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  • #16
    Originally posted by Yelta View Post
    Yep done that, my take is that a lot of the criticism is coming from those who are pretty computer illiterate, incapable of learning how to use a new OS or are simply resistant to change.

    I'm sure I can (make do) with 8.1 until 9 shows up.
    My take on it is that W8 is an abortion of a product, simply because the only thing Windows really has going for it (IMO) is its existing market share (and compatibility therewith) and users' familiarity with the interface.

    W8 UI is counterintuitive to Windows users in a lot of ways, and from what I've heard from a couple of guys in sysadmin roles it's a PITA to integrate into existing systems in some ways (I'm assuming networking and distributed app management, but I'm just guessing).

    Part of that issue is retraining users in a corporate environment; sometimes it's better to keep a less efficient interface if the retraining/unfamiliarity inefficiencies outweigh the difference between the current UI and the new one. Given that corporate users rarely use touchscreens in the first place, I'm not even sure there's an argument to be made that it can be more efficient for business use.

    As it stands, they're trying to out-apple apple, and it's a bit like a guy who's been teaching karate for twenty years, hears everyone likes this new BJJ thing and starts teaching that instead.

    Karateka are going to hate the change and people who like BJJ enough to be doing that are going to go with the people who have been teaching BJJ for ten years, not the guy trying to play catch-up.

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    • #17
      Yep- no interest for me whatsoever.

      We're now 100% Mac except for a standalone Win 7 notebook used to run RoastMonitor. I wouldn't go back.

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      • #18
        Like Chris, Mac through & through I'm afraid bar a banger CS laptop. Been using them now since the last millennium!
        Used to work in prepress using both platforms - but that simply confirmed my loyalties!

        But good luck with Win8.1

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        • #19
          MS don't say Vista was a failure either, but the many thousands of machines purchased then 'upgraded' to WinXP would tend to disagree. MS claimed lots of sales but that was on bundled OS?machine sales and didn't count how many of those promptly became wickedly fast XP boxes.

          Stick with Win7 till the next version comes out. W8 (a better name for it ) is the new Vista. You can config it to run like Win7 but very few people like it and it's a resource hog like Vista was. (there is a reason why Android tablets come with 16GB or 32GB and W8 tablets have 64GB as minimum.

          re Apple - it's a not-so-surprising support issue for them. With all it's failings, MS has had to support 5 or more generations of hardware with each version of Windows; Apple supports only one. Want the new OS, buy the new box. So they limit support to make their customers buy the new box. I've got an old IBM R60 running Win7 and I had it running on an R52. The R52 predates the sale of PC/Laptop business to Lenovo by about 4 years, so that's an almost 10 year old machine. AFAIK Mavericks is the first attempt by Apple to cover multi-generations of Macs.

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          • #20
            Given the choice I'd probably still get Win 7 if I was paying, however would get Windows 8 if it was cheaper. I have it on my server because I managed to get a free legitimate license.

            Just do steps one and two in the following guide, even if you're in 8.1 and then it all functions pretty much as 7 does anyway.

            Windows 8.1 tips & tricks: 13 ways to increase productivity | IT PRO

            I've only been using computers for about 20 years but when I first installed Win 8 RC1 and I had to Google "How to close a window in windows 8", I knew there was something not very intuitive about the OS. My issues were all solved just by booting to desktop and installing Classic Shell, which allows an XP/7 start button and functionality. I'm a fan of new stuff but I think they dropped the ball by not offering a 'classic' mode.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by fruity View Post
              Which apps? It is faster to boot and faster to launch most applications. Obviously there will be exceptions.
              There would only be milliseconds in it and therefore neither here nor there as far as App' launching is concerned. Application usage after launching is not measurably different on my system.

              Originally posted by fruity View Post
              As for new features, I was referring to things like Storage Spaces & the new Winkey shortcuts. Can't see how they'd be annoying. ;-)
              Don't use either of these in my work-flow and as far as the default user i/face is concerned, it's terrible in a desktop environment. I use a small app that starts Win8 straight on to a desktop, where life is much easier...

              Mal.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Dimal View Post
                There would only be milliseconds in it and therefore neither here nor there as far as App' launching is concerned. Application usage after launching is not measurably different on my system.


                Don't use either of these in my work-flow and as far as the default user i/face is concerned, it's terrible in a desktop environment. I use a small app that starts Win8 straight on to a desktop, where life is much easier...

                Mal.
                That's a common criticism I don't understand. If you're using it in desktop mode, how is terrible vs 7? It's essentially the same.

                I'd suggest checking out the new shortcuts. Win+X is especially useful, and you'll miss it when you go back to 7. Certainly time-saving, which realistically, is what it's all about.

