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  • Low Mycotoxin Organic Single Bean

    Hi guys, I'm searching for a coffee bean that is low in mycotoxins and organic. I've read that its preferable to stick to a single bean source (not a blend) that is grown at higher altitudes.

    Any suggestions would be appreciated.

  • #2
    Why?
    Spend a bit more time researching the truth, and do not focus on all the "health" claims that are currently popping up everywhere.
    Google Carlini Coffee Company and read their take on mycotoxins.

    As to "organic", that has to be the most misunderstood term when it comes to food production. It should not be used, instead food should be graded as to the type and level of pesticides used, and whether on not it is genetically modified. The type of fertiliser used is growing the food is irrelevant.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Bosco_Lever View Post
      Why?
      Spend a bit more time researching the truth, and do not focus on all the "health" claims that are currently popping up everywhere.
      Google Carlini Coffee Company and read their take on mycotoxins.

      As to "organic", that has to be the most misunderstood term when it comes to food production. It should not be used, instead food should be graded as to the type and level of pesticides used, and whether on not it is genetically modified. The type of fertiliser used is growing the food is irrelevant.
      While I happen to agree with much of what you have said, I hardly think that the type of fertiliser used in growing food is irrelevant. What we put into the land does end up in the food that we eat, the water we drink and even in the air that we breathe... therefore it is hardly irrelevant.

      Comment


      • #4
        I think the abstract from a journal article in 1980 sums up mycotoxins in coffee: "Because of the extremely low frequency of findings, the low levels of toxins, and the experimental data showing 70--80% destruction by the roasting process of toxin added to green coffee, further study on this topic has been discontinued"

        Someone must have come across this recently and thought 'low mycotoxin coffee' would be a good marketing ploy. It is impossible to completely avoid mycotoxins, and they really don't matter in small amounts! The irony is that modern farming methods and nasty chemicals have reduced levels in food significantly.

        As for 'organic' however, I do see the benefits but currently my wallet can't keep up with it. I imagine that the overly strict certification process drives prices up.

        If you want some organic coffee try the 'espresso organic' available here on beanbay, I'm sure its good!

        Comment


        • #5
          To be classed as organic, chemical fertilisers are not permitted. Nitrogen, Phosphorous and Potassium (NPK) produced by processing and chemical means are not allowed, even though they are pure and refined products. I see no reason why they are discriminated against. A plant will take what it needs from the soil, and does not care of the source. Over use of fertiliser is a concern, but so are outdated farming practices. A lot of "organic" farmers use fertiliser sourced from chicken manure (for example, organic pelleted fertiliser). These chickens could have been pumped full of antibiotics and hell knows what else, but because the nitrogen is from an animal, it is permitted. Trace elements (absolutely necessary) are permitted, yet they are produced in the same way as your basics (NPK), so the standards are outdated.
          I have done lots of gardening and have tried organic methods extensively. I found they were no better, and in most cases worse. Healthy soil, and the correct amount of fertiliser applied when necessary will always yield the best results. I strongly believe in alternate pesticides and advocate their use. In some areas, you have no choice due to the prevalence of pests.
          What we put into the land is important, but so are farming methods.
          I stand behind my belief that the term organic is outdated and misunderstood. It is nothing more than a marketing term and is over exploited.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Bosco_Lever View Post
            chemical fertilisers are not permitted. Nitrogen, Phosphorous and Potassium (NPK) produced by processing and chemical means are not allowed, even though they are pure and refined products. I see no reason why they are discriminated against.
            It's because they're chemicals, not natural nutrients.

            Comment


            • #7
              I can see your point though Bosco. I would rather have cheaper 'semi-organic' crops that are pesticide free, or at least use newer alternatives that are less harmful to the ecosystem. I guess the whole 'organic' idea also reflects the impact on the environment. Using natural fertilisers may be more eco friendly than synthesising them with waste products etc? Hmm as a chemist I suddenly feel very hypocritical.

              Comment


              • #8
                "Natural nutrients" are chemicals too.

                Comment


                • #9
                  So horse manure that may have all sorts of veterinary chemicals in it, is good because it is natural.

                  However a chemical fertiliser is bad even if it does not have any contaminants that are harmful to humans or the environment.

                  I must admit I find many people support all sorts of claims for emotional or self serving reasons rather because there is science that suggests it is true.

