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Light roasts through espresso machine

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  • STS
    replied
    Great info and insights Tampit. Thanks

    Sean

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  • TampIt
    replied
    Hi All

    Having fallen for a really good light Colombian roast in the mid '70's, which would now probably be described as "organic, fair trade, microlot" (still using the same farm / growing methodology / processing since then!) I would offer a few thoughts gained through experience (and pain).

    I usually drink espresso or latte (with the occasional long black from my modded stirrer / plunger). I should add that I like a wide variety of coffees. I also drink a lot of medium roast single origins plus the occasional good dark roast SO. Just like my favourite scotches, most blends are a (very) distant second to my tastes. YMMV, however I believe stating preferences in this thread is essential. The above LC has been described by one barista friend as "a meal in a cup" because it is so rich.

    Originally posted by Pete39 View Post
    I have found letting lighter roasts like those rest for another week or so tames the in your face espresso and produces lovely, sweet, well rounded shots.
    Yes, although there are a lot of ways of tinkering / taming any roast. The LC I mentioned can, with a little effort, give a stunning cuppa on hour one (barely cooled after roasting) or even day 440ish (left at a friend's beach house for 18 months, stored well: in the cellar /basement @ 18C). I know of no dark roast that works beyond (say) day 45, most darks "drop off the flavour cliff" around day 22. The "440" one was still stunning, however I had to play with the grind a lot. Now I think about it, I have zero experience with any other old roast that was actually able to work so naturally it would need a little time to work out the settings... The thing that stuck in my mind was that despite the limited crema it was much mellower and sweeter than younger LC roasts. All agreed it was quite beguiling. Ages like red wine perhaps?

    Originally posted by STS View Post
    I find the secret to lighter roasts as a short black/ristretto for my palate is to grind quite a bit finer than a darker roast.

    I use a longer preinfusion and a slower pour to highlight the desired characteristics.

    Sean
    Yes. Although I would add that using a much, much finer grind to slow the pour and then using faster flow baskets (I use VST / naked p/f) tend to bring out the very best in light roasts. Whether you run it ristretto or not is a matter of taste. IMO preinfusion makes a lot more difference to a shot that most temp / pressure profiles (although any of those can really shift the flavours around). Which brings me to another issue: knowing what you are actually aiming for when balancing a shot helps a lot!

    Originally posted by Bames View Post
    I find that with lighter roasts you really need to pull them long to get a full extraction. I find ristrettos generally a bit a bit sour, and under extracted light roasts can be very sour!
    Don't be afraid of a long shot!
    I edited your comment slightly. "Don't be afraid of a long shot!": too right! I have had several excellent "circa 90 second" shots from all types of roasts if the grinder is good enough (I now use Mahlkonig Varios). To me, balancing the flavour of light roasts which vary strongly over time (LC does, particularly in the first week) merely means that all parameters have to be considered every time you walk up to the grinder & machine. After a few years of "light roast practice", I find pulling a "best guess" shot first usually tells me what I should adjust for the next attempt. FWIW, I think of it as the coffee telling me what it needs... Once I have set it up for the current "roast time", pumping them out consistently is easy.


    Enjoy your (light roasted) cuppa: no wheatgrass or other so-called "3rd wave" rubbish in sight.


    TampIt

    PS: I really wish some of the less tolerant posters in CS would realise that their personal tastes are not the only way...

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  • RayTCoffeePro
    replied
    If you have a single origin....

    Thats great for espresso... Count me in....

    Because I've no luck for single origin... im always an espresso blend kinda guy.....

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzo89
    replied
    Originally posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Yeah. You'd have to be a dick to order one
    Well some of us are just plain old dicks and have nothing to hide

    In all seriousness though, it is something I am inclined to experiment with at home rather than to actually go out and order such a thing. To go out of your way to seek the chance of a potentially disappointing coffee outside of the home sort of defeats the point of going out at all. Some of my 'schlong's' at home have been enjoyable so far, but certainly not all. You have also conjured up a pretty accurate scenario of what might happen to the 'schlong' regular when ordering Won't be making that mistake. With the exception of seeing MW in the flesh at Noosa since he most likely has it down pat.

