Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

[andy]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial


...well they ARE pretty & extreme for home use fellas!

[JavaB]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Hey Robusto....

We have "Extreme Machines" now ;D ;D ;D ;D

I love the: "CoffeeSnobs drool over the very pretty toys in this category"

Wooooo Hoooooo 8-) 8-)

[robusto]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

JavaB, far it be for me to argue with you -- Im sure youre right again. Deceptively similar to Procons, though.

Good point Thundergod: Confusing the two tanks would bring a new meaning to the term over-extracted.

Dennis, the light areas are where the various components have been brazed to the boiler. Id imagine the molten metal flowed to the the boundaries of the flux. Ah, dont you love it when it flows nicely instead of beading like water on a polished car!

-Robusto

[Dennis]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Woo Hoo Robusto - I was very interested in seeing the pics...and almost inspired to open up my machine, though not sure if that would affect the warranty. Can I presume those lith areas on the boiler are from flux when soldering?

The dial is a beauty!

[Thundergod]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

All looks very nice, just dont mix up those hoses behind, and now you have a "customised" guage that looks like it was always meant to be there.

[JavaB]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Great pictures there Robusto

Re the pump..... given your problems without supply pressure Id suspect its not a proton.....

And looking like a proton - so does my La Cimbali - exactly the same infact.....

But it is higher capacity and will NOT draw water from a tank.... and thats possibly why the capacity is higher..... it is designed (been modified by La Cimbali?) for greater volume but less pressure increase.

[robusto]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Thanks to Thundergod whos tutored me in the art of posting multiple pics, here are a few of the Grimac 2-group  during the dismantling phase 3 few weeks back.

While there was some grime, the machine was remarkably clean.

The motor is an RPM brand, and while the pump sticker says GRIMAC it looks like a Proton.  The pressure is easily adjusted via the bolt on top of the pump



The 5-litre copper boiler -- puny compared to some Snobs steam engines  . But produces a great head of steam at low pressure - Set at 0.8 bar.  The two heat exchangers are clearly visible to the left and right of the boiler towards the rear. On the middle-top are, from left, safety valve, filler probe (with earth wire) and vacuum break valve.

Towards the front of the picture are the two meters which measure how much water has gone through for volumetric dosing. Between them is the Sirai pressurestat. KLUNK. KLUNK. KLUNK ad infinitum.



The element is 3200W. Quick recovery for dinner party situations.



With the drip tray removed, the solenoid pump valve is on the left. The knob outide/left  is for manual filling under mains pressure.  The braided hose is the water inlet.



The new gauge in place -- has an eliptical face and round body and is really for a Rancilio, but fitted the round cutout perfectly.  


Not exactly edifying  :-[ but hopefully temporary. Left 10-litre tank is for the drip tray. Right one for filtered water.


And finally.... here it is, with  a DMM and thermocouple connected to top of boiler.



Almost time for a coffee... Pity the beans are only one day old  

-Robusto

[JavaB]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Robusto,

Re the oscillations, Id say it was air trapped in the pump and / or the pump was suffering from cavitation..... Air would be sneaking past the rotor and interfering with the water flow.

[Sparky]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial


Maybe the pump is a bit tired. Mine has no problems with drawing water from a tank... but as we all know, its new. The one of the old pumps I first used had fluctuation problems because the seals were shot. If youre going to plumb it in anyway, then I dont see the problem. But if youre going to run it off a tank, then maybe another visit to coffeeparts is in order.

[Thundergod]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

You need to host them somewhere first.
Like on Photobucket or similar.

Then you paste the individual photo links into your post (suitably image tagged).
The alternative is to splice them all into one photo and post normally.

e.g.

[robusto]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Thanks JavaB. Any theories on the end to gauge oscillations after having temporarily attached to the water main?

(Ive been trying to attach multiple pictures, but Im afraid Im doing something wrong --- is there a step by step guide!!!)

--Robusto

[JavaB]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Robusto,

Good to hear its all working properly now, and that gauge looks really good (and saved some pennies as well!)

Id be looking at the label on the back of the pump.... It doesnt sound like its a procon - you shouldnt be getting these issues if it is - as Mark said they will actually draw water from a tank lower than the coffee machine.

Maybe in a past service the pump has been replaced and they used some other brand (to reduce cost - or because thats all they had at hand.....). The procon label is clearly visible on the back of the pump......

[robusto]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Ive mentioned before that the pressure gauge oscillates and that the pump pressure is halved when two groups are used simultaneously....

This morning I hooked up the water intake to a tap.

I was able to run both groups at once at 8 bars.  -- JavaB and  Sparky, youre right, the pump does rely on a boost from incoming water pressure.

Secondly: The gauge pointer oscillation has disappeared!!! Its rock steady now -- even after removing the mains hose and going back to the tank. And dare I say it, the pump also seems quieter.

Some sort or air lock earlier perhaps?

The new Rancilio pressure gauge is installed on the outside panel where it should be and works well

The replacement solenoid has also (so far!) cured the leaking to earth problem.

The new two-hole steam tip is rather slow, the holes are miniscule. Have only done one latte with them, but it allowed me to maintain control throughout.

--Robusto

[robusto]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

MachoSilvia, there are a few mad 2-gropup commercial machine owners here. Sparky and JavaB are at the top of the heap with their techno-wizardry.

Congratulations on adding to the team with the Futurmat. How about some pictures and details please?

Steaming is a big learning curve after mastering Silvia. Its easier if you use a large jug. In any case, its a matter of mastering many variables: position of the wand, depth of the wand, steam volume, angle, hand steadiness, and being aware of the idiosynchratic noises which sussgest success or faiulure.

Even before I received mine, I measured out the space it would take where Silvia formerly was, and knew it was going to be a huge enchroachment. But its yet to go there -- its still on the breakfast bar side of the kitchen.

When we built out house we had 15Amp supplies and 410V 3-phase installed, so power is not a problem.

Good luck and keep us all posted about your Futurmat journey


-Robusto

[MachoSilvia]

Re: Upgraditis: 2-group Grimac Commercial

Hows the steaming on the new machine? Ive just got my 2 grp commercial futurmat machine running yesterday, and I am overwelmed by the pressure, compared with my old silvia.. a much similar situation to you... Im testing it on the hose water connection, it seems to work ok for me... you must have a very understanding wife to allow that beast in your kitchen! At first I thought I was mad getting a 2grp machine, but nice to know im not the onlyone whos mad!

Its probably already been asked, but what power do you run it on?