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  • #16
    Re: You, I and our planet.

    Originally posted by 282526284A0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
    Plus we havent purchased CRT monitors since 2004 and they would be in poor shape. Lets face it, you will get better effort out of your general staff population by giving them better equipment and not leaving them on old technology junk just because you can. Its all about context. It takes more to support older equipment than new.
    I have to step in here.
    Ive never had to replace a monitor because it was faulty.
    Ive either still got them or theyve been passed on to someone whos needed a replacement.
    Ive always wondered why I see so many old monitors in council cleanups.

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    • #17
      Re: You, I and our planet.

      TG - You must be the lucky one. We have had a number go Kaputt over the years.
      While yes the old CRT units definitely have a longer life than an LCD we find that their images are not as crisp and comfortable on the end user as they once were.
      Also they cost more to run than LCD units.
      The ultimate aim in everything when replacing equipment is to ensure as much as possible that it can be passed off to others to make use of and not get thrown to landfill.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: You, I and our planet.

        I dont think computer equipment would dare fail on me.

        My newest screen is LCD but a few years old now.
        Whenever my son asks if Id like a new bigger one I ask back "what for?".
        He was only saying the other day how he likes the crt screen hes hooked up to my new (2nd hand) PC. It used to be his and is one of his favourites.

        Some of my equipment may burn a bit more power as youve mentioned but I make up for it elsewhere.

        The family has been having a go at me for almost 30 years for asking them to turn unused lights off.
        Before my council introduced recycling bins I was saving up empty milk and shampoo bottles for three years and today I pay for an extra recycling bin because I fill 1.5 per week.

        I could do better with water recycling but havent automated that yet and would install a rainwater tank if I could scrape a few dollars together.

        Some little things arent hard to do. You said you already recycle.
        Have you swapped to energy efficient light globes yet?
        I was an early adopter. I didnt change them all at once but when the latest smaller ones came along a stocked up and now ASAIK most of the lights in the house have been changed over except for odd little ones like those in the range hood.

        I recently downsized my car from my old 4.0 litre 1994 Falcon to a 1.8l Astra (2000 model).

        The Falcon had reached the point where even its regular 6 monthly services had extended its life as far as economically viable.
        Things were starting to break down faster.

        I could do better but I think I do more than a lot of others, my wife and kids included.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: You, I and our planet.

          Originally posted by 764A574C464750454D46220 link=1253756834/17#17 date=1254019882
          Have you swapped to energy efficient light globes yet?
          No and I dont know that i really want to but i guess will be forced to soon, i have one in the study but i find the quality of the light compared to say a 100w traditional globe frankly - CRAP.

          We use the low voltage dichroic globes everywhere else and have some LED versions of these and again i am not convinced the quality of the light is all that good.
          While the dichroic globes are good they are not much in the way of power savers but i too constantly have to tell the rest of the family to turn lights off.

          We recently bought a new dishwasher and the major requirement for me was the water rating and managed to get one down on the 11L rating, the environment wasnt really a consideration but more that fact that soon i think we will be paying much much more for water.

          I havent done the water tank think as its going to cost too much money to connect to the toilets etc and at this stage the return on investment just isnt there. We may just put one in for watering the garden over the summer but my attitude is that if it doesnt survive then tough luck

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          • #20
            Re: You, I and our planet.

            Originally posted by 4E43404E2C0 link=1253756834/18#18 date=1254020729
            Originally posted by 764A574C464750454D46220 link=1253756834/17#17 date=1254019882
            Have you swapped to energy efficient light globes yet?
            No and I dont know that i really want to but i guess will be forced to soon, i have one in the study but i find the quality of the light compared to say a 100w traditional globe frankly - CRAP.

            We use the low voltage dichroic globes everywhere else and have some LED versions of these and again i am not convinced the quality of the light is all that good.
            While the dichroic globes are good they are not much in the way of power savers but i too constantly have to tell the rest of the family to turn lights off.

            We recently bought a new dishwasher and the major requirement for me was the water rating and managed to get one down on the 11L rating, the environment wasnt really a consideration but more that fact that soon i think we will be paying much much more for water.

            I havent done the water tank think as its going to cost too much money to connect to the toilets etc and at this stage the return on investment just isnt there. We may just put one in for watering the garden over the summer but my attitude is that if it doesnt survive then tough luck
            We try to do our bit....

