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Windows 8.1 on a new desk top, early thoughts.

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  • #31
    Originally posted by fruity View Post
    Either way... backup backup backup!
    Absolutely mate...

    I've been saved quite a few times by having recent backups on hand - Nothing due to drive failure though, just windows being silly and becoming corrupted.

    Mal.

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    • #32
      I've been using Windows 8.1 for about 6 months. It seems like Microsoft is trying too hard to impress. This thing with tiles on my laptop screen is not that usable.

      I personally think Microsoft should take a leaf from Apple and just replace Windows with a newly built version of Windows, maybe based on a UNIX operating system like BSD or Linux. That's what Apple did with OSX, it's now built on a UNIX core (I'm sure it's BSD).

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      • #33
        Originally posted by pamount View Post
        I've been using Windows 8.1 for about 6 months. It seems like Microsoft is trying too hard to impress. This thing with tiles on my laptop screen is not that usable.

        I personally think Microsoft should take a leaf from Apple and just replace Windows with a newly built version of Windows, maybe based on a UNIX operating system like BSD or Linux. That's what Apple did with OSX, it's now built on a UNIX core (I'm sure it's BSD).
        Hi pamount

        Yes, OSX is a set of pretty pictures (interface) built on a BSD base. Not a bad mix: solid under the bonnet and cosmetically easy to use.

        MS probably cannot do the same as they have spent 15+ years throwing unsuccessful patent lawsuits and other bits of chocanery & FUD at the 'nixes (SCO Unix anyone?). Apple may not be welcome within the 'nix camp, however I suspect MS would be actively fought / hacked against.

        Most Apple aficionados have conveniently forgotten that earlier Macs had as many crashing probs as their Win contemporaries. Their strategy of using slightly modified (i.e. SCSI pin 1 & 2 "Apple mod"), proprietary, way overpriced & poor quality hardware combined with using their OS to restrict the available actions in a partially successful attempt to gain some measure of stability was a nightmare. For this IT guy, the Mac SE was the worst hardware / software combo I ever lived with (for those with a long enough memory).

        Roll on the future (perhaps Android, another 'nix?)

        TampIt

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        • #34
          Originally posted by TampIt View Post
          Hi pamount

          Yes, OSX is a set of pretty pictures (interface) built on a BSD base. Not a bad mix: solid under the bonnet and cosmetically easy to use.

          MS probably cannot do the same as they have spent 15+ years throwing unsuccessful patent lawsuits and other bits of chocanery & FUD at the 'nixes (SCO Unix anyone?). Apple may not be welcome within the 'nix camp, however I suspect MS would be actively fought / hacked against.

          Most Apple aficionados have conveniently forgotten that earlier Macs had as many crashing probs as their Win contemporaries. Their strategy of using slightly modified (i.e. SCSI pin 1 & 2 "Apple mod"), proprietary, way overpriced & poor quality hardware combined with using their OS to restrict the available actions in a partially successful attempt to gain some measure of stability was a nightmare. For this IT guy, the Mac SE was the worst hardware / software combo I ever lived with (for those with a long enough memory).

          Roll on the future (perhaps Android, another 'nix?)

          TampIt
          Most "Apple aficionados" don't use the earlier Macs. The situation is different now.

          Maybe Microsoft can't join the "nix camp" as you say but they can't let the current situation go on. They need to build a completely new version Windows from the ground up. Maybe offer an optional compatibility layer for legacy systems if they do that.

          Android seems like a fractured mess to me. Market penetration means nothing if the profit per unit is minimal.

          As for me I just had to buy a full retail version of Windows 8.1. Even if I got a job tomorrow it would be a while before I could buy a new Mac, unfortunately.

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          • #35
            Windows 8.1 on a new desk top, early thoughts.

            I think the MS kernel is fine, it's just the interface people don't like in 8. Stability-wise, 99% of the problems are 3rd party drivers & software. Linux obviously doesn't have this issue as the drivers are built-in (mostly) not add-on modules.

            The catch for Windows is, as you said, compatibility. People expect decades of compatibility in Windows: on a Mac, they just buy a new computer or a new accessory or a new program. It's a weird attitude, but there it is: Apple gets away with three years of support and limited legacy support, while MS is getting lambasted for finally killing XP 13 years after release.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by fruity View Post
              I think the MS kernel is fine, it's just the interface people don't like in 8. Stability-wise, 99% of the problems are 3rd party drivers & software. Linux obviously doesn't have this issue as the drivers are built-in (mostly) not add-on modules.

              The catch for Windows is, as you said, compatibility. People expect decades of compatibility in Windows: on a Mac, they just buy a new computer or a new accessory or a new program. It's a weird attitude, but there it is: Apple gets away with three years of support and limited legacy support, while MS is getting lambasted for finally killing XP 13 years after release.
              You can say that about the MS kernel but I never had such stability problems when I had my MacBook Pro (which is too old now). I was able to plug things into my MacBook Pro without problems. Plus how many people keep their computers for "decades"? I would've thought most Windows users buy new computers within no more than 5 years at the most.

              The only reason I'm using a Windows laptop now is because it was given to me and I don't have a job at the moment.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by pamount View Post
                You can say that about the MS kernel but I never had such stability problems when I had my MacBook Pro (which is too old now). I was able to plug things into my MacBook Pro without problems. Plus how many people keep their computers for "decades"? I would've thought most Windows users buy new computers within no more than 5 years at the most.

