Via Venezia tripping breaker

[noidle22]

wait a second.....

.......based on some information of dubious provenance from a public internet forum, I'd be pretty unhappy.

Variac.

Also, reproduce the fault if you can. Make sure that it's not tripping the RCD rather than the breaker - do you have RCDs on your bench?

i dunno man but i think you just called your own advice dubious. please stop replying to my thread. i don't really care of your opinion on me, there's no need to continue anymore.

[MorganGT]

In the real world, in workshops that repair a variety of machines/appliances, we all get much of our training on the job. If the employer is ethical they will reduce the labour time on some jobs to compensate for this, though in my experience most do not. Even if you work for a manufacturer and only fix their gear, you don't go back to school every time a new model or product comes out. Usually it's more like an email with a wiring schematic, and an exploded parts diagram.

I live in the real world too, I work exclusively on coffee machines and grinders, and most of our 'training' is on the job, since we will happily fix any make of machine. Once you learn the basics, opening up and fixing a machine you have never seen before is really just a case of comparing what you find to machines you already know to identify the problem. It seems to work for us, since we have often had machines sent to us by the importers of a particular make of machine, whose in-house techs had given up on trying to fix. And with new models appearing on the market, you have to be able to pull one apart and figure out any new issues they contain, since it's just not feasible to get 'factory' trained on everything you plan to work on unless you are going to specialise in just one make, which is not really practical if you want to stay in business.

I have had 'training' by the developer of a particular brand of machine that one of our bigger customers had started importing for use in his customers' premises - that experience made me wonder if there was any real benefit to repeating that with other makes - probably not, if that was a typical 'training' experience.

....and sometimes 'factory' training won't equip you for fixing problems, since the factory doesn't even know they exist yet. When La Marzocco FB80s and GB5s started appearing, some started shutting down unexpectedly when in heavy use. At the time neither the importer nor anyone at La Marzocco seemed to realise there was a problem, nor had any idea what the cause was. Turns out you can configure one in the Technician programming menu to not refill the boiler if any of the groups are running (to keep the water pressure more stable) and it will shut down for safety if the boiler level gets too low. So if you are busy and one or more groups is always operating, and you take water from the boiler for teas, before long the whole machine shuts down without warning. It's fun diagnosing and fixing a problem like that, but no amount of 'factory' training would have helped at that point, as La Marzocco themselves had not yet figured out the issue yet, so it would not have figured in any training.

[fatboy_1999]

Oh let it go already!

[Hildy]

And what may also not be apparent, the closest service centre who advertises coffee mqchine repairs is over 200km away. The customer unfortunately doesnt have a lot if choice.

I explained this to the customer along with my assessment and possible causes and he was ok with this. He decided not to proceed with the repair due to the machines age and costs involved.

Perhaps it would be in uour best interest Hildy to actually understand the situation and the variables involved fully before casting judgement.

If someone comes to me with a sick dog and the nearest vet is 200km away, I'm going to say 'go to the vet'. I'm not going to say 'it's likely not fixable, but you can put your dog down with a bullet'. I'm definitely not going to try to treat the dog - I could get struck off for that. I've been told that the Nuremberg defense is impermissible for unethical acts.

if I took my car to a mechanic and discovered that they'd never worked on a diesel before and that their diagnosis was based on some information of dubious provenance from a public internet forum, I'd be pretty unhappy.

[noidle22]

my bad my bad..........

[Dragunov21]

good one mate, you're an ass

I think is what he was getting at...

[noidle22]

Quote from noidle22 "good one mate, you're an asset to my thread. " Mate, I think you miss-spelled "asset"

I thought it was right? Google says it's spelt that way and so does like every dictionary.

[noidle22]

And what may also not be apparent, the closest service centre who advertises coffee mqchine repairs is over 200km away. The customer unfortunately doesnt have a lot if choice.

I explained this to the customer along with my assessment and possible causes and he was ok with this. He decided not to proceed with the repair due to the machines age and costs involved.

Perhaps it would be in uour best interest Hildy to actually understand the situation and the variables involved fully before casting judgement.

[leograyson]

does anyone else think it's ethical to do your training at customer expense? or do coffee machine techs not have professional ethics?

In the real world, in workshops that repair a variety of machines/appliances, we all get much of our training on the job. If the employer is ethical they will reduce the labour time on some jobs to compensate for this, though in my experience most do not. Even if you work for a manufacturer and only fix their gear, you don't go back to school every time a new model or product comes out. Usually it's more like an email with a wiring schematic, and an exploded parts diagram.

Quote from noidle22 "good one mate, you're an asset to my thread. " Mate, I think you miss-spelled "asset"

[Dragunov21]

Dude, you've made your point, getting passive-aggressive about it just makes you look bad.

In an ideal world, OP might say upfront "You're better off taking this to someone who specialises in coffee machines". In a world where people have to toe the company line to continue earning a crust, that may not be possible.

[Hildy]

does anyone else think it's ethical to do your training at customer expense? or do coffee machine techs not have professional ethics?

[noidle22]

I hope someone can make this easy for me. Hi, I'm a chiropractor and I've got a patient with a bone sticking out of his arm. We don't actively advertise fixing of broken bones but he's come in here now and I don't know what to do. He also can't feel his fingers. I've manipulated spines for people who can't feel their fingers before but I've never worked on an arm. Can you give me any tips about arm bones? Can this be the reason that he can't feel his fingers? I think it's that funny bone, you know, the humorous.

good one mate, you're an asset to my thread.

[Hildy]

I hope someone can make this easy for me. Hi, I'm a chiropractor and I've got a patient with a bone sticking out of his arm. We don't actively advertise fixing of broken bones but he's come in here now and I don't know what to do. He also can't feel his fingers. I've manipulated spines for people who can't feel their fingers before but I've never worked on an arm. Can you give me any tips about arm bones? Can this be the reason that he can't feel his fingers? I think it's that funny bone, you know, the humorous.

[noidle22]

All fair comments and sorry to have caused any offense. I guess I was only looking at it from the customer's point of view and it really is all too easy to forget about the other side of the coin... the hard working men and women trying to do their best and make a buck while doing so.

No worries, I was a bit tense yesterday evening and my response was probably more aggressive than it should have been.

As to the other points, if saeco's parts support is now fully integrated with philips, im a service centre for philips so I might be able to get the parts from them.

I also powered the machine up now and and let it get up to temperature. Thw whole time it was hissing loudly and once the ready lights cane on the steam wand started leaking and water was dripping out of the group fairly steadily. Seems like a leaky boiler to me?

Anyway, ive contacted the customer and let him know of the problems and possible causes and he decided not to worry about fixing it due to the costs involved. Also discovered it had never been descaled which may be contributary to the failure :/
Oh well, got a project now :P

[Hildy]

If anyone has any quick tips on easy troubleshooting ideas chuck them out there.

Variac.

Also, reproduce the fault if you can. Make sure that it's not tripping the RCD rather than the breaker - do you have RCDs on your bench?