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  • #16
    Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

    Standard outrage I have come up against when I comment to cafes about the swill coffee I have been served up. One just because you have been doing something for a long time doesnt mean you are good at it and two just because your friends say you are doing a great job doesnt mean you are.

    Chris I feel for you I hope things get better before they get worse, who knows maybe you will lift the standard by this focus. (but dont hold your breath)

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    • #17
      Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

      And there was absolutely no commercial interest from them in putting that letter in? Unbiaised report, my grandmas patootie!

      The pictures not the best, I suppose, but all I can see on top of that coffee is white froth...wheres the crema???

      I feel for you, Chris and - besides being a couple of thousand ks away - you have my support, also.

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      • #18
        Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

        Funny Den my wife just said we may have to move ot Aussie ;D
        I have penned a reply and Ill post it if it gets printed. I have been emailing the editor direct as I know him and he said there were 2 places in town that had won awards that he wont go to as the coffee was undrinkable, so that one fan
        No its all good i have been getting plenty of "good on yous" to keep me fired up on the subject. Game On

        Chris

        ps: thanks again for your support you guys and gals all rock !

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        • #19
          Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

          I reckon Andy has the idea--a coffee tasting.

          Offer a challenge and see what happens.

          Greg

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          • #20
            Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

            If you step outside Redzone and listen carefully, youll hear a faint Aussie roar on the soft westerly [smiley=thumbsup.gif] Keep it up!

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            • #21
              Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

              One should enquire if they follow the World Barista Championships and if they are members of the NZ chapter of the AASCA

              When I test people on there coffee knowledge I generally ask a couple of lead questions
              1) Is roasted coffee a perishable food
              2) what are the 3 threes of coffee

              If they cant answer those questions after 16 years of cafe experience then they are not a cafe that serves coffee for coffees sake they are in fact a food establishment that serves coffee to wash down the food

              KK

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              • #22
                Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                They keep ratting on about the Roasters and teh Cafes ..

                As usual they missed the point...

                It was about the in abaility to make a good cup.. Not the food and or the roasters...  Had poisen a number of times form places that served great food and thought they could make a coffee... Instant would have been better..

                In addition the 16 years, sounds more like the usual .... lets play with numbers and the context of those years......

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                • #23
                  Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                  Originally posted by 293E3F2134353E6A696A5B0 link=1256000922/17#17 date=1256200472
                  No its all good i have been getting plenty of "good on yous" to keep me fired up on the subject. Game On  

                  Chris
                  onya Chris.

                  Anybody whos seriously "on" about anything will welcome an opportunity to lift their game and learn more about what theyre "on" about.

                  The complaints come from people blasted out of their comfort zones. Anybody who actually wants to learn recognises the need for the absence of comfort.

                  Were right there with ya. Go for it.  [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

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                  • #24
                    Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                    Originally posted by 5C697E7C4C7469767A777F1B0 link=1256000922/18#18 date=1256201263
                    I reckon Andy has the idea--a coffee tasting.

                    Offer a challenge and see what happens.

                    Thats something I included in my reply

                    Chris

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                    • #25
                      Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                      to kinda play devils advocate for a moment ...

                      just because we can roast up some good coffee at home and seek/achieve godshots in our kitchens doesnt necessarily mean we can step into a commercial environment and tell the operator yer doin it wrong no matter how wrong they might be, or we think they might be.

                      After all, theyre still trading, they have customers, so they must be doing SOMETHING right.

                      I think its important for us snobs to keep in mind that what we have access to in terms of product, info and support through this website (and the personal networks we build as a result) is likely more immediate, more useful and of a much higher quality than what a large commercial roaster can or will provide to a cafe on contract.

                      While we may, or think we might know more, were not in that business, were not analysing the P&L every week/month/quarter/year so we dont know if theyre doin it wrong or not. Is it possible that we might be able to suggest ways to improve the coffee product on offer in many cafes in our local area? More than likely yes.

                      Do media outlets deliberately misquote people and twist their words to suit the pitch of their story? Most certainly.

