Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Calculating Your Machines Energy Consumption...

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

    Originally posted by 353D32343C6663570 link=1248135212/13#13 date=1248852579
    Haha or you just have waaaaaaaaaay too much time on your hands  
    naaaahhhhh its my magnetic personality
    Back to the Brasilia with you times a wasting  ;D

    Originally posted by 102532300038253A363B33570 link=1248135212/14#14 date=1248858929
    Are you complaining that the deadband is too narrow and the machine is too temperature stable?

    If you are still running it with the case off it WILL cool down quicker and cycle at shorter intervals.

    Greg
    thanks Greg maybe i am complaining (worring) about little, i have just been running another 1grp  HX machine on the bench and it has a lot longer deadband. Did not time it yet but way longer. the ON time is a bit longer too but it may have a larger range to travel on the gauge. It is about 7l i think.

    Case on or off have little effect to the Carimali, I think the relay needs replacing, cause if this was quite it would be so much better. The Bzzz click CLACK Bzzzz it throws out worry me  

    if any one in SYD has a spare relay CA4-9 220v (coffeepart 700653-22) i can borrow / loan something for let me know.

    I might go for a coffee at Jetblack tomorrow and listen to their machines for a while. So much shiny coffee bling will ease my worries.

    happy days
    Leeham

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

      Originally posted by 6E626B66666F030 link=1248135212/15#15 date=1248871948
      Case on or off have little effect to the Carimali, I think the relay needs replacing, cause if this was quite it would be so much better. The Bzzz click CLACK Bzzzz it throws out worry me  
      That sounds like a relay- but not to labour a point, the pressurestat contacts make a loud click on and of- almost and explosion- if they are very worn. You could just take the cover off it and look- mine were black. It is easy also to pull the diaphragm out and see if the unit is very stiff or worn. You can do this before anything else- its not either or with replacing.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

        thanks telemaster, your not laboring a point, i like to get more info / ideas on potential issues and really appreciate your (and others) posts.

        the Pstat actually is fairly quite. i pulled the diaphragm and i seems ok that is it flexes in out quite well. when in operation i can "see" it spark (tiny blue contact spark) across  the points.

        i might jump the wires on to the next set of contacts on the Pstat, the ones being used dont seem worn or burnt (not like my old holden used to burn points) but might change a behavior. I will give them a little rub with a file first to clean.

        The relay is in the computer box under the drip tray, and as i said it really gets some interesting buzz click clack noises happening. It also gets a bit of a "thunk" from the element turning on. Its working but i would not be leaving it on and going out of the house.

        the other machine now on the bench has a sari pstat as well, I am going to run it so i can see it in operation and compare movements and noises. Cant run them both as i only have one pump.... :-/.

        I am trying to keep costs low as i intend to pass this machine on to someone else and want them to get a good deal to.

        thanks
        Leeham

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

          Makes sense about the computer box
          Brett

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

            Originally posted by 414D444949402C0 link=1248135212/2#2 date=1248176729
            on another note, i did a rough power cost calculation
            at 3000watt its costing me max $0.69 an hour (69 cents) to run
            it normally runs 25ish mins from turn on to first "off"
            it then needs a bit of flushing and group head warming time etc
            $.69 an hour seems to be a lot - our resident commercial machine lover JavaB had calculated, from memory, a rate of about 200w/hr being about $1 day for 24 hour use.  I calc that at 200w/hr used I would be paying about 50c a day for 10 hours use...?

            Cheers

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

              Hey OzScott

              the rate i was paying was 23cents per KWH (think i still am, have moved)
              this includes a "green power $$" i choose to pay

              so i calculated the 3000watt (3kwh usage) element to cost .69Cents per hour when fully on. if you were making lots of coffee (commercial enviro) it may well cost that if you add in the pump cost. there would be a very short cycle when making lots of coffee, i would think. The Carmimali may have a pstat issue and be shortening the cycle.
              It has not even been opened since the move.....

              My Brugentti runs on idle about 60% on 40%off it has a 2300watt element so would be roughly 32 cents and hour to run idle
              2.3kw X.23 cents X .60 %
              but again when making coffee it would be on 80%ish so a bit more $$ say .42cents???

              i am not sure but i think USA power prices are less than ours?

              best to find watt rate you pay and do a calculation on your machine

              i am not even sure i am calculating it right????

