Just one other thing. Sorry if this is obvious, but are you tasting the straight espresso shots from your machine?
This is a critical part of dialing everything in. You can’t make a good long black without a good espresso shot!
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Newbie trying to produce a drinkable long black
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Hi Paul
Very Glad to hear you got things sorted out. Sometimes a bit of face to face support can help get things sorted out.
Hopefully you're getting some more enjoyable and consistent shots.
Noticed the link to this gross sounding video didn't work... "three legs on your espresso stool"... doesn't sound good. But it may help.
:-)
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Nice thread and some good troubleshooting going on. Here's a bunch of geekery I've come across recently which helps me make sense of the whole dialling in thing (a work in progress to be sure.)
Commercial link removed as per the Site Posting Policy
Happy brewing, I'm sure you'll have it down pat in no time.
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Update #2
Following advice I took my grinder back to the shop this morning along with my coffee. Received warm welcome and they had no issues with dialing in my grinder. As it happens I had the grind setting right. I was just underdosing. My grind time was 6.9 secs but it needed to be 8.3 secs.
I have been out all day so have only just had a chance to try it out at home. I cannot claim total success but I did at least produce two recognizable long blacks. With more practice I am optimistic my shots will steadily improve.
Thanks again to everyone for your advice and support. It is a delight to have good people like you take an interest and offer help to a stranger.
Merry Christmas.
Paul
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Hi Paul...
I am very soon to be in exactly the same boat as you in that after a goof few months the kitchen is finally finished, plumbers coming tomorrow to plumb everything in and then I will be trying out the machine - an Alex Leva and Eureka Atom in my case.
I will be keen to hear how you went with the training as I plan to do exactly the same next year.
Will post some pics of the new set up in the next day or so.
Good luck with it all.
Alastair
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Hi Paul,
Happy to hear you are making progress in the right direction, easy mistake to make when you are first starting out.
I'd be quite surprised if making very small changes in grind make such a dramatic change in the volume of coffee produced. I think you hit the nail on the head about not having the right dose of ground coffee in the basket. This is something that you need to learn to get consistent pours. If you get a consistent (and correct) dose of coffee, then the grind is your main other variable (providing fresh beans are used of course).
Try looking up the '5c piece' test for a good guide on proper dosing levels. I've not used your machine or grinder before, but maybe as a rough guide fill your portafilter level to the rim with coffee beans and this should be a ball park guide to how much coffee you need. Weighing the beans used for each shot could also help with consistency once you get the hang of dosing.
Also as level3ninja mentioned earlier 40ml is a little low for a double standard espresso shot, I'd aim for between 50-60ml over the 25-30 seconds.
Hope thats not all too confusing, again training is money well spent (especially when you've got top shelf equipment that should be able to output coffee as good as most cafes!)
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Matt
What an excellent suggestion. I will take grinder etc to the place I bought my equipment and they should be able to get me on track pretty quickly. Now I can get some sleep. Yippee!
In the unlikely event it fails I’ll post a video (but it may well take the form of an online suicide). Just kidding.
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Newbie trying to produce a drinkable long black
Hi Paul
You never know your luck... One of the site sponsors might be free to help over the next few days. Jet Black espresso is over your way. Di Bartoli are just across the bridge and down a bit 🤣. Paying these people money in exchange for help is also good at this busy time of year.
Or perhaps the place where you purchased the machine from?
You could just take your portafilter, grinder and beans with you.
If you work with someone and have those dialled in right then you should be good to go at home too. (Assuming your machine is ok). But that would be a good start.
Can you take a video of what’s happening? Post here via YouTube?
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Latest update:
Have produced two sets of long blacks (one pair longer than the other). Both poor but drinkable. Would send back at a coffee shop. Crema is weak and disappears while carrying cups from machine to (testy) wife.
This is all getting too frustrating and my wife is very unhappy at the expense (approaching $6000 if you include grinder) for such a miserable result. Not looking good for Christmas. Woe is me.....
I think I urgently need to arrange for some private barrista training tomorrow.
Can anyone suggest a person or company I can contact in Sydney (especially North Shore)? Don’t need to be taught about anything other than making decent espresso and long blacks. We can learn about milk frothing etc when we go to the already booked and paid course in late January.
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No worries, Paul. Was just making sure....we do get a few chaps say 'yeh, absolutely fresh, bought it from Woolies last week'. You can tell your Mrs that it's raining in Perth and the cricket might be disrupted anyway.
Seeing as you've got a camera, wouldn't hurt to take a photo of your ground coffee scattered on a piece of white paper and also pinched between two fingertips (to see how it cakes).
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steiny555: you guessed correctly re double basket. I am indeed using a double. I tried a single just once and wisely decided to leave it in the box for now. Based on your advice I have managed to increase liquid output to around 40g from about 18g of ground coffee. To increase liquid output further I tried making the grind coarser but when I did so the output jumped alarmingly (doubled) with only a tiny change in grind. I suspect I may need to grind more than 18g of coffee because the filter basket is not getting filled up to the level I was shown to aim for in the shop. I think this may be contributing to the erratic differences in output I am seeing. I suspect I may be getting random channeling in the puck* because the filter basket is underfilled.
As one of our Prime Ministers once said - life was not meant to be easy.
* Even if my coffee is not getting any better I am at least picking up on some of the geeky barrista terminology
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Barry O’Speedwagon (love that name by the way). Coffee is from Bay Coffee Roasters in Neutral Bay Sydney. They roast if not every day then every few days so I am confident the beans are not the problem. It’s me.
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level3ninja: Sorry - I am weighing things and the output was 40g of coffee not 40ml. Apologies for the confusion.
And yes the T64 does have a worm drive. My main problem was trying to find an initial grind that was roughly what was needed. This was where I spent some time winding the worm drive as there is no quick way to disengage it and do bigger changes with just the dial (at least not that I have found). So I spent lots of time doing coarse changes to find a starting point. It was then I became aware of how very sensitive the beast is to small changes. Hence my attempts at humour regarding grinder manufacturers.
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Just to totally eliminate one factor, could you kindly confirm what you mean by 'bought fresh yesterday'. When were the beans roasted, and who roasted them?Originally posted by Plane24 View PostThanks everyone. The coffee I am using was bought fresh yesterday. The problem is with the workman and he cannot blame his tools. I will adjust grind to be coarser as per you recommendations and see how I go. Will report back later.
Thanks again!
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Hehehe. Sounds like a good alternative use of the brush. Back scratcher also comes to mind.
Was just trying to gauge how much gear and knowledge they set you on your way with. Good that you have some extra training coming up but as you say it can be frustrating at times starting out.
Thank you for your inspiration Paul. I’m just now finishing up a cup of black gold with festive fruit mince pie on the side.
Hope you get an enjoyable cup too.
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