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3 months, still no good microfoam! Help

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  • 3 months, still no good microfoam! Help

    Hi guys,

    Yes, I've read all threads on this, but still not good... Frustrating!

    Equipment: EM6910 setting max temp and wettest.
    Milk: 1st try Devondale Skinny, 2nd try Devondale Semi-skin (the ones that not in the fridge)

    So, I end up with microfoam, but its at the top of the milk... the rest of the milk when I pour does not have that creammy look... Latte art is merely impossible.

    Its like the micrfoam is not mixed with all the milk.

    am I missing something?

    Thanks in advance folks!

  • #2
    How soon after you've steamed the milk do you pour??

    The thing with skinny or semi-skinny milk is that the foam likes to separate from the bulk of the milk fairly quickly, which leads to what you described.

    Be sure to constantly "swirl"/"swish" the stretched milk in the jug until you pour (i.e. as soon as it's steamed, make small circles with your milk jug in hand).

    Having said that, it's hard to say for sure what's going on with seeing you in action. If you post a video up, we could certainly diagnose most things further.

    Hope this helps.
    -Aaron

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by aaronpratt View Post
      How soon after you've steamed the milk do you pour??

      The thing with skinny or semi-skinny milk is that the foam likes to separate from the bulk of the milk fairly quickly, which leads to what you described.

      Be sure to constantly "swirl"/"swish" the stretched milk in the jug until you pour (i.e. as soon as it's steamed, make small circles with your milk jug in hand).

      Having said that, it's hard to say for sure what's going on with seeing you in action. If you post a video up, we could certainly diagnose most things further.

      Hope this helps.
      -Aaron
      Hi Aaron! Good idea, will do a lattee today and post a video.

      I do swirl the milk... still looks like the microfoam is all up...

      Let me check! Cheers!

      Comment


      • #4
        IMO everything is more critical with skinny milk and there is very little room for error.

        Try with high quality full milk, or a drop of two of dishwashing liquid in water to see if your technique actually works.

        Greg

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by GregWormald View Post
          IMO everything is more critical with skinny milk and there is very little room for error.

          Try with high quality full milk, or a drop of two of dishwashing liquid in water to see if your technique actually works.

          Greg
          Dishwashing? or could it be any detergent?

          Comment


          • #6
            Dishwashing liquid works. Don't know about any others.

            Greg

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by GregWormald View Post
              Dishwashing liquid works. Don't know about any others.
              Yes, but does it taste any good Greg?

              Comment


              • #8
                LOL!

                Well, It looks like with detergent I can get pretty good microfoam! I think I'll start serving my deterngen-latte

                One of the issues I find is that I am stretching too much the milk and when I pour, a lot of foam comes down... making impossible to make latte art.

                Any tips on when to stop the stretching?

                Cheers!

                Comment


                • #9
                  From what you're describing it sounds like full cream milk might solve your issues. Sounds like your skim is separating before you pour.. which happens quite often. Give full cream a try and see if you have some more success..

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by cherni78 View Post
                    LOL!

                    One of the issues I find is that I am stretching too much the milk and when I pour, a lot of foam comes down... making impossible to make latte art.

                    Any tips on when to stop the stretching?

                    Cheers!
                    Hi Cherni,

                    In terms of when to stop stretching, it really comes down to your technique of how much you stretch it from the word go; i.e. do you stretch it with "big bubbles" for the first 10 seconds, or slowly stretch it for 30 seconds?? Either way, it's really tough to give guidance. This is one of those things you'll need to test again and again until you get it right. For instance, you're finding you're stretching it too much, so next time try stretching it slower in the same time frame of stretching and see what happens. Still don't like it? try again with a shorter time frame and see what happens. Milk stretching, along with everything coffee, is something you need to slowly fine tune until it meets you're desired level.

                    Still, a video would help a lot lol

                    Hope this helps again.

                    Cheers,
                    Aaron

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by aaronpratt View Post
                      Hi Cherni,

                      In terms of when to stop stretching, it really comes down to your technique of how much you stretch it from the word go; i.e. do you stretch it with "big bubbles" for the first 10 seconds, or slowly stretch it for 30 seconds?? Either way, it's really tough to give guidance. This is one of those things you'll need to test again and again until you get it right. For instance, you're finding you're stretching it too much, so next time try stretching it slower in the same time frame of stretching and see what happens. Still don't like it? try again with a shorter time frame and see what happens. Milk stretching, along with everything coffee, is something you need to slowly fine tune until it meets you're desired level.

