Techniques • Home-Barista.com

                  Adjust your technique accordingly.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I'm going to have another "crack" at this.
                    Originally posted by DuaneDibbley View Post
                    Hey guys,

                    Having a little trouble reading my puck post pull.

                    The details are:

                    Silvia V3
                    Rosco Hand grinder @ 0.65mm
                    16.5g Fresh Nessun Dorma beans.
                    Rancilio Naked PF handle
                    Rancilio 14g basket

                    Pic:

                    Now, the grind scattered up the side of the filter and somewhat up on top of the lip makes me think too much head space and the top bit of puck is being allowed to swirl around a little.

                    However, the fairly large indent of the shower screen bolt makes me think that it's overdosed?

                    The pour formed fairly evenly and ran nicely at around the diameter of a large mouse tail. Only very minor sprays. I feel like it blonded a little quickly, but I'm not even 100% sure where the goldilocks zone for blonding is?

                    How can I fix this? Also - someone please point out what the actual problem is - I assume there has to be one

                    Thanks!
                    Question: Rate my Puk?. My revised reply, on the basis of now taking a closer and magnified look at the photo as well as having another read of the entire topic. To me, the photo of your puk seems to indicate a small under dose. On a well packed (if not over packed) dose, the indentation of the locating bolt is usually very sharp, and yours isn't, indicating there was probably a small amount of liquid on top of the puk immediately the group handle was removed from the group, and before it dissipated into the puk over time while you were getting ready to take the photo. Also there seem to be areas where the kiss of the shower can be seen, and others where it cant. Ergo you asked "Rate my Puk" and my reply is, it seems to be just a whisker under dosed. Whether that makes any difference to the quality of your cup or not is hard to say, and whether it caused "early blonding" in the resulting cup is impossible to know except where you can make a row of coffees under different conditions and see what happens wrt blonding in each case. And sometimes, some coffees just blond out earlier than others...... As noted by someone else, try making coffee using different doses, but keeping the grind constant (at least at first...only ever change one variable at a time) and see what happens. My interpretation, is you are asking how to fix what you think is early blonding, and if it may be related to what can be seen of your puk. You also ask if there is a problem, my reply is: only if you think so. I will note again, irrespective, I think you can make a better coffee if you replace the rancilio filter with a std commercial one BUT....the same conditions of coffee making and traditional "puk reading" will apply. Kindly note "puk reading" is not an exact art....and is consequently subject to a great deal of opinion . Enjoy.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      You might be interested in what happens in this video to help you with your puck diagnosis.

                      Transparent portafilter

                      I agree with those above who suggest that you concentrate on grind and dose and ignore what the puck looks like completely. FWIW, my current pucks come out fairly solid, but with a previous coffee (that was just as nice as the current one, just different), once I adjusted dose and grind to taste, the pucks were really sloppy. So for me, what the puck looks like doesn't matter.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I disagree as I dont think anyone should entirely ignore the look of their resulting puks. It happens to be a very handy diagnostic tool especially for beginners that have made whopper mistakes.

                        Granted this isnt a whopper or any mistake at all and as we have nearly all said now, who says there is anything actually wrong.

                        But the OP did ask, and there are some things that can be and have been said in reply, especially if he is trying to improve his coffee making skills and understanding.

                        I will say again, I dont believe anyone should entirely ignore their puk as it is one of the many useful diagnostics in espresso making.

                        Keep it up Duane.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I guess what I'm saying is, if you look at what happens to the puck at the end of the extraction in the video you can see a rapid back-flow when the shot ends. This back-flow will disturb anything that happened to the puck during the shot and so how can you get any useful info out of it?

                          I suggest to the op to ignore pucks because of that and, because when I was starting out, I used the 5 cent test to get the dose about right and then fine-tuned from there. I got concerned when the puck got a bit sloppy and used that as a sign my dose was to small. I then did a little session with a barista who tasted my shot an said the grind wasn't fine enough. I replied I couldn't go any finer because I'd have to reduce the dose or shot would choke. He said so reduce the dose. I said, but the puck will get sloppy. He said, who cares? I followed his advice and got a really nice, sweet shot, but a really sloppy puck. I have not seen any correlation between a good shot and what the puck looks like, hence my suggestion to the OP to ignore the puck.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Personally, I am a fan of a good looking puck.
                            I don't think anyone should have to put up with an ugly puck.
                            It's your democratic right.
                            Demand it.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Pete39 View Post
                              You might be interested in what happens in this video to help you with your puck diagnosis.

                              Transparent portafilter
                              Wow, that video was really interesting. I had previously thought that it was necessary for the grounds to rest up against the screen but that looks like it's filling with water first and then the water is being forced through them. Unless I'm missing something?

                              Comment

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