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                • #23
                  As far as keyboard-searching/launching, I can (and do) do that in W7, FWIW.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by fruity View Post
                    That's a common criticism I don't understand. If you're using it in desktop mode, how is terrible vs 7? It's essentially the same.
                    It doesn't default to Desktop with Start - Takes more fiddling than it should.

                    Originally posted by fruity View Post
                    I'd suggest checking out the new shortcuts. Win+X is especially useful, and you'll miss it when you go back to 7. Certainly time-saving, which realistically, is what it's all about.
                    That doesn't suit my workflow and I'm happy that it works for you. Doesn't work for me and that is that, as far as I'm concerned. And by the way, my computer experience goes way back to the mid 70s when huge mainframes were the only game in town, so I know how to work my way around a PC environment and several different O/S's too...

                    Mal.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Dimal View Post
                      And by the way, my computer experience goes way back to the mid 70s when huge mainframes were the only game in town, so I know how to work my way around a PC environment and several different O/S's too...

                      Mal.
                      Here comes the holier than thou... :P

                      It can default to desktop in 8.1. You don't need an app. And being a user since the 70s, I'm surprised you don't use keyboard shortcuts almost exclusively!?

                      Back on topic, like I said, if you're prepared to LEARN Win8 is the obvious choice, Yelta. It won't take more than a couple of hours to master if you go in with an open mind.

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                      • #26
                        Wow!
                        "holier than thou" is a game Mal doesn't play.
                        That is just a misread of his post. :-D

                        Go Mac....Plug-in. Play. Period.;-D

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                        • #27
                          I run a Linux Desktop at work, I connect to a Windows 7 desktop for my work apps.
                          I Run UNIX on my home server, I use an OSX desktop and a new touchscreen Laptop running windows 8. I have not upgraded this to 8.1 yet, I'm a UNIX admin, ie I'm lazy.

                          Why do I use all of these, because each performs it's specific purpose best. Linux at work for my systems admin & scripting, Windows for my office Apps, UNIX on my home Server for Mass storage and virtualisation, OSX for itunes streaming (for SWMBO) and web browsing and Windows for Games. I might look into using Linux this or next year for games, but I doubt it will be a complete cutover.

                          at home my everyday is the windows 8 laptop? because everything else is packed away ( I moved in march ((2013)) and I still have everything in boxes ) but it does what I NEED it to do.

                          Windows 8:
                          It's different yes. It's not like any of its predecessors, But it's no slouch, given reasonable hardware it runs quite fast, give it old or insufficient hardware and it will suck.
                          I would say give it memory, then an SSD, then better CPU (then dedicated Graphics if you want it).

                          I would say windows 8 is as stable as windows 7 (patched to date), which I'd say was as stable as windows XP (which I now have not used for about 3 years).
                          It forces you to reboot if you have been running for too long ( I think 2 weeks it starts prompting you ) which probably gives it a little more stability (regular reboots to clear locks , dead processes & mem leaks before they turn into crashes).

                          The touchscreen interface (what was called metro) I do not use. Why ? because the apps I use are not metro apps, I use a web browser, iTunes and steam (for games), or launch the apps I need from desktop shortcuts.
                          Finding apps that are installed can be a problem, they don't always get added to the metro apps list (could be win 8 app installs need something different to windows 7).

                          Once you are in Desktop mode and you have your apps running, It's much like windows 7.

                          If all of the apps you use are metro apps, I cannot say how good it is (using the touchscreen may be better) as i don't use any. ( of course they are not metro apps because you run XP )

                          As Chris says, he uses what works, but windows 7 for Roast monitor, why ? probably because it only runs on windows.

                          What I'm trying to say is, make sure the apps you use work on Windows 8, If they are great, you'll have no stability or performance issues Windows 8, Just the possible Usability issue :-)

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                          • #28
                            Wow.....I guess I should stop using MS-DOS? And the TRS-80 and Spectrum should go to the trash bin in the sky?

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Barry O'Speedwagon View Post
                              Wow.....I guess I should stop using MS-DOS? And the TRS-80 and Spectrum should go to the trash bin in the sky?
                              Barry,
                              Only if they are no longer working for you, If they still work, then why the hell not ?

                              I can assure you, nobody would think to write a virus or exploit for them nowadays :-)

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by amellor View Post
                                Barry,
                                Only if they are no longer working for you, If they still work, then why the hell not ?

                                I can assure you, nobody would think to write a virus or exploit for them nowadays :-)
                                Yeh, stuff all chance of getting a virus into the TRS-80...given that it uses a cassette drive

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