                      Still, a video would help a lot lol

                      Hope this helps again.

                      Cheers,
                      Aaron

                      Hi Aaron!

                      Sorry for the delay... here is the Vid. Is in two parts (my fiance was filming)



                      And this is the end product:



                      What am I doing wrong?

                      The steam settings in the EM6910 are +10 in temp and +0.02 in pump (Dry).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Try the "driest" steam setting. For steaming milk we're after steam that's as dry as possible.

                        And by watching your video, it seems that you over-stretched the milk (i.e. creating a nice foamy head floating on top of the milk) and also created too much big bubbles that didn't get incorporated.

                        My suggestions:
                        1. Try lowering the wand by just a tiny bit to get more of a "tchk tchk tchk" and less of the "tchssssk tchk tchk tchssssk" sound (don't know how to explain this properly :P). the long "tchssssk" sound means the wand is a tiny weeny bit too high which creates more big bubbles.

                        2. Try dipping the wand at around the 28 seconds mark and move the wand to one side to really swirl the milk. You started dipping the wand at around the 38 seconds mark and there's probably too much stiff foam at the top already to be mixed into the milk properly.

                        3. Also try doing the initial stretching part with the wand closer to one side of the jug so you're stretching + spinning the milk to start incorporating microfoam into the milk right from the beginning. I find this method quite effective with my Breville BarVista with bugger-all steam power.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Try looking at it like this -

                          Steam temp controls how long it takes the milk to warm, steam pump controls how powerful the swirling effect is. the whole dry/wet thing is deceiving.

                          To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement. Try this -

                          As you look down at the milk divide the "circle" in to imaginary quarters. Put the wand in as far as the join between the stem and tip in the lower top left "quarter" (about the 9 o'clock line) with the jug tilted slightly away from the machine. Open the valve and get the milk spinning without any air going in. This only takes a few seconds - then lower the jug until you get the "hiss" of the air entering the milk. If you have a thermo introduce air to 25C, if by hand go until the jug loses its cold edge, then lift the jug so the tip is back where you started. Work on keeping the tip absolutely still , only moving the jug if the swirling milk is in danger of causing more air to be sucked in.

                          Hope that helps some.

                          C.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by oble89 View Post
                            Try the "driest" steam setting. For steaming milk we're after steam that's as dry as possible.
                            This is usually the case, however from experience with the EM6910 the wettest setting seems to be the ideal; it tends to keep the mil

                            Originally posted by Chris View Post
                            To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement.
                            Agreed! This is you're main problem by far. When you stretch the milk, perhaps the most important thing is to make sure that what you're stretching actually gets spread throughout the milk, which is achieved by either rolling the milk, or by the whirlpool effect (WE). I typically use the WE; it's fairly easy and works a treat.

                            Essentially all the WE is is positioning the steam tip in such a way as to create a little whirlpool action in the milk. Once you've got your whirlpool going THEN slowly start to lower your milk jug to get the stretching, making sure the whirlpool keeps going. Once you've stretched enough lower the tip deeper into the milk, again ensuring that whirlpool keeps going (this is so that the foam doesn't separate) until it's up to temperature.

                            Again, hope this helps.
                            -Aaron

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by aaronpratt View Post
                              This is usually the case, however from experience with the EM6910 the wettest setting seems to be the ideal; it tends to keep the mil



                              Agreed! This is you're main problem by far. When you stretch the milk, perhaps the most important thing is to make sure that what you're stretching actually gets spread throughout the milk, which is achieved by either rolling the milk, or by the whirlpool effect (WE). I typically use the WE; it's fairly easy and works a treat.

                              Essentially all the WE is is positioning the steam tip in such a way as to create a little whirlpool action in the milk. Once you've got your whirlpool going THEN slowly start to lower your milk jug to get the stretching, making sure the whirlpool keeps going. Once you've stretched enough lower the tip deeper into the milk, again ensuring that whirlpool keeps going (this is so that the foam doesn't separate) until it's up to temperature.

                              Again, hope this helps.
                              -Aaron
                              Thanks guys! Will try today!!! And film again

                              Comment

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