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Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

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  • #16
    Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

    Originally posted by 3025323027223B3B3A3639570 link=1260516382/15#15 date=1260764435
    So Chris, how do you find this generally compares to the Minore III given there are a number of similarities between the two? Shot quality, build quality (can probably guess on that one :), steam power etc etc...
    Interesting questions Greg.

    I have commented on most of those aspects earlier in the thread.

    Ultimately, a well configured e-61 should deliver very good shots, and like your Minore or a Giotto or similar, the results are as expected. Initial impressions of thermostability are great as well.

    As for steam, its in the VBM DS league and the Minore is asthmatic in comparison.

    The key things are the rotary pump which is really quiet, and the tank/plumb flexibility. I reckon to have the PID control both boilers is pretty cool as well.

    Build is pretty good. I have seen a few better and many, many worse...

    One thing to keep in mind is that there is no way youd put a Duetto in the boot for a weekend away. Its just too heavy....

    Chris

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    • #17
      Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

      Are the Vivi and Alex also coming Chris?

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      • #18
        Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

        Originally posted by 2A353F2E333D31392E5C0 link=1260516382/17#17 date=1260820724
        Are the Vivi and Alex also coming Chris?
        I am unsure Vic :-/,

        My feeling is that the Vivi and Alex might not be in very high demand in whats a saturated market.

        The machines we have are for evaluation to determine their suitability fo the Australian market and are not for sale. We are presently contemplating adding the Duetto to our range and invite CSers to express interest via PM or email.

        Chris

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        • #19
          Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

          Id say Paolo knows exactly what hes talking about.

          Ive also read the same reports, and possibly spoken to some of the same people. Im not doubting that this machine has been configured differently for the Australian market, and as Chris knows, I was talking to the first people who had them the minute they landed. However, before shelling out a considerable amount of $$$ for one, Id like to know whats been changed for the Australian market rather than a vague, hand-waving approach!

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          • #20
            Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

            Originally posted by 54616C6B5F436F66666565000 link=1260516382/18#18 date=1260824186
            The machines we have are for evaluation to determine their suitability fo the Australian market and are not for sale.  
            No probs CH.

            I will use my professional judgement after a thorough assessment of the machine and then I will make a decision based on that assessment. Thats why we have evaluation machines. Its so that I can test them.

            As for shortcomings, I cannot name a single machine without them.

            What too many here fail to realise is that just because some bloke in the US running a prototype on 20A and full tilt found issues with a machine, that does not neccessarily correspond to worldwide issues...The Expobar eb-61 leva is a typical example...

            Now given that a mere handful of Aussies have seen one, and even fewer have used one, I suspect that there may be a lack of hard data around.  :-?

            Lets all see who can make the highest mark on the wall. It would be just as productive....:

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            • #21
              Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

              Originally posted by 53666B6C58446861616262070 link=1260516382/20#20 date=1260854768
              As for shortcomings, I cannot name a single machine without them.
              So true Chris,

              Everthing manufactured regardles if they are cars, trucks or vacuum cleaners are made with compromises in them :

              Have you got any time frame at this stage if the evaluations prove the units to be good thing??

              Warren.

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              • #22
                Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                My feeling is that the Vivi and Alex might not be in very high demand in whats a saturated market.
                Understood, theres a lot of E61 HX boxes around and a dealer cant be expected to stock the lot, however the Alex with its rotary pump and reservoir could find its niche.

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                • #23
                  Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                  I understand Chris, and I know the sponsors here taken as a group, take a lot of care not to put out machines that are unsuitable for the Australian market. Id only ever buy an australian-spec machine, rather than a grey import box, and always buy from a sponsor if stocked.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                    Update...

                    Today I pulled a further 80 or so shots back to back and hit the machine with some milk work as well (total 3L)...Faultless, and I dont think I was able to push the machine beyond idle.

                    I also pulled the cover from our second machine and had a good poke around inside:[*]Insulated steam boiler[*]Braided hoses to and from pump[*]Lots of ventilation to ensure it breathes well[*]All key electricals mounted high and clear of water[*]Beautiful build. For a complex machine, its very neat with excellent attention to internal wiring, ties etc. The pix of the prototype which are floating around simply dont do it justice.

