Windows 8.1

[Journeyman]

MS don't say Vista was a failure either, but the many thousands of machines purchased then 'upgraded' to WinXP would tend to disagree. MS claimed lots of sales but that was on bundled OS?machine sales and didn't count how many of those promptly became wickedly fast XP boxes.

Stick with Win7 till the next version comes out. W8 (a better name for it ) is the new Vista. You can config it to run like Win7 but very few people like it and it's a resource hog like Vista was. (there is a reason why Android tablets come with 16GB or 32GB and W8 tablets have 64GB as minimum.

re Apple - it's a not-so-surprising support issue for them. With all it's failings, MS has had to support 5 or more generations of hardware with each version of Windows; Apple supports only one. Want the new OS, buy the new box. So they limit support to make their customers buy the new box. I've got an old IBM R60 running Win7 and I had it running on an R52. The R52 predates the sale of PC/Laptop business to Lenovo by about 4 years, so that's an almost 10 year old machine. AFAIK Mavericks is the first attempt by Apple to cover multi-generations of Macs.

[DesigningByCoffee]

Like Chris, Mac through & through I'm afraid bar a banger CS laptop. Been using them now since the last millennium!
Used to work in prepress using both platforms - but that simply confirmed my loyalties!

But good luck with Win8.1

[TC]

Yep- no interest for me whatsoever.

We're now 100% Mac except for a standalone Win 7 notebook used to run RoastMonitor. I wouldn't go back.

[Dragunov21]

Yep done that, my take is that a lot of the criticism is coming from those who are pretty computer illiterate, incapable of learning how to use a new OS or are simply resistant to change.

I'm sure I can (make do) with 8.1 until 9 shows up.

My take on it is that W8 is an abortion of a product, simply because the only thing Windows really has going for it (IMO) is its existing market share (and compatibility therewith) and users' familiarity with the interface.

W8 UI is counterintuitive to Windows users in a lot of ways, and from what I've heard from a couple of guys in sysadmin roles it's a PITA to integrate into existing systems in some ways (I'm assuming networking and distributed app management, but I'm just guessing).

Part of that issue is retraining users in a corporate environment; sometimes it's better to keep a less efficient interface if the retraining/unfamiliarity inefficiencies outweigh the difference between the current UI and the new one. Given that corporate users rarely use touchscreens in the first place, I'm not even sure there's an argument to be made that it can be more efficient for business use.

As it stands, they're trying to out-apple apple, and it's a bit like a guy who's been teaching karate for twenty years, hears everyone likes this new BJJ thing and starts teaching that instead.

Karateka are going to hate the change and people who like BJJ enough to be doing that are going to go with the people who have been teaching BJJ for ten years, not the guy trying to play catch-up.

[foana]

I agree, it should have been rebranded. But I guess it really comes down to how you define failure, or even if MS would admit it. Generally they are trying to make profit via sales, and if sales are bad it may indicate that a product is failing.

"NetMarketShare, an Internet statistics portal, estimates that total share of Windows 9 to 10 per cent, significantly lower than competitor Android. Its predecessor, Windows 7, continues to enjoy increase in sales. However, Windows 8.1 has an even lower adoption rate of only 3.6 per cent as of mid-January.Another industry researcher, TechMarketView, said that corporate clients are still purchasing more Windows 7 PCs, while "Windows 8 is not getting a look-in from the corporate users and the consumers I've spoken to all say they appalled by it," said TechMarketView Chairman Richard Holway."

Windows 8 Suffers from Poor Sales, Bad Customer Feedback - International Business Times

[fruity]

I can certainly see that a lot tech pundits are rubbishing the UI (and rightly so, in some respects). But I don't know that MS considers it a failure. Their sales so far have been actually pretty good.

IMHO, calling it 'Windows' was a mistake. People have certain expectations of what Windows is, and Win8 doesn't fit those expectations.

If they'd just called it something else completely, there would be very little (justifiable) criticism over the UI - it could then be compared to other touch UIs like iOS or Android.

Either way, it doesn't take long to get used to at all, particularly if you forget about clicking your way through everything and start searching from the keyboard.

[Yelta]

Yeah, so "failure" might have been a bit harsh, but all you need to do is a google search to read the myriad of articles alluding to it.

If history repeats itself, you will get offered a cheap upgrade to Win9, though that is usually only offered months before the next OS is released.

Yep done that, my take is that a lot of the criticism is coming from those who are pretty computer illiterate, incapable of learning how to use a new OS or are simply resistant to change.

