Re: automatic machines
And your points were good too. Its nice to strive for excellence, its great to master a challenge..... and its really good to have great coffee (I love the sound and smell of a grinder!!!!) And its good to hear about the next step because I think we are all evolving with our habits and desires. As you get older or wiser your standards change and the manual starts to become more attractive. I guess us automatics are halfway up the evolutionary chain, above the instant stuff.....but with room to improve.
And dont get me wrong, I love hearing about how the other half live......it educates me and puts ideas into my head for `one day`!!!!
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Re: automatic machines
good points sharon
i think i may have a lot more time on my hands than some (most?).
if anyone needs caffine it sounds like you do, enjoy your coffee, you deserve it.
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Re: automatic machines
I personally think that everything you are saying is 100% valid. Its like arguing that a slow cooked meal made with all fresh ingredients, love, someone stiring the pot gently, watching it simmer with no rush.....is going to be more satisfactory than a frozen meal that you throw in the oven. In reality the slow cooked meal is not that hard to make, especially when you analyse and break the steps down. So why dont we cook like that all the time????Originally posted by crafty_butcher link=1180516219/15#18 date=1189394126:
ok, i may have missed the point of the thread...on reflection, this post probably needs moving :-[
hi guys
sorry to re-vamp and old thread, but ive just been through the auto vs manual machine debate with my wife, before purchasing my silvia. she wanted convenience, i wanted coffee. this is not a knock on those that have autos, just a collection of my thoughts.
to me preparing and drinking coffee at home is about the experience as much as it is the consumption of a hot bevarage, which, if you think about it, is all that coffee is (yeah i know, and wine is just fermented grapes).
But the joy of preparing an espresso, cappucino or latte for friends with a manual machine, grinding the beans, dosing, tamping, extracting and steaming milk, is far more about providing them with an experience than it is about giving them a hot drink.
And the way i figure, during the time spent learning how to drive your manual machine, you will produce some pretty ordinary coffee, but it wont be much worse that the stuff that some autos make. but once you get it right...
the mess is not really that much of a problem either once you get a routine (after about a week of use). the ease of being able to pull the thing apart and clean, put back together and be ready to go again far outweights the convenience of an auto, as soon as the auto needs its first return-to-place-of-purchase repair or service.
plus, there is no need for a pullman tamper with an auto, and they are works of art and justification enough to buy a maunal.
think about this, if you went to a cafe and asked for a long mac, and the barista did nothing but pushed a button, would you be happy? i wouldnt.
as i said, just my thoughts, i may have a lot more time on my hands than some people.
Well, it really does depend on your time and lifestyle and priorities.
In my house when you get up at 6.30 to take your oldest to 7.00am sport, organise his breakfast, clothes, lunch and sundry .....then you come back home to do the same for 2 other kids who move at the speed of grass growing. Then you come back home to a messy house with a hundred chores, plus doing my paid work.....well the last thing I want to do is clean out another machine of any type!!!!
So at this stage of my life, I am ok with buying the best coffee I can, and pressing a button. One day, I dream of having time to not mind to do a few extra steps. Most of my friends are at the same stage and admit they would not bother with a manual. Most of us buy drinks at cafes too, so no one should feel too sorry for us!
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Re: automatic machines
:
ok, i may have missed the point of the thread...on reflection, this post probably needs moving :-[
hi guys
sorry to re-vamp and old thread, but ive just been through the auto vs manual machine debate with my wife, before purchasing my silvia. she wanted convenience, i wanted coffee. this is not a knock on those that have autos, just a collection of my thoughts.
to me preparing and drinking coffee at home is about the experience as much as it is the consumption of a hot bevarage, which, if you think about it, is all that coffee is (yeah i know, and wine is just fermented grapes).
But the joy of preparing an espresso, cappucino or latte for friends with a manual machine, grinding the beans, dosing, tamping, extracting and steaming milk, is far more about providing them with an experience than it is about giving them a hot drink.
And the way i figure, during the time spent learning how to drive your manual machine, you will produce some pretty ordinary coffee, but it wont be much worse that the stuff that some autos make. but once you get it right...
the mess is not really that much of a problem either once you get a routine (after about a week of use). the ease of being able to pull the thing apart and clean, put back together and be ready to go again far outweights the convenience of an auto, as soon as the auto needs its first return-to-place-of-purchase repair or service.
plus, there is no need for a pullman tamper with an auto, and they are works of art and justification enough to buy a maunal.
think about this, if you went to a cafe and asked for a long mac, and the barista did nothing but pushed a button, would you be happy? i wouldnt.
as i said, just my thoughts, i may have a lot more time on my hands than some people.
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Re: automatic machines
To answer an earlier question, the pinprick hole is designed to suck extra air into the wand, causing more air bubbles in the milk. This is great for making foamy milk, but terrible for microfoam, which is made using steam only. Basically a "froth enhancer" device, you can see more results of them here: http://coffeegeek.com/guides/frothingguide/steamguide
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Re: automatic machines
Linda, you have been helpful from the start. Thanks to you I held onto this machine because I knew that you had high standards and that it was working for you. So thanks for that!!Originally posted by Maccas_chicka link=1180516219/15#15 date=1183614519Hi Sharon and lilli!