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                Originally posted by 4549404D4D44280 link=1248135212/20#20 date=1252535694
                My Brugentti runs on idle about 60% on 40%off
                That seems incredibly high!

                Commercial machines typically run at about a 15% on/85% off duty cycle at idle.

                You might want to do another check of your machines duty cycle and verify those times. Make sure you measure it after your machine has been on for at least a couple of hours so it has stabilized. If it is indeed running at a 60% on duty cycle at idle it would be a prime candidate for insulating!


                Java "60%?!?!?!?" phile
                Toys! I must have new toys!!!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                  now now it was a bit of a guess on the high end, not often i even leave it on for more than 2 hrs....

                  its only 7 lt so that may have an impact on heat / thermal mass

                  but yeah i will try to retime it using a timer.

                  now i have NFI but i would have thought 15% duty a amazing number to achieve without any insulation. most machines seem to have so much open space in the case and little measures to retain any heat (open bottom / top etc)
                  they bleed heat at an amazing rate, not saying your wrong, i just thought thats pretty good

                  leeham


                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                    My FAEMA Due is 10.5% on duty cycle when sitting - but its an 11l lagged boiler.

                    Cheers

                    PS, There is another thread on this and I calc for 10 hours running, without start up power, and no use, just sitting on, 50c/day using .15c/kw in Brisbane.

                    Cheers

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                      Yeah Ozscott i saw your post and thought WOW thats low. Its an interesting discussion.

                      next time i turn mine on i am going to retime it a bit to see

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                        Originally posted by 222E272A2A234F0 link=1248135212/22#22 date=1252537197
                        now i have NFI but i would have thought 15% duty a amazing number to achieve without any insulation
                        At idle my 2 group Cimbali M28 has a duty cycle of 1/8 with an uninsulated 12l boiler. Thats only 12.5% on time. If you do a search on here youll find that others with commercial machines have reported similar times. Including Telemaster in his 2nd post in this thread. Realize that these are the rates when the machine is fully up to temp and just idling. Not for the warm-up period, when the duty cycle will obviously be much higher.


                        Java "Getting close to espresso season here!" phile
                        Toys! I must have new toys!!!

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: commercial heater on off cycle how long is yours??

                          i timed my Brugentti machine today, after a good hour at idle i timed 3 cycles
                          times seem very stable  
                          222 secs off
                          25 secs on
                          cycle 247 secs

                          14.5 cycles per hour or 364secs ish
                          duty time 10.2% ish

                          based on that i am getting a cost on duty cycle of about 6 cents per hour, i am truly amazed at that i thought i was "ON"  a lot more.

                          now off to make a coffee, and eat my humble pie hat

                          and it really shows me the Carimali has some explaining to do.... ;D

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Calculating Your Machines Energy Consumption...

                            We have a 1800 watt boiler on our ECM, it is on at 7am and switched off at approx 10pm, not a lot of use, so I would say it heats about 15 percent of time. (machine on for about 15 hours a day)
                            we ran it on a cent o meter from bunnings for a while and calculated about 40-50 cents a day.
                            And our rough figures were about $200 a year to run. We are in Victoria so it depends on your power cost and type off off peak rates you have, and meter installed in your power box etc.
                            But our sparkie checked our figures and said he thinks with the new interval meters and off peak etc, and average home machine with a 1800 watt element and little use about $150 a year.
                            For the savings on espressos and with the appreciation of guests I think its money well spent.
                            cheers
                            Note-if i added insualtion around the boilerI figure I would save another $30 but I worry the machine we burn or something and being an illegal addition I dont want the worry.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Calculating Your Machines Energy Consumption...

                              Originally posted by 363A29385B0 link=1248135212/27#27 date=1252905356
                              We have a 1800 watt boiler on our ECM
                              :-? Might be worth checking that marc...More like 1200/1300 I think...

                              2mcm

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Calculating Your Machines Energy Consumption...

                                2mcm its the ECM A1....bigger boiler than Giotto

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X