            However many things are nothing more than smoke and mirrors and cost shifting.. With teh end result that many get a warm glow feeling that they are doing some good; while in fact, the actual carbon usage has been offset by the manufacturing... But as it is done in another Country... It does not get counted / included and thus the real picture is no better and infact can be worse...

            SOLAR panels are one of the worse and in my opinion should be banned around the world until they come up with a better method to manufacture.....

            At the end of the day it is robbing Peter to pay Paul... But hey... Ya can not tell some people..

            For those that wish to disagree... Do some REAL research on the cost and impact of making solar panels and then take a cement pill and harden up...

            Wind power and use of the sun is great, but it needs to be fully investigated and focused on real savings and not a $$$ value on goods and services; with out taking into account the REAL costs to the enviournment..

            We as a consumer society are just too short sighted...

            Now... I must go and replace my kitchen utilities, phone, PC, trade in my car as it 6 months old and if I have some $$$ left over look at a new GRinder ;D

            Love to all :

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: You, I and our planet.

              Ive lost a few plants but thats the way it goes I suppose.

              The coffee plants get priority these days.

              The "lawn" never gets watered unless its grey water that Ive bothered to carry with a bucket.

              Connecting a tank to the toilets and for some garden use would eventually pay for itself.
              My roof catches heaps of rainwater but the upfront cost is prohibitive atm.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: You, I and our planet.


                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                Changing footprints is in some cases too hard and not worth the effort
                Sadly its apparent that its not worth your effort. I think its worth mine and for the sake of the place I live and the people I love I really hope that attitude is held by the minority.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                do i worry to much about what my kids or my kids kids will be faced with in 50 years?? Nope, it just doesn’t interest me that much
                That is possibly the most selfish thing I have ever seen posted on CS.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                i dont go out of my way to reduce my personal environmental foot print unless it can save me time or $$
                ...and this is the second most. It reeks of the me! me! me! generation. Very sad.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                anything other full commitment and living like a bush dweller off the land is not achieving the outcome.
                I have some DDT that you can use in your garden, some asbestos brake pads for your car and some lead based paint to splash around your house.

                Surely the forced restriction of the above dangerous items has made you and your children’s lives safer. Why do you have to wait for a government department to mandate their ban? Cant you show the initiative and do something proactive now to make things better?

                Walking into the supermarket you can buy an apple wrapped in plastic. Would you buy it or buy one from the green grocer out of a box? The same goes for lettuce! I want to meet the people that think that buying a plastic bag of cut lettuce saves any amount of time or money... I mean, seriously, lettuce is pretty easy to process at home!

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                You make think its crap
                Yes, in my 20 year industry experience I do think it is.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                if a business takes on another or perhaps different application that involves more computing resources, this then starts the process of the PC upgrade/replacement.
                Yes, if it was written badly or deployed in the wrong way.

                Why would you install the new application on the desktop? Thin clients are cheap, rarely breakdown as they have no (or little) moving parts and all your upgrades (and backups etc) can happen in a central place.

                Upgrade the server or add another machine to the cluster, dont replace your 300 desktop PCs every few years.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                We are basically a MS software house in that 99% of all software used is MS
                That could at least part of the problem. A company who exists because their bloatware needs ever increasing power to run the next version and the marketing might to tell you that the next version has a pile of features that you "need"... even if your users never use them.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                We use sharepoint 2007 and office 2007, if i was using 5 - 10 yr old PCs in our environment then they wouldn’t run office 2007
                So can you continue to use an older version that has less hardware resource requirements or can you find another product that does the same job (or better) as a web based application that just needs a browser to access it?

                Or once again, if the business cannot exist without the latest version then installing it once on a server and using thin clients to access it would also make sense.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                You cant compare the pc you salvaged for the snobbery with a corporate environment they don’t even come close.
                Sorry, that wasn’t my intention. I was trying to make the point that in my world, one of the most functional and useful computers happens to be an old stinker that was salvaged and replacing it to the latest greatest because the number on the calendar changed would not make it function any better than it currently does.

                I have other computers too. The one at home that Im using to type this on is a 5+ year old P4, runs office 2007 perfectly along with fat apps like Photoshop and is also our HTPC, media centre, DVD player/burner etc. It doesn’t need replacing but when it does a baremetal restore from a nightly image will mean that its back and running on new (or newer) hardware quickly and easily.