As I have said to you before Sharon, I know for a fact that the Technician guy changed my wand over from another machine, and this has improved the amount of steam volume that comes from it.
If covering the hole for both you and lilli works best, then thats great! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
-Linda
One of the things I noticed was that on some Saeco machines the wand end just pulled off with no resistance, and other Saeco machines had resistance. I think it depends on the red orangy ring that is holding the wand in place. Maybe the looser let more air in and it makes more bubbles. Maybe the tighter ones dont need the hole covered? The SA and me definately noticed that the wands were not consistant, depending on the rubber ring inside!!!
Any chance of posting a photo of your wand??? Im dying to see what the new one could look like. When I rang, no one knew what I was talking about!
Cheers Sharon
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Re: automatic machines
Hi Sharon and lilli!
As I have said to you before Sharon, I know for a fact that the Technician guy changed my wand over from another machine, and this has improved the amount of steam volume that comes from it.
If covering the hole for both you and lilli works best, then thats great! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
-Linda
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Re: automatic machines
Im in exactly the same boat, and now think the hole may have been blocked or partially blocked before it was thoroughly cleaned and resulted in the bubbles.
All of the suggestions didnt work, so I resorted back to covering the hole - and am now making good coffees again.
Thanks for the help.
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Re: automatic machines
Linda, do you know for sure that the covering of the hole will cause problems (its such a tiny hole!!!!). I was thinking that the steam is even stronger when I cover the hole. i would love to know why the milk froths better with the hole covered. I was thinkingthat the hole was to encourage big bubbles, as this wand was designed for bubbly froth to appeal to those that just want to see something that looks like froth. Like a fail safe wand even for dummies!!! I dont think the design is to encourage micro foam. Other wands dont seem to have this hole!!!!Originally posted by Maccas_chicka link=1180516219/0#10 date=1183440442Hi lilli!Originally posted by lilli link=1180516219/0#9 date=1183425805I have covered the small hole on the wand with instant success, but does anyone know why this bubbling would happen in the first place? And what the hole is for?
That hole on the steam wand for the Saeco is a breather hole. It is not supposed to be blocked/covered/taped up etc. There is quite a significant difference if you do block it up, as this decreases the amount of steam that comes through.
Try this:
1. Let the steam come out of the wand for about 10-15 seconds, you will notice a BIG difference with the amount that comes out. It has to build up from the boiler and that is why it "bubbles" so to speak when you immerse it into the milk.
2. The tip of the wand should only just be in the milk. Too far in will make it squeal and out to far will of course make those big bubbles, and splatter milk everywhere.
See how you go, the steam on these machines make the best microfoam.
Hope this helps
- Linda
Meanwhile, for me, the covering up of the hole has transformed my frotyhing to very proffesional hights, and it would be hard for me to go back to bubbles!
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Re: automatic machines
Hey guys, I have tried all the suggestions and nothing worked for me except covering the hole. But, maybe this is just because when I cover the hole the wand ends up being in a perfect angle or position. Maybe its a secondary effect from covering the hole.
I discussed this with the sales lady who works for Saeco, I see her a lot in HN and Myers. Of course she was reluctant to recommend doing anything that might jeapordise the machine, and who knows if it will damage anything!!! But, to her surprise her machine for display had the hole blocked with caramalised milk and she could not clean it, probably needed a pin! So, in effect she was using the machine with the hole covered!!!!
For myself, I am getting a brilliant cup of coffee now, totally brialliant. i get fantastic beans from a roaster that blew my mind!!! And my milk texturising is awsome. I think the Saeco does better with different types of milk too. My personal opinion is that I get a very smooth silky microfoam from a full fat milk. Sometimes I mix half pura lite with half full fat...to try to compromise.
Ive noticed that different cafes do the milk very different too!
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Re: automatic machines
Thanks for the tips, ill give it a go tonight & let you know how i fare...
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Re: automatic machines
Hi lilli!Originally posted by lilli link=1180516219/0#9 date=1183425805I have covered the small hole on the wand with instant success, but does anyone know why this bubbling would happen in the first place? And what the hole is for?
That hole on the steam wand for the Saeco is a breather hole. It is not supposed to be blocked/covered/taped up etc. There is quite a significant difference if you do block it up, as this decreases the amount of steam that comes through.
Try this:
1. Let the steam come out of the wand for about 10-15 seconds, you will notice a BIG difference with the amount that comes out. It has to build up from the boiler and that is why it "bubbles" so to speak when you immerse it into the milk.
2. The tip of the wand should only just be in the milk. Too far in will make it squeal and out to far will of course make those big bubbles, and splatter milk everywhere.
See how you go, the steam on these machines make the best microfoam.
Hope this helps
- Linda
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Re: automatic machines
Sharon - Ive got the same problem with my Saeco - bubbling milk. For the first 2-3 months it was fantastic then one day it suddenly changed. I have covered the small hole on the wand with instant success, but does anyone know why this bubbling would happen in the first place? And what the hole is for? Other than this recent problem the machine has been great.
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Re: automatic machines
;D Definitely I am one of the lazy one ! I increased my dosage from one cup to four cups per day since I got my automatic ..... well good and bad but I just love the convenience ! :P
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Re: automatic machines
you think?
I think there are plenty of people who are just downright lazy.
that certainly explains why theres a microwave in every kitchen (except mine :P)
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