                  After all aren't mycotoxins natural so should be acceptable in “organic” products?

                  Many fungicides would be seen as chemicals so having the in food would then be unacceptable.

                  What does organic mean any way?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by don_nairn View Post
                    So horse manure that may have all sorts of veterinary chemicals in it, is good because it is natural.

                    However a chemical fertiliser is bad even if it does not have any contaminants that are harmful to humans or the environment.

                    I must admit I find many people support all sorts of claims for emotional or self serving reasons rather because there is science that suggests it is true.

                    After all aren't mycotoxins natural so should be acceptable in “organic” products?

                    Many fungicides would be seen as chemicals so having the in food would then be unacceptable.

                    What does organic mean any way?
                    Uranium occurs naturally too but I doubt if that means it can certified as organic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Curare could be considered a “natural” product.

                      However it would have little place in a healthy diet.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Vinitasse View Post
                        Uranium occurs naturally too but I doubt if that means it can certified as organic
                        Hahah I've seen 'organic salt' sold before, which cracks me up because by definition it is an 'inorganic' chemical

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Bosco_Lever View Post
                          Why?
                          Spend a bit more time researching the truth, and do not focus on all the "health" claims that are currently popping up everywhere.
                          Google Carlini Coffee Company and read their take on mycotoxins.

                          As to "organic", that has to be the most misunderstood term when it comes to food production. It should not be used, instead food should be graded as to the type and level of pesticides used, and whether on not it is genetically modified. The type of fertiliser used is growing the food is irrelevant.
                          Hey Bosco, Thanks for your feedback. Why? Because I try to be as health conscious as I can and I believe in sourcing the best produce I can afford. The health claims are supported by scientific research and if levels are high they will have an adverse affect on your health.

                          The European Food Safety Authority regulates and monitors the levels of toxicity on mycotoxins in their consumables, so I would say it definitely worth investigating where my coffee is sourced from and how it is processed. EFSA Topic: Mycotoxins

                          I did run into the Carlini article and it makes perfect sense but it is an opinion piece, and they state that 'I am not a chemist, doctor or scientist – just an engineer and a realist' I'd prefer something a little more solid and scientifically researched. They do close the article with this statement and I think this is gold - NO reliable and easy method available for measurement of mycotoxin levels, nor do the brokers have readings or records available on the lots they sell relating to mycotoxin levels – therefore everyone is “flying blind”. So it suggests that the topic needs to be properly researched and there may be some merit into more studies.

                          Bottom line for me is quality. I'm after a well produced bean that is roasted without shortcuts that could potentially cause me future health problems.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by burr View Post
                            I think the abstract from a journal article in 1980 sums up mycotoxins in coffee: "Because of the extremely low frequency of findings, the low levels of toxins, and the experimental data showing 70--80% destruction by the roasting process of toxin added to green coffee, further study on this topic has been discontinued"

                            Someone must have come across this recently and thought 'low mycotoxin coffee' would be a good marketing ploy. It is impossible to completely avoid mycotoxins, and they really don't matter in small amounts! The irony is that modern farming methods and nasty chemicals have reduced levels in food significantly.

                            As for 'organic' however, I do see the benefits but currently my wallet can't keep up with it. I imagine that the overly strict certification process drives prices up.

                            If you want some organic coffee try the 'espresso organic' available here on beanbay, I'm sure its good!
                            Hi Burr, thanks for the feedback. The reason for my initial question was that I came across Bulletproof coffee http://bit.ly/QCeRjt

                            There is a podcast with Dave Asprey (Bulletproof coffee creator) and coffee expert Dan Cox that is pretty interesting and explains a lot more about mycotoxins and coffee stuff in general #100 Coffee Titan Dan Cox on Caffeine, Coffee, and Mycotoxins

                            Whether it's BS or not is another thing altogether but he does draw on research to prove his point, and in my opinion it's worth finding out more about it. In Europe toxicity of mycotoxins are regulated so surely it's worth considering - as you rightly stated small amounts are harmless so some sort of regulation would be welcomed. I think the food industry at least owes us good pure coffee!

                            I'll definitely give the 'Espresso Organic' a try.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by juanca View Post
                              The health claims are supported by scientific research .

                              ................ the topic needs to be properly researched and there may be some merit into more studies.
                              juanca, it may help if you can quote the sources for the 'scientific research'.

                              Comment

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