                The only reason I'm using a Windows laptop now is because it was given to me and I don't have a job at the moment.
                One experience is a pretty small sample size. ;-)

                That's just it though: Windows users keep their PCs for much longer than 5 years, and much longer than Mac users in general. If they didn't, their would be very few Windows XP machines still around (Win 7 is 5 years old this year).

                Personally I work with all platforms & each has their pros and cons. I quite like the Mac hardware: it's a shame it doesn't work quite as well running Windows or Linux.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by fruity View Post
                  One experience is a pretty small sample size. ;-)

                  That's just it though: Windows users keep their PCs for much longer than 5 years, and much longer than Mac users in general. If they didn't, their would be very few Windows XP machines still around (Win 7 is 5 years old this year).

                  Personally I work with all platforms & each has their pros and cons. I quite like the Mac hardware: it's a shame it doesn't work quite as well running Windows or Linux.
                  No, I've heard about many other experiences with Macs.

                  Windows XP is still used by a lot of companies even on brand new computers. It takes about 6 months for them to test apps on a new operating system and that doesn't include updating those apps. I remember putting SOEs with Windows XP on brand new computers after Windows 7 came out.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by pamount View Post
                    No, I've heard about many other experiences with Macs.

                    Windows XP is still used by a lot of companies even on brand new computers. It takes about 6 months for them to test apps on a new operating system and that doesn't include updating those apps. I remember putting SOEs with Windows XP on brand new computers after Windows 7 came out.
                    It takes a lot longer than 6 months for most companies! All the new Windows operating systems have been available for testing a lot more than 6 months prior to official release.

                    Mac users always go on and on about how much better their Mac is than their old Windows machine. Funny though, they conveniently ignore that a) they were replacing an old machine with a new one; b) it cost a fraction of their Mac; and c) if anything goes wrong with their Mac it's not the Mac's fault and they just buy a new one. It is why non-Mac users see them as a cult: somehow everything is magically better in Macland! ;-)

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by fruity View Post
                      Windows users keep their PCs for much longer than 5 years, and much longer than Mac users in general. If they didn't, their would be very few Windows XP machines still around (Win 7 is 5 years old this year).
                      Morning Fruity,

                      I'm certainly one of the Windows users you refer to.

                      I bought a new PC with XP installed in 2002, the hardware was showing signs of age in 2007/8 so replaced it with another box running XP, this is the system I replaced about 10 days ago, even then the only reason I upgraded was because MS announced they were not supporting XP after April this year and I was obviously concerned about security implications.

                      Two PC's in almost 12 years, both running XP, never experienced a problem/failure/virus or security breach with either machine during that time.

                      I'm certainly a happy MS user, wouldn't even contemplate a change.

                      Of course prior to XP we had Windows 98 and 2000, an entirely different story, those of us who are old enough recall the blue screen of death only too well.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Yelta View Post
                        Of course prior to XP we had Windows 98 and 2000, an entirely different story, those of us who are old enough recall the blue screen of death only too well.
                        Don't remind me! ;-)

                        Although I now remember the same story then, with people insisting on staying with 98SE over XP. History repeats!

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by fruity View Post
                          Don't remind me! ;-)

                          Although I now remember the same story then, with people insisting on staying with 98SE over XP. History repeats!
                          Guess its the age old story, people hate to move out of their comfort zone, mind you there was little comfort using 98, more like constant frustration, I couldn't upgrade fast enough when XP was released.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by fruity View Post
                            It takes a lot longer than 6 months for most companies! All the new Windows operating systems have been available for testing a lot more than 6 months prior to official release.

                            Mac users always go on and on about how much better their Mac is than their old Windows machine. Funny though, they conveniently ignore that a) they were replacing an old machine with a new one; b) it cost a fraction of their Mac; and c) if anything goes wrong with their Mac it's not the Mac's fault and they just buy a new one. It is why non-Mac users see them as a cult: somehow everything is magically better in Macland! ;-)
                            Well if it takes a lot longer than 6 months then it only supports what I'm saying. From what I've seen it's not like every company has access too or ever bothers with having a pre-release version of a new version of Windows.

                            I've got experience with Windows, OSX and some distros of Linux. With Windows I get a level of problems that I haven't experienced with OSX, so I'm hardly going to praise Windows computers over Macs.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by pamount View Post
                              Well if it takes a lot longer than 6 months then it only supports what I'm saying. From what I've seen it's not like every company has access too or ever bothers with having a pre-release version of a new version of Windows.

                              I've got experience with Windows, OSX and some distros of Linux. With Windows I get a level of problems that I haven't experienced with OSX, so I'm hardly going to praise Windows computers over Macs.
                              For 7 & 8, at least, everyone had access to pre-release versions.

                              I can't dispute you've had issues with Windows machines, but just pointing out your bad experience with Windows isn't necessarily the rule. What issues have you had? Are they actually Windows issues, or the result of 3rd-party software? As I said before, Microsoft becomes the default for the blame game on a Windows machine, when usually it's nothing to do with them. Apple is somehow the opposite (it's everyone one else's fault but their own).

                              Speaking of OSX, Mavericks users might want to be aware of a critical vulnerability in SSL handling (affects iOS too, but a patch is already available, 7.0.6 & 6.1.6).

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                FWIW, as I said not an Apple user but just read this Apple promises fix for security flaw affecting Mac computers as experts warn of hacking threat - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) may be of interest given that the Cupertino aficionados are constantly reminding us that security issues don't affect their choice of operating system.

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