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  • chokkidog
    replied
    What?? No happy ending? ;-D

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  • TC
    replied
    Originally posted by chokkidog View Post
    ...some people's comments re lighter roasts refer more to inappropriate extraction and/or application and/or roast profile, rather than light roasts per se.
    Got it in one chokki.

    The use of stoopid names tho....

    Went into my local and asked for a double length schlong finished off with a touch of magic. I got evicted :P

    Leave a comment:


  • STS
    replied
    Originally posted by chokkidog View Post
    Good on you for that

    Tho' to be fair, a proper reading of some people's comments re lighter roasts refer

    more to inappropriate extraction and/or application and/or roast profile, rather than light roasts per se.
    I would totally agree on this.

    Therefore, a thread that constructively looks at how to modify or tweak different parameters to achieve a better brew with a lighter roast can only be a good thing.

    Sean

    Leave a comment:


  • chokkidog
    replied
    Originally posted by STS View Post
    Apologies, to Chris et al. I misinterpreted his humour in the context of his and others well documented dislike of the lighter roast in numerous other threads.
    Good on you for that

    Tho' to be fair, a proper reading of some people's comments re lighter roasts refer

    more to inappropriate extraction and/or application and/or roast profile, rather than light roasts per se.

    Leave a comment:


  • mwcalder05
    replied
    Originally posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Yeah. You'd have to be a dick to order one
    Hey, I have a number of good paying customers who order this! And then I have the people who come from their workplace for coffee and refuse to say it for their coworkers so they show us the paper that they've scribbled down the order on. A little bit of humour always lightens up the day!

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  • STS
    replied
    Originally posted by chokkidog View Post
    STS.... first negative comment? Yours and who else's?

    I see an interesting thread with some mild humour based on the word choice in one post (#2).
    Apologies, to Chris et al. I misinterpreted his humour in the context of his and others well documented dislike of the lighter roast in numerous other threads.

    Leave a comment:


  • Yelta
    replied
    Originally posted by STS View Post
    Wow! A full 2 days before the first negative comment. That would have to be a record wouldn't it?
    Morning STS, from the tone of this it sounds like you would prefer to hear only from posters who are members of the Hail good fellow back slapping club.

    As a matter of interest I dislike under roasted beans that produce coffee akin to a grass infusion laced with alum, of course I never would have said this had you not posted the above.

    One mans meat is another mans poison, there's room for all of us.

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  • chokkidog
    replied
    STS.... first negative comment? Yours and who else's?

    I see an interesting thread with some mild humour based on the word choice in one post (#2).

    Leave a comment:


  • STS
    replied
    Originally posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Yeah. You'd have to be a dick to order one
    Wow! A full 2 days before the first negative comment. That would have to be a record wouldn't it?

    Leave a comment:


  • TC
    replied
    ....with a double ris for a 'Schlong'
    Yeah. You'd have to be a dick to order one

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzo89
    replied
    Originally posted by mwcalder05 View Post
    Welcome to the light side greenman! Everything is worth a try. I like to have my LB with around 60 degree water with a double ris on top. Otherwise known as a Shlong in my cafe . I find that it brings a lot more clarity and sweetness when everything cools down.
    Experimental ristrettos or espresso with the lighter SO's is always worth a try. I took your method of 60degree water with a double ris for a 'Schlong' (haha) and it worked out really well for some of them! My usual method while experimenting with SO's was a double ris on its own for most of them but some come out waaay too acidic to be enjoyable. When that happens I would normally switch over to a double ris piccolo.
    This method of yours is going to be my lazy way of enjoying a nice lightly roasted SO when I don't have time for a siphon. The 'love for the light' in this thread is refreshing.

    Leave a comment:

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