Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
First you find out if the judge is a coffee snob, and if that is the case request a bench trial (judge only - no jury) to eliminate the Nescafe factor. . .
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
But can you imagine convincing a Jury (if it ever got that far) - all sitting there sipping their instant coffee :P - that Xyzs coffee house (hope thats not a real one) makes cr@p coffee? :
:
Its a bit like convincing a Jury that someone has stolen a computer program.... but the owner still has the discs.... and its still running on his/her computer.... so how has it been stolen? :-/ :-/
The law is often more about perception than reality! As is often said "Justice is blind" - it might not have any taste as well
;D ;D
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
and the truth shou set us free
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Heres another good information sheet on defamation regarding material published after 1 January 2006:
http://www.artslaw.com.au/LegalInformation/Defamation/DefamationLawsAfterJan06.asp
Take particular note of the sections regarding defences.
The explanations of defences 1 and 2 are the relevant ones.Defences
The first step when someone threatens you with defamation is to establish whether they actually have a case. The plaintiff must be able to prove all three elements discussed above – that the material has been communicated to a third person (other than the plaintiff), that the plaintiff is identified in the communication and that the communication defames them.
The next step is to consider whether you have a defence under the law of defamation. Defences include:
1. Honest opinion (previously known as fair comment)
2. Justification/Truth
3. Qualified privilege
4. Other defences
Lovey - your journo mate may well have been right prior to 01/01/2006 but one of the changes brought in was the defence of "truth".
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Originally posted by reubster link=1176013879/15#15 date=1176167567Can I suggest that within this site, we create and maintain a state by state list of cafes that can produce a coffee up to the standards we CSers expect.
You know, like a "coffee snobs cafe seal of approval".
For fun, perhaps, a shit-list too.....................Ahh! but that would grow extensively long and get very depressing, actually not much fun really.
Goood Idea [smiley=tekst-toppie.gif]
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Can I suggest that within this site, we create and maintain a state by state list of cafes that can produce a coffee up to the standards we CSers expect.
You know, like a "coffee snobs cafe seal of approval".
For fun, perhaps, a shit-list too.....................Ahh! but that would grow extensively long and get very depressing, actually not much fun really.
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
I found this on google (first link :-)) http://www.uow.edu.au/arts/sts/bmartin/dissent/documents/defamation.htmlOriginally posted by Lovey link=1176013879/0#13 date=1176161441Not doubting your bar skills at all your wigedness ;D,Originally posted by robusto link=1176013879/0#11 date=1176102392Putting on my QCs wig and silks here,
Defamation laws have changed so that it is now easier to name and shame with impunity, providing it is truthful, not done with malice, and is an an opinion.
"I think Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" would probably be OK.
But "Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" may be defamatory and hard to prove as fact.
-Robusto
Ive been told by a journo friend of mine that truth is not a defence to defamation.
I dont know if this is only relates to journos (who seemed to get sued a lot) for printing possibly defamatory stuff in their papers, but it would seem like a bad precedent if that was the case.
It was written in 1996, but says:
The same basic defences apply throughout Australia, although the things you have to prove to apply them may differ. For example, in some Australian states, truth alone is an adequate defence. In other states, a statement has to be true and in the public interest -- if what you said was true but not considered by the court to be in the public interest, you can be successfully sued for defamation.
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Not doubting your bar skills at all your wigedness ;D,Originally posted by robusto link=1176013879/0#11 date=1176102392Putting on my QCs wig and silks here,
Defamation laws have changed so that it is now easier to name and shame with impunity, providing it is truthful, not done with malice, and is an an opinion.
"I think Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" would probably be OK.
But "Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" may be defamatory and hard to prove as fact.
-Robusto
Ive been told by a journo friend of mine that truth is not a defence to defamation.
I dont know if this is only relates to journos (who seemed to get sued a lot) for printing possibly defamatory stuff in their papers, but it would seem like a bad precedent if that was the case.
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Maybe a place for a "get together" outing for CSrs? A beanbay pickup point?Originally posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1176013879/0#0 date=1176013879Bebita - Level 2 Melb. Central...
This is Dave Makins newly opened cafe (though he doesnt work there). Very good Veneziano from a LM grinder and FB80. I have no doubt it will be even better as they dial in and learn their cafe. Bread based lunch offer looked great! Grab a shot, pull up a pew at the communal table and enjoy.
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Putting on my QCs wig and silks here,
Defamation laws have changed so that it is now easier to name and shame with impunity, providing it is truthful, not done with malice, and is an an opinion.
"I think Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" would probably be OK.
But "Crappy Cafes coffee is crap" may be defamatory and hard to prove as fact.
-Robusto
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
A minor place and the spoon. The guys at a minor place were the first generation of latte artist. They came from a group that were the first crew to do latte art in Melbourne. Extraction, great. When most of us were using stale coffee they were on doing the fresh beans. I remember having coffee made about 8 years ago from them at Atomica. They were pretty awesome back then. Spoon is something they do really well. I tried it last week as a joke and i cant remember how to use the spoon.
If the spoon is done well, it can be better than the free pour. Saw some amazing spoon action today! "no sexual reference"
Went to 7grams last week. Pretty awesome!!
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
"Original post modified to remove the outing of the bad ones"
Pity. I liked those comments in your original post!
A bit of honest criticism is a good thing IMHO. Might call to
account some of the cafes around here that trade on the
long-forgotten "prize winning" barista who obviously managed
zero transfer of skills in the day or so he/she was there ...
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
The sites I was referring to take comments and ratings from the public (even without having to register).
So you can give them a low rating and back it with a well worded comment.
The next person along is therefore forewarned.
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
Might be worthwhile if you want to give them some publicity, but most cafe review sites are an absolute joke. Theres one site where a team of four or five self-professed "experts" "reviewed" cafes by going and ordering a single drink ... basically anything, and mostly takeaway. So you got really top places being canned because their single shot, 16oz hazelnut latte wasnt hazelnutty enough or some similar garbage. What I found absolutely hilarious was that the last time I stumbled across that site the top rating was given to a cafe where the drink that they ordered was a hot chocolate!Originally posted by Thundergod link=1176013879/0#6 date=1176084592There are plenty of review sites where you can leave feedback on these places.
For cafe reviews, I think that Ill stick to reputable peoples opinions!
Cheers,
Luca
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Re: Good ones, no bad ones- espresso when out...
There are plenty of review sites where you can leave feedback on these places.
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