                    The caveat with any machine of this type is that there are plenty of electronics: 2 x SSR and the now proven Gicar PID, so I thnk its logical to factor in a higher overall cost of ownership than a simple HX machine. I say that with the Minore III as well. Should issues occur, the key electronics are very easily accessed for replacement.

                    I have had further discussions with the export manager of Gruppo Izzo and we have an agreement in place to secure stocks- exclusive to CSers for the time being- and for the moment, in Melbourne and Sydney only with strict return to base requirements for warranty support. With any new machine, we want them close to us on launch in case of unforseen teething problems. I doubt that we will encounter issues though. Early adopters are welcome to make contact to discuss purchase if youre itchy for new technology.

                    My instinct is that this machine will be very suitable for the top end Australian market. The next step for the machine will be in plumbed in mode for a not too crazy coffee cart gig

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                    • #25
                      Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                      out of interest how would this stack up against a GS3 in terms of build quality and performance?

                      Its about +- half the price (on your GS3 list$$) and was wondering how they compare.

                      Or is that like comparing apples and pineapples. One is smooth and sweet, while the other is rough and can hurt like buggery......

                      will one be in SYD to have a look at soon?

                      Leeham

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                      • #26
                        Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                        Originally posted by 48444D404049250 link=1260516383/25#25 date=1260958728
                        out of interest how would this stack up against a GS3 in terms of build quality and performance?

                        Its about +- half the price (on your GS3 list$$) and was wondering how they compare.

                        Or is that like comparing apples and pineapples. One is smooth and sweet, while the other is rough and can hurt like buggery......

                        will one be in SYD to have a look at soon?

                        Leeham
                        Hi Leeham,

                        I really dont think you can make that comparison. The LM is saturated group and (IMHO) probably a few $K for the brand cred...Guess its like purchasing a euro car over a falcon?

                        Inherent in the e-61 is slow temperature change- a plus and also a limitation I guess. The LM can be altered pretty quickly and offers 0.2 deg. C increments in temperature. The Gicar PID is a 1.0deg PID.

                        To get rotary pump and a tank with the ability to plumb, the e-61 options are/were Iberital LAnna at $3.4k and the now discontinued ECM Veneziano S1 at circa $4k (2006). When compared to them, it offers great bang for buck.

                        FWIW, the internal build has it over the ECM and the Iberital.

                        Needless, if you want the specs, its that or the GS/3 at 2 x price.

                        As for Sydney, not yet. Grab a flight to Melbourne and Ill pick you up and drop you off...

                        Chris

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                        • #27
                          Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                          you could always have two of these instead of a GS/3?

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                          • #28
                            Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                            CH i gotta get a job 1st......

                            i guess i was just thinking if I was to lash out and look for something that might be really good and hopefully last a while (+5yrs) what are the options. I really like my commercial machine it might not be the best machine for coffee but I like the solid build of them (it).

                            I know CH you keep saying get a better grinder..... its on the cards but the right one has to show up.

                            I have looked at the expo MIn 3 and although it looks nice i prefer thicker stainless steel. CH I like you Bez Galatea for quality but not a fan of Vibe (but it does come rotary). I like the smaller size of them in general as it takes up a little less bench space than my Brug

                            anyway not wanting to take this OT to far, be good to see them lined up somewhere soon.

                            Thanks for the comparison Chris and we look forward to your final verdict of the trials.

                            Leeham

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                            • #29
                              Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                              Alrighty,

                              We put it to the pressure test on a cart and couldnt fault it. A further 200 coffees later, I am happy that this machine is robust and we will be releasing it for mass consumption.

                              We have our first 5 machines arriving in January and then a larger order via sea will come later. CSers whod like to have one can make contact and we will take a deposit.

                              Its a pretty nice machine all up

                              Chris

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                              • #30
                                Re: Izzo Alex Duetto II discussion thread

                                [split] [link=http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1261520262/0#0][splithere][/link][splithere_end]

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