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  • #61
    Re: Need help choosing the right machine

    Originally posted by 5A4F585A4D485151505C533D0 link=1250739532/59#59 date=1253163212
    so if the SJ is a Hilux so is the Mini E.
    Although a hilux with dodgy electric windows that are only mildly adjustable (from all reports).

    Not to try and introduce another option, I was talked away from the Mini E to the Macap M4D as a good doserless for home (I realise the burr set is smaller). I cant fault it but have not tried a blind tasting with an alternative grinder.

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    • #62
      Re: Need help choosing the right machine

      In terms of absolutes the GS3 would have to be the best (having admittedly never used one); but as has been suggested, the benefit over the other machines is minimal where the price is significantly greater. There are other factors that will have a far greater effect on whats in the cup than whether the machine is a GS3 or a Giotto - both will produce dreck if the rest of your setup isnt right. If I had $7k to spend, Id sooner see it spent on a good overall setup than a GS3 paired with rubbish

      If it was my money it would go on one of the cheaper machines, a good grinder like a Mazzer Robur, a steady supply of fresh beans (or even better roast your own if you have the time which I suspect you dont), knockbox and a decent tamper (happy to make recommendations on that one if you need ).

      As to which machine, I have a Minore III and have been quite happy with it, but I havent voted as I dont have any experience with the rest of the machines so I dont think itd be a fair vote. Id recommend visiting a local sponsor and see some of these machines in the metal and Im sure youll be in a much better position to make a call that suits you. The importance of absolute specifications can be far outweighed by little things you pick up in the metal ("Those handles actually look really ugly", "Hey didnt realise the hot water wand hits the lever", "That drip tray is bigger than I thought" etc)

      Good luck,
      Greg

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      • #63
        Re: Need help choosing the right machine

        Originally posted by 77415A450041330 link=1250739532/56#56 date=1253147773
        So please let me know which one is better from this list. If you were to pick one wthout judging on its price, which one would you pick? eg, which one has less trouble, easier to clean, cheaper to maintain, last longer between services? and most importantly, which one make the best coffee out of all?
        You mention ROI in the poll and a different set of criteria in your specs from the post. Not many of us have had the opportunity to use all the machines listed let alone judge which best meets your criteria.

        My advice is to go the Giotto,not because I own one, but because it ticks all boxes if not topping the list. As it is a popular machine the chance of getting parts and service are improved.

        The ability to meet high demand is another important criterion and the VBM is better for this purpose.

        Which one makes the best coffee? Well, the real answer is YOU do, but if that is determined by tweakability then perhaps the GS3 has it. I wouldnt buy one even if money isnt the object. I think, as outlined by Chris, it offers poor ROI.

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        • #64
          Re: Need help choosing the right machine

          Originally posted by 6C796E6C7B7E6767666A650B0 link=1250739532/61#61 date=1253171503
          If I had $7k to spend, Id sooner see it spent on a good overall setup than a GS3 paired with rubbish.
          Super Jolly (or anything better?), Tamper, Knock bin, Thermometer and milk jar are on the list after this.

          Originally posted by 6D677265656A7E780B0 link=1250739532/62#62 date=1253174412
          You mention ROI in the poll and a different set of criteria in your specs from the post.
          Exactly! ROI was one criteria too. However, my list of criteria was used as an example. So you can add yours too based on your own experience with any of those machines. But thanks for valid comments.

          Cheers

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          • #65
            Re: Need help choosing the right machine

            WOW DRIVER!!!!

            I have just posted my preference for your poll and seen the 50+% for the La Mazocco!
            I guess that is a statement if i ever saw one!

            Make sure you get yourself a capable grinder..im sure youve heard it b4 but ill say it again...Buy a good grinder first while your learning and upgrade your machine later. If you outlay the big $$$ for something like the La M or the Giotto then make sure you get a tutorial with it so your no affraid to use it.

            Good luck with your purchase and welcome to coffee snobs .. Im sure we will be seeing a lot of you

            I can just imagine the next thread... "What roaster should i buy?" hahahahaha

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            • #66
              Re: Need help choosing the right machine

              If you can wait a little while, Chris of Talk Coffee will be evaluating the Izzo Alex Duetto II.

              From what I have been able find out, it seems to be one great machine.

              I can feel upgradeitis comming on if the elaluation is is good

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              • #67
                Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                Originally posted by 645D434D776F280 link=1250739532/64#64 date=1253429831
                WOW DRIVER!!!!

                I have just posted my preference for your poll and seen the 50+% for the La Mazocco!
                I guess that is a statement if i ever saw one!

                Make sure you get yourself a capable grinder..im sure youve heard it b4 but ill say it again...Buy a good grinder first while your learning and upgrade your machine later. If you outlay the big $$$ for something like the La M or the Giotto then make sure you get a tutorial with it so your no affraid to use it.