                Originally posted by 393437395B0 link=1253756834/13#13 date=1253975213
                where i am not paying for the company to change their equipment.
                AAARRRGGGHHHHH.
                Yes you are paying and that was the point of this thread. You dont pay in direct dollars out of your pocket but you are paying and the true cost might be far higher than you can see.

                I would never expect to be able to change your thoughts and opinions but I would love to know that at some point in the future you would at least consider the wider impact of your decisions in the current mix of business need, cost and justification process that you follow.

                eg: My previous random example of thin clients. The effort of looking at MS terminal server in a Win2008 cluster of virtual machines to serve your 300+ desktops might just make financial and environmental sense.

                ...Then we all win. MS sell you more software, your users get the latest greatest features that they will never be bothered to learn or use, you get easy to deploy/manage/service client machines, your business bean-counters will see a bottom line improvement and as a resulting casualty eventually the environment impact will be less when you avoid the next 300 machine upgrade.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: You, I and our planet.

                  Originally posted by 7659534E370 link=1253756834/4#4 date=1253802507
                  I took this book on a couple of plane trips to read (in fact I bought it at the airport) and paused when I had the thought that the extra weight of this book on a plane caused "x" amount of extra greenhouse gas emmisions from the plane... pondered more about the amount of fuel that 500g of book would take to cross the country in the air and how much fuel was burnt driving the logs to the paper factory, the paper to the printers, the book to the warehouse, the book to the reseller.... and then woke-up to hear that the plane was about to land.This meant that I would have to continue reading it on the return trip too and thus cause more environmental damage.

                  Grin

                  ...and I still didnt know the fuel usage per kilo on an airbus flight math or ergo how much less environmental impact a jockey has on a plane to me or how much green house gas tax surcharge a really fat person should pay on top of their flight fees.Which was about the time I thought, damn, need to stop getting distracted with random silly thoughts and read more of the book.
                  Some years ago, I used to work for an airline, and this IS a seriously considered issue.
                  I could bang on about it for ages but in my usual fashion, I favour the slightly humorous over the serious.
                  At one stage whilst working there, they had done a study that came back with some cost saving estimates per year if they managed to reduce on board weight by 100-150kg per flight. It was some astronomical figure (probably hugely overinflated). This led to all manner of things being reviewed with the main target being catering. In the end, the main recommendation was reducing (or completely removing on some flights) .... ice.
                  I did comment to my boss that I should get a bonus every year from the company based on the fact that every time I did not fly on one of our planes, I was saving the company money. I then suggested that I could double my contribution by flying on the competitors planes and thus costing them money. For some reason, I did not get the bonus.

                  No doubt, this whole exercise was inspired by Robert Crandall, but I found it amusing at the time.

                  As for the airlines charging by weight, its probably going to happen on the cheaper airlines at some stage. It always reminds me of the part of Hitch-Hikers guide to the Galaxy talking about the planet Bethselamin:

                  A fabulously beautiful planet, Bethselamin is now so worried about the cumulative erosion by ten billion visiting tourists a year that any net imbalance between the amount you eat and the amount you excrete whilst on the planet is surgically removed from your body weight when you leave: so every time you go to the lavatory there it is vitally important to get a receipt.
                  Brett (Just back from O/S and now feeling very guilty).

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: You, I and our planet.

                    Originally posted by 6D6A7F696472543A3232320B0 link=1253756834/22#22 date=1254062827
                    I favour the slightly humorous over the serious.
                    ...which you do well and this time it was both funny and interesting.

                    Ice? I have flown a fair bit and not until now did I realise that I cannot remember the last time I had a drink with ice.

                    Originally posted by 6D6A7F696472543A3232320B0 link=1253756834/22#22 date=1254062827
                    Brett (Just back from O/S and now feeling very guilty).
                    Welcome back! Nah, dont feel guilty. Air travel is a great form of transport (although I do get annoyed at the obsene amount of packaging on simple things in-flight and their lack of a recycle bin for all their rubbish).

                    The purpose of the post wasnt to inflict guilt, its really more about being aware of your usage/footprint/waste and when given a choice, choose a better option than you did last time.