                      Does this sort of response actually point to a gap in the market that could be filled by a motivated snob? I certainly think so! (Dennis, got anything to add on this one?)

                      I guess what Im saying is that I think we need to be careful what/how we comment or provide feedback to cafes and coffee purveyors in our local area or somewhere we might be visiting. What we have learned through this awesome website can be useful for improving the general level of quality but I think we should be mindful that its someones livelihood that could be effected by what we say. Dont get me wrong, Im all for improving the quality of coffee served overall.

                      All that said, I fully support your efforts to improve the quality of coffee served in your local cafes. If you get run out of town Chris, we have a spare room! Plus you dont need big hairy hobbit feet to live in St Peters like you do down in The Shire, where Sylvania is.  ;D ;D  

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                      • #26
                        Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                        Point taken hazchem

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                        • #27
                          Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                          Originally posted by 48415A4348454D200 link=1256000922/24#24 date=1256242302
                          I guess what Im saying is that I think we need to be careful what/how we comment or provide feedback to cafes and coffee purveyors in our local area or somewhere we might be visiting. What we have learned through this awesome website can be useful for improving the general level of quality but I think we should be mindful that its someones livelihood that could be effected by what we say. Dont get me wrong, Im all for improving the quality of coffee served overall.
                          Agree fully... However if you look at what has been said and take it all in context... My perception...

                          Redzone has stated / implied that teh quality of the coffee being SERVED is not as great as it could be...

                          He has attempted to include the Roaster and make people aware that quality beans are a must. At no stage did I see it reported that the roaster was not providing a good service.

                          Some people have taken it / responded that their cafes are great and that the do a great service etc. I am sure that many of us would agree that some places do great food etc but miss the boat with good coffee.

                          As sated previously; Here is an opportunity to step up their game in one area and instead, they attack the messenger.

                          PS. The editor wanted my full contact details.. SO maybe my comments or part of : may get made public...


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                          • #28
                            Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                            After all, theyre still trading, they have customers, so they must be doing SOMETHING right.
                            Sometimes all they are doing right is being located in a good position.

                            When I was working in North Sydney I observed that those cafes in the best traffic areas got the most customers.
                            It was convenient coffee not good coffee.

                            Being a former banker I can analyse P&Ls and would like to see what they were for the place I worked at temporarily (though I doubt they existed).

                            The place had huge potential to improve (mostly by taking advantage of the foot traffic flow) but as I said recently, the owner was forever sitting down having a coffee with his mates and the place has since closed down.

                            (The coffee could have been better too.)

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                            • #29
                              Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                              Originally posted by 7079627B707D75180 link=1256000922/24#24 date=1256242302
                              Does this sort of response actually point to a gap in the market that could be filled by a motivated snob? I certainly think so! (Dennis, got anything to add on this one?)
                              I agree with you Hazchem.

                              Im sure you could walk into more than 90% of cafes and not even look at the menu to know whats on offer.  These ones are not about serving fantastic coffee.  They are there to make an OK meal and as someone said, wash it down with a cup of Joe.  They are there because they chose a business that would make a profit.  I dont think they are there because they relish early starts and late finishes, cleaning tables, etc. but do enjoy working with the public.  

                              Chris was asked for comment and he made it.  Fair enough.  Though if you owned a profitable cafe, frequented by loyal, returning customers, and felt you were doing a pretty good job, wouldnt you too would be offended and probably react in some way.

                              Yesterday I worked 18 hours with a 30 minute break, and loved every minute.  When you do that, along side me, then Ill welcome suggestions on how I can improve my business.  I am a living example of someone who decided to put their money where their mouth is and Im glad to say its working out well.  

                              But until you do that, youre just all talk.  So better to keep your nose out of other peoples business and focus on your own P&L.

                              PS. Aaron, Ive seen your hairy feet.  ;D



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                              • #30
                                Re: Snobs quote leads to outrage...

                                More in Saturdays paper anyone want me to post a picture?

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