                Good luck with your purchase and welcome to coffee snobs .. Im sure we will be seeing a lot of you

                I can just imagine the next thread... "What roaster should i buy?" hahahahaha
                Hahaha good call!

                Well I am actually gonna get proper training. Also I was told Super Jolly will go great with LM? are there any better than SJ to match the La M?

                Also, what roaster should I buy?  ;D


                Originally posted by 372C33302B2C37430 link=1250739532/65#65 date=1253436602
                If you can wait a little while, Chris of Talk Coffee will be evaluating the Izzo Alex Duetto II.

                From what I have been able find out, it seems to be one great machine.

                I can feel upgradeitis comming on if the elaluation is is good
                Thanks Topshot, I will check it out

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                  I recently went through the same exercise and similar equipment choices. I can only tell you that I am extremely happy that I didnt buy a super automatic. A Jura Z5 and S9 were my beginning choices. After a lot of research and conversation I decided to go with the Alex Duetto II and have had it for several weeks now. I had my choices narrowed down to the Vivaldi Mini, La Marzocco GS3, Viebiemme and the Alex Duetto II.

                  If I had already owned a good enough grinder I would have gone with the GS3 but by adding a grinder to the mix is was over my budget. The dual plumbing feature was important and I am glad I did go with the Duetto. After using it I am going to get in plumbed in. So far the only issue is with frothing but I dont think that is a fault of the machine...user deficiency! I would like a longer steam wand but perhaps not that big a deal once I become accustomed to it.

                  The one feature that the Vivaldi and the GS3 has that would be handy would be the automatic shot pulls. It would be nice to do the shots while steaming. I am not good enough to do both at the same time. Actually the Vivaldi Mini is a lot of machine for the money.

                  You have the top machines on your list and whatever choice you make couldnt be bad ones.

                  BTW....I purchased a Mahlkonig K30 Vario grinder to go along and it is fantastic. Consistent doses over and over without a lot of involvement. Program it once for singles and doubles and repeat over and over.

                  Good luck!

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                    Ok DRIVER!

                    From your earlier post it sounds like multiple people will be using the set up as well as yourself?
                    If thats the case then your going to want a volumetric dosing espresso machine so people arent making them self over extracted shots.

                    You are also going to want a grinder that either has a dosing unit attached or doses via pre set time straight into the group handle thus negating you having to train anyone on how to use your set up correctly?

                    If mess and cleanliness are a concern then a completely polished machine may not be a great idea as these are difficult to keep sparkling at the best of times.

                    Will you be plumbing the machine or using an internal water supply and drip tray?
                    Some of the E61 machines have rather small drip trays and need emptying often. Plumbing a machine is also something that needs careful attention and maintaining requiring the need for a water supply and inline filter nearby.

                    Add to the budget a knock box and quality tamper from someone such as Greg Pullman and cleaning cloths and products and the budget for a machine starts to shrink doesnt it?

                    Finally... your going to need 2 kilos of beans to practice with. I burnt my way through 2 kilos in 3 days when i picked up my Dalla Corte Mini and i probably could have gone through more if i had access to it.

                    I know you have enough to think about already but choose wisely DRIVER!
                    Dont just go for the Ferrari Enzo because other people think its the cool thing to have... You might find yourself thinking that the Audi R8 could have given the same smile for a lot less money and fear it might get scratched?

                    P.S. RE: Roaster?... Hottop B from Pullman espresso is the go and on special as we speak! Mine is on its way!

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                    • #70
                      Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                      Originally posted by 2E1709073D25620 link=1250739532/68#68 date=1255075271
                      Some of the E61 machines have rather small drip trays and need emptying often.
                      The drip tray on my Expobar has a 2 litre capacity.

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                      • #71
                        Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                        I love my Super Jolly paired with a commercial 2 group...Macaps rate well on this site as do some other commercial grinders.

                        The SJ has advantages over the Mini, but only if you have the room and are not too worried by some more dosh.

                        Cheers

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                        • #72
                          Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                          Is This thread for real .....

                          Surely DRIV3R , there is enough info for you to make a call .

                          My advice is just get out there get setup and move on. If your looking for the perfect machine, it doesnt exist.

                          BUT you can buy any top shelf machine from any number of manufacturers , and the taste in the cup will be superb.

                          hotshod

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                          • #73
                            Re: Need help choosing the right machine

                            Originally posted by 4D7B607F3A7B090 link=1250739532/43#43 date=1251459057
                            how many double shots can I get outta 600 grams?
                            As many as you like. Oh, you wanted good ones?  :-? ;D

                            Always think that this is a silly question when were discussing dropping many $$$$ on a top home setup. Buy Vittoria on special for the GS/3 as its really cheap and you will spend less per shot :

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