I'm sure I can (make do) with 8.1 until 9 shows up.

[foana]

Yeah, so "failure" might have been a bit harsh, but all you need to do is a google search to read the myriad of articles alluding to it. Win8 was MS trying to combat the vastly expanding market share of tablets which is currently killing PC sales. Not because Windows 7 is a failure. The problem is existing PC users/environments don't want a fancy new way of doing things. And thus poor uptake and bad sales. MS have refused to bring back the functionality of previous OS and so Win9 is a thing that has to happen.

If history repeats itself, you will get offered a cheap upgrade to Win9, though that is usually only offered months before the next OS is released.

[fruity]

Definitely not faster with the app's I use day to day...
A lot of those so-called features are also downright annoying...

Mal.

Which apps? It is faster to boot and faster to launch most applications. Obviously there will be exceptions.

As for new features, I was referring to things like Storage Spaces & the new Winkey shortcuts. Can't see how they'd be annoying. ;-)

[Yelta]

Thanks Dimal and Fruity, valuable insights.

[Yelta]

MS has already acknowledged the failure of Win 8/8.1 and plans to release Win9 in April 2015. Though it does not really help in your decision. No XP Support for a year can be a risk, as any holes they find in 7/8 can possibly be used on XP. Atm im supporting a company with 600+ users migration from XP to Win7 and they have completely scrapped 8 mainly due to poor functionality. Though I have to say you don't really need a touch screen for Win8. It's more about learning the new functionality, which will be irrelevant come Win9. So I'd just stick with Win7 for 5+ years.

Thanks foana, that's the sort of info Im looking for.

The reports are not saying 8 is a failure simply that sales are slower than they had hoped, only 25 million sales so far I would imagine a lot are going for mobile devices rather than desk top machines, it's a totally different market than it was 10 years ago, desk top suits my needs just fine.

Not prepared to stick with XP unsupported for the next 12 months, as far as touch screen is concerned I really don't see the point of it on a desk top machine, my current box is well over 5 years old so I really do need to act pretty soon.

Don't feel inclined to spend on an old OS, Windows 7, as I said in my original post, have had a brief run through on 8, seems everything is there, just a matter of learning to do things a little differently, I imagine there will be a reasonably priced seamless upgrade to 9 when the time comes.

[Dimal]

8.1 pros: faster, more secure, more stable, some handy new features.

Definitely not faster with the app's I use day to day...
A lot of those so-called features are also downright annoying...

Mal.

[fruity]

Oh, and as for Apple, it's worth pointing out that they support their OSes for about 3 years. XP is on it's 13th year of support. :P

[fruity]

MS has already acknowledged the failure of Win 8/8.1 and plans to release Win9 in April 2015. Though it does not really help in your decision. No XP Support for a year can be a risk, as any holes they find in 7/8 can possibly be used on XP. Atm im supporting a company with 600+ users migration from XP to Win7 and they have completely scrapped 8 mainly due to poor functionality. Though I have to say you don't really need a touch screen for Win8. It's more about learning the new functionality, which will be irrelevant come Win9. So I'd just stick with Win7 for 5+ years.

Link to acknowledgement please? The release of 9 isn't an acknowledgement in itself, unless you consider the release of 8 to similar acknowledge the failure of 7 (same time frame: 3 years).

Yelta, 8.1 will be fine for you if you're prepared to learn, or you're already using keyboard search for everything you do in XP. If you don't want to learn, 7 is a better pick, as it's easier to setup to work like XP.

8.1 pros: faster, more secure, more stable, some handy new features.

7 pros: better backup (particularly if you get the pro version), traditional interface, well-tested.

Most businesses will use 7, because it's now well-known and proven environment. Business IT is typically fairly conservative though, and once they're on 7 it's likely they won't upgrade again for another 2-3 versions (probably Win 10, if we get one).

FWIW, I use both 7 & 8 on a daily basis. I'm starting to miss some of the 8 shortcuts in 7, but really there's not much to complain about with either.

[Dimal]

Yep...

I agree. Win7 Pro is still available commercially and is way more friendly and intuitive to use. I've got Win8 Pro installed as a dual-boot o/s but after testing out over the past few months, I'm sticking with Win7 Pro until something MUCH better comes along.

And, as for switching over to an Apple system? Well, this is not even conceivable after being an MS o/s user for the last couple of decades. Way too much software on hand that will never work outside of a PC... If I do ever make a switch, it will be to a Linux kernel of one flavour or another.

Mal.