                    Baby steps... if we all change a little then the difference can be great.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: You, I and our planet.

                      Originally posted by 5E73777B761A0 link=1253756834/14#14 date=1253975898
                      I think its the Darling that is in a much worse situation from most perspectives, given that most of the feeder systems are dammed and allow hardly a trickle of water to reach it....
                      Yes, youre right Mal. A couple of years ago now, but the ABC1 doco "Two Men and a Tinnie" was quite telling about the state of the Murray and moreso of the Darling. They also showed the Murray lakes section too.

                      I hear they want to build more dams in the Darling Downs to help with Toowoombas dwindling supply or cater for the growth in the Highfields area. Do the rivers there flow into the Macintyre-Darling system (well, the ones with water in them)?

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                      • #26
                        Re: You, I and our planet.

                        Originally posted by 7B716473737C686E1D0 link=1253756834/24#24 date=1254178749
                        I hear they want to build more dams in the Darling Downs to help with Toowoombas dwindling supply or cater for the growth in the Highfields area.
                        I think youre right there Steve.... Theyre in pretty dire straights though, less than 10% water volume total for all existing reservoirs.

                        Originally posted by 7B716473737C686E1D0 link=1253756834/24#24 date=1254178749
                        Do the rivers there flow into the Macintyre-Darling system (well, the ones with water in them)?
                        Yep, I think most of em end up flowing into that system....

                        Mal.

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                        • #27
                          Re: You, I and our planet.

                          Our river systems are in a sorry state right across the country. Only took us a bit over 200 years.

                          Around my way, we have rivers and creeks suddenly going dry. Apparently it has nothing to do with the coal mining thats being carried out directly beneath them.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: You, I and our planet.

                            Originally posted by 725F5B575A360 link=1253756834/25#25 date=1254218643
                            Theyre in pretty dire straights though, less than 10% water volume total for all existing reservoirs.
                            Hows Warwick going? Its the Condamine there isnt it?

                            Originally posted by 714453517C61360 link=1253756834/26#26 date=1254218986
                            Our river systems are in a sorry state right across the country. Only took us a bit over 200 years.  
                            Given that we have only been recording climate stats for the last 150 years in Australia, Im a little hesitant to say were in terminal decline - yet (I know thats not what you are claiming).

                            It could turn out to be our worst ever drought (on record) but the optimist in me hopes that natural forces will come into play and rescue us from a somewhat dire situation. Then, when we emerge from it, well know a bit more about living in, and looking after, this wonderful country.
                            <Pass another soap box will ya, this ones worn out>

                            But if Im wrong, then NZ is a nice place and climate change may allow coffee production there  :-/.

                            PS I see youve got a new avatar there Greg. Did you lash out on a Tele or are you just opting for a more electric persona?

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: You, I and our planet.

                              Originally posted by 5C564354545B4F493A0 link=1253756834/27#27 date=1254222033
                              But if Im wrong, then NZ is a nice place and climate change may allow coffee production there.
                              ;D Probably shouldnt laugh, but Im picturing bean bay in 20 years - NZ Mt Cook Estate, or maybe even further south - Vinson Massif Supremo.

                              PS I see youve got a new avatar there Greg. Did you lash out on a Tele or are you just opting for a more electric persona?  
                              Bit of both, Steve - Ive got a more electric / rock project going at present and my old electrics wouldnt quite cut it so I HAD to get a new Tele.  : Loving it and feeling more electric, so a change of avatar was required. (Sounds a familiar upgadeitis scenario, eh Guitar Coffee Snobs?)  

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: You, I and our planet.

                                Originally posted by 526770725F42150 link=1253756834/28#28 date=1254226190
                                or maybe even further south - Vinson Massif Supremo
                                ;D That would make a nice blend with 10% Ross shelf Robusta


                                Originally posted by 7D485F5D706D3A0 link=1253756834/28#28 date=1254226190
                                my old electrics wouldnt quite cut it so I HAD to get a new Tele.  
                                Of course - upgraditis isnt confined to coffee equipment.
                                Nice - what is it. An American vintage series?

                                Anyway, back on topic, I hope you are planting trees to offset the C02 released when you crank up the amp  ;D. Of course, I doubt youd be turning it all the way to 11 on an acoustic/electric